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Post by rapscallioness on Oct 14, 2017 2:00:46 GMT
...I want brothels. And a tavern. And to be able to get my character drunk if I want to.
Biovar, please.
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Post by majesticjazz on Oct 14, 2017 2:09:05 GMT
Oh, I get it. Some folks are trying to single out another BW dev to demonize in case they think they find more fuel to peddle their "SJWs are ruining gaming/Bioware!" theory. God, this is so pathetic. And just plain insidious. No, virtual rape is insidious.
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Post by river82 on Oct 14, 2017 4:30:49 GMT
And to be able to get my character drunk if I want to. Biovar, please. Talking about getting drunk, I was really disappointed in the Mass Effect trilogy that there were no consequences for getting smashed out of your skull. I was looking forward to having my Shepard wake up to discover she signed control of the Normandy over to some Batarian pirates, or Aria, but alas that was not to be
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Post by melbella on Oct 14, 2017 4:39:10 GMT
And to be able to get my character drunk if I want to. Biovar, please. Talking about getting drunk, I was really disappointed in the Mass Effect trilogy that there were no consequences for getting smashed out of your skull. I was looking forward to having my Shepard wake up to discover she signed control of the Normandy over to some Batarian pirates, or Aria, but alas that was not to be
I'm more annoyed that Shepard passes out after 3 measly drinks. In my head-canon, Shepard can't get drunk, thanks to Cerberus blood-scrubbing upgrades, which helps pave the way for a harrowing dive into depression and death-wishing.
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Post by naughtynomad on Oct 14, 2017 5:38:04 GMT
And to be able to get my character drunk if I want to. Biovar, please. Talking about getting drunk, I was really disappointed in the Mass Effect trilogy that there were no consequences for getting smashed out of your skull. I was looking forward to having my Shepard wake up to discover she signed control of the Normandy over to some Batarian pirates, or Aria, but alas that was not to be That would be hilarious. It opens a whole new questline to get back the Normandy, and keep your Alliance commission.
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Post by davesin on Oct 14, 2017 6:26:10 GMT
Talking about getting drunk, I was really disappointed in the Mass Effect trilogy that there were no consequences for getting smashed out of your skull. I was looking forward to having my Shepard wake up to discover she signed control of the Normandy over to some Batarian pirates, or Aria, but alas that was not to be That would be hilarious. It opens a whole new questline to get back the Normandy, and keep your Alliance commission. It would certainly make Citadel DLC better. And during the whole fight sequence, Shepard would still suffer from hangover. Try to get headshots in such condition...
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Post by FireAndBlood on Oct 14, 2017 11:27:30 GMT
Even for your standards this is pathetic, Majesticjizz.
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Post by majesticjazz on Oct 14, 2017 14:36:31 GMT
Even for your standards this is pathetic, Majesticjizz. How so? In all seriousness, my theory is this. Before Bioware was willing to do certain things with their games, but due to the new personalities on their teams, there is a different type of influence. I forgot which game (Dragon Age or Mass Effect) but the story has it that during a production meeting, one of the females on the team displayed disgust with certain elements in the game. It was suggested that if left in the game, it would or could sour the female players if they perceived it a certain way. As a result, Bioware took the content out, despite the same/similar content being in previous games. The video I gave shows Sam Miggs talking about virtual rape and suggesting how misogynistic the gaming industry is. I wont go into the details that is why I posted the video to watch and told you to research her. Well apparently she is now an assistant writer with Bioware. Not sure how much influence an assistant writer has, but she is on the team. Given her stance on gaming, perhaps not really her, but people inside Bioware who agree with her (including men and Manveer Heir comes to mind) may have had some influence. Influence regarding no brothels in DAI and even DA4 because it depicts women as sex objects....despite the brothels in DAO and DAI featuring male prostitutes. Same can be said about the whole Desire Demon appearance as it could be perceived as something tilted towards male satisfaction....once again using the female body as an object of sexual desire (pun intended). Bioware now has men and woman on the staff who now challenge certain content making its way into the games even if they were in previous games. Given Bioware's track record of being progressive/inclusive... it would make sense that Bioware doesnt want to be a standard dudbro developer thinking their audience is all males (Like Rockstar Games or CDPR). They WANT to be seen as inclusive the same way Rockstar Games wants to be seen as disruptive or Playdead wants to be seen as creative and odd. Therefore they take extra steps to ensure "all groups" are treated fairly and not offended by any content. Bioware has reached out to LGBT groups to make sure the content in their game is representative of the community and not offensive, who is to say they Bioware doesnt also reach out to women activists groups to make sure the content isnt offensive? This isnt a bad thing, but to people who miss the DAO of old, it could be annoying. And it could explain certain things like the desire demon and no brothels. Yes, DAI and MEA does feature female nudity in a way DAO and DA2 never did, but it is in a less lustful way and more ina romantic "two people in love" way vs walking into a brothel and seeing a bundle of naked women waiting for you to "purchase" them like TW3.
