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Post by RageUnderFire on Sept 16, 2016 20:47:36 GMT
Think Miranda from ME2. It was clear right from the opening bell that your video game girlfriend was going to have a bigger role than any other sidekick.
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Post by bshep on Sept 16, 2016 21:05:43 GMT
Sure she and Jacob were connected to the story but if you are going to be fair Mordin, Legion and Tali had a much bigger role thanks to their storylines (Genophage and QuarianXGeth conflict).
So i don't agree with you OP.
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Post by themikefest on Sept 16, 2016 21:06:01 GMT
Its hard for her to be a girlfriend for those that play as femshep. I do believe that she would've played a bigger role in ME3 since she was one of TIM's top operatives. But, unfortunately, she got reduced to cameos instead
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Post by themikefest on Sept 16, 2016 21:09:28 GMT
Sure she and Jacob were connected to the story but if you are going to be fair Mordin, Legion and Tali had a much bigger role thanks to their storylines (Genophage and QuarianXGeth conflict). So i don't agree with you OP. Mordin wasn't required since Padok Wiks takes his place while still able to cure the genophage. Legion and Tali are only required for peace. Tali didn't have to be a squadmate for that.
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Post by Nihilus on Sept 16, 2016 21:09:51 GMT
I personally really hope they won't do this. I think all aspects should get an equal amount of love, sidekicks included. But I guess there are exceptions as long as it fits the overarching story being told, and in this regard I think that Miranda wasn't too bad.
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Post by Dukemon on Sept 16, 2016 21:11:14 GMT
I thought Miranda was the protagonist.^^ Shepard the beautiful eye catcher.
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Post by Beerfish on Sept 16, 2016 21:17:29 GMT
I thought Miranda was the protagonist.^^ Shepard the beautiful eye catcher. Butt shots!
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Post by RoboticWater on Sept 16, 2016 21:28:42 GMT
Did she though? Every crew member got a lot of screen time. I'd bet she would have the most only because she's one of the two starting members as well as a significant relationship with Cerberus, but even then her presence probably only wins out by a small margin. I don't think you could definitively chalk her up as the "co-star" unless you deliberately made it that way. It's not like every conversation you have with TIM goes through her. I wouldn't actually mind it if they did though. If it makes sense plot-wise why not?
Liara is the closest thing Mass Effect has to co-star considering how integral she is to each game's plot. I don't mind that dynamic in theory, but in practice Liara's character progression was a bit awkward. If we got a better sense of how she became a badass information broker, I'm sure that would have been cleared up. It would also help if she was less of a Mary Sue. If I'm going to be opposite a character for a long time, I'd like for them to have more interesting (even unsavory) facets about them (e.g. Mordin).
However, if we want to extend the definition of co-star out to the antagonist, then my answer is definitely. The central plot of nearly every BioWare game has lived or died on the shoulders of its antagonist, mainly because BioWare seem incapable of making a coherent plot that's inherently interesting. Since I have little faith that BioWare will just miraculously start writing deep and coordinated plot-lines after all these years, I can at least hope that the villain will get enough attention to distract from the inconsistencies. I'm fairly confident that the main narrative arcs of Mass Effect 2-3 and DA:I would have been as well regarded as Mass Effect 1's if their antagonists were deeper characters with enough screen time to develop.
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Post by bshep on Sept 16, 2016 21:41:23 GMT
Sure she and Jacob were connected to the story but if you are going to be fair Mordin, Legion and Tali had a much bigger role thanks to their storylines (Genophage and QuarianXGeth conflict). So i don't agree with you OP. Mordin wasn't required since Padok Wiks takes his place while still able to cure the genophage. Legion and Tali are only required for peace. Tali didn't have to be a squadmate for that. You do know the OP was talking about ME2 and i was answering based on that game, right? Besides i was talking about having bigger roles in the story not about being required to it. And talking about requirement in ME3 is kinda silly because everyone involved in the main story had a replacement character (apart from Liara).
