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Post by colfoley on Dec 27, 2018 23:21:31 GMT
I like this a lot. I didn't mind being the Inquisitor or the Warden-Commander (official titles with actual duties attached to them), but I also liked being Hawke, who was an Almighty Janitor and just sort of fell into being Champion because they killed a guy. Like, there was no Champion office, no Champion castle, Hawke was mostly just a person trying to live their life. I enjoyed that a lot and would love to play a character in a similar position again. If I could get back my Hawke with Isabela on a ship exploring the various coastal areas and island of Thedas... Sadly there are too many things to deal with in DA4 (canary invasion, Solas stuff, wardens, etc) so we'll get the usual boring 'save the world' stuff with important hero-person. I'll be pleasantly surprised if the events mentioned above happen anyway and our new pc's primary job is to look out for themselves/family and friends/community. I'd put those odds as being 'fairly likely'.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: melbella
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Post by melbella on Dec 28, 2018 1:22:27 GMT
our new pc's primary job is to look out for themselves/family and friends/community. So long as we're not railroaded into losses, that would be fine. I didn't like that, no matter how well I investigated the murders and put the clues together in DA2, Leandra was always killed.
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Post by vertigomez on Dec 28, 2018 2:17:39 GMT
I don't mind railroading for story beats like that, like Leandra dying or Anders blowing up the Chantry. Sometimes awful shit happens and we can't do anything about it. A story where nothing bad ever happens or the protagonist always finds the 100% optimal no-loss solution lacks a little impact, I think...
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Dec 28, 2018 2:21:11 GMT
I don't mind railroading for story beats like that, like Leandra dying or Anders blowing up the Chantry. Sometimes awful shit happens and we can't do anything about it. A story where nothing bad ever happens or the protagonist always finds the 100% optimal no-loss solution lacks a little impact, I think... Theres a difference between not being able to stop something and being given the Idiot Ball to let it happen. For example investigate Leandra’s disappearance immediately rather than “My mother is missing after getting the same kinds of flowers we’ve attached to a serial killer. Better wait several hours before even beginning the search for her.” Or for Anders, confront him and have there be a fight or something where he escapes and doesn’t reappear until he does his thing rather than nobody acting in it.
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melbella
N7
Trouble-shooting Space Diva
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: melbella
Prime Posts: 2186
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Post by melbella on Dec 28, 2018 2:33:33 GMT
The idiot ball is why I don't bring Aveline to the foundry in Act 1 anymore. For her to say in Act 2 'there's no evidence' is just flat out wrong if she was there when you found Ninette's ring and then gave it to Ghislain, who clearly identifies it as hers.
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Post by pessimistpanda on Dec 28, 2018 5:32:59 GMT
Well since we came to town, The whole city's been a mess. Women butchered every night, And elves placed under false arrest. Won't you come on over? Investigate just one crime sceeeeene? Do some fucking police work AAAAAAAAAVELIIIIIIIIIIINE
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR
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Post by davkar on Dec 28, 2018 7:47:48 GMT
our new pc's primary job is to look out for themselves/family and friends/community. So long as we're not railroaded into losses, that would be fine. I didn't like that, no matter how well I investigated the murders and put the clues together in DA2, Leandra was always killed. I was picturing a personal ME3 with real stakes, choices and consequences. Translated into gameplay progression and narrative I want an interconnected Witcher 2 Chapter 2s (overlapping maps but essentially two different areas and stories) stacked on each other. Impactful EMS resources affecting gameplay and story, base/caravan and resource management. DA4 will likely opens with the canary invasion. PC has to fight their way out of x city. (human example) Will they save the powerful family artifact or the elven servants/slave trapped in the storehouse? Where would they lead the survivors? Seek refuge with the dwarves (kal-sharok) where they'll likely have to deal with darkspawn or accept the help of the chantry inquisition/secret, masquerading as some other group inquisition who'll likely drag them into the Solas crap. There might be areas where you couldn't get in one playthrough based on your choices. Unfortunately with all the 'live' content bs and the popularity of the checklist open worlds this won't happen. Get ready for clearing 50 canary outposts and finding elven treasure maps. Yay.
