The Mage Underground - "I have made this place a sanctum of healing and salvation! Why do you threat May 13, 2018 7:00:39 GMT Catilina, talyn82, and 1 more like this
Post by Cantina on May 13, 2018 7:00:39 GMT
Cantina The problem is that sometimes when you try such an act to be heard what people here is the wrong message. In Anders' case, his actions proved every single horror story that the Chantry and Templars tell about mages as correct, therefore ironically justifying the injustice Anders was protesting against in the eyes of the common citizens. If it was for three things, all Anders' action would have done would be to lead to the genocide of all the southern mages. The only three things that prevented that were: Divine Justinia V being sympathetic to the mages eventually leading to many Templars and Seekers leaving the Chantry, Orlais being in the midst of a civil war, and Fereldan still recovering from the Blight. If those three things or even if two of those three things didn't happen, an Exalted March would have been called instead of a Conclave.
But that is what the message was. Anders did what The Chantry was telling people to get their attention. You expect him, to what? Send a card and some flowers. Butter up the Divine in hopes she would see reason to grant freedom?!? Or maybe use magic to blow-up a Chantry to get the world's attention.
Divine Justina was not sympathetic to mages. Telling the Templars to be more lenient towards the mages is not sympathy. However, when the mages were being hunted by the Templars after they defected from their duty, the Divine felt the need to protect the mages out of guilt.
As for the Exalted March, she could have ordered it to happen at any point. Instead she lacked any back-bone. Beatrice knew Kirkwall was becoming a problem. Then Justinia arrives and the problem has grown worse. And her solution is to what? Send a delegate to assess the situation. What they going to say upon return. "Yep its bad, better send an army."
As for the history of the Circles, I think you are skipping a pretty important time period in your summary: the time between Andraste's rebellion and the Nevarran Accord that created the Circles. After the First Blight and Andraste's rebellion, it was complete chaos for everyone with tons of mages abusing citizens and citizens abusing mages. The first Inquisition formed to stop this and act as basically a protector of both groups against each other, which is probably why Justinia called for an Inquisition to be formed if the Conclave failed. Eventually as the Chantry formed, they saw the good mages contributed to the world like their aid with the Second Blight and they, the mages, and the Inquisition met in the Nevarran Accord to find a solution that benefited all parties. Ironically, the Chantry which you claimed saw the mages as tools were among the first and only to see them as people.
I am fully aware there was a time frame between Andraste and the Nevarran Accord. I was not going to sit down and use crayons and paper to get my point across. Furthermore, to use the Tevinter Imperium as a reason not give mages freedom is a poor reason. You are comparing the old The Chantry to the current Chantry. It was not my intention to say The Chantry has always been bad. BUT when the system did form, there were already cracks. Just because this institution use to be good, does not in any way, shape or forum justify the injustices mages have to face. And don't get me started on the Conclave. Simply put -Justina was an idiot.
I'm not disagreeing that this agreement got corrupted over the centuries, it had, I'm just arguing that it is not accurate to portray that as the situation from the start. Also, it's not fair to paint this as only one side making things worse. We have just as long a time period of incidents with mages, both inside the Circles with people like Jowan, Uldred, and Orsino, and outside the Circles like Connor, the Baroness, Quentin, and Anders that fueled those beliefs. In fact the biggest reason why the southern Chantry and Templars doubled down on the limitations is arguably the Tevinter Chantry and Templars giving mages the freedom they did which led to the magocracy returning making Tevinter what it was when Andraste rebelled, thus to many seeming like a warning of what happens if those rules against mages aren't in place. Basically, there are people on all sides which made the situation what it devolved into.
A few of those people you mentioned did what they did for their own selfish reasons. And I know what they did probably did not help the mages. However, just because one person does something wrong, does not and should not mean that all people with magic will do the same thing. Yes, its quite obvious that the mages do hold some of the responsibility but most of it lies with the Chantry. How many Templar abuses have gone unpunished times a thousand years.
When one mage resorts to blood magic, and you start to buckle down more, its not going to make the situation any better. Put too much pressure on something and it will burst. The Chantry could have done something about how the mages were treated within the Circle Towers. Then when something like Kirkwall happens, they act all shocked that something like that did happen and quickly try to appease the masses by what? Having a meeting over tea and cookies and hope everyone gets along. Phiff.
And to add insult to injury, The Chantry absolved Meradith of her crimes. There reason was: "There were so many cases of Blood Magic coming out of Kirkwall, they felt Meredith's methods were justified." Yet they did not investigate very deep because most of those cases were cause by Meredith do to her allowing said treatment to continue. Once again The Chantry is sticking up for one of their own and despite how bad the situation got in Kirkwall, the easiest solution is to blame the mages.
When an institution, a religious one in fact, preaches compassion, yet behind closed doors picks and chooses who receives that compassion. Promote a Templar, condemn a mage. After all people within a religious sect can do no wrong. And if they do. Quickly sweep it under the carpet. And if you can't do whatever you can to save your own skin.
The Chantry started with good intentions but as the years rolled by it has become far more corrupt then any Circle Tower.
You mentioning how the Chantry covered up Andraste being a mage reminds me of the irony with that argument, in that the Tevinter Chantry is doing the same thing but in reverse. Instead of hiding Andraste being a mage and claiming her power was divine, the Tevinter Chantry claims that Andraste was a mage to hide her power being divine. Not saying you are wrong, just saying that I find how they are making opposite claims but for the same reason funny.
No. I stated, "I believe that Andrasate was mage." Nothing pertaining to that being a cover-up.