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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 22, 2017 4:45:55 GMT
That's a gameplay mechanic. They aren't actually physically there. Of course not but for them to trigger on a planet that your father has never scene nor stepped on seems pretty odd right? If anything they should have just tied it to your level. Not really. If I recall, the memory triggers were set to Ryder progressing in the role of Pathfinder. So them being on worlds you are pathfinding, next to outposts you establish, etc makes sense.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2017 4:47:33 GMT
Of course not but for them to trigger on a planet that your father has never scene nor stepped on seems pretty odd right? If anything they should have just tied it to your level. Not really. If I recall, the memory triggers were set to Ryder progressing in the role of Pathfinder. So them being on worlds you are pathfinding, next to outposts you establish, etc makes sense. So I'm assuming it's based on how many foot steps you take? Sorry...I jest!
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 22, 2017 4:49:27 GMT
Not really. If I recall, the memory triggers were set to Ryder progressing in the role of Pathfinder. So them being on worlds you are pathfinding, next to outposts you establish, etc makes sense. So I'm assuming it's based on how many foot steps you take? Sorry...I jest! I know you jest, but you are kind of right since as you follow in your father's footsteps metaphorically speaking you unlock more of his memories.
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Post by cypherj on Sept 22, 2017 4:51:31 GMT
A lot of this stuff is extreme nitpicking, which he admits. But some of the things are the same issues I had with the story. - Why no Pathfinders on the Nexus, makes no sense. Every ship should have been able to operate independently in case it was the only one that made it. WHich would include Pathfinders. - How can exiles in limited number, with limited resources, not only colonize but drive the enemy from a planet, but the AI with more people and resources have failed at every attempt to colonize a world. Even the Angarans are struggling with the Kett, but some exiles drive them off a planet and put their heads up on spikes as trophies. - They tell Ryder that he/she has to raise the viability planets, but the only way to do it is through vaults that no one knows exist, there's no other way to accomplish the task. It's like they wrote the story backwards. We need planets to be viable so we're going to use these vaults > only Ryder and activate vaults > Ryder can only activate vaults with advanced SAM > Ryder gets advanced SAM by becoming Pathfinder after Alec's Death. The video is pretty funny though. Another good one was chasing down memory triggers placed on planets that your father has never set foot on... They're a bunch more issues I had, these were just the biggest ones. The main issue is that when you play a game from the OT or a DA game, you get the feeling that there was a universe before the current story, and that this story is just one this universe has to offer. In ME:A it's like they came up with a story first and then made the entire universe match this one particular story, so the universe just never felt fleshed out in any way. So who cares if Ryder's entire purpose in the game is not really being a Pathfinder, first boots on the ground, making first contacts, actual wild frontier stuff, but having his/her sole purpose in the game be fighting Kett and activating vaults. Neither of which anyone knew about before they arrived. I just never got into it. Without these things what would have been left, all of the actual Pathfinder stuff had been done by the time you woke up.
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Post by Element Zero on Sept 22, 2017 4:58:25 GMT
Wait a minute. How did the scene make you think that it was possible? That it isn't possible is literally the point of the scene, so how did the scene end up communicating to you the opposite of what it was supposed to convey. The fact that Alec was still able to partially breath and talk with his helmet off. Is it really that hard to believe that it was possible to pull this off? Or are you just busting my balls for the hell of it? I'm not trying to bust your balls, to be clear. He could breath and talk because there was in fact air. Nitrogen and Argon are major constituents of our own atmosphere. The problem was the lack of oxygen. He would begin suffocating very quickly in that atmosphere. Based upon how thoroughly screwed our protagonist was each time his/her helmet shattered, it appears that those helmets vent atmo pretty quickly if damaged or removed. That's why I just can't see sharing being a viable approach. Even if it could work under some circumstances, it would seemingly be too tedious to pull off under those circumstances. When I play that scene, I see a brilliant, experienced operative weighing all of the variables very quickly and coming up with the only acceptable path. He had to make sure Scott/Sara survived, and that SAM was transferred to him/her. Obviously, the first reason was that he was a father. We later learn about Ellen Ryder's whereabouts, and SAM's uniqueness. I don't even think it would've been asphyxiation that ultimately killed him, but rather his abrupt disconnection from SAM. They were woven pretty tightly. The poor writing wasn't in the execution of this scene, but in failing to explain its events better afterward via Harry Carlyle in the medbay. There's a ton of crappy, poorly thought out writing in MEA. I just don't think this scene is such an example.