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Post by colfoley on Dec 28, 2018 8:02:29 GMT
So long as we're not railroaded into losses, that would be fine. I didn't like that, no matter how well I investigated the murders and put the clues together in DA2, Leandra was always killed. I was picturing a personal ME3 with real stakes, choices and consequences. Translated into gameplay progression and narrative I want an interconnected Witcher 2 Chapter 2s (overlapping maps but essentially two different areas and stories) stacked on each other. Impactful EMS resources affecting gameplay and story, base/caravan and resource management. DA4 will likely opens with the canary invasion. PC has to fight their way out of x city. (human example) Will they save the powerful family artifact or the elven servants/slave trapped in the storehouse? Where would they lead the survivors? Seek refuge with the dwarves (kal-sharok) where they'll likely have to deal with darkspawn or accept the help of the chantry inquisition/secret, masquerading as some other group inquisition who'll likely drag them into the Solas crap. There might be areas where you couldn't get in one playthrough based on your choices. Unfortunately with all the 'live' content bs and the popularity of the checklist open worlds this won't happen. Get ready for clearing 50 canary outposts and finding elven treasure maps. Yay. ...I do hate it when a good post where I wanna like it goes real south real fast. I mean sure I understand the desire for pessism and there can be a lot of pessismism but just because company A is doing x and company b is also doing x does not necessitate that company A will do thing y which company B also does. Because BioWare has never done any of the stuff that Ubisoft does. BioWare has not made a game like any of the Far Crys or Assassin Creeds...and some of those gameplay features have existed long before the term 'live service' has even gained popularity.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Dec 28, 2018 8:12:34 GMT
DA4 will likely opens with the canary invasion. We should have listened to Shale.
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Post by davkar on Dec 28, 2018 8:49:50 GMT
I was picturing a personal ME3 with real stakes, choices and consequences. Translated into gameplay progression and narrative I want an interconnected Witcher 2 Chapter 2s (overlapping maps but essentially two different areas and stories) stacked on each other. Impactful EMS resources affecting gameplay and story, base/caravan and resource management. DA4 will likely opens with the canary invasion. PC has to fight their way out of x city. (human example) Will they save the powerful family artifact or the elven servants/slave trapped in the storehouse? Where would they lead the survivors? Seek refuge with the dwarves (kal-sharok) where they'll likely have to deal with darkspawn or accept the help of the chantry inquisition/secret, masquerading as some other group inquisition who'll likely drag them into the Solas crap. There might be areas where you couldn't get in one playthrough based on your choices. Unfortunately with all the 'live' content bs and the popularity of the checklist open worlds this won't happen. Get ready for clearing 50 canary outposts and finding elven treasure maps. Yay. ...I do hate it when a good post where I wanna like it goes real south real fast. I mean sure I understand the desire for pessism and there can be a lot of pessismism but just because company A is doing x and company b is also doing x does not necessitate that company A will do thing y which company B also does. Because BioWare has never done any of the stuff that Ubisoft does. BioWare has not made a game like any of the Far Crys or Assassin Creeds...and some of those gameplay features have existed long before the term 'live service' has even gained popularity. It's not pessimism, just lowering expectations. Bioware has the potential to make the game I envisioned but EA is commissioning it for the investors, not the players. The launch of Anthem will decide a lot of things. If it's a financial success (and EA only cares about that) then DA4 will be littered with the similar kind of content. If it fails then they might start listening to player feedback or they put BW on the chopping block next (let's not forget MEA was a failure too). DAI was riding the open world band wagon but since 80% of the areas serves no (/story) purpose other then 'extending' playtime those resources could have been spent better elsewhere. Story, characters, you know, thing BW excels at. Hissing wastes looks good, I enjoyed clearing it in the first 2 pts but I would gladly trade that area for a fleshed out (least Josie level) Harding romance. MEA maps had slightly more story relevance with the viability meter but they felt checklist-y. Now Anthem promises "hop in your power armor with some friends to slay the weekly monster for *high item color* loot!" experience.
