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Post by Sartoz on Sept 9, 2016 19:02:36 GMT
<<<<<<<<<<(0)>>>>>>>>>>> That is why we have landing shuttles. The Tempest is not a bloody cargo ship. Next thing you'll see the ARKs landing. It's a pet peeve of mine that spaceships stay in space and specialized attack shuttles or cargo shuttle for planetary landings. I really doubt, though, that we will see this in the game. It's just concept art. Why would it have to be a cargo ship to land? It's a pretty small spaceship, all things considered, and it's not like spaceships - on that scale and substantially larger - operating within atmosphere hasn't pretty much always been a thing in the Mass Effect universe. The designers - in-universe and at BioWare - apparently decided that having a ship that could land on a planet, and then act as a base, made sense for what we'd be doing in Andromeda. And it's definitely not just concept art. Hell, it's not even the only shot we have of Tempest on the ground: <<<<<<<<<<(0)>>>>>>>>>> If I put my Navy hat on, I see the starship in a different light. First - we are in potentially dangerous places Second - establishing a beach head and proceeding with the Colonization Program is the mission objective. Third - all human and hardware assets are crucial. If you lose them, you cannot replace them. Fourth - this makes the safety of the ship paramount. Leaving it in orbit to provide fire support for the landing team makes sense. Fifth - losing a landing shuttle is not the same as losing the Tempest on the ground in potential hostile terrain. Sixth - if the landing mission goes into the crapper, the Tempest can leave and come back with reinforcements, if necessary. Seventh - the ARKs are designed for the Colonization Program in a distant galaxy. They will contain all the necessary internal space to carry provisions, gear, power and machinery to start a colony. This also includes the necessary planetary landing crafts. Eighth - the Tempest is a starship and should be a military one at that. Not a cargo barge. In Mass Effect 2, the crew had access to a landing shuttle. Why you can't have it in the Tempest is puzzling. Bio can always put the Mako inside a landing shuttle. Why the whole ship needs to land is also puzzling. The Tempest is not a colony ship. But, hey, I'm not the Artistic Director. These decisions were made , probably using the rule of Cool.
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Post by Sartoz on Sept 9, 2016 19:05:21 GMT
<<<<<<<<<<(0)>>>>>>>>>> Do you really need to land a spaceship to use the Mako? Really Bio? Get your shyte together. The concept art shows only two landing struts. Just two to balance a long cigar? Also, the Tempest is poised to drop a load. Not very flattering. Maybe the landing lift should drop to the rear? For a science fiction game with high tech a specialized planet landing shuttle is more apropos. Oh, well, let's hope Bio has time to make minor corrections. I see four Landing struts. <<<<<<<<<<(0)>>>>>>>>>> On the wings? Do they touch the ground?
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Post by Catfishers on Sept 9, 2016 19:07:01 GMT
I see four Landing struts. <<<<<<<<<<(0)>>>>>>>>>> On the wings? Do they touch the ground? Yes.
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Post by kamaln7 on Sept 9, 2016 19:11:48 GMT
I see four Landing struts. <<<<<<<<<<(0)>>>>>>>>>> On the wings? Do they touch the ground? Yes and yes. (Bush kinda covers the fourth one)
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bshep
N5
We destroy them or they destroy us.
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Post by bshep on Sept 9, 2016 19:18:25 GMT
Maybe not.The images show the Tempest parked close to what look like a small outpost and one inhabitated asteroid. Those does not look like dangerous places to the ship to land.
Agree with most of it but as i said above we don't know if those places are really dangerous and besides there is a possibility the ship is not big enough to fit a land vehicle and a shuttle, Like the Normandy SR-1, which i believe the Tempest belongs in the same class of ship.
We do not know yet what role the Tempest fulfill. Who knows, maybe she is not outfited to combat like the Normandy was.
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Post by BansheeOwnage on Sept 9, 2016 19:33:25 GMT
It's not very elegant is it?? It's nowhere near as sleek as the Normandy. I quite like the chunkiness, to be honest. And, to my eye at least, it still looks fairly sleek from the top. (Also super into the black/white/red paint.) Certainly helps distinguish it from Normandy, at least, in spite of the similar shape. Cool shot of the Normandy SR-3! Wait.