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Post by Element Zero on Sept 22, 2017 5:01:11 GMT
A lot of this stuff is extreme nitpicking, which he admits. But some of the things are the same issues I had with the story. - Why no Pathfinders on the Nexus, makes no sense. Every ship should have been able to operate independently in case it was the only one that made it. WHich would include Pathfinders. - How can exiles in limited number, with limited resources, not only colonize but drive the enemy from a planet, but the AI with more people and resources have failed at every attempt to colonize a world. Even the Angarans are struggling with the Kett, but some exiles drive them off a planet and put their heads up on spikes as trophies. - They tell Ryder that he/she has to raise the viability planets, but the only way to do it is through vaults that no one knows exist, there's no other way to accomplish the task. It's like they wrote the story backwards. We need planets to be viable so we're going to use these vaults > only Ryder and activate vaults > Ryder can only activate vaults with advanced SAM > Ryder gets advanced SAM by becoming Pathfinder after Alec's Death. The video is pretty funny though. Another good one was chasing down memory triggers placed on planets that your father has never set foot on... Yeah, those are presumably an extreme abstraction of our Pathfinder's mental and emotional growth. It's a cool fetch-quest skinned in a creative way, ultimately. The hunt was easy, and the payoff good, so I liked it.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2017 5:03:17 GMT
Another good one was chasing down memory triggers placed on planets that your father has never set foot on... They're a bunch more issues I had, these were just the biggest ones. The main issue is that when you play a game from the OT or a DA game, you get the feeling that there was a universe before the current story, and that this story is just one this universe has to offer. In ME:A it's like they came up with a story first and then made the entire universe match this one particular story, so the universe just never felt fleshed out in any way. So who cares if Ryder's entire purpose in the game is not really being a Pathfinder, first boots on the ground, making first contacts, actual wild frontier stuff, but having his/her sole purpose in the game be fighting Kett and activating vaults. Neither of which anyone knew about before they arrived. I just never got into it. Without these things what would have been left, all of the actual Pathfinder stuff had been done by the time you woke up. I agree. I think ME1 (at least for the story) did a far better job. Another problem I had was the open world. Bioware was able to produce a better story through its semi linear game play than its open world. But I'm not exactly the biggest fan of open world games anyway...
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Post by samhain444 on Sept 22, 2017 5:06:26 GMT
"The Beginners Guide to Picking Nits in the Adromeda Galaxy"
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Post by alanc9 on Sept 22, 2017 5:13:57 GMT
He could breath and talk because there was in fact air. Nitrogen and Argon are major constituents of our own atmosphere. The problem was the lack of oxygen. He would begin suffocating very quickly in that atmosphere. I have a sneaking suspicion that he also would have ended up talking with a Donald Duck voice. Imagine how well that would have gone over. I imagine that nobody on the writing staff even considered that it was something which would need to be explained.
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Post by alanc9 on Sept 22, 2017 5:17:45 GMT
Another good one was chasing down memory triggers placed on planets that your father has never set foot on... Yeah, those are presumably an extreme abstraction of our Pathfinder's mental and emotional growth. It's a cool fetch-quest skinned in a creative way, ultimately. The hunt was easy, and the payoff good, so I liked it. It would have made more sense if the trigger locations were related to actually doing stuff. Most of the triggers seem to be at scenic views instead. That would have turned Ryder Family Secrets into a completionism check, though, and I guess they didn't want any more of those.
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Post by Element Zero on Sept 22, 2017 5:23:17 GMT
Yeah, those are presumably an extreme abstraction of our Pathfinder's mental and emotional growth. It's a cool fetch-quest skinned in a creative way, ultimately. The hunt was easy, and the payoff good, so I liked it. It would have made more sense if the trigger locations were related to actually doing stuff. Most of the triggers seem to be at scenic views instead. That would have turned Ryder Family Secrets into a completionism check, though, and I guess they didn't want any more of those. The most logical approach, in most games, would've been to tie the memories to advancement in the critical path. There would be problems with that in Andromeda, though. I barely touch the critical path until the game is about 65% complete. I'm sure there are others who do the same, so paving would've been terrible. They also clearly wanted to incentivize exploration, as those scenic placements demonstrate. It was a bit of an odd fetch-quest, but not an unpleasant one.