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Post by rras1994 on Oct 14, 2017 15:16:32 GMT
Even for your standards this is pathetic, Majesticjizz. How so? In all seriousness, my theory is this. Before Bioware was willing to do certain things with their games, but due to the new personalities on their teams, there is a different type of influence. I forgot which game (Dragon Age or Mass Effect) but the story has it that during a production meeting, one of the females on the team displayed disgust with certain elements in the game. It was suggested that if left in the game, it would or could sour the female players if they perceived it a certain way. As a result, Bioware took the content out, despite the same/similar content being in previous games. Everything you said there was wrong. It was DAI, the writers were getting together feedback on their work. After one of the guys had said his work, one of the other writers (who was female - this was ONLY brought up by David Gaider as the value of having diverse writers as they are more likely to be able to point out different thiongs from another angle- also no mention of disgust) mentioned how it could be misconstrued as rape. The writer was NOT trying to write a rape scene, had accidently written one, so they changed it. It wasn't fixed because of "female players" (I actually think it would have been happening to male players), and it had nothing to do with female writers wanting to change Biowares tone. When you write things like this, it almost seems like you are trying to suggest that women are trying to ruin your games. Funny that.
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Post by majesticjazz on Oct 14, 2017 15:18:55 GMT
How so? In all seriousness, my theory is this. Before Bioware was willing to do certain things with their games, but due to the new personalities on their teams, there is a different type of influence. I forgot which game (Dragon Age or Mass Effect) but the story has it that during a production meeting, one of the females on the team displayed disgust with certain elements in the game. It was suggested that if left in the game, it would or could sour the female players if they perceived it a certain way. As a result, Bioware took the content out, despite the same/similar content being in previous games. Everything you said there was wrong. It was DAI, the writers were getting together feedback on their work. After one of the guys had said his work, one of the other writers (who was female - this was ONLY brought up by David Gaider as the value of having diverse writers as they are more likely to be able to point out different thiongs from another angle- also no mention of disgust) mentioned how it could be misconstrued as rape. The writer was NOT trying to write a rape scene, had accidently written one, so they changed it. It wasn't fixed because of "female players" (I actually think it would have been happening to male players), and it had nothing to do with female writers wanting to change Biowares tone. When you write things like this, it almost seems like you are trying to suggest that women are trying to ruin your games. Funny that. Not wrong What you said still backs up my point....which is that certain things will not make it into the game due to how certain people could perceive it whether it be rape, racism, sexism or any other topic. You corrected my details but the core remains the same. And no, it is YOU that may want for me to suggest that women are trying to ruin my games cause it makes for an easier way to attack my points by positing me as a disgruntled male gamer. I just feel that Bioware now has a larger demographics on their team to draw input from. Like I said (which you conveniently ignored), that isnt a bad thing. It could just explain certain actions they took like desire demons and brothels. My gaming experience isnt ruined. It is altered and changed, but not ruined. I still have Rockstar Games and CDPR to goto if I want that "boys only" type of experience.
