Is new Bioware agaisnt christianity?

Jun 1, 2017 1:29:42 GMT q5tyhj said:

Its not what? Its a silly and naive notion that shows that he's out of his depth on the topic (like Hawking's idea about using philosophy to argue against using philosophy). Being a brilliant scientist doesn't preclude being a piss-poor theologian or philosopher, so just stick to do what you do best.

dude. this is the guy who came up with the concept of dark matter, the thing believed to control gravity that can't be see, touched, scaled, or calculated out side it effect of gravity. The thing Einstein hinted at existing. the thing that we can see no matter what but believes controls all gravity which we still don't understand.

Gravity the thing we don't know why it works yet always believes is there. So but the guy has a point. If we have faith gravity always works with out understanding why it works why would belief in god be stretch. And people who try to use science to argue ageists god never take note of this.

These guy's seen things and understand thing you don't and understand we don't have the answer and taking faith in thing we don't understand , they have a point.

if you don't understand then answer me this then...why does gravity work?

I'm not an expert, but from what I've seen of those scientists, their reasoning is that there is such perfection in nature, in the tiniest, most miniscule part of a possibly infinite universe, that it proves to them there's a divine hand behind it all. Rather than because they have faith that it works.

I mean, I'm basically agnostic, bordering on atheist, but even I wonder sometimes, when I see a sunset, or the stars twinkling down at me, or ponder a perfect spiral galaxy.

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Post by cobalt72 on Jun 1, 2017 2:30:07 GMT

I didn't watch the video but how long was he out there? I'm not an expert but I think it may be a problem if you're walking everywhere opposed to driving. I mean, the hazard doesn't become dangerous until you've been out for a bit or walked a lot

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Post by dreman999 on Jun 1, 2017 2:30:22 GMT

Jun 1, 2017 2:19:34 GMT R'Shara said:

dude. this is the guy who came up with the concept of dark matter, the thing believed to control gravity that can't be see, touched, scaled, or calculated out side it effect of gravity. The thing Einstein hinted at existing. the thing that we can see no matter what but believes controls all gravity which we still don't understand.

Gravity the thing we don't know why it works yet always believes is there. So but the guy has a point. If we have faith gravity always works with out understanding why it works why would belief in god be stretch. And people who try to use science to argue ageists god never take note of this.

These guy's seen things and understand thing you don't and understand we don't have the answer and taking faith in thing we don't understand , they have a point.

if you don't understand then answer me this then...why does gravity work?

I'm not an expert, but from what I've seen of those scientists, their reasoning is that there is such perfection in nature, in the tiniest, most miniscule part of a possibly infinite universe, that it proves to them there's a divine hand behind it all. Rather than because they have faith that it works.

I mean, I'm basically agnostic, bordering on atheist, but even I wonder sometimes, when I see a sunset, or the stars twinkling down at me, or ponder a perfect spiral galaxy.

That old school science. Newton's school of science belief. And Ironically perfect spiral galaxies lead to dark matter theory.

Anyway, I taking about perspective after they start looking into things not from before. when you reach the end of the mastery of the understand of what man knows about physic, you'll be surprised in how little we know. We have no guarantee the laws of physics will always stay the same later then what it is now.

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Is new Bioware agaisnt christianity? Jun 1, 2017 2:30:52 GMT

Post by alanc9 on Jun 1, 2017 2:30:52 GMT

Jun 1, 2017 1:57:05 GMT R'Shara said:

Then don't start an argument? I mean you know my opinion of this mechanic. You know I will defend my opinion. If you want to debate it I'm going to be down with it. But don't start a debate or argument then act like I'm the one that instigated it and claim to be attacked for it.

If you think it's fine then good for you. I've lived in the west and SW US all my life as do most of my friends. 120f is not dangerous unless you're being dumb.

You'd dislike the mechanic even if they used better numbers, right?