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Post by Rascoth on Sept 9, 2016 19:46:03 GMT
Yes and yes. (Bush kinda covers the fourth one) Hey, can I ask were you got this pic from? Would love it without those red rectangles.
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KirkyX
N3
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by KirkyX on Sept 9, 2016 19:52:17 GMT
Why would it have to be a cargo ship to land? It's a pretty small spaceship, all things considered, and it's not like spaceships - on that scale and substantially larger - operating within atmosphere hasn't pretty much always been a thing in the Mass Effect universe. The designers - in-universe and at BioWare - apparently decided that having a ship that could land on a planet, and then act as a base, made sense for what we'd be doing in Andromeda. And it's definitely not just concept art. Hell, it's not even the only shot we have of Tempest on the ground: <<<<<<<<<<(0)>>>>>>>>>> If I put my Navy hat on, I see the starship in a different light. First - we are in potentially dangerous places Second - establishing a beach head and proceeding with the Colonization Program is the mission objective.Third - all human and hardware assets are crucial. If you lose them, you cannot replace them. Fourth - this makes the safety of the ship paramount. Leaving it in orbit to provide fire support for the landing team makes sense. Fifth - losing a landing shuttle is not the same as losing the Tempest on the ground in potential hostile terrain. Sixth - if the landing mission goes into the crapper, the Tempest can leave and come back with reinforcements, if necessary. Seventh - the ARKs are designed for the Colonization Program in a distant galaxy. They will contain all the necessary internal space to carry provisions, gear, power and machinery to start a colony. This also includes the necessary planetary landing crafts. Eighth - the Tempest is a starship and should be a military one at that. Not a cargo barge.In Mass Effect 2, the crew had access to a landing shuttle. Why you can't have it in the Tempest is puzzling. Bio can always put the Mako inside a landing shuttle. Why the whole ship needs to land is also puzzling. The Tempest is not a colony ship. But, hey, I'm not the Artistic Director. These decisions were made , probably using the rule of Cool. We are indeed exploring potentially dangerous places, but any act of exploration is inherently a matter of risk versus reward, and I would argue that the rewards of having Tempest on the surface - an instant highly defensible 'beach head' and mobile research base, which can be used as both living quarters and a laboratory for analysing any samples of the local flora and fauna, any artifacts, and so on, without constant shuttle trips back and forth - outweigh the potential risks, particularly when you consider that Tempest, as a military starship, will have far more effective armour, kinetic barriers and weaponry than any shuttle. It's an added risk, certainly, but Tempest simply couldn't perform her role - scout/research ship, intended to conduct planetary surveys in advance of the rest of the fleet - nearly as effectively from orbit, and so that risk is, in my approximation, worthwhile. The reason we don't have a shuttle is that the designers of Tempest decided that the advantages of having a smaller ship that could easily operate within an atmosphere outweighed the potential advantages of having a shuttle, and having to enlarge the ship to fit the attendant support facilities. This would seem to be in keeping with Alliance military doctrine generally, as the one Alliance frigate we've actually seen - the SR-1 - did not, in fact, have a shuttle, and Tempest seems smaller still. I'm really not sure what you're getting at with the points I struck through. Why would any of that have anything to do with whether landing Tempest is sensible or not? Oh, and dismissing it all as 'rule of cool' seems a mite trite. (Though, in fairness, I'd hardly object even if that were the case--if it wasn't for 'rule of cool', there'd be no biotics, no faster than light travel, and no space battles in the franchise. Besides, as I pointed out, it'd be a 'rule of cool' that has been adhered to since the very first game with the SR-1, so it'd be a little odd to take issue with it now.)
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bshep
N5
We destroy them or they destroy us.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Prime Posts: 1876
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Post by bshep on Sept 9, 2016 19:56:49 GMT
Yes and yes. (Bush kinda covers the fourth one) Hey, can I ask were you got this pic from? Would love it without those red rectangles. The picture is on the first page of the thread. But the link to the site would be nice too.
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Post by kamaln7 on Sept 9, 2016 19:58:54 GMT
Yes and yes. (Bush kinda covers the fourth one) Hey, can I ask were you got this pic from? Would love it without those red rectangles.
