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Post by griffith82 on Aug 6, 2017 20:30:20 GMT
that's the problem though. Fine many people like playing that type of a character... I even played my Ryder like that a little...but Shepard is something at this point i wouldn't call even a character. He was a caricature. So bad infact that the only growth they gave him was tob turn him.into a religious icon. But the truly bad thing was nothing he was given was earned. He was given everything 'because protagonist'. Ryder on the other hand had to earn everything he was given and constantly prove himself. Good point. I'm sure Shepard started off along the same lines (hell, my Shepard grew up on the streets) but the reality is Ryder is at a totally different point of his career. By the end of the game I'd argue Ryder is well on his way to being every bit the badass that Shepard was, even if he is more Picard than Kirk. Kirk got annoying over time. Picard on the other hand. |
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Post by KaiserShep on Aug 6, 2017 20:36:25 GMT
that's the problem though. Fine many people like playing that type of a character... I even played my Ryder like that a little...but Shepard is something at this point i wouldn't call even a character. He was a caricature. So bad infact that the only growth they gave him was tob turn him.into a religious icon. But the truly bad thing was nothing he was given was earned. He was given everything 'because protagonist'. Ryder on the other hand had to earn everything he was given and constantly prove himself. Take SAM away and see how effective Ryder was.... Well, really no worse off than Shepard would be. If you disregarded the story and just threw Shepard into Ryder's situation, Shep would be just as screwed without the AI to interpret languages and activate alien technology. Look at the Collector Ship mission. When the trap is set, the ship locks down and the team is trapped. The only reason they get out is because EDI's cyberwarfare suite opens up doorways and points the way out. They would have died right then and there if EDI wasn't there to hack the ship's systems. |
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Post by colfoley on Aug 6, 2017 20:36:44 GMT
JJ Kirk > Kirk > Picard.
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jaegerbane
N3
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: JaegerBane
PSN: JaegerBane
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Post by jaegerbane on Aug 6, 2017 20:56:17 GMT
Take SAM away and see how effective Ryder was.... Well, really no worse off than Shepard would be. If you disregarded the story and just threw Shepard into Ryder's situation, Shep would be just as screwed without the AI to interpret languages and activate alien technology. Look at the Collector Ship mission. When the trap is set, the ship locks down and the team is trapped. The only reason they get out is because EDI's cyberwarfare suite opens up doorways and points the way out. They would have died right then and there if EDI wasn't there to hack the ship's systems. Pretty much that. Shepard even admits as much during the debrief. |
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warrior
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I don't like MP!
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by warrior on Aug 6, 2017 20:57:22 GMT
Picard is so much better than Kirk!!!!!
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Post by majesticjazz on Aug 6, 2017 21:08:19 GMT
And Jacob mentioned that if it were anyone else (as in not Shepard), the project wouldnt have been successful. Yeah, Shepard's a badass. I mean the character has become a staple for Bioware along with Revan. Furthermore, femShep os no doubt one of the more popular female protagonist in videogames If Bioware were to create a prequel ME game about Shepard it would print money. Yes, Shepard is indeed a badass. Only after three games, and with a backstory that already established them as a hero. To expect Ryder to be the same after one game and a vastly different backstory comes across as both entitled and a bit stupid. It didnt take Revan and The Hero of Fereldan only had one game and look how popular they were. |
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Post by majesticjazz on Aug 6, 2017 21:21:02 GMT
And Jacob mentioned that if it were anyone else (as in not Shepard), the project wouldnt have been successful. Yeah, Shepard's a badass. I mean the character has become a staple for Bioware along with Revan. Furthermore, femShep is no doubt one of the more popular female protagonist in videogames and really helped propel more female hero's in videogames. Ryder stands on the shoulders Shepards success. If Bioware were to create a prequel ME game about Shepard it would print money. when someone stands on the shoulders it means they are reaching higher... No, it means that someone else paved the way. You cannot act like Shepard is some 2bit hero that nobody cares about. The people at the EA E3 2014 media conference shouted in loud applause when Shepard was shown. You can like Ryder all you want, but to sit there and act like Shepard had no positive effect for Bioware and WRPGs in general is to be a bit naive. Again, FemShep (which many people say is the definitive Shepard) was a huge factor in having devs put female heros in the front seat without having to sexualize them. Say what you want about Shepard but his/her legacy is up there with some of the greatest game heros of all time and this isnt just what MajesticJazz is saying, but many fans and media alike. |
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Post by samhain444 on Aug 6, 2017 21:34:51 GMT
Keep the hope alive, buddy
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Post by colfoley on Aug 6, 2017 21:40:33 GMT