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Post by R'Shara on Jun 1, 2017 2:33:55 GMT

Jun 1, 2017 2:30:52 GMT alanc9 said:

Jun 1, 2017 1:57:05 GMT R'Shara said:

Then don't start an argument? I mean you know my opinion of this mechanic. You know I will defend my opinion. If you want to debate it I'm going to be down with it. But don't start a debate or argument then act like I'm the one that instigated it and claim to be attacked for it.

If you think it's fine then good for you. I've lived in the west and SW US all my life as do most of my friends. 120f is not dangerous unless you're being dumb.

You'd dislike the mechanic even if they used better numbers, right?

Actually, I think it'd have been fine if they didn't half ass it. As long as they also fixed Voeld never moderating. Something like 150F+ for level 1, 170F or 180F for level 2, and 200 for level 3 would have been very realistic numbers. Ditto with the cold and the radiation hazard. -50C isn't pleasant by any means, but people bundle up and live/work/play in that temperature all the time. -80, -100, -120C would have been realistic.

For radiation, the current level 1 hazard is background radiation that we live with every day. They seriously just picked numbers out of their asses.

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Post by dreman999 on Jun 1, 2017 2:39:42 GMT

Jun 1, 2017 2:17:20 GMT R'Shara said:

A black metal pan out in the sun for 2-3 hours is going to be far more than 120F, just so you know. And the guy doing it is not dying, is he? And he's out there the whole time it's cooking.

Edit: An egg requires a temperature of about 160F in order to become firm. I'll completely agree that 160F is pretty hazardous.

I'll give the point that what is going on with rdyer dieing in second on eleedan is bs but being outside when it;s hot like that can be super dangerous give an hour or 2......not in 5 second like with ryder but you know...

Video game logic...

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Is new Bioware agaisnt christianity? Jun 1, 2017 2:43:50 GMT

Post by R'Shara on Jun 1, 2017 2:43:50 GMT

Jun 1, 2017 2:39:42 GMT dreman999 said:

Jun 1, 2017 2:17:20 GMT R'Shara said:

A black metal pan out in the sun for 2-3 hours is going to be far more than 120F, just so you know. And the guy doing it is not dying, is he? And he's out there the whole time it's cooking.

Edit: An egg requires a temperature of about 160F in order to become firm. I'll completely agree that 160F is pretty hazardous.

I'll give the point that what is going on with rdyer dieing in second on eleedan is bs but being outside when it;s hot like that can be super dangerous give an hour or 2......not in 5 second like with ryder but you know...

Video game logic...

Yeah if you're outside in 120+ for hours, and you aren't careful, you could die. That's how those hikers died in death valley not so long ago. But even if you're not careful, it would take a while before it's dangerous, not the few min that Ryder (with LIFE SUPPORT) does. If you're careful, you can be out for hours and still be fine.

Just add an extra 20 or 30 degrees (either F or C) to the hazard levels, and I'll call it good.

www.nps.gov/deva/planyourvisit/summer-visit.htm

Lol the lit torch always made me facepalm.

Last Edit: Jun 1, 2017 2:45:40 GMT by R'Shara

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Post by q5tyhj on Jun 1, 2017 2:45:30 GMT

Jun 1, 2017 1:29:42 GMT q5tyhj said:

Its not what? Its a silly and naive notion that shows that he's out of his depth on the topic (like Hawking's idea about using philosophy to argue against using philosophy). Being a brilliant scientist doesn't preclude being a piss-poor theologian or philosopher, so just stick to do what you do best.

dude. this is the guy who came up with the concept of dark matter, the thing believed to control gravity that can't be see, touched, scaled, or calculated out side it effect of gravity. The thing Einstein hinted at existing. the thing that we can see no matter what but believes controls all gravity which we still don't understand.

Gravity the thing we don't know why it works yet always believes is there. So but the guy has a point. If we have faith gravity always works with out understanding why it works why would belief in god be stretch. And people who try to use science to argue ageists god never take note of this.