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Post by Rascoth on Sept 9, 2016 19:59:21 GMT
Hey, can I ask were you got this pic from? Would love it without those red rectangles. The picture is on the first page of the thread. But the link to the site would be nice too. Thanks. Haven't noticed it was updated, since I jump straight to last post.
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KirkyX
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by KirkyX on Sept 9, 2016 20:00:10 GMT
Yes and yes. (Bush kinda covers the fourth one) Hey, can I ask were you got this pic from? Would love it without those red rectangles. (Psst, I updated the main post with a clean version of it, scrubbed from further down that Reddit thread.) EDIT: Whoops, beaten to the punch. For the record, I don't actually know where it is on the official site; I just grabbed the picture from that thread, and there doesn't seem to be a link.
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bshep
N5
We destroy them or they destroy us.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Prime Posts: 1876
Prime Likes: 376
Posts: 4,444 Likes: 7,936
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We destroy them or they destroy us.
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Post by bshep on Sept 9, 2016 20:01:41 GMT
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Post by KirkyX on Sept 9, 2016 20:02:25 GMT
Ah, that explains why I couldn't find it; it's not on the UK site, and that's where Google sent me.
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Post by Sartoz on Sept 9, 2016 20:03:35 GMT
Maybe not.The images show the Tempest parked close to what look like a small outpost and one inhabitated asteroid. Those does not look like dangerous places to the ship to land. Agree with most of it but as i said above we don't know if those places are really dangerous and besides there is a possibility the ship is not big enough to fit a land vehicle and a shuttle, Like the Normandy SR-1, which i believe the Tempest belongs in the same class of ship. We do not know yet what role the Tempest fulfill. Who knows, maybe she is not outfited to combat like the Normandy was. <<<<<<<<<<(0)>>>>>>>>>> Hm... Look at it from the ARKCON Project back in the MW galaxy. The Project Planners main purpose was to seed the humans (I'm looking at it from only the Alliance perspective and not the other races) in the Andromeda galaxy. Off the bat, they have no information what's there. The solution is to plan for the worst. Plan it in such a way that we can establish that beach head. So, what is the worst? Hostile intelligent and space faring races comes to mind. That means that military support elements must be part and parcel of the project. That includes Navy military vessels, scout vessels and star system exploration vessels. Some vessels need to be purpose built for specific mission... such as stealth for scout vessels. These vessels are packed with the necessary gear, sensors and offensive / defensive weapons suited to the main main assignment objective. What is that? For the Tempest, its main purpose is to ferry the exploration crew to different planetary systems. However, since you don't know what you'll meet, the Tempest is also designed to be fast and provide limited fire support from orbit for the exploration crew down below. A navy captain has three main responsibilities: 1- the mission, 2 - safety of the ship, 3- safety of the crew. yes, Ryder is not military. However, this does not eliminate the responsibilities. For the ARKCON project planners to allow crucial assets to land instead of a smaller and less crucial asset (shuttle) makes no sense. I've read enough military science fiction that these things make sense. I would prefer that the story followed some military protocols. Why even in the early North American colonization efforts had military support ships. Mind, I'm not losing any sleep over this.
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Post by Pounce de León on Sept 9, 2016 20:07:19 GMT
<<<<<<<<<<(0)>>>>>>>>>> Do you really need to land a spaceship to use the Mako? Really Bio? Get your shyte together. The concept art shows only two landing struts. Just two to balance a long cigar? Also, the Tempest is poised to drop a load. Not very flattering. Maybe the landing lift should drop to the rear? For a science fiction game with high tech a specialized planet landing shuttle is more apropos. Oh, well, let's hope Bio has time to make minor corrections. It's got 4 landing legs. Two are at each wing tips.
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Hrungr
Twitter Guru
ღ N-Special
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Staff Mini-Profile Theme: Hrungr
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Prime Likes: 65,767
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More coffee...? More coffee.
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Post by Hrungr on Sept 9, 2016 20:11:32 GMT
Funny, in that pic it looks smaller for some reason. I guess the ship is pretty far away. Smaller than what? The Normandy? That doesn't surprise me. The Normandy SR1 was a frigate, the Normandy SR2 was a heavy frigate, and the Tempest looks like something like a corvette or destroyer. Tempest in a teacup...?
