IF we get another Mass Effect game....

Aug 7, 2017 5:02:18 GMT majesticjazz said:

It doesnt matter what the circumstances were. In the end, Ryder didnt EARN it. She or he was GIVEN it. The circumstances may have dictated that it was reasonable for Ryder to be given it but she/he was still given it....and didnt earn it.

Oh and challenging your statments is not trolling.

claiming it was pure nepotism in light of the game's actual narrative (whether good or bad) is trolling. You asserted it was nepotism in light of facts. trolling. Could the rest of the game's narrative given the character more opportunities via a more convincing trial by fire? Yeah I think so. But you just go "daddy gave daddy gave lolol"
basically. You're ignoring ingame facts and acting like that's a genuine rebuttal.

Truth be told, there kinda was some nepotism involved. Granted, Ryder does end up proving themselves in the end. That wasn't so much my issue though, the issue that I had was SAM doing everything. Ryder does end up interfacing with the remnant at the end without SAM, but I'd like to see more of that. I'd also like to see the characters return in the sequel, but as stated before, SAM needs to take a big backseat. And dude, I played through the game twice, to say "if you played the game" is insulting.

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IF we get another Mass Effect game.... Aug 7, 2017 5:33:25 GMT

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Post by smilesja on Aug 7, 2017 5:33:25 GMT

claiming it was pure nepotism in light of the game's actual narrative (whether good or bad) is trolling. You asserted it was nepotism in light of facts. trolling. Could the rest of the game's narrative given the character more opportunities via a more convincing trial by fire? Yeah I think so. But you just go "daddy gave daddy gave lolol"
basically. You're ignoring ingame facts and acting like that's a genuine rebuttal.

Truth be told, there kinda was some nepotism involved. Granted, Ryder does end up proving themselves in the end. That wasn't so much my issue though, the issue that I had was SAM doing everything. Ryder does end up interfacing with the remnant at the end without SAM, but I'd like to see more of that. I'd also like to see the characters return in the sequel, but as stated before, SAM needs to take a big backseat. And dude, I played through the game twice, to say "if you played the game" is insulting.

Did SAM do the loyalty missions and rescue the Moshae and the retrieved the other arks?

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IF we get another Mass Effect game.... Aug 7, 2017 5:33:31 GMT Hanako Ikezawa, smilesja, and 1 more like this

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Post by KaiserShep on Aug 7, 2017 5:33:31 GMT

Aug 7, 2017 5:27:52 GMT majesticjazz said:

Aug 7, 2017 5:25:35 GMT KaiserShep said:

I don't think the Warden is quite the best example there. All of the major decisions in Origins have fairly easy ways out, especially ones that have to do with the Warden personally. I pimped Alistair out to the witch and got a get-out-of-sacrifice free card and everyone went home happy and Alistair got creep-laid.

I mentioned the Warden cause he or she was able to make decisions that cost the lives of their squad. While not as emotional as the VS, the choices were still there.

Ryder lacked those choices.

I guess this could be seen as an inherent weakness of accounting for potential games in the future where they might want to save certain things that might be used in a follow-up installment.

This is basically what happened in ME2, given the weak reasoning behind Liara refusing to join Shepard and the Virmire survivor's behavior on Horizon, not to mention Shepard's inability to leave Cerberus.

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IF we get another Mass Effect game.... Aug 7, 2017 5:33:45 GMT

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Post by mannyray on Aug 7, 2017 5:33:45 GMT

Aug 7, 2017 5:20:13 GMT majesticjazz said:

claiming it was pure nepotism in light of the game's actual narrative (whether good or bad) is trolling. You asserted it was nepotism in light of facts. trolling. Could the rest of the game's narrative given the character more opportunities via a more convincing trial by fire? Yeah I think so. But you just go "daddy gave daddy gave lolol"
basically. You're ignoring ingame facts and acting like that's a genuine rebuttal.

So did Ryder earn the Pathfinder role at the game's beginning or was it given to them?

You are arguing an argument that isnt true.

Ryder didnt go through the trials to earn her role, her father given the circumstance gave it to her or him.

That is like a dying N7 (no pun intended) decides to anoint a rookie with the honor of N7 just to be able to carry on the mission.

The situation may have deemed it necessary but it still wasnt earned.

So instead you play the "you are a troll" card as some last ditch effort to add validity to your claims.

And you're backpedaling. The issue isn't how she got the job, it's the stakes in the narrative throughout the game.

And Shepard had everything at the game's outset. Anything Jesus Christ SuperShep got was already attained at the game's very beginning before you even play! Doesn't mean Shepard's a bad character or that the story's stakes weren't better illustrated.