These guy's seen things and understand thing you don't and understand we don't have the answer and taking faith in thing we don't understand , they have a point.

if you don't understand then answer me this then...why does gravity work?

I know perfectly well who Heisenberg is. His credentials as a physicist are beyond reproach. Unfortunately, credentials in physics or other natural sciences don't carry over into other, non-science fields, like philosophy or theology. When it comes to a topic like the existence of God, Heisenberg has no special authority or qualifications.

And we don't have faith that gravity works, we know that gravity works. And that it will continue to work in the future as in the past is not a matter of faith, but a methodological assumption with an overwhelming amount of inductive support (in virtue of it never having failed to hold thus far). It falls short of a mathematical/logical certainty, sure, but there's a rather large gap between a matter of faith and a claim that is very inductively strong but still falls short of complete logical infallibility. The fact that we cannot know most things to a complete logical certainty, even in science, doesn't mean we have license to just believe things without evidence quite generally. I doubt Heisenberg thought that it did, I suspect that you're more reading your own ideas into the quote. My guess would be that he thinks either that his own work in quantum mechanics reveals the fundamentally random and even magical nature of reality in a way that indicates the handiwork of God, or perhaps just offers a glimpse of God's nature, or perhaps the more standard story about science being a descriptive endeavor that leaves the more existentially meaningful questions open to religion. Unfortunately, no way to know either way, as there is no citation for this quote and so no way to look at the context... or even verify if Heisenberg actually said it all. :-/

Last Edit: Jun 1, 2017 2:59:57 GMT by q5tyhj

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Is new Bioware agaisnt christianity? Jun 1, 2017 2:46:53 GMT

Post by R'Shara on Jun 1, 2017 2:46:53 GMT

dude. this is the guy who came up with the concept of dark matter, the thing believed to control gravity that can't be see, touched, scaled, or calculated out side it effect of gravity. The thing Einstein hinted at existing. the thing that we can see no matter what but believes controls all gravity which we still don't understand.

Gravity the thing we don't know why it works yet always believes is there. So but the guy has a point. If we have faith gravity always works with out understanding why it works why would belief in god be stretch. And people who try to use science to argue ageists god never take note of this.

These guy's seen things and understand thing you don't and understand we don't have the answer and taking faith in thing we don't understand , they have a point.

if you don't understand then answer me this then...why does gravity work?

I know perfectly well who Heisenberg is. His credentials as a physicist are beyond reproach. Unfortunately, credentials in physics or other natural sciences don't carry over into other, non-science fields, like philosophy or theology. When it comes to a topic like the existence of God, Heisenberg has no special authority or qualifications.

And we don't have faith that gravity works, we know that gravity works. And that it will continue to work in the future as in the past is not a matter of faith, but a methodological assumption with an overwhelming amount of inductive support (in virtue of it never having failed to hold thus far). It falls short of a mathematical/logical certainty, sure, but there's a rather large gap between a matter of faith and a claim that is very inductively strong but still falls short of complete logical infallibility. The fact that we cannot know most things to a complete logical certainty, even in science, doesn't mean we have license to just believe things without evidence quite generally. I doubt Heisenberg thought that it did, I suspect that you're more reading your own ideas into the quote. My guess would be that he thinks either that his own work in quantum mechanics reveals the fundamentally random and even magical nature of reality in a way that indicates the handiwork of God, or perhaps just offers a glimpse of God's nature, or perhaps the more standard story about science being a descriptive endeavor that leaves the more existentially meaningful questions open to religion. Unfortunately, no way to know either way, as there is no citation for this quote and so no way to look at the context... or even verify if Heisenberg actually said it all. :-/

That's how I always took it.