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cankiie
N3
People are too forgiving when it comes to video games, and their focus is malplaced.
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Post by cankiie on Dec 28, 2018 12:37:39 GMT
Oh! Another wishlist thingy!
Looting needs to be fixed... yes, fixed.
I don't mind the crafting introduced in DA:I so much, heck, I don't care much for the lack of looks in the gear you can craft.
But the looting is horrendous.
I have a suggestion - allow an ability on the wheels-option to send companions out to gather every lootable object within proximity, it should be close obviously, this goes for ores, plants and corpses, maybe even chests if you'd like, looting and crafting should NOT be as time consuming as it is in DA:I.
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Post by phoray on Dec 28, 2018 17:32:36 GMT
@canklie
I'm all for the DA2 system. You find a node, and for "access to the site" merchants collect on your behalf and you just buy from them.
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People are too forgiving when it comes to video games, and their focus is malplaced.
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Post by cankiie on Dec 28, 2018 17:54:19 GMT
@canklie I'm all for the DA2 system. You find a node, and for "access to the site" merchants collect on your behalf and you just buy from them. I was thinking about something akin to this www.nexusmods.com/dragonage/mods/28Auto loot. Just for your companion instead, and at a much smaller scale than what you can see in the mod. The mod basically sends your character and companions to the closest loot pile and loots it automatically. I would prefer something like that for my companions, rather than having to walk by every single node myself and click the same button over and over again. The only time looting is interesting is when you have had a boss battle. Otherwise looting can NEVER be fun and interesting, and therefor you might as well make it as minimalized as possible. Granted I don't want to see future games void of crafting and finding the resources and looting, but it can be made much less obnoxious.
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Post by Little Bengel on Dec 28, 2018 17:55:15 GMT
Regarding the story, there are two major complaints I could aim at DAI:
-The fact that the Mage-Templar War is solved in the process of ONE FREAKING MISSION (the Orlesian Civil War kinda suffers from the same problem, IMO), which kinda left people blueballed on that aspect.
-The story in general felt... sanitized. Part of it could be blamed on having to do side-quests/close rifts to progress in the story, but there was also a feeling that our choices (Mage/Templar and Warden/Hawke aside) had no tangible impact. Trespasser was, without a doubt, a step in the right direction, from the focus on pure story and having more tangible consequences (hi Iron Bull).
What I'd like for DA4, story-wise, would be for the Tevinter-Qunari War to NOT be solved in a couple of missions, and to have it be a tangible part of the story for most of the game. Our choices (especially from DAI) should have more tangible consequences, and the story itself... yeah, I can't describe Trespasser as anything but a step in the right direction, and Bioware needs to build on that.
Also, more meaningful interactions with our companions, both positive and negative. Again, DAI felt sanitized in that aspect, especially in the negative part - DAII let you hand over Isabela and Fenris over, kill Anders, or spare him and piss off Sebastian, and DAO could have you kill Leliana and Zevran and leave Sten to die... and in DAI the most you could do was punch a bald dude in the face. (again, Trespasser. Iron Bull. yey)
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cankiie
N3
People are too forgiving when it comes to video games, and their focus is malplaced.