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Post by wright1978 on Sept 16, 2016 21:50:48 GMT
Loved Miranda in ME2 and she accompanied my Shep everywhere and was his significant other. I still don't think i'd describe her as a co-star. Jacob and her had a more active role in between missions content because of their role in the story as part of link to cerberus. I don't mind if there's similar justification for more active involvement this time round either.
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Post by Rascoth on Sept 16, 2016 21:59:47 GMT
I don't think she got that much more screen time than other companions. And I agree with RoboticWater . If there's anyone closest to being co-star (though, imo, not close enough to being called like that), it's Liara.
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Post by linksocarina on Sept 16, 2016 22:06:31 GMT
Sure she and Jacob were connected to the story but if you are going to be fair Mordin, Legion and Tali had a much bigger role thanks to their storylines (Genophage and QuarianXGeth conflict). So i don't agree with you OP. Mordin wasn't required since Padok Wiks takes his place while still able to cure the genophage. Legion and Tali are only required for peace. Tali didn't have to be a squadmate for that. Neither is Miranda to be fair... Liara is pretty much the only one to fit that bill.
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Post by themikefest on Sept 16, 2016 22:09:47 GMT
Mordin wasn't required since Padok Wiks takes his place while still able to cure the genophage. Legion and Tali are only required for peace. Tali didn't have to be a squadmate for that. You do know the OP was talking about ME2 and i was answering based on that game, right? If Mordin's loyalty mission isn't completed, there's nothing about the genophage in ME2 except for a few lines from Mordin. Legion and Tali don't have to be recruited in ME2
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Post by themikefest on Sept 16, 2016 22:12:52 GMT
Mordin wasn't required since Padok Wiks takes his place while still able to cure the genophage. Legion and Tali are only required for peace. Tali didn't have to be a squadmate for that. Neither is Miranda to be fair... Liara is pretty much the only one to fit that bill. After Mars she isn't. Sure she's on Thessia, but shouldn't of been required
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RageUnderFire
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Post by RageUnderFire on Sept 16, 2016 22:25:41 GMT
Its hard for her to be a girlfriend for those that play as femshep. I do believe that she would've played a bigger role in ME3 since she was one of TIM's top operatives. But, unfortunately, she got reduced to cameos instead BroShep is the only true hero!
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Post by RageUnderFire on Sept 16, 2016 22:29:39 GMT
Sure she and Jacob were connected to the story but if you are going to be fair Mordin, Legion and Tali had a much bigger role thanks to their storylines (Genophage and QuarianXGeth conflict). So i don't agree with you OP. Both Legion and Tali came way too late in the game. Simply put they didn't get enough screen time. Matter of fact Quarians always seemed like a background race.
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Post by bshep on Sept 16, 2016 22:30:10 GMT
You do know the OP was talking about ME2 and i was answering based on that game, right? If Mordin's loyalty mission isn't completed, there's nothing about the genophage in ME2 except for a few lines from Mordin. Legion and Tali don't have to be recruited in ME2 So? The biggest storylines and the most important characters in them (ME2) apart from the main quest are still the same Mordin, Tali and Legion. Miranda's is only involved in a big role in the starter quest(Minuteman Station and Freedom's Progress) until you find Joker and the Normandy SR-2.
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Post by bshep on Sept 16, 2016 22:32:51 GMT
Sure she and Jacob were connected to the story but if you are going to be fair Mordin, Legion and Tali had a much bigger role thanks to their storylines (Genophage and QuarianXGeth conflict). So i don't agree with you OP. Both Legion and Tali came way too late in the game. Simply put they didn't get enough screen time. Matter of fact Quarians always seemed like a background race. I am just pointing out even then have bigger roles in the story than Miranda. Like some people already said Liara would be a much better option to the role considering all her story in the trilogy, but even then i would not classify her as such.
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Post by RageUnderFire on Sept 16, 2016 22:35:53 GMT
I'll walk everyone through this.
During Part 2:
*Miranda is the very first character you see. She's the star of one of the few cut scenes of the game. Bioware clearly wanted to showcase her.
*Miranda brings your azz back to life and is the very first face you see. She has a maternal bond with Shepard in a strange way.