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Is new Bioware agaisnt christianity? Jun 1, 2017 2:52:28 GMT KaiserShep, dragontartare, and 1 more like this

Post by thats1evildude on Jun 1, 2017 2:52:28 GMT

May 31, 2017 20:06:27 GMT @privateinvestigator said:

May 31, 2017 20:04:58 GMT Kabraxal said:

Huh? God is a robot? How did you get that?

And given that Inquisition has the best and most mature handling of faith and religion, it seems Bioware isn't hating anything.

Inquisition demonized the Chantry/Tenplars which is the closest christianity that works has.

You could make that argument about Dragon Age 2, but DAI portrays the Templars pretty fairly. I think they come off as more heroic than the rebel mages, personally.

Sure, the Red Templars are evil, but many of them were also corrupted against their will.

Last Edit: Jun 1, 2017 2:55:08 GMT by thats1evildude

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Is new Bioware agaisnt christianity? Jun 1, 2017 3:09:27 GMT

Post by dreman999 on Jun 1, 2017 3:09:27 GMT

dude. this is the guy who came up with the concept of dark matter, the thing believed to control gravity that can't be see, touched, scaled, or calculated out side it effect of gravity. The thing Einstein hinted at existing. the thing that we can see no matter what but believes controls all gravity which we still don't understand.

Gravity the thing we don't know why it works yet always believes is there. So but the guy has a point. If we have faith gravity always works with out understanding why it works why would belief in god be stretch. And people who try to use science to argue ageists god never take note of this.

These guy's seen things and understand thing you don't and understand we don't have the answer and taking faith in thing we don't understand , they have a point.

if you don't understand then answer me this then...why does gravity work?

I know perfectly well who Heisenberg is. His credentials as a physicist are beyond reproach. Unfortunately, credentials in physics or other natural sciences don't carry over into other, non-science fields, like philosophy or theology. When it comes to a topic like the existence of God, Heisenberg has no special authority or qualifications.

And we don't have faith that gravity works, we know that gravity works. And that it will continue to work in the future as in the past is not a matter of faith, but a methodological assumption with an overwhelming amount of inductive support (in virtue of it never having failed to hold thus far). It falls short of a mathematical/logical certainty, sure, but there's a rather large gap between a matter of faith and a claim that is very inductively strong but still falls short of complete logical infallibility. The fact that we cannot know most things to a complete logical certainty, even in science, doesn't mean we have license to just believe things without evidence quite generally. I doubt Heisenberg thought that it did, I suspect that you're more reading your own ideas into the quote. My guess would be that he thinks either that his own work in quantum mechanics reveals the fundamentally random and even magical nature of reality in a way that indicates the handiwork of God, or perhaps just offers a glimpse of God's nature, or perhaps the more standard story about science being a descriptive endeavor that leaves the more existentially meaningful questions open to religion. Unfortunately, no way to know either way, as there is no citation for this quote and so no way to look at the context... or even verify if Heisenberg actually said it all. :-/

Of course it's a matter of faith. Would you put your faith is something you don't full understand and that no one else fully understands? The issue is a question of consistency. The thing with gravity we trust it because it show no reason to change it's standard action. But that does not mean it can't one day change it action. Nothing says the laws of physic will not one day change and the gravity will act differently. Heck, it's theories there places in existed that gravity does work differently. Yet we still trust gravity will not suddenly change. That's faith. Ofcouse you can say you can trust it because it shows no signs of change...but that that's the thing, we don't know enough about it to be able to say that. We don't know if there is any elements out side our perspective that can change it. We are 3 dimensional beings and if there is a dimensional of reality out there that can effect our plains gravity which we can't see or even touch, how can we say it would not come in contact with us and effect our gravity that it will change. aka murphy's law.

if something outside our perspective of reality can change how our gravity works in our plain then it can one day happen. And here we are saying gravity will not changed.....that is faith.

that's his point. We don't know enough to know why things work and if they continue work...yet we have faith that it will do in science. irony is the purest form.