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IF we get another Mass Effect game.... Aug 7, 2017 5:33:45 GMT smilesja likes this

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Post by Guts on Aug 7, 2017 5:33:45 GMT

Aug 7, 2017 5:33:25 GMT smilesja said:

Truth be told, there kinda was some nepotism involved. Granted, Ryder does end up proving themselves in the end. That wasn't so much my issue though, the issue that I had was SAM doing everything. Ryder does end up interfacing with the remnant at the end without SAM, but I'd like to see more of that. I'd also like to see the characters return in the sequel, but as stated before, SAM needs to take a big backseat. And dude, I played through the game twice, to say "if you played the game" is insulting.

Did SAM do the loyalty missions and rescue the Moshae and the retrieved the other arks?

Good point.

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IF we get another Mass Effect game.... Aug 7, 2017 5:33:54 GMT via mobile

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Post by majesticjazz on Aug 7, 2017 5:33:54 GMT

claiming it was pure nepotism in light of the game's actual narrative (whether good or bad) is trolling. You asserted it was nepotism in light of facts. trolling. Could the rest of the game's narrative given the character more opportunities via a more convincing trial by fire? Yeah I think so. But you just go "daddy gave daddy gave lolol"
basically. You're ignoring ingame facts and acting like that's a genuine rebuttal.

Truth be told, there kinda was some nepotism involved. Granted, Ryder does end up proving themselves in the end. That wasn't so much my issue though, the issue that I had was SAM doing everything. Ryder does end up interfacing with the remnant at the end without SAM, but I'd like to see more of that. I'd also like to see the characters return in the sequel, but as stated before, SAM needs to take a big backseat. And dude, I played through the game twice, to say "if you played the game" is insulting.

Well said

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IF we get another Mass Effect game.... Aug 7, 2017 5:36:19 GMT

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Post by mannyray on Aug 7, 2017 5:36:19 GMT

claiming it was pure nepotism in light of the game's actual narrative (whether good or bad) is trolling. You asserted it was nepotism in light of facts. trolling. Could the rest of the game's narrative given the character more opportunities via a more convincing trial by fire? Yeah I think so. But you just go "daddy gave daddy gave lolol"
basically. You're ignoring ingame facts and acting like that's a genuine rebuttal.

Truth be told, there kinda was some nepotism involved. Granted, Ryder does end up proving themselves in the end. That wasn't so much my issue though, the issue that I had was SAM doing everything. Ryder does end up interfacing with the remnant at the end without SAM, but I'd like to see more of that. I'd also like to see the characters return in the sequel, but as stated before, SAM needs to take a big backseat. And dude, I played through the game twice, to say "if you played the game" is insulting.

Your rhetoric came off more like someone who watched PewdePie doing a playthrough, however. I'm on my third playthrough now. If it makes you feel any better I would like to see Sam be less of a narrative crutch in a sequel.

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IF we get another Mass Effect game.... Aug 7, 2017 5:36:58 GMT

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Post by Guts on Aug 7, 2017 5:36:58 GMT

Aug 7, 2017 5:36:19 GMT mannyray said:

Truth be told, there kinda was some nepotism involved. Granted, Ryder does end up proving themselves in the end. That wasn't so much my issue though, the issue that I had was SAM doing everything. Ryder does end up interfacing with the remnant at the end without SAM, but I'd like to see more of that. I'd also like to see the characters return in the sequel, but as stated before, SAM needs to take a big backseat. And dude, I played through the game twice, to say "if you played the game" is insulting.

Your rhetoric came off more like someone who watched PewdePie doing a playthrough, however. I'm on my third playthrough now. If it makes you feel any better I would like to see Sam be less of a narrative crutch in a sequel.

If that was the case I apologize. (I want more Peebee in ME:A2)

Last Edit: Aug 7, 2017 5:37:30 GMT by Guts

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IF we get another Mass Effect game.... Aug 7, 2017 5:37:28 GMT via mobile

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Post by majesticjazz on Aug 7, 2017 5:37:28 GMT

Aug 7, 2017 5:20:13 GMT majesticjazz said:

So did Ryder earn the Pathfinder role at the game's beginning or was it given to them?

You are arguing an argument that isnt true.

Ryder didnt go through the trials to earn her role, her father given the circumstance gave it to her or him.

That is like a dying N7 (no pun intended) decides to anoint a rookie with the honor of N7 just to be able to carry on the mission.

The situation may have deemed it necessary but it still wasnt earned.

So instead you play the "you are a troll" card as some last ditch effort to add validity to your claims.

And you're backpedaling. The issue isn't how she got the job, it's the stakes in the narrative throughout the game.

And Shepard had everything at the game's outset. Anything Jesus Christ SuperShep got was already attained at the game's very beginning before you even play! Doesn't mean Shepard's a bad character or that the story's stakes weren't better illustrated.

Jesus Christ SuperShep couldn't save both Ash and Kaiden. But at least Shepard faced such choices.....Ryder didnt.