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Post by smilesja on Oct 14, 2017 15:23:01 GMT
Even for your standards this is pathetic, Majesticjizz. How so? In all seriousness, my theory is this. Before Bioware was willing to do certain things with their games, but due to the new personalities on their teams, there is a different type of influence. I forgot which game (Dragon Age or Mass Effect) but the story has it that during a production meeting, one of the females on the team displayed disgust with certain elements in the game. It was suggested that if left in the game, it would or could sour the female players if they perceived it a certain way. As a result, Bioware took the content out, despite the same/similar content being in previous games. The video I gave shows Sam Miggs talking about virtual rape and suggesting how misogynistic the gaming industry is. I wont go into the details that is why I posted the video to watch and told you to research her. Well apparently she is now an assistant writer with Bioware. Not sure how much influence an assistant writer has, but she is on the team. Given her stance on gaming, perhaps not really her, but people inside Bioware who agree with her (including men and Manveer Heir comes to mind) may have had some influence. Influence regarding no brothels in DAI and even DA4 because it depicts women as sex objects....despite the brothels in DAO and DAI featuring male prostitutes. Same can be said about the whole Desire Demon appearance as it could be perceived as something tilted towards male satisfaction....once again using the female body as an object of sexual desire (pun intended). Bioware now has men and woman on the staff who now challenge certain content making its way into the games even if they were in previous games. Given Bioware's track record of being progressive/inclusive... it would make sense that Bioware doesnt want to be a standard dudbro developer thinking their audience is all males (Like Rockstar Games or CDPR). They WANT to be seen as inclusive the same way Rockstar Games wants to be seen as disruptive or Playdead wants to be seen as creative and odd. Therefore they take extra steps to ensure "all groups" are treated fairly and not offended by any content. Bioware has reached out to LGBT groups to make sure the content in their game is representative of the community and not offensive, who is to say they Bioware doesnt also reach out to women activists groups to make sure the content isnt offensive? This isnt a bad thing, but to people who miss the DAO of old, it could be annoying. And it could explain certain things like the desire demon and no brothels. Yes, DAI and MEA does feature female nudity in a way DAO and DA2 never did, but it is in a less lustful way and more ina romantic "two people in love" way vs walking into a brothel and seeing a bundle of naked women waiting for you to "purchase" them like TW3. That sounds like a conspiracy theory.
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Post by majesticjazz on Oct 14, 2017 15:26:36 GMT
How so? In all seriousness, my theory is this. Before Bioware was willing to do certain things with their games, but due to the new personalities on their teams, there is a different type of influence. I forgot which game (Dragon Age or Mass Effect) but the story has it that during a production meeting, one of the females on the team displayed disgust with certain elements in the game. It was suggested that if left in the game, it would or could sour the female players if they perceived it a certain way. As a result, Bioware took the content out, despite the same/similar content being in previous games. The video I gave shows Sam Miggs talking about virtual rape and suggesting how misogynistic the gaming industry is. I wont go into the details that is why I posted the video to watch and told you to research her. Well apparently she is now an assistant writer with Bioware. Not sure how much influence an assistant writer has, but she is on the team. Given her stance on gaming, perhaps not really her, but people inside Bioware who agree with her (including men and Manveer Heir comes to mind) may have had some influence. Influence regarding no brothels in DAI and even DA4 because it depicts women as sex objects....despite the brothels in DAO and DAI featuring male prostitutes. Same can be said about the whole Desire Demon appearance as it could be perceived as something tilted towards male satisfaction....once again using the female body as an object of sexual desire (pun intended). Bioware now has men and woman on the staff who now challenge certain content making its way into the games even if they were in previous games. Given Bioware's track record of being progressive/inclusive... it would make sense that Bioware doesnt want to be a standard dudbro developer thinking their audience is all males (Like Rockstar Games or CDPR). They WANT to be seen as inclusive the same way Rockstar Games wants to be seen as disruptive or Playdead wants to be seen as creative and odd. Therefore they take extra steps to ensure "all groups" are treated fairly and not offended by any content. Bioware has reached out to LGBT groups to make sure the content in their game is representative of the community and not offensive, who is to say they Bioware doesnt also reach out to women activists groups to make sure the content isnt offensive? This isnt a bad thing, but to people who miss the DAO of old, it could be annoying. And it could explain certain things like the desire demon and no brothels. Yes, DAI and MEA does feature female nudity in a way DAO and DA2 never did, but it is in a less lustful way and more ina romantic "two people in love" way vs walking into a brothel and seeing a bundle of naked women waiting for you to "purchase" them like TW3. That sounds like a conspiracy theory. Ok, label it whatever you want, but that is my theory. I never said it was law or fact.
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Post by rras1994 on Oct 14, 2017 15:29:40 GMT
Everything you said there was wrong. It was DAI, the writers were getting together feedback on their work. After one of the guys had said his work, one of the other writers (who was female - this was ONLY brought up by David Gaider as the value of having diverse writers as they are more likely to be able to point out different thiongs from another angle- also no mention of disgust) mentioned how it could be misconstrued as rape. The writer was NOT trying to write a rape scene, had accidently written one, so they changed it. It wasn't fixed because of "female players" (I actually think it would have been happening to male players), and it had nothing to do with female writers wanting to change Biowares tone. When you write things like this, it almost seems like you are trying to suggest that women are trying to ruin your games. Funny that. Not wrong What you said still backs up my point....which is that certain things will not make it into the game due to how certain people could perceive it. Yes, wrong. You suggested that a writer was stopped from writing something he wanted cus it could offend people. Instead, it was because he'd written something that had the opposite effect of what he actually wanted. That doesn't mean they are excluding topics from a game. And let's stop towing the line. You mean rape. You want rape in the game because you think it's "dark" and "edgy". There was rape in DAI in a codex. It was very graphic and cruel. But that doesn't count to you as it wasn't "visual" enough. It wasn't in the other Dragon Age games either. It was always implied like with the Hespith poem, it's not shown in city elf origin and in DA2 you have the girl before it happens and you save her (which is kinda a boring cliche but tbh that scene was all about Ander's losing his control rather than the rape).
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Post by midnight tea on Oct 14, 2017 15:42:39 GMT
That sounds like a conspiracy theory. It very much is.
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Post by midnight tea on Oct 14, 2017 15:47:12 GMT
Not wrong What you said still backs up my point....which is that certain things will not make it into the game due to how certain people could perceive it. Yes, wrong. You suggested that a writer was stopped from writing something he wanted cus it could offend people. Instead, it was because he'd written something that had the opposite effect of what he actually wanted. That doesn't mean they are excluding topics from a game. And let's stop towing the line. You mean rape. You want rape in the game because you think it's "dark" and "edgy". There was rape in DAI in a codex. It was very graphic and cruel. But that doesn't count to you as it wasn't "visual" enough. It wasn't in the other Dragon Age games either. It was always implied like with the Hespith poem, it's not shown in city elf origin and in DA2 you have the girl before it happens and you save her (which is kinda a boring cliche but tbh that scene was all about Ander's losing his control rather than the rape). Honestly? Every time someone misconstrues feedback for creative work as a sort of unwanted interference, it shows how little they know about creative process. ...Though, in case of some people, I imagine that if another writer suggested "moar sexxx! and "moar arbitrarily understood darkness!" they wouldn't mind or didn't consider it an objectionable interference at all. It's only when they don't get what they want is when it's all conspiracy theories and hostile takovers.
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Post by shechinah on Oct 14, 2017 16:08:39 GMT
Not wrong What you said still backs up my point....which is that certain things will not make it into the game due to how certain people could perceive it whether it be rape, racism, sexism or any other topic. You corrected my details but the core remains the same. No, I'm with rras1994 on this. It's standard practice for writers to have someone go over their writing to make sure what is conveyed is what is intended by them. That's why some writers appreciate having a diverse ranged of people look through their work. It's to ensure that a scene written matches the writer's vision of said scene. The writer uses others' perception to judge how well this has been done. It's little different than how a builder might use a tape measure to make sure the length and width of what they're working on is correct. Sure, you could use your own thumb but with the other tool, you're more likely to achieve the results you seek.
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Post by majesticjazz on Oct 14, 2017 16:35:13 GMT
Not wrong What you said still backs up my point....which is that certain things will not make it into the game due to how certain people could perceive it. Yes, wrong. You suggested that a writer was stopped from writing something he wanted cus it could offend people. Instead, it was because he'd written something that had the opposite effect of what he actually wanted. That doesn't mean they are excluding topics from a game. And let's stop towing the line. You mean rape. You want rape in the game because you think it's "dark" and "edgy". There was rape in DAI in a codex. It was very graphic and cruel. But that doesn't count to you as it wasn't "visual" enough. It wasn't in the other Dragon Age games either. It was always implied like with the Hespith poem, it's not shown in city elf origin and in DA2 you have the girl before it happens and you save her (which is kinda a boring cliche but tbh that scene was all about Ander's losing his control rather than the rape). Ok I remain in my stance. You all are obligated to disagree.
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Post by shechinah on Oct 14, 2017 16:43:09 GMT
Ok I remain in my stance. You all are obligated to disagree. Or we disagree with you not because of any obligation, morally or legally, but because we are free-thinking individuals whose opinions differ from yours.