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Is new Bioware agaisnt christianity? Jun 1, 2017 3:16:52 GMT

Post by R'Shara on Jun 1, 2017 3:16:52 GMT

I know perfectly well who Heisenberg is. His credentials as a physicist are beyond reproach. Unfortunately, credentials in physics or other natural sciences don't carry over into other, non-science fields, like philosophy or theology. When it comes to a topic like the existence of God, Heisenberg has no special authority or qualifications.

And we don't have faith that gravity works, we know that gravity works. And that it will continue to work in the future as in the past is not a matter of faith, but a methodological assumption with an overwhelming amount of inductive support (in virtue of it never having failed to hold thus far). It falls short of a mathematical/logical certainty, sure, but there's a rather large gap between a matter of faith and a claim that is very inductively strong but still falls short of complete logical infallibility. The fact that we cannot know most things to a complete logical certainty, even in science, doesn't mean we have license to just believe things without evidence quite generally. I doubt Heisenberg thought that it did, I suspect that you're more reading your own ideas into the quote. My guess would be that he thinks either that his own work in quantum mechanics reveals the fundamentally random and even magical nature of reality in a way that indicates the handiwork of God, or perhaps just offers a glimpse of God's nature, or perhaps the more standard story about science being a descriptive endeavor that leaves the more existentially meaningful questions open to religion. Unfortunately, no way to know either way, as there is no citation for this quote and so no way to look at the context... or even verify if Heisenberg actually said it all. :-/

Of course it's a matter of faith. Would you put your faith is something you don't full understand and that no one else fully understands? The issue is a question of consistency. The thing with gravity we trust it because it show no reason to change it's standard action. But that does not mean it can't one day change it action. Nothing says the laws of physic will not one day change and the gravity will act differently. Heck, it's theories there places in existed that gravity does work differently. Yet we still trust gravity will not suddenly change. That's faith. Ofcouse you can say you can trust it because it shows no signs of change...but that that's the thing, we don't know enough about it to be able to say that. We don't know if there is any elements out side our perspective that can change it. We are 3 dimensional beings and if there is a dimensional of reality out there that can effect our plains gravity which we can't see or even touch, how can we say it would not come in contact with us and effect our gravity that it will change. aka murphy's law.

if something outside our perspective of reality can change how our gravity works in our plain then it can one day happen. And here we are saying gravity will not changed.....that is faith.

that's his point. We don't know enough to know why things work and if they continue work...yet we have faith that it will do in science. irony is the purest form.

I really don't think that's what he meant. Only my opinion, but it's basically you get so deep in science that it gets to the point where it seems divine. I don't know if you've ever read anything by Carl Sagan, but that was basically what he believed. That science proved the existence of God by its very perfection.

Edit: Sorry, that's what he wrote about in some of his books, not necessarily what he believed.

Last Edit: Jun 1, 2017 3:23:46 GMT by R'Shara

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Is new Bioware agaisnt christianity? Jun 1, 2017 3:25:56 GMT

Post by dreman999 on Jun 1, 2017 3:25:56 GMT

Jun 1, 2017 3:16:52 GMT R'Shara said:

Of course it's a matter of faith. Would you put your faith is something you don't full understand and that no one else fully understands? The issue is a question of consistency. The thing with gravity we trust it because it show no reason to change it's standard action. But that does not mean it can't one day change it action. Nothing says the laws of physic will not one day change and the gravity will act differently. Heck, it's theories there places in existed that gravity does work differently. Yet we still trust gravity will not suddenly change. That's faith. Ofcouse you can say you can trust it because it shows no signs of change...but that that's the thing, we don't know enough about it to be able to say that. We don't know if there is any elements out side our perspective that can change it. We are 3 dimensional beings and if there is a dimensional of reality out there that can effect our plains gravity which we can't see or even touch, how can we say it would not come in contact with us and effect our gravity that it will change. aka murphy's law.

if something outside our perspective of reality can change how our gravity works in our plain then it can one day happen. And here we are saying gravity will not changed.....that is faith.

that's his point. We don't know enough to know why things work and if they continue work...yet we have faith that it will do in science. irony is the purest form.