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Post by Guts on Sept 22, 2017 5:49:10 GMT
They're a bunch more issues I had, these were just the biggest ones. The main issue is that when you play a game from the OT or a DA game, you get the feeling that there was a universe before the current story, and that this story is just one this universe has to offer. In ME:A it's like they came up with a story first and then made the entire universe match this one particular story, so the universe just never felt fleshed out in any way. So who cares if Ryder's entire purpose in the game is not really being a Pathfinder, first boots on the ground, making first contacts, actual wild frontier stuff, but having his/her sole purpose in the game be fighting Kett and activating vaults. Neither of which anyone knew about before they arrived. I just never got into it. Without these things what would have been left, all of the actual Pathfinder stuff had been done by the time you woke up. I agree. I think ME1 (at least for the story) did a far better job. Another problem I had was the open world. Bioware was able to produce a better story through its semi linear game play than its open world. But I'm not exactly the biggest fan of open world games anyway... Thinking back to what you said about how the metroidvania style might not suit ME all that well, here's another idea, Dark Souls 1 and even Fallout New Vegas did this. You get large open worlds, but they are smaller compared to the ones in ME:A and have much less fetch quests, you also "lead" a character down a certain path, and by this I mean that every other way other than going to say a certain part of the map would mean, for a while at least until you've sufficiently leveled up, almost certain death, or a really tough time. Take New Vegas for instance: You start off in Goodsprings, if you just go North, you'll run into Deathclaws that would immediately whoop your ass, but you go south, you won't die as easily. Or in Dark Souls, sure you can go right to Blighttown, provided you started with the Master key, but really, if you go anywhere other than to the Undead Burg, you'll get your ass whooped. (Fuck those skeletons and necromancers man)
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Post by Serza on Sept 22, 2017 8:47:58 GMT
The average person can hold their breath from 30 seconds to 2 minutes untrained. 4-5 minutes and beyond trained (the record being 20+ minutes). I'd imagine that would be more than enough time to do the job. Swapping a vacuum sealed space helmet doesn't seem the least bit feasible to me. It's not a scuba rebreather. How much atmo is lost with each decompression and swap? This argument has always seemed willfully obtuse to me. Congratulations. You are no longer merely "clever" - now you're a "motherfucking genius" because that's apparently what it takes to understand. Yeah, AI was outlawed. Not like anyone has never broken laws before :| Too nitpicky. Its not that it was outlawed, its that this guy made the most advanced AI ever in his garage and somehow didn't get caught when. Excuse me, did he not? I thought getting caught was half the reason they left for Andromeda. And the reason he told his kids. Oh well! Guess I missed something! Well, there was still air present to carry the sound of his voice, just not air that wouldn't poison him. I can only base things off of my own life experience. While training in the Army Infantry and later training up for Special Forces, I had to go through many a gas chambers that had me taking my gas mask off then putting it back on, clearing it, then taking a new breath. I'd imagine given the technology of ME:A and being ready for any potential problems that may arise (broken mask) that the swapping method couldn't be that far fetched. And yes...I know that I can't apply real life to a game but hey, why not try? But it is just a game and giving you a death scene for reasons is what it's all about. Mhm. And regardless, your mask was contaminated, and even if it resealed properly, the gas got in. So, CS gas, I presume? Any eye irritation, tearing up, or any other symptoms of getting gassed by that? A lot of this stuff is extreme nitpicking, which he admits. But some of the things are the same issues I had with the story. - Why no Pathfinders on the Nexus, makes no sense. Every ship should have been able to operate independently in case it was the only one that made it. WHich would include Pathfinders. - How can exiles in limited number, with limited resources, not only colonize but drive the enemy from a planet, but the AI with more people and resources have failed at every attempt to colonize a world. Even the Angarans are struggling with the Kett, but some exiles drive them off a planet and put their heads up on spikes as trophies. - They tell Ryder that he/she has to raise the viability planets, but the only way to do it is through vaults that no one knows exist, there's no other way to accomplish the task. It's like they wrote the story backwards. We need planets to be viable so we're going to use these vaults > only Ryder and activate vaults > Ryder can only activate vaults with advanced SAM > Ryder gets advanced SAM by becoming Pathfinder after Alec's Death. The video is pretty funny though. Another good one was chasing down memory triggers placed on planets that your father has never set foot on... Attention. Pay more. It pays off. Ironic, right. That's a gameplay mechanic. They aren't actually physically there. yeah, its a shoddily implemented scavenger hunt. Since its supposed to me linked the (nebulous) idea of advancing as a pathfinder, it should have been tied to main story mission progression, not environmental markers Pathfinder job description. Recite. Now.
