If Bioware decided to continue the Andromeda storyline do you think Tann would end up like Udina?

true, Link. Also I don't mind that Indoctrinated Reaper Sleeper Agents causing Civil wars within all factions. For example, Sleeper Agents causing a friendly fire incident to slow 2 squads down by making them fight each other. 


Imagine a few Sleeper Agents causes the death of 2 N7 Squads by an Alliance bombing Run by the way of disinformation. or A squad of Krogan attack you and your squad during the Genophage segment. Of course, Suicide bombings at all hub worlds.  For Example, Visiting Thressia and an Justicar runs up to you and guides you into a trap by other Reaper Sleeper Agents for an team suicide explosion in which you have to escape the carnage.

Or a Rash of bombings on the Citadel killing many innocent people. Due to the sadistic nature of Reapers, Having them target your team mates and Normandy crew by attacks or indoctrination. 

This makes me think about that one instance on the Citadel where two turians try to kill you outside of Chora’s Den. Since then, hubs were basically guaranteed safe zones unless there’s a transition and the entire thing turns into a battlefield, like the final assault or the Citadel coup. Danger should be everywhere and surprise you on occasion, but that never seems to happen, and it’s a real shame. 

I just think there's a difference between being an opportunistic, narcissistic twat who gladly discards humanity's greatest soldier to forward human dominance in politics vs actually staging a violent coup against his alien counterparts in an attempt to "seize power". It's desperate, I get it, but man, Udina doesn't even talk the same way in ME3. There's none of that comedic spark to his dialogue, you know, that self-aware writing that depicts him as some sort of doofus. He also has black hair and that's weird? The characters agree in unison that Udina's actions are shocking, yeah sure I get it, but from a WRITER'S POV this was an incredible disservice to the character.

I feel the same way about Samara showing her emotions as much as she does on her ME3 mission and then deciding to commit suicide over sticking to the code when it dictates her daughter should die. Okay, this is different, you don't have to comment on it, but c'mon, this is some overemotional bullshit. Samara was brutal and ruthless in the previous game. She has her feelings but she holds the code in higher regard and ME3 and its shitty new writers just bastardized the fuck out of everything done either by Brian Kindregan, Drew K or Chris L'Etoile in ME3. You should never put emotional "feels" above what is believable and if you beg to differ, that's fine except you'd be wrong, but Samara was out of character here.

Udina and Anderson were both written by Drew in ME1 and 2. In 3 Mac took them upon himself and IT SHOWS. Udina hadn't even done the coup in ME3 in my initial playthrough back in march 2012 before I said "What is wrong with the way they talk?". ME3 took itself too seriously and it ruined Udina's character. He's the sort of character like Captain Qwark in the R&C series who is an asshole, he is kinda ruthless and he is a massive coward, but then in the most dire situation and the final chapter you would've seen him prove you WRONG in how shitty he is, by redeeming himself somehow or surprising you with how at the bottom of his heart he does care at least a little about the cooperation between humanity and aliens, and none of this is communicated when he assassinates hundreds on the Citadel by going along with Cerberus (already a bipolar decision) to "save Earth" which is some bullcrap excuse the game came up with afterwards, or rather, Chris Hepler who wrote the codex in isolation. Reading the Incursion comic that is a tie-in Mac Walters comic to ME3 it just confirmed what I felt in ME3, that Mac was trying to portray Udina as some sniveling evil schemer who wanted to play Palpatine. He fucking orders Bailey to kill Detective Chellick (or was it Exec Pallin?) to get rid of alien influence and promote Bailey to office -- UDINA DOESN'T GO THIS FAR! ...and it's all portrayed as such to paint this idea of Udina always having been in tow with Cerberus "behind the scenes", because that's what Mac Walters has done in Every. Single. Comic or subplot in his career as Lead Writer EVER. Even in Andromeda this shit happens and it's just not believable.

If by ending up like Udina, you mean dead, then I hope so. I strongly disliked Tann. He seemed so useless and incapable.

In current replay, I'm not seeing Tann on the level of Udina. That distinction goes to the lovely Addison. Hell, she bitches about you not having done anything to deserve the title of Pathfinder and then actually tries to stop you from doing your job. Were it not for Vetra, the game would take place entirely aboard the Nexus until the kett eventually invaded and destroyed it. Or everyone starved to death. Yeah, boot her ass out the airlock.

"I am the council"

A lot of the issues with Udina's coup are caused by the game moving away from the original cut script. In the original the Council were seriously debating whether or not to sacrifice one of the homeworlds (Kahje) to the Reapers, and Udina's 'coup' attempt was a last desperate bid to force them to agree to it, so they would buy more time for the other races to fight back. Thane died to kill Udina, thus saving the hanar and finally repaying the drell debt to the hanar for saving them from extinction.

I agree. I don't get the Tann hate as I don't see any reason for Ryder to hate him beyond everyone else hating him. Tann reminds me of what Iron Bull says in DAI. A leader isn't chosen because he's competent but because he's the one willing to do the job or something like that.  Kesh seems nice and everyone likes her, but she is no leader. She just sits around complaining,  and after everything you do for the Krogan she still doesn't offer any help like the rest of the leaders near the end. Kandros does nothing the entire game. Two colony sites were lost under his watch.  And Addison is just a ***** who allows people like Spender to do whatever he wants.  The Nexus leadership was terrible across the board but Tann is the only one I actually respected, he was faking it until he made it and he was smart enough to latch onto Ryder quickly while Addision did nothing but try to make an enemy out the only pathfinder they had. Sure Tann tells Ryder to figure it out, but that's forgivable as he knows nothing about what a pathfinder's job is. 

I still think it's stupid how they traveled to a new galaxy without any plans for creating a habitable world on their own in case of emergencies and so on. The entire Andromeda Initiative is full of morons. 

I doubt we get anymore Andromeda games but if they did, I wouldn't be surprised if they give him the Udina treatment. The writers went out of their way to try and make the player hate Tann.

I didn't mind him telling you to figure it out.  Many bosses have no idea how to do your job, so they ask you to do it.  Its kind of normal.  When working in a supervisor position on a project with a programmer, I explained what I wanted done, but I didn't tell him how to do it.  If he said something couldn't be done or was impractical I reworked what I needed to get done.

And yes, much of the plot hinges on everyone being an idiot with few plans, less contingency plans, and unrealistic expectations of nothing going wrong. People acted less like colonists and explorers and more like passengers on a cruise ship.

Not saying he is a great and inspirational leader, but that's really not that bad. Figuring it out can be, we don't have the tools to analyze it,or an affirmative statement that it can't be done. While I remember the pathfinder line about this, I don't remember the science one so maybe the context was worse. And he freely admitted that he wasn't a leader and wasn't good with people, so I just didn't have a problem with him. He's actually trying which is more than I can say for the rest of the leadership.

Perhaps, but it's very clear that Tann is, at best, lower management. His micromanaging, dictatorial style that includes *not listening* to what his people are telling him says that really, it's a good thing for the Initiative to replace Tann.