Last Edit: Aug 7, 2017 5:38:23 GMT by majesticjazz

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IF we get another Mass Effect game.... Aug 7, 2017 5:38:01 GMT

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Post by mannyray on Aug 7, 2017 5:38:01 GMT

One other thing to remember. Had Alec lived who knows if Cora or one of his kids would have gotten the mantle had he either retired or died of natural causes? Odds are one of the kids, but Cora being under the impression she was next in line throws a little doubt on that.

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IF we get another Mass Effect game.... Aug 7, 2017 5:38:43 GMT

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Post by mannyray on Aug 7, 2017 5:38:43 GMT

And you're backpedaling. The issue isn't how she got the job, it's the stakes in the narrative throughout the game.

And Shepard had everything at the game's outset. Anything Jesus Christ SuperShep got was already attained at the game's very beginning before you even play! Doesn't mean Shepard's a bad character or that the story's stakes weren't better illustrated.

Jesus Christ SuperShep couldn't save both Ash and Kaiden. But at least Shepard faced such choices.....Ryder didnt.

relevance?

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IF we get another Mass Effect game.... Aug 7, 2017 5:38:53 GMT Guts likes this

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Post by KaiserShep on Aug 7, 2017 5:38:53 GMT

I wouldn't mind SAM being toned back as well. I think the game already pushed its point about the shared perspective of AI's and such, but I'd like there to be something that perhaps reduces or at least frees Ryder from sharing the fate of SAM node. Another upshot of which would be the ability to come up with a story-related reason for changing the combat system and allowing players to once again dedicate the character to a particular combat class and skill reset.

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IF we get another Mass Effect game.... Aug 7, 2017 5:42:38 GMT

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Post by KaiserShep on Aug 7, 2017 5:42:38 GMT

And you're backpedaling. The issue isn't how she got the job, it's the stakes in the narrative throughout the game.

And Shepard had everything at the game's outset. Anything Jesus Christ SuperShep got was already attained at the game's very beginning before you even play! Doesn't mean Shepard's a bad character or that the story's stakes weren't better illustrated.

Jesus Christ SuperShep couldn't save both Ash and Kaiden. But at least Shepard faced such choices.....Ryder didnt.

I'll admit that I found the Virmire decision to feel a wee bit cheap, and it really felt telegraphed from a mile away. The more I thought about it, the more I thought about how it should have been a part of the STG team that was already there to guard that stupid bomb, which then had insult added to injury when the idiot council never even acknowledged that the team sent by the salarians were the ones who came up with the bomb in the first place.

Come to think of it, it seems like a huge chunk of the setbacks were because of BioWare making all of their space politicians weapons grade morons. :rage:

If we're gonna have dramatic choices, I have to say Mordin is the prime example. Easily one of the most painful decisions Shepard can make, to me, is betraying Mordin if you believe the krogan should not be cured, but you don't meet the requirements to convince him.

Last Edit: Aug 7, 2017 5:44:12 GMT by KaiserShep

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IF we get another Mass Effect game.... Aug 7, 2017 5:43:14 GMT

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Post by Guts on Aug 7, 2017 5:43:14 GMT

And you're backpedaling. The issue isn't how she got the job, it's the stakes in the narrative throughout the game.

And Shepard had everything at the game's outset. Anything Jesus Christ SuperShep got was already attained at the game's very beginning before you even play! Doesn't mean Shepard's a bad character or that the story's stakes weren't better illustrated.

Jesus Christ SuperShep couldn't save both Ash and Kaiden.

I'm probably going to cause a disagreement saying this. Ready?
I hated Liara in ME2 and ME3 because she felt like a character that developed extreme competence in skills that didn't fit her character in ME1, I also disliked how Bioware portrayed her as being a character that could "do no wrong" morally speaking. I wanted to question why she would enshrine your armor in her apartment, regardless of whether or not you romanced her. (And yes I know that Liara shouldn't remain an innocent archaeologist forever given the nature of the story, but the way it was handled was inconsistent, wouldn't info brokering take a bit more than archaeology skills? Just saying. Becoming the best on Illium in two years also doesn't make any sense)

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IF we get another Mass Effect game.... Aug 7, 2017 5:47:22 GMT smilesja and Vall like this

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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2017 5:47:22 GMT

Aug 7, 2017 5:38:01 GMT mannyray said:

One other thing to remember. Had Alec lived who knows if Cora or one of his kids would have gotten the mantle had he either retired or died of natural causes? Odds are one of the kids, but Cora being under the impression she was next in line throws a little doubt on that.

Alec's true plans for Cora were never really clear.

She had this hero worship thing going on, and always looked to others she respected for the answers. She wasn't really ready for leadership, at least not until she resolved some of that later in the game. I suspect Alec was aware of this, and intended her to be second-in-command permanently, not in line to take over. Shrug.

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IF we get another Mass Effect game.... Aug 7, 2017 5:49:20 GMT

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Post by mannyray on Aug 7, 2017 5:49:20 GMT

Aug 7, 2017 5:43:14 GMT Guts said: