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Post by Iakus on Sept 23, 2016 23:34:01 GMT
Back on the old boards, I made a thread where we could speculate on how we could get from the Milky Way to Andromeda without breaking ME lore. Ideas ranged from reverse-engineering Reaper ships, to wormholes to ancient intergalactic relays from Leviathan times.
Now we know that the arks are traveling there via ftl and stasis pods. And it is heavily implied the journey will start before ME3, at the least. Maybe before ME1
So, how does that work? FTL ships need to discharge their cores every 2-3 DAYS or the crew dies and the ship is destroyed. And the trip is going to last centuries.
Thoughts?
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Post by Obliviousmiss on Sept 23, 2016 23:40:50 GMT
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Post by Sartoz on Sept 24, 2016 0:12:02 GMT
<<<<<<<<<<(0)>>>>>>>>>>
I'm of the opinion that FTL drive tech is NOT static. I'm thinking of the Star Trek Warp drive where improvements were made over time.
I have not read any LORE that said FTL improvements is impossible. Only that Reaper FTL was better than the Alliance. However, I can postulate that the Reapers / Star Brat stopped research once they were satisfied / concluded its "current" tech was sufficient to handle newcomers. Once the "newbies" discovered the Relays, they became ripe for extermination and therefore, would not come across anything faster. This logic proved itself true until Femshep.
How did we get there?.. via stasis pods and centuries of travel. Besides, the 600 year journey may not be accurate. We could arrive many, many centuries later. Also, these huge ARKs can be equipped with their own discharge facilities (ie: Citadel anyone?).
Personally, I wish Bio introduces an innovative FTL drive suitable for intergalactic travel. Maybe that's why the ARK's engine is so huge.
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Post by rapscallioness on Sept 24, 2016 0:38:59 GMT
At this point, I'm thinking an AI, or computer system will keep the whole thing functioning for the centuries we're traveling.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 24, 2016 0:59:26 GMT
At this point, I'm thinking an AI, or computer system will keep the whole thing functioning for the centuries we're traveling. Most likely. As well as have a bunch of mechs in storage in case something needs to be physically fixed. I would love for them to be Geth, but if not I suspect a group of VIs to be doing it.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 24, 2016 1:01:07 GMT
Back on the old boards, I made a thread where we could speculate on how we could get from the Milky Way to Andromeda without breaking ME lore. Ideas ranged from reverse-engineering Reaper ships, to wormholes to ancient intergalactic relays from Leviathan times. Now we know that the arks are traveling there via ftl and stasis pods. And it is heavily implied the journey will start before ME3, at the least. Maybe before ME1 So, how does that work? FTL ships need to discharge their cores every 2-3 DAYS or the crew dies and the ship is destroyed. And the trip is going to last centuries. Thoughts? Personally my favorite theory about how we do it is still the Black Ark Theory, where we use Collector ships or the data collected about them to build our Arks. After all the Collectors have surpassed every hurdle we need to surpass for intergalactic travel.
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Post by Adhin on Sept 24, 2016 1:11:46 GMT
Pretty much what Sartoz said. They have the ability to discharge cores with out landing/getting in the field of some planet to deal with it. Not on ships though, but spacestations (and the citadel) have the ability to allow ships to discharge so that tech 'exists'. I'd imagine the engines are that large because A, it's a big ass ship, and B to give room for it's own ability to deal with the static build up.
I mean as far as I'm concerned the static build up is just electricity. I mean it's basically the excess leakage due to running a current through an Eezo Core. So they just need away to grab/collect that excess electricity and move/use it for something.
I'm actually not sure why other ships don't do that to be honest. You have this excess and they just let it build up then 'discharge it'? It's freakin' energy they could be using to power other systems. I mean look at our hybrid/electrical cars. We, in current day, are constantly finding ways to recharge the battery 'while' your using the damn thing lol. Take the shit, store it in reserves and use that to run through the Eezo Core when it gets full enough.
Since perpetual energy is impossible it'll eventually run it's self out blah blah something something psuedo-science babble.
So yeah my bets on some kinda discharge-recycler. Also 600-800 year trip.
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Post by Iakus on Sept 24, 2016 1:12:01 GMT
<<<<<<<<<<(0)>>>>>>>>>> I'm of the opinion that FTL drive tech is NOT static. I'm thinking of the Star Trek Warp drive where improvements were made over time. I have not read any LORE that said FTL improvements is impossible. Only that Reaper FTL was better than the Alliance. However, I can postulate that the Reapers / Star Brat stopped research once they were satisfied / concluded its "current" tech was sufficient to handle newcomers. Once the "newbies" discovered the Relays, they became ripe for extermination and therefore, would not come across anything faster. This logic proved itself true until Femshep. How did we get there?.. via stasis pods and centuries of travel. Besides, the 600 year journey may not be accurate. We could arrive many, many centuries later. Also, these huge ARKs can be equipped with their own discharge facilities (ie: Citadel anyone?). Personally, I wish Bio introduces an innovative FTL drive suitable for intergalactic travel. Maybe that's why the ARK's engine is so huge. But the discharge facilities are supposed to be like lightning rods, transferring the electrical energy from the core to something else it can ground itself into other than, you know, a ship's hull. What would there be for the energy to ground itself into? I mean, I suppose somehow the electricity could be modified so it could radiate out from the ship as heat? You'd have to stop and just "chill" but at least you wouldn't need special facilities, I guess...
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Post by Iakus on Sept 24, 2016 1:13:33 GMT
Personally my favorite theory about how we do it is still the Black Ark Theory, where we use Collector ships or the data collected about them to build our Arks. After all the Collectors have surpassed every hurdle we need to surpass for intergalactic travel. Do we even know that Collector ships don't need to discharge? I think that this is just an assumption. Sovereign's "corpse" would be a more likely source if anything. The Turians developed the Thanix, maybe the humans found something out about Reaper FTL technology. It is an assumption. I mean, we know they can go LONGER without discharging (2-3 years or so, since they flew in from dark space). But we don't know if they can go indefinitely or not. We do know that Reapers have been reported as being "wreathed in lightning" when landing on planets.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 24, 2016 1:17:32 GMT
Personally my favorite theory about how we do it is still the Black Ark Theory, where we use Collector ships or the data collected about them to build our Arks. After all the Collectors have surpassed every hurdle we need to surpass for intergalactic travel. Do we even know that Collector ships don't need to discharge? I think that this is just an assumption. Sovereign's "corpse" would be a more likely source if anything. The Turians developed the Thanix, maybe the humans found something out about Reaper FTL technology. We know they are Reaper-tier tech, and we know the Reapers have surpassed the issue. It's only logical then that this applies to them as well. I doubt we'd get anything useful from Sovereign in terms of his core. After all we did see it go boom in Mass Effect 1. It's not like the Thanix project where what they were studying was still mostly intact. And even with a mostly intact spinal cannon and the simplicity of a gun over a reactor, it took the Turians eleven months to develop it.
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Post by Adhin on Sept 24, 2016 1:23:46 GMT
I highly doubt it's collectors for 2 main reasons. 1 the only person to ever get onto, or deal with a collector ship was Shepard and depending on a 'choice' it was either blown the shit up or not and they kinda wanna avoid any 'choices'. 2 the time between ME2 and 3 is very, very short. We're talking a few months from relay exploding in the DLC (which can happen before or after you do the whole Omega relay).
Anyway, point is it would have to take place 'after' ME2 but before ME3 which is like a period of.. 3-4 months? No way the ARK project is started 'and' finished with super new untested tech in 3 months. I don't care how futury the future is it aint taking 3 months to theorize, test, and be like 'yup it works lets do this' while making multiple ARK ships lol.
I think the ARK project makes far more sense to start (not when we play) sometime after ME1, theres a whole year lost after Shepard dies. And considering some of the top brass believes Shepard prior to that it's likely they decided on some backup plan, and it probably got the greenlight when Shepard was 'killed'. And I'm sure the Alliance got there hands on some pieces of Sovereign for study.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 24, 2016 1:33:10 GMT
I highly doubt it's collectors for 2 main reasons. 1 the only person to ever get onto, or deal with a collector ship was Shepard and depending on a 'choice' it was either blown the shit up or not and they kinda wanna avoid any 'choices'. 2 the time between ME2 and 3 is very, very short. We're talking a few months from relay exploding in the DLC (which can happen before or after you do the whole Omega relay). Anyway, point is it would have to take place 'after' ME2 but before ME3 which is like a period of.. 3-4 months? No way the ARK project is started 'and' finished with super new untested tech in 3 months. I don't care how futury the future is it aint taking 3 months to theorize, test, and be like 'yup it works lets do this' while making multiple ARK ships lol. I think the ARK project makes far more sense to start (not when we play) sometime after ME1, theres a whole year lost after Shepard dies. And considering some of the top brass believes Shepard prior to that it's likely they decided on some backup plan, and it probably got the greenlight when Shepard was 'killed'. And I'm sure the Alliance got there hands on some pieces of Sovereign for study. Not true. James Vega also dealt with a Collector ship during the events of Mass Effect: Paragon Lost. It was the mission he talks about in ME3 when he lost the colony and his squad other than one member. He had to choose between saving the colonists or saving a scientist who had extensive data about the Collectors, as in everything on their ship's computer, and chose the latter. He feels extremely guilty about this and even more so when he sees it as pointless because Shepard deals with the Collectors. Also besides the data, the ship crashed onto the planet and the Alliance sent a team to recover everything about it. This occurred around the time Shepard was revived, so early Mass Effect 2. That means it was a whole year before Mass Effect 3 starts. If we were able to build the Crucible in half that time, this would be doable.