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Post by majesticjazz on Oct 14, 2017 16:45:43 GMT
Ok I remain in my stance. You all are obligated to disagree. Or we disagree with you not because of any obligation, morally or legally, but because we have our own opinions that differ from yours. And that is perfectly fine.
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Post by shechinah on Oct 14, 2017 16:48:48 GMT
Or we disagree with you not because of any obligation, morally or legally, but because we have our own opinions that differ from yours. And that is perfectly fine. You do know what obligated means, right? Because according to your post, you're saying we don't actual have our own opinions and we have to disagree with you out of social, moral or legal obligation. It's not a matter of opinion, it's a matter of obligation. To put it differently: you just unintentionally created an example of why writers usually have someone to go over their work and make sure it's proper intent is conveyed. Unless the above was what you meant to convey?
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Post by majesticjazz on Oct 14, 2017 16:54:11 GMT
And that is perfectly fine. You do know what obligated means, right? Because according to your post, you're saying we don't actual have our own opinions and we have to disagree with you out of social, moral or legal obligation. It's not a matter of opinion, it's a matter of obligation. To put it differently: you just unintentionally created an example of why writers usually have someone to go over their work and make sure it's proper intent is conveyed. Unless the above was what you meant to convey? Ok
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Post by alanc9 on Oct 14, 2017 17:25:32 GMT
Yes, wrong. You suggested that a writer was stopped from writing something he wanted cus it could offend people. Instead, it was because he'd written something that had the opposite effect of what he actually wanted. That doesn't mean they are excluding topics from a game. And let's stop towing the line. You mean rape. You want rape in the game because you think it's "dark" and "edgy". There was rape in DAI in a codex. It was very graphic and cruel. But that doesn't count to you as it wasn't "visual" enough. It wasn't in the other Dragon Age games either. It was always implied like with the Hespith poem, it's not shown in city elf origin and in DA2 you have the girl before it happens and you save her (which is kinda a boring cliche but tbh that scene was all about Ander's losing his control rather than the rape). Ok I remain in my stance. You all are obligated free to disagree. Now that we're past the "obligated" bit, what's your substantive position here? That writers should never accept peer review? Or is it just that the peer review is working wrong, and a better version of Bio would have been into the whole rape thing; the writer didn't intend rape but it was a happy accident that should have been kept. Or is it that Gaider was lying about the whole thing? I'm just trying to figure out how the conspiracy theory works.
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Post by midnight tea on Oct 14, 2017 17:47:06 GMT
Ok I remain in my stance. You all are obligated free to disagree. Now that we're past the "obligated" bit, what's your substantive position here? Other than being glaringly passive-aggressive...? I don't think we'd find anything substantive here. This thread has long spun off its axis, but I propose we not let people who have proven, many times over, that they're interested mostly with negative nancy'ing and crapping on Bioware hijack discussions or mood on forum.
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Post by naughtynomad on Oct 14, 2017 19:23:13 GMT
Now that we're past the "obligated" bit, what's your substantive position here? Other than being glaringly passive-aggressive...? I don't think we'd find anything substantive here. This thread has long spun off its axis, but I propose we not let people who have proven, many times over, that they're interested mostly with negative nancy'ing and crapping on Bioware hijack discussions or mood on forum. Hahaha... this is just priceless. You don't like that people have differences of opinion than you, so you want to remove them from the forum. Thankfully the mods are much smarter than to entertain such a asinine suggestion. Here is some sound advice for you to live a more successful and less high-strung life: Learn that just because someone disagrees with you doesn't mean they're wrong. Learn that your opinions are just that... opinions. Learn that criticisms of a product you enjoy doesn't make someone a "negative nancy" but actually does more to support that product than your deluded, misguided, blind acceptance of all its faults. But then again, you've made it abundantly clear, that you are incapable of have logical discussions across the entity of this thread, so I won't be holding my breath.
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Jun 26, 2017 22:00:50 GMT
1,021
warrior
I don't like MP!
717
Mar 20, 2017 22:14:03 GMT
March 2017
warrior
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by warrior on Oct 14, 2017 20:24:15 GMT
I'm here for brothels if male NPCs can be sex workers, too. That our PC could sleep with.
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