when someone stands on the shoulders it means they are reaching higher... No, it means that someone else paved the way. You cannot act like Shepard is some 2bit hero that nobody cares about. The people at the EA E3 2014 media conference shouted in loud applause when Shepard was shown. You can like Ryder all you want, but to sit there and act like Shepard had no positive effect for Bioware and WRPGs in general is to be a bit naive. Again, FemShep (which many people say is the definitive Shepard) was a huge factor in having devs put female heros in the front seat without having to sexualize them. Say what you want about Shepard but his/her legacy is up there with some of the greatest game heros of all time and this isnt just what MajesticJazz is saying, but many fans and media alike. I'm not saying Shepard is a two bit hero. Nor am i saying he isn't popular. He clearly is. Hell i enjoyed playing Shepard immensely. Just saying i prefer Ryder from a character and role playing sense. |
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Post by suikoden on Aug 6, 2017 21:49:59 GMT
No, it means that someone else paved the way. You cannot act like Shepard is some 2bit hero that nobody cares about. The people at the EA E3 2014 media conference shouted in loud applause when Shepard was shown. You can like Ryder all you want, but to sit there and act like Shepard had no positive effect for Bioware and WRPGs in general is to be a bit naive. Again, FemShep (which many people say is the definitive Shepard) was a huge factor in having devs put female heros in the front seat without having to sexualize them. Say what you want about Shepard but his/her legacy is up there with some of the greatest game heros of all time and this isnt just what MajesticJazz is saying, but many fans and media alike. I'm not saying Shepard is a two bit hero. Nor am i saying he isn't popular. He clearly is. Hell i enjoyed playing Shepard immensely. Just saying i prefer Ryder from a character and role playing sense. I think in general, video games represent an escape from reality for players, and along those lines, they prefer to play the archetype heroes that they'll never be in real life. That's why people love Shepard - whereas Ryder is more of a common man/woman, who also happens to be a complete, socially awkward loser that nobody respects. It's no surprise that people dislike the character. |
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Guts on Aug 6, 2017 21:54:55 GMT
Good point. I'm sure Shepard started off along the same lines (hell, my Shepard grew up on the streets) but the reality is Ryder is at a totally different point of his career. By the end of the game I'd argue Ryder is well on his way to being every bit the badass that Shepard was, even if he is more Picard than Kirk. Kirk got annoying over time. Picard on the other hand. Sorry I couldn't resist. |
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Post by griffith82 on Aug 6, 2017 21:55:49 GMT
I'm not saying Shepard is a two bit hero. Nor am i saying he isn't popular. He clearly is. Hell i enjoyed playing Shepard immensely. Just saying i prefer Ryder from a character and role playing sense. I think in general, video games represent an escape from reality for players, and along those lines, they prefer to play the archetype heroes that they'll never be in real life. That's why people love Shepard - whereas Ryder is more of a common man/woman, who also happens to be a complete, socially awkward loser that nobody respects. It's no surprise that people dislike the character. I can partly agree here. When I've had a rough day I go to trusty ol GTA. |
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Post by colfoley on Aug 6, 2017 21:57:14 GMT
I'm not saying Shepard is a two bit hero. Nor am i saying he isn't popular. He clearly is. Hell i enjoyed playing Shepard immensely. Just saying i prefer Ryder from a character and role playing sense. I think in general, video games represent an escape from reality for players, and along those lines, they prefer to play the archetype heroes that they'll never be in real life. That's why people love Shepard - whereas Ryder is more of a common man/woman, who also happens to be a complete, socially awkward loser that nobody respects. It's no surprise that people dislike the character. you are right. Well except for everything after 'socially awkward'. But people Sure like playing their uber.mensches. |
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Post by griffith82 on Aug 6, 2017 21:59:26 GMT
Kirk got annoying over time. Picard on the other hand. Sorry I couldn't resist. Ah the scene that inspired one of the best mid season cliffhangers on Stargate Atlantis. |
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Post by samhain444 on Aug 6, 2017 22:01:27 GMT
I'm not saying Shepard is a two bit hero. Nor am i saying he isn't popular. He clearly is. Hell i enjoyed playing Shepard immensely. Just saying i prefer Ryder from a character and role playing sense. I think in general, video games represent an escape from reality for players, and along those lines, they prefer to play the archetype heroes that they'll never be in real life. That's why people love Shepard - whereas Ryder is more of a common man/woman, who also happens to be a complete, socially awkward loser that nobody respects. It's no surprise that people dislike the character. Yep, nobody respects Ryder by the end... Oh, expect the crew The Moshae The Nexus leadership The entire Angaran people The Krogan Aksuul even Yep, nobody except pretty much the entire cast of the game |
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Post by suikoden on Aug 6, 2017 22:16:11 GMT
I think in general, video games represent an escape from reality for players, and along those lines, they prefer to play the archetype heroes that they'll never be in real life. That's why people love Shepard - whereas Ryder is more of a common man/woman, who also happens to be a complete, socially awkward loser that nobody respects. It's no surprise that people dislike the character. Yep, nobody respects Ryder by the end... Oh, expect the crew The Moshae The Nexus leadership The entire Angaran people The Krogan Aksuul even Yep, nobody except pretty much the entire cast of the game When it takes 5 minutes of playing Ryder to realize that it'll take another 99 hours before anyone respects you because you're playing a socially awkward loser - that's not a good thing. |
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N3
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 788 Likes: 780
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Guts on Aug 6, 2017 22:17:31 GMT