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Post by goishen on Sept 24, 2016 1:39:21 GMT
That's true, we don't even know when it takes place. My thinking is that humanity is in the start of another high tech industrial revolution. We're building things so fast that nobody can keep track of all the stuff out there. This is all through out the games, with the Normandy being the tip of the iceberg.
So, that being said, a ton of people came up with some very creative ideas that for one reason or another didn't make it to today. Now fast forward to ME time. At the very start of another industrial revolution, we would have all sorts of ideas. One of those ideas could be Hyperion engines, an engine that doesn't have to be discharged.
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Post by Adhin on Sept 24, 2016 1:45:19 GMT
Not true. James Vega also dealt with a Collector ship during the events of Mass Effect: Paragon Lost. It was the mission he talks about in ME3 when he lost the colony and his squad other than one member. He had to choose between saving the colonists or saving a scientist who had extensive data about the Collectors, as in everything on their ship's computer, and chose the latter. He feels extremely guilty about this and even more so when he sees it as pointless because Shepard deals with the Collectors. Also besides the data, the ship crashed onto the planet and the Alliance sent a team to recover everything about it. This occurred around the time Shepard was revived, so early Mass Effect 2. That means it was a whole year before Mass Effect 3 starts. If we were able to build the Crucible in half that time, this would be doable. I honestly did not know that about Vega, though I have a vague member of him talking about that. My memory of ME3 isn't as good as other games due to the general lack of times played for reasons. Wonder what the timing on that is, I still feel like the ARK project would have to be prior to that but I could see that playing a huge part in the whole engines of the ships. Really does make me wonder how long the whole project would take though as a whole. There's like a year or 2 between ME1/2 prior to Shepard getting killed right? Then a year during him being 'dead' prior to being revived. Then at some point he ends shit with the collectors and you got 4 months-ish till ME3 happens between the 2 games. Starting after the events of ME1 makes the most sense from a build time and general research time and figuring it all out. Collector thing would end up being a last minute (in the grand scheme of things) then at that point. edit: goishen : Yeah that engine would be the main concern for the project. What it would entirely be around - the ships just rooms and shit you know? The engine is the main priority for that kinda trip.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 24, 2016 1:58:04 GMT
Not true. James Vega also dealt with a Collector ship during the events of Mass Effect: Paragon Lost. It was the mission he talks about in ME3 when he lost the colony and his squad other than one member. He had to choose between saving the colonists or saving a scientist who had extensive data about the Collectors, as in everything on their ship's computer, and chose the latter. He feels extremely guilty about this and even more so when he sees it as pointless because Shepard deals with the Collectors. Also besides the data, the ship crashed onto the planet and the Alliance sent a team to recover everything about it. This occurred around the time Shepard was revived, so early Mass Effect 2. That means it was a whole year before Mass Effect 3 starts. If we were able to build the Crucible in half that time, this would be doable. I honestly did not know that about Vega, though I have a vague member of him talking about that. My memory of ME3 isn't as good as other games due to the general lack of times played for reasons. Wonder what the timing on that is, I still feel like the ARK project would have to be prior to that but I could see that playing a huge part in the whole engines of the ships. Really does make me wonder how long the whole project would take though as a whole. There's like a year or 2 between ME1/2 prior to Shepard getting killed right? Then a year during him being 'dead' prior to being revived. Then at some point he ends shit with the collectors and you got 4 months-ish till ME3 happens between the 2 games. Starting after the events of ME1 makes the most sense from a build time and general research time and figuring it all out. Collector thing would end up being a last minute (in the grand scheme of things) then at that point. I'm glad I was able to show you something new. Mass Effect 1 takes place during the year 2183. A month after the end of Mass Effect 1 the Collectors attack the SR1 and Shepard is declared KIA. Two years later in early 2185 Shepard is revived and the events of Mass Effect 2 occur. In early 2186 the events of the Arrival DLC occur. Six months later the events of Mass Effect 3 begin and the war ends a few months later around the end of the year. So since we know we are leaving before the endings, that gives us a total of about three years between the events on Eden Prime and the Crucible firing. And yeah, I'm not saying that the project had to start after the events of Paragon Lost. The theory just supports that either that and/or the data Shepard gathered during ME2 provided the final piece of the puzzle for the project. It's a nebulous theory.