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Posts: 391 Likes: 1,705
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Post by KirkyX on Sept 9, 2016 20:16:06 GMT
Smaller than what? The Normandy? That doesn't surprise me. The Normandy SR1 was a frigate, the Normandy SR2 was a heavy frigate, and the Tempest looks like something like a corvette or destroyer. Tempest in a teacup...? Hey, hey BioWare... Custom soundtrack options for our cabin's space iPod/clock? Pretty pweeese?
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Post by Sartoz on Sept 9, 2016 20:16:09 GMT
The reason we don't have a shuttle is that the designers of Tempest decided that the advantages of having a smaller ship that could easily operate within an atmosphere outweighed the potential advantages of having a shuttle, and having to enlarge the ship to fit the attendant support facilities. This would seem to be in keeping with Alliance military doctrine generally, as the one Alliance frigate we've actually seen - the SR-1 - did not, in fact, have a shuttle, and Tempest seems smaller still. I'm really not sure what you're getting at with the points I struck through. Why would any of that have anything to do with whether landing Tempest is sensible or not? Oh, and dismissing it all as 'rule of cool' seems a mite trite. (Though, in fairness, I'd hardly object even if that were the case--if it wasn't for 'rule of cool', there'd be no biotics, no faster than light travel, and no space battles in the franchise. Besides, as I pointed out, it'd be a 'rule of cool' that has been adhered to since the very first game with the SR-1, so it'd be a little odd to take issue with it now.) <<<<<<<<<<(0)>>>>>>>>>> Well, I'm also looking at this from the ARKCON mission planners point of view, "back home". Read up thread. I can't see the Alliance doctrine working in the Helius Cluster.... you are on your own here. You lose a ship, it won't be replaced and you can't call for help. The doctrine needs to be changed to the new situation. However, you are right regarding the size of the Tempest but its main mission is to ferry the crew to different star systems not to analyze the flora and fauna. We could argue that time was a factor, that corners were cut.. etc. But, at the end of the day, we have what we have. And, if it's fun to play the game... what more can one ask?
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You'll be peeling goddamn potatoes for the rest of your miserable excuse for a military career!
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Post by General Mahad on Sept 9, 2016 20:22:30 GMT
That looks badass, why didn't the trailer didn't do it justice?
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bshep
N5
We destroy them or they destroy us.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by bshep on Sept 9, 2016 20:27:03 GMT
Bioware haven't showed a trailer with the Tempest yet, just a behind the scenes video.
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Post by shechinah on Sept 9, 2016 20:35:05 GMT
Bioware haven't showed a trailer with the Tempest yet, just a behind the scenes video. It's appeared in the E3 2016 trailer and not just in the opening shot as far as I can remember. It can be seen flying on the desert planet.
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bshep
N5
We destroy them or they destroy us.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: MasterDassJennir
Prime Posts: 1876
Prime Likes: 376
Posts: 4,444 Likes: 7,936
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Post by bshep on Sept 9, 2016 20:36:38 GMT
Bioware haven't showed a trailer with the Tempest yet, just a behind the scenes video. It's appeared in the E3 2016 trailer and not just in the opening shot as far as I can remember. It can be seen flying on the desert planet. My mistake. Had forgotten that....
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Post by AlleluiaElizabeth on Sept 9, 2016 20:40:25 GMT
Funny, in that pic it looks smaller for some reason. I guess the ship is pretty far away. It does. I thought it was a fighter for a second. Like an F-18 sized plane, I mean. lol It must be the perspective. I think it is going to be a pretty small ship, though. Given the size of the ramp, how much ship space is still available behind the top of that ramp, and the size of a Mako, I'm guessing the Tempest must be smaller than the first Normandy. Then again, it might be Bigger on the Inside. I mean, the layout of the SR2 had a glaring issue for me that never made any structural sense, so this being a seemingly small ship, but still being comfortable on the inside with multiple decks is totally a possibility.
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Post by goishen on Sept 9, 2016 20:44:47 GMT
Or it could be just like I said, not meant for overnight missions. The Normandy had four floors. I don't think that this one is gonna any more than two. No crew bunks, no amenities, no fluff, maybe a doctor's closet, and a toilet. Oh, and a place for the Mako to launch from. That's about it.
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