Posts: 457 Likes: 281
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Post by cankiie on Dec 28, 2018 18:10:47 GMT
Regarding the story, there are two major complaints I could aim at DAI: -The fact that the Mage-Templar War is solved in the process of ONE FREAKING MISSION (the Orlesian Civil War kinda suffers from the same problem, IMO), which kinda left people blueballed on that aspect. -The story in general felt... sanitized. Part of it could be blamed on having to do side-quests/close rifts to progress in the story, but there was also a feeling that our choices (Mage/Templar and Warden/Hawke aside) had no tangible impact. Trespasser was, without a doubt, a step in the right direction, from the focus on pure story and having more tangible consequences (hi Iron Bull). What I'd like for DA4, story-wise, would be for the Tevinter-Qunari War to NOT be solved in a couple of missions, and to have it be a tangible part of the story for most of the game. Our choices (especially from DAI) should have more tangible consequences, and the story itself... yeah, I can't describe Trespasser as anything but a step in the right direction, and Bioware needs to build on that. Also, more meaningful interactions with our companions, both positive and negative. Again, DAI felt sanitized in that aspect, especially in the negative part - DAII let you hand over Isabela and Fenris over, kill Anders, or spare him and piss off Sebastian, and DAO could have you kill Leliana and Zevran and leave Sten to die... and in DAI the most you could do was punch a bald dude in the face. (again, Trespasser. Iron Bull. yey) What I gathered from the mage vs templar thingy was that you took one of the two large forces of mages/or templars and Corypheous took the other. Because the larger force of either mages or templars were now with the inquisition and the other with Corypheous this means that other mages and templars out in the world are now left without any top leaders and orders, and all they have are smaller skirmishes. The Orlesian thing... I am not entirely sure what I want to think about that civil war, I mean... you pretty much quell that fire, your intention was to quell it so that you could gain the support of the Orlesian army one way or another. You even personally go to the Exalted Plains to the armies or parts of the army that the war is over.
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Post by colfoley on Dec 28, 2018 18:27:55 GMT
Regarding the story, there are two major complaints I could aim at DAI: -The fact that the Mage-Templar War is solved in the process of ONE FREAKING MISSION (the Orlesian Civil War kinda suffers from the same problem, IMO), which kinda left people blueballed on that aspect. -The story in general felt... sanitized. Part of it could be blamed on having to do side-quests/close rifts to progress in the story, but there was also a feeling that our choices (Mage/Templar and Warden/Hawke aside) had no tangible impact. Trespasser was, without a doubt, a step in the right direction, from the focus on pure story and having more tangible consequences (hi Iron Bull). What I'd like for DA4, story-wise, would be for the Tevinter-Qunari War to NOT be solved in a couple of missions, and to have it be a tangible part of the story for most of the game. Our choices (especially from DAI) should have more tangible consequences, and the story itself... yeah, I can't describe Trespasser as anything but a step in the right direction, and Bioware needs to build on that. Also, more meaningful interactions with our companions, both positive and negative. Again, DAI felt sanitized in that aspect, especially in the negative part - DAII let you hand over Isabela and Fenris over, kill Anders, or spare him and piss off Sebastian, and DAO could have you kill Leliana and Zevran and leave Sten to die... and in DAI the most you could do was punch a bald dude in the face. (again, Trespasser. Iron Bull. yey) meh I'd be shocked if bioware repeats the same story mistakes again.
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Post by phoray on Dec 28, 2018 18:29:00 GMT
@salos There is an absurd murder knife option it's just locked behind Dorian's romance. Boo But there is all the direct executions. But with it being so organized, it does feel rather "okay"
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Post by UutIVvdPw7END0Ef on Dec 28, 2018 19:10:46 GMT
Useful mounts that can be used in combat and don't stop banter or prevent searching/picking items. Maybe with various stats and race/class bonuses.
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Hrungr
Twitter Guru
ღ N-Special
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Staff Mini-Profile Theme: Hrungr
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Prime Posts: 18,258
Prime Likes: 65,767
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Post by Hrungr on Dec 28, 2018 21:23:09 GMT
I touched on this ages ago, but on the topic of farming crafting materials, my "Pie In The Sky" dream would be to turn it more of a business and skip the farming.
For example, you would explore the region you're in and find places to invest in mines. They do the work for you, and you just come back periodically to pick up your (metal) crafting materials, gold, gems, and sell whatever you didn't need. And that's all you would need to do.
However, the more you invest, perhaps even hiring specialist NPCs, the greater the output, and the greater the chance they'll find exotic fade-touched materials. Over time, you watch as your operations grow larger, and they might even uncover hidden locations for you to explore.