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Post by cypherj on Sept 22, 2017 12:00:30 GMT
They're a bunch more issues I had, these were just the biggest ones. The main issue is that when you play a game from the OT or a DA game, you get the feeling that there was a universe before the current story, and that this story is just one this universe has to offer. In ME:A it's like they came up with a story first and then made the entire universe match this one particular story, so the universe just never felt fleshed out in any way. So who cares if Ryder's entire purpose in the game is not really being a Pathfinder, first boots on the ground, making first contacts, actual wild frontier stuff, but having his/her sole purpose in the game be fighting Kett and activating vaults. Neither of which anyone knew about before they arrived. I just never got into it. Without these things what would have been left, all of the actual Pathfinder stuff had been done by the time you woke up. I agree. I think ME1 (at least for the story) did a far better job. Another problem I had was the open world. Bioware was able to produce a better story through its semi linear game play than its open world. But I'm not exactly the biggest fan of open world games anyway... If any story was set up for open world it was this one, it's about exploring. But the way they set it up you didn't really explore you just drove from marker to marker calling down dropships and then going to three vaults and ultimately the spot they already had marked for you make the colony. Why not let you explore looking for a good place to make settle, testing the water in certain areas, cataloging the wildlife. Going into caves, and subterranean caverns, with different surrounding than the surface, perhaps glimpses of what the planets used to look like because these pockets were protected from the scourge. Then once you start a colony have the side quests tie directly to expanding your colony, adding science labs, adding hydroponics bays, etc. People would have been way more into doing them because they would have wanted to see if and how they affected their colonies. Then they could have tied in what type of pods you opened into this as well. I all honesty, I wouldn't even have done the vaults at all. I would have just given each viable world its own story and challenge. Some non-humanoid race inhabiting a planet, killed the colonists in your first attempt to colonize it. You find out what they are, why they're so protective of the world. Do you exterminate as a conqueror or let them be and move on. You find Angarans on a planet, a real first contact. Earn their trust finally get taken to their main city. This way it isn't just going to a planet calling down the forward bases, activating three vaults, go to the marked spot, start a colony. Rinse and repeat. Then you could have picked the best option, started on colony, and had that colony expand over the rest of the game while you as pathfinder explored the surrounding systems to see if there were any threats to your colony, other races, resources, etc. Another thing that never made sense to me was, you have twenty thousand humans, why are you starting multiple colonies and spreading them out the several systems with limited resources and no way to defend them. The entire setup of the Initiative, the initial mission, the current mission made absolutely no sense whatsoever. But if you had to have the vaults, just have Ryder discover a vault on the world, and ultimately figure out that these vaults were used to create entire worlds. Maybe even have a world were the vault malfunctioned, something like Habitat 7, so you could see what the worlds would have been like if the vault wasn't able to finish the job. Then you could have still ultimately still found out about the Angarans and the unknown race that created parts of the cluster.
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Post by themikefest on Sept 22, 2017 12:08:17 GMT
- the scanner Mark: What's wrong Ryan? Ryan: The generator is broken. I don't have a scanner to know what the cause is. Mark: Gotcha. Want to go play cards in the breakroom while we wait for Ryder to return?
- on the shuttle the player learns that Liam and Ryder don't know each other. Why wasn't the pathfinder team waken up earlier? Get each team member familiar with each other. Make sure your gear and weapons are in working order. Go over any scenarios of what they might encounter.
- Cause of death is like a hero. I wonder if that's contagious? Why couldn't Carlyle give a straight answer when asked what the cause of death was?
- It seems like the game rushes the player through Hab 7 and dad's death to get to the Nexus to start finding a path
- using the nomad to get around instead of using a shuttle
- no option to not recruit squadmates
- using an escape pod to reach a planet. Not only put the lives of the pathfinder and squadmate in danger, but the rest of the crew in danger. What will they do if something were to happen to the tempest that requires everyone to evacuate? I guess they die. No big deal. The player gets a "wouldn't it be cool to use the escape pod" scene crap.
- the mother. The kids were surprised she was on the Hyperion. Did dad have a fake funeral for her? Did he tell his kids she was cremated and the urn that was to have her ashes was really filled with dirt? Is there a tombstone back on Earth with an empty casket buried? If there's a sequel, and she is cured, what answer will her kids give when she asks them if there was a funeral?
- the sam voice thing. The thing needs a mute button.
there's other stuff I could list.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2017 12:43:58 GMT
I can only base things off of my own life experience. While training in the Army Infantry and later training up for Special Forces, I had to go through many a gas chambers that had me taking my gas mask off then putting it back on, clearing it, then taking a new breath. I'd imagine given the technology of ME:A and being ready for any potential problems that may arise (broken mask) that the swapping method couldn't be that far fetched. And yes...I know that I can't apply real life to a game but hey, why not try? But it is just a game and giving you a death scene for reasons is what it's all about. Mhm. And regardless, your mask was contaminated, and even if it resealed properly, the gas got in. So, CS gas, I presume? Any eye irritation, tearing up, or any other symptoms of getting gassed by that? Another good one was chasing down memory triggers placed on planets that your father has never set foot on... Attention. Pay more. It pays off.