I'm not saying Shepard is a two bit hero. Nor am i saying he isn't popular. He clearly is. Hell i enjoyed playing Shepard immensely. Just saying i prefer Ryder from a character and role playing sense. I think in general, video games represent an escape from reality for players, and along those lines, they prefer to play the archetype heroes that they'll never be in real life. That's why people love Shepard - whereas Ryder is more of a common man/woman, who also happens to be a complete, socially awkward loser that nobody respects. It's no surprise that people dislike the character. Somehow I feel I'm kind of the opposite. I find it more enjoyable playing some average schmuck. |
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 788 Likes: 780
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Post by Guts on Aug 6, 2017 22:18:33 GMT
I think in general, video games represent an escape from reality for players, and along those lines, they prefer to play the archetype heroes that they'll never be in real life. That's why people love Shepard - whereas Ryder is more of a common man/woman, who also happens to be a complete, socially awkward loser that nobody respects. It's no surprise that people dislike the character. Yep, nobody respects Ryder by the end... Oh, expect the crew The Moshae The Nexus leadership The entire Angaran people The Krogan Aksuul even Yep, nobody except pretty much the entire cast of the game I noticed this when playing the game, that people didn't really respect you until a bit of a ways into the game. It's one of the few aspects of the story that I liked. |
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cobalt72
N2
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
Posts: 175 Likes: 340
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Post by cobalt72 on Aug 6, 2017 22:20:29 GMT
Eh, I'd rather play as an average nobody who earns people's respect. While I enjoyed playing as Shepard I disliked how he was already pretty much a hero at the start of the first game.
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Post by vonuber on Aug 6, 2017 22:20:56 GMT
I think in general, video games represent an escape from reality for players, and along those lines, they prefer to play the archetype heroes that they'll never be in real life. Which is true for a certain type of player, yes, whose own life is nothing 'special' and they want to feel powerful to cover their own perceived inadequacies. I could see the attraction when I was younger, now I find it a bit sad as life is for living and enjoying. Certainly explains all the angry posts and memes that occur when this fantasy is threatened. That's why people love Shepard - whereas Ryder is more of a common man/woman, who also happens to be a complete, socially awkward loser that nobody respects. It's no surprise that people dislike the character. You wouldn't know though, having not played the game, that Ryder gets the respect in the end after having earned it. That's the whole fucking point. |
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Post by samhain444 on Aug 6, 2017 22:27:44 GMT
Yep, nobody respects Ryder by the end... Oh, expect the crew The Moshae The Nexus leadership The entire Angaran people The Krogan Aksuul even Yep, nobody except pretty much the entire cast of the game When it takes 5 minutes of playing Ryder to realize that it'll take another 99 hours before anyone respects you because you're playing a socially awkward loser - that's not a good thing. Yeah, again, more of your usual nonsense...not unexpected |
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Post by abaris on Aug 6, 2017 22:48:34 GMT
Picard is so much better than Kirk!!!!! I would agree, but do you see the distinction between Kirk and Picard? Kirk's the over emotional one while Picard stays rational most of the time. He's much more the leader figure than Kirk. |
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Post by suikoden on Aug 6, 2017 23:00:27 GMT
When it takes 5 minutes of playing Ryder to realize that it'll take another 99 hours before anyone respects you because you're playing a socially awkward loser - that's not a good thing. Yeah, again, more of your usual nonsense...not unexpected Well, Ryder remains a socially awkward loser for the entire 10-hour demo, and that's not going make anyone want to play any more. Bioware could have potentially mitigated this problem if female Ryder actually looked like her attractive model counterpart (instead of a buggy-eyed oddity). "Nobody fucks down, they fuck up, or across" - and when we're dealing with a fantasy world where banging aliens is one of the developer's main selling points... |
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Post by samhain444 on Aug 6, 2017 23:10:17 GMT
Yeah, again, more of your usual nonsense...not unexpected Well, Ryder remains a socially awkward loser for the entire 10-hour demo, and that's not going make anyone want to play any more. Bioware could have potentially mitigated this problem if female Ryder actually looked like her attractive model counterpart (instead of a buggy-eyed oddity). "Nobody fucks down, they fuck up, or across" - and when we're dealing with a fantasy world where banging aliens is one of the developer's main selling points... You have no legitimate points to make until you finish the game...sorry, just the way it is. Your empty screeds will remain just that until you correct this... |
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Post by smilesja on Aug 6, 2017 23:15:46 GMT
Yeah, again, more of your usual nonsense...not unexpected Well, Ryder remains a socially awkward loser for the entire 10-hour demo, and that's not going make anyone want to play any more. Bioware could have potentially mitigated this problem if female Ryder actually looked like her attractive model counterpart (instead of a buggy-eyed oddity). "Nobody fucks down, they fuck up, or across" - and when we're dealing with a fantasy world where banging aliens is one of the developer's main selling points... It's not going YOU play more because if you did play through at least the main quest Ryder slowly gets respect from everyone. |
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