I really don't think that's what he meant. Only my opinion, but it's basically you get so deep in science that it gets to the point where it seems divine. I don't know if you've ever read anything by Carl Sagan, but that was basically what he believed. That science proved the existence of God by its very perfection.

that's still the same thing. You come to a point you just don't have the answers for everything and find that things just work. It then takes years even life times to get the answers. that fact that we put trust in something we don't understand why it work with no way to tell if it will change one day or not is a matter of faith.

We believe gravity will always work even if there maybe a chance one day it may change from how it works now. that is the defintion of faith to the letter

faith.http://www.dictionary.com/browse/faith
confidence or trust in a person or thing

the fact that we don't question that gravity will work is the definition of faith.

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Is new Bioware agaisnt christianity? Jun 1, 2017 3:26:01 GMT R'Shara likes this

Post by alanc9 on Jun 1, 2017 3:26:01 GMT

And we don't have faith that gravity works, we know that gravity works. And that it will continue to work in the future as in the past is not a matter of faith, but a methodological assumption with an overwhelming amount of inductive support (in virtue of it never having failed to hold thus far). It falls short of a mathematical/logical certainty, sure, but there's a rather large gap between a matter of faith and a claim that is very inductively strong but still falls short of complete logical infallibility.

Of course it's a matter of faith. Would you put your faith is something you don't full understand and that no one else fully understands? The issue is a question of consistency. The thing with gravity we trust it because it show no reason to change it's standard action. But that does not mean it can't one day change it action. Nothing says the laws of physic will not one day change and the gravity will act differently. Heck, it's theories there places in existed that gravity does work differently. Yet we still trust gravity will not suddenly change. That's faith. Ofcouse you can say you can trust it because it shows no signs of change...but that that's the thing, we don't know enough about it to be able to say that. We don't know if there is any elements out side our perspective that can change it. We are 3 dimensional beings and if there is a dimensional of reality out there that can effect our plains gravity which we can't see or even touch, how can we say it would not come in contact with us and effect our gravity that it will change. aka murphy's law.

if something outside our perspective of reality can change how our gravity works in our plain then it can one day happen. And here we are saying gravity will not changed.....that is faith.

that's his point. We don't know enough to know why things work and if they continue work...yet we have faith that it will do in science. irony is the purest form.

What's the difference between "faith" and "a methodological assumption with an overwhelming amount of inductive support," exactly? Is there a substantive dispute here, or is this just rhetoric?

I suppose there's a nonzero probability that gravity will suddenly stop working the way it always has, but the probability of that is so low that it's not worth my time to think about. Is that "faith"? I thought faith was a little more robust than that.

Last Edit: Jun 1, 2017 3:29:42 GMT by alanc9

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Is new Bioware agaisnt christianity? Jun 1, 2017 3:28:39 GMT

Post by R'Shara on Jun 1, 2017 3:28:39 GMT

[Carl Sagan] rejected the label of “atheist” because he was open to the possibility that science would perhaps one day find compelling evidence to prove God. Nevertheless, he thought that the likelihood of that happening was very small. Instead, Sagan talked about “spirituality“ as something that happens within the realm of material world, when humans encounter nature and are filled with awe.

In his book, The Demon-Haunted World: Science as a Candle in the Dark, Sagan writes:

“Science is not only compatible with spirituality; it is a profound source of spirituality. When we recognize our place in an immensity of light years and in the passage of ages, when we grasp the intricacy, beauty and subtlety of life, then that soaring feeling, that sense of elation and humility combined, is surely spiritual.”

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Is new Bioware agaisnt christianity? Jun 1, 2017 3:29:19 GMT R'Shara likes this

Post by q5tyhj on Jun 1, 2017 3:29:19 GMT