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Post by Adhin on Sept 24, 2016 2:29:42 GMT
I'm glad I was able to show you something new. Mass Effect 1 takes place during the year 2183. A month after the end of Mass Effect 1 the Collectors attack the SR1 and Shepard is declared KIA. Two years later in early 2185 Shepard is revived and the events of Mass Effect 2 occur. In early 2186 the events of the Arrival DLC occur. Six months later the events of Mass Effect 3 begin and the war ends a few months later around the end of the year. So since we know we are leaving before the endings, that gives us a total of about three years between the events on Eden Prime and the Crucible firing. And yeah, I'm not saying that the project had to start after the events of Paragon Lost. The theory just supports that either that and/or the data Shepard gathered during ME2 provided the final piece of the puzzle for the project. It's a nebulous theory. We know we leave before ME3 entirely. There's ARK Ships outside of earth with shuttles taking people to the ships. The VERY start of ME3 is the Reapers literally trashing earth. It would be impossible to have those events overlapping at all. I could definitely see the launch happening just prior to ME3, with that 6 month period you mention between ME2 and 3. But it definitely would of had to start well before that point for sure. Curious what they end up picking. I feel like Shepards death and that whole 2 year period would make the most sense for the Alliance to go 'well if Shepard was right and not crazy... we should have a backup plan'. Just seems to make sense.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 24, 2016 2:42:08 GMT
I'm glad I was able to show you something new. Mass Effect 1 takes place during the year 2183. A month after the end of Mass Effect 1 the Collectors attack the SR1 and Shepard is declared KIA. Two years later in early 2185 Shepard is revived and the events of Mass Effect 2 occur. In early 2186 the events of the Arrival DLC occur. Six months later the events of Mass Effect 3 begin and the war ends a few months later around the end of the year. So since we know we are leaving before the endings, that gives us a total of about three years between the events on Eden Prime and the Crucible firing. And yeah, I'm not saying that the project had to start after the events of Paragon Lost. The theory just supports that either that and/or the data Shepard gathered during ME2 provided the final piece of the puzzle for the project. It's a nebulous theory. We know we leave before ME3 entirely. There's ARK Ships outside of earth with shuttles taking people to the ships. The VERY start of ME3 is the Reapers literally trashing earth. It would be impossible to have those events overlapping at all. I could definitely see the launch happening just prior to ME3, with that 6 month period you mention between ME2 and 3. But it definitely would of had to start well before that point for sure. Curious what they end up picking. I feel like Shepards death and that whole 2 year period would make the most sense for the Alliance to go 'well if Shepard was right and not crazy... we should have a backup plan'. Just seems to make sense. True, so then two and a half years since ME1 and one year since PL and the beginning of ME2. Though to be fair that scene may just be when we get aboard, but it leaves the galaxy later. Though yeah from the position of the horizon line it takes place a few hours before the beginning scene in ME3 where the shuttle goes down to Earth. I definitely think they started after ME1. The Citadel DLC shows that while they publically denied it, the Council accepted Shepard's story about the Reapers. And if not and it took PL or Arrival for them to realize, that still gives them more time that they had with the Crucible, a project that dwarfs the Arks since it is the size of the Citadel. If they can build that in a few months, if we had the knowledge we could build the Arks in half to two and a half years.
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Post by Adhin on Sept 24, 2016 2:50:45 GMT
True, so then two and a half years since ME1 and one year since PL and the beginning of ME2. Though to be fair that scene may just be when we get aboard, but it leaves the galaxy later. Though yeah from the position of the horizon line it takes place a few hours before the beginning scene in ME3 where the shuttle goes down to Earth. I definitely think they started after ME1. The Citadel DLC shows that while they publically denied it, the Council accepted Shepard's story about the Reapers. And if not and it took PL or Arrival for them to realize, that still gives them more time that they had with the Crucible, a project that dwarfs the Arks since it is the size of the Citadel. If they can build that in a few months, if we had the knowledge we could build the Arks in half to two and a half years. That is a fantastic point with the Crucible being made in a few months under far, far worse conditions. Granted we had multiple galactic generations worth of blueprints and research in information to use for it. Either way if they could do that in that amount of time it's 2-ish years is more then enough I feel to figure out how to deal with the static issue. Them being large probably actually helps with that considering it gives you the space to implement that. Can't really do it on a smaller ship I'd imagine.