Ironic, right.And what exactly was there to pay attention too or are you just talking out your ass? I'm betting the latter. Ironic, right? As for the contamination, If it had been that bad then Ryder would have been screwed from the onset of the game when his/her mask cracked. This is the far future where they can travel FTL but can't have a suit that can properly filter a contaminate once inside the the suit... Either way it's just a game and something minor to contemplate.
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Post by Element Zero on Sept 22, 2017 13:17:37 GMT
themikefest, I always have an inner rant during those "we didn't get a chance to meet in the MW scenes". I know that players would've bitched if they didn't get their in-game intro scenes. I've seen it happen too many times before. That said, it's mind-numbing that an "elite team" like the Pathfinder team would be sent into the field without months of joint training and team-building. Those scenes are a pet peeve of mine. A lot of the most annoying stuff in this series, for me, has come from the writers' complete lack of knowledge on a variety of topics, especially military. Read a few books, at the least, guys. SMH.
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Post by Serza on Sept 22, 2017 13:18:50 GMT
Ha! We got ourselves a lucky one. I can't remember why the heck exactly did I say that.
Don't flatter yourself. I tend to automatically forget stupid things in order to keep my faith in humanity up.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2017 13:21:43 GMT
themikefest , I always have an inner rant during those "we didn't get a chance to meet in the MW scenes". I know that players would've bitched if they didn't get their in-game intro scenes. I've seen it happen too many times before. That said, it's mind-numbing that an "elite team" like the Pathfinder team would be sent into the field without months of joint training and team-building. Those scenes are a pet peeve of mine. A lot of the most annoying stuff in this series, for me, has come from the writers' complete lack of knowledge on a variety of topics, especially military. Read a few books, at the least, guys. SMH. Intro's have never bothered me that much but I definitely lean more towards Dark Souls style of just dumping you in to it.
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Post by majesticjazz on Sept 22, 2017 13:49:35 GMT
Once again GamingSins made valid points why the game is a colossal disappointment and why BioWare should listen to fans and stop making excuses. Let me know what you guys think about this video and part 2 is coming up. Good video. Looking forward to part 2.
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Post by anarchy65 on Sept 22, 2017 13:58:30 GMT
"I chose you because you are like me... dreamers. And a bit of nepotism doesn't hurt either."
That was the most hilarious one. But the video is completely right. Since the beginning of the game I thought that the plot made no actual sense, although I couldn't exactly understand why, but this video explains everything.
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Post by anarchy65 on Sept 22, 2017 14:05:09 GMT
"I'm convinced that the Andromeda Initiative was created to banish stupid people from the Milky Way"
Damn, that would be a great plot twist for a sequel. It makes total sense. Imagine, the Benefactor is actually a good guy that wanted to ban the most stupid people from the Milky Way so they wouldn't screw up against the Reapers. It would be a much better plot than Andromeda.
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Post by alanc9 on Sept 22, 2017 15:56:20 GMT
Why not let you explore looking for a good place to make settle, testing the water in certain areas, cataloging the wildlife. Going into caves, and subterranean caverns, with different surrounding than the surface, perhaps glimpses of what the planets used to look like because these pockets were protected from the scourge. Then once you start a colony have the side quests tie directly to expanding your colony, adding science labs, adding hydroponics bays, etc. People would have been way more into doing them because they would have wanted to see if and how they affected their colonies. Then they could have tied in what type of pods you opened into this as well. I'm not convinced that this would have produced interesting gameplay, but it's not detailed enough to really judge. I suppose we handle the problem of communication by handwaving it away the way Star Trek does?
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by sageoflife on Sept 22, 2017 16:10:16 GMT
*Fans nitpick over every little thing, then wonder why the developers didn't think the game was worth continuing.*
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Sondergaard
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR
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sondergaard
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR
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Post by Sondergaard on Sept 22, 2017 16:18:29 GMT
I imagine that nobody on the writing staff even considered that it was something which would need to be explained. There's your problem. None of us are pathfinders for the AI so none of us have the slightest idea how their helmets work. Just one line would have explained what happened but they didn't think it necessary because they already knew and assumed we did as well. The obvious solution apparently wasn't obvious to them so they didn't explain it away. That's bad writing in a nutshell. By itself it's a tiny nitpick. Unfortunately this is the 4th game in a much loved series and this sort of sloppiness will be picked up on. And before anybody says it, I'm not setting impossible standards. I'm setting perfectly reasonable standards for any half-decent writing team.
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