*Miranda is often at the decision making table
*Miranda is the second person in charge in the chain of command for the Normandy
*Miranda was designed to fit onto any squad regardless of your job class. Her amazing squad boosting passives pretty much screamed please use me all the time master
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Post by themikefest on Sept 16, 2016 22:36:10 GMT
So? The biggest storylines and the most important characters in them (ME2) apart from the main quest are still the same Mordin, Tali and Legion. Miranda's is only involved in a big role in the starter quest(Minuteman Station and Freedom's Progress) until you find Joker and the Normandy SR-2. Mordin I get. More for dealing with the seeker swarms than anything else. The other two? If they're that important, they should've been required. Since they aren't, they aren't important, at least when it comes to ME2
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Post by Nayawk on Sept 16, 2016 22:58:11 GMT
Surely this depends on how you play the game, you have control and each character can have as much or as little screen time as you desire. Yes there might be a rough path mapped out in the devs minds of how the average play through would go, but just because it is there doesn't mean you have to do it.
Personally I barely talk to Miranda outside of getting off the station and acquiring the Normandy, after that she is on her own. Same with Liara, she is always the recruited in ME1 at the every last moment and gets pretty much ignored from then on out.
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Post by PapaCharlie9 on Sept 16, 2016 23:14:19 GMT
Think Miranda from ME2. It was clear right from the opening bell that your video game girlfriend was going to have a bigger role than any other sidekick. Whew! I thought you were going to say Diana Allers and I was going to reply "NO!" I still don't understand why Shep couldn't punch her. BTW, let me fix your OP for you: "Think Miranda from ME2. It was clear right from the opening bell that your video game girlfriend was going to have a bigger role in marketing the game and promotional collateral (posters, web ads, whatnot) than any other sidekick." And if you were a producer and cast Yvonne Strahovski, you'd do the same thing, since she was a hot property at the time. What ever happened to her?
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Post by sageoflife on Sept 16, 2016 23:30:35 GMT
No. It does nothing but anger players who prefer other squadmates.
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Post by Fogg on Sept 16, 2016 23:41:22 GMT
Sure she and Jacob were connected to the story but if you are going to be fair Mordin, Legion and Tali had a much bigger role thanks to their storylines (Genophage and QuarianXGeth conflict). So i don't agree with you OP. A discussion with quality arguments? BSN is officially dead...
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Post by Sartoz on Sept 17, 2016 0:08:47 GMT
Did she though? Every crew member got a lot of screen time. I'd bet she would have the most only because she's one of the two starting members as well as a significant relationship with Cerberus, but even then her presence probably only wins out by a small margin. I don't think you could definitively chalk her up as the "co-star" unless you deliberately made it that way. It's not like every conversation you have with TIM goes through her. I wouldn't actually mind it if they did though. If it makes sense plot-wise why not? Liara is the closest thing Mass Effect has to co-star considering how integral she is to each game's plot. I don't mind that dynamic in theory, but in practice Liara's character progression was a bit awkward. If we got a better sense of how she became a badass information broker, I'm sure that would have been cleared up. It would also help if she was less of a Mary Sue. If I'm going to be opposite a character for a long time, I'd like for them to have more interesting (even unsavory) facets about them (e.g. Mordin). However, if we want to extend the definition of co-star out to the antagonist, then my answer is definitely. The central plot of nearly every BioWare game has lived or died on the shoulders of its antagonist, mainly because BioWare seem incapable of making a coherent plot that's inherently interesting. Since I have little faith that BioWare will just miraculously start writing deep and coordinated plot-lines after all these years, I can at least hope that the villain will get enough attention to distract from the inconsistencies. I'm fairly confident that the main narrative arcs of Mass Effect 2-3 and DA:I would have been as well regarded as Mass Effect 1's if their antagonists were deeper characters with enough screen time to develop. <<<<<<<<<(0)>>>>>>>>> Hm... I would say that, in this story, the human antagonist is killed off, once the Krogan loyalty mission is successfully over. Ryder will then encounter the other foes such as the Khet, pirates and possibly other races. The latter is where fragile alliances come into the picture. Personally, I bet the Khet is our main foe and not one individual.
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