And then carry this idea to the other crafting materials.
Explore a region, find seeds for your various crafting plants, then invest in a greenhouse/farm to grow this stuff for you. Hire people to pick what's available in the region. Maybe hire on a specialist like Ines the Botanist.
For common monsters/wildlife, set up hunting camps in the region and have hunters roam the area getting hides for you. The more you invest, more hides, and a greater chance you'll get a heads-up that an exotic/fade-touched monster has moved into the area.
The general idea here being - encourage exploration and investment, watch your ventures grow over time, and skip the tedious farming. I'd also avoid Preston Garvey-ing these ventures where you're constantly having to run around protecting them. The odd time is okay (eg. if there's quest tied to it), but not to overdo it.
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Post by phoray on Dec 28, 2018 21:39:52 GMT
NO CLIFFHANGERS
DA5 may not happen. PLEASE.
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Post by phoray on Dec 28, 2018 21:41:02 GMT
hey Hrungr that sounds like a "War Table" of Resources. like our NPC has some side business and there is paperwork and negotiations.
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N3
People are too forgiving when it comes to video games, and their focus is malplaced.
Posts: 457 Likes: 281
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Post by cankiie on Dec 28, 2018 21:47:15 GMT
I touched on this ages ago, but on the topic of farming crafting materials, my "Pie In The Sky" dream would be to turn it more a business and skip the farming. For example, you would explore the region you're in and find places to invest in mines. They do the work for you, and you just come back periodically to pick up your (metal) crafting materials, gold, gems, and sell whatever you didn't need. And that's all you would need to do. However, the more you invest, perhaps even hiring specialist NPCs, the greater the output, and the greater the chance they'll find exotic fade-touched materials. Over time, you watch as your operations grow larger, and they might even uncover hidden locations for you to explore. And then carry this idea to the other crafting materials. Explore a region, find seeds for your various crafting plants, then invest in a greenhouse/farm to grow this stuff for you. Hire people to pick what's available in the region. Maybe hire on a specialist like Ines the Botanist. For common monsters/wildlife, set up hunting camps in the region and have hunters roam the area getting hides for you. The more you invest, more hides, and a greater chance you'll get a heads-up that an exotic/fade-touched monster has moved into the area. The general idea here being - encourage exploration and investment, watch your ventures grow over time, and skip the tedious farming. I'd also avoid Preston Garvey-ing these ventures where you're constantly having to run around protecting them. The odd time is okay (eg. if there's quest tied to it), but not to overdo it. I kinda see this as a combination of what Phoray had suggested with the merchant selling stuff. And the looking for quarry and log thingies in Inquisition. It is actually a great idea. You cut down on the obnoxious looting of crafting material while also encouraging exploring, and you are not getting all the materials shipped automatically to you, though perhaps this could be made a purchaseable upgrade later on in the game? If we are going to have something like the war table in DA4, something about establishing supply roads.
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Hrungr
Twitter Guru
ღ N-Special
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Staff Mini-Profile Theme: Hrungr
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: Hrungr
Prime Posts: 18,258
Prime Likes: 65,767
Posts: 30,847 Likes: 112,337
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Post by Hrungr on Dec 28, 2018 21:49:42 GMT
hey Hrungr that sounds like a "War Table" of Resources. like our NPC has some side business and there is paperwork and negotiations. Similar! Just a little more fleshed out, and your operations would visible in the world (you could visit your mines, farms, see the odd hunter in the wilderness).
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Post by phoray on Dec 28, 2018 21:52:45 GMT
hey Hrungr that sounds like a "War Table" of Resources. like our NPC has some side business and there is paperwork and negotiations. Similar! Just a little more fleshed out, and your operations would visible in the world (you could visit your mines, farms, see the odd hunter in the wilderness). TO be my indelicate self. I just nutted. I am very pleased with this representation of text and real world blending together.
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Post by NotN7 on Dec 28, 2018 21:54:05 GMT
Are we talking about a bazar type of deal? such as EverQuest and other MMo"s ?
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