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Post by Iakus on Sept 24, 2016 3:15:15 GMT
That's true, we don't even know when it takes place. My thinking is that humanity is in the start of another high tech industrial revolution. We're building things so fast that nobody can keep track of all the stuff out there. This is all through out the games, with the Normandy being the tip of the iceberg. So, that being said, a ton of people came up with some very creative ideas that for one reason or another didn't make it to today. Now fast forward to ME time. At the very start of another industrial revolution, we would have all sorts of ideas. One of those ideas could be Hyperion engines, an engine that doesn't have to be discharged. Except ME time is NOT an high tech industrial revolution. IF anything, it's stagnating. Nothing]s being really discovered, they're just reverse-engineering Prothean tech. It's why humans and turians were so close technologically speaking when one's been out among the stars to 2000 years and the other for a single generation.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 24, 2016 3:31:20 GMT
That's true, we don't even know when it takes place. My thinking is that humanity is in the start of another high tech industrial revolution. We're building things so fast that nobody can keep track of all the stuff out there. This is all through out the games, with the Normandy being the tip of the iceberg. So, that being said, a ton of people came up with some very creative ideas that for one reason or another didn't make it to today. Now fast forward to ME time. At the very start of another industrial revolution, we would have all sorts of ideas. One of those ideas could be Hyperion engines, an engine that doesn't have to be discharged. Except ME time is NOT an high tech industrial revolution. IF anything, it's stagnating. Nothing]s being really discovered, they're just reverse-engineering Prothean tech. It's why humans and turians were so close technologically speaking when one's been out among the stars to 2000 years and the other for a single generation. In the ME Trilogy, we were shown 1 aspect of a society that encompasses way more than 44 Billion people of vastly different species and abilities. It is quite likely that not every scientist in that large and diverse a society is "just reverse-engineerring Prothean tech." Javik even acknowledges that the cycle of the ME Trilogy differed from his in that they allowed for and maintained diversity while still cooperating with one another and he says THAT might be the hope for the current cycle.
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Post by goishen on Sept 24, 2016 4:08:52 GMT
That's true, we don't even know when it takes place. My thinking is that humanity is in the start of another high tech industrial revolution. We're building things so fast that nobody can keep track of all the stuff out there. This is all through out the games, with the Normandy being the tip of the iceberg. So, that being said, a ton of people came up with some very creative ideas that for one reason or another didn't make it to today. Now fast forward to ME time. At the very start of another industrial revolution, we would have all sorts of ideas. One of those ideas could be Hyperion engines, an engine that doesn't have to be discharged. Except ME time is NOT an high tech industrial revolution. IF anything, it's stagnating. Nothing]s being really discovered, they're just reverse-engineering Prothean tech. It's why humans and turians were so close technologically speaking when one's been out among the stars to 2000 years and the other for a single generation. No, it would be a tech industrial revolution if simply because of making parts for the engines. Which would spark other people to think about it and come up with offshoots of said inventions. It may not be as large an industrial revolution, but it is one.
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Post by Antibaar on Sept 24, 2016 6:32:35 GMT
It is possible the Ark's were constructed somewhere between ME1 and late ME2. Maybe someone,did take very seriously Shepard's warnings about the Reapers. Also I think,the Ark's have ancient alien origins something like Crucible.
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Xerxes52
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Post by Xerxes52 on Sept 24, 2016 7:24:36 GMT
In addition to the eezo core, you'll also get electrostatic build up from more mundane sources like space radiation, plasma sheets, and regions of space with charged particles. The ships could be fitted with plasma contactors to neutralize electrostatic build up, basically what the ISS uses, but scaled up appropriately for the colony ships.
No space magic required.
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Post by Pounce de León on Sept 24, 2016 7:25:57 GMT
We fall through a plot hole and job well done.
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Post by fchopin on Sept 24, 2016 11:26:44 GMT
So, how does that work? FTL ships need to discharge their cores every 2-3 DAYS or the crew dies and the ship is destroyed. And the trip is going to last centuries. Thoughts? Maybe we have AI's to stop the ships every few days or just shut down the engines and continue going forward until discharge and then start over again.
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