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Post by xmojo1 on Sept 24, 2018 7:18:25 GMT
Right now, and for the forseeable future, there is a big void in the RPG market traditionally dominated by the "Big Three", i.e. Dragon Age franchise, The Witcher franchise and The Elder Scrolls franchise. The Witcher series has ended and will not return (as far as we know). The Elder Scrolls 6 is probably at least 4 years away, maybe more. Dragon Age: Inquisition was released 4 years ago. This is a huge opportunity for Bioware to release Dragon Age 4 within the next 1-2 years without any competition. They've had the past 4 years to work on the next release and could even allow for a longer development time to really polish the game and still release without fear of competition from Bethesda. I just hope they make use of the lull in TES: 6 development to really make a polished and excellent game without feeling the need to rush it so they can compete. As much as I'm looking forward to TES: 6, I would also love to see DA 4 be the next big game that's going to fill up my time for the next few years.
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Post by thats1evildude on Sept 24, 2018 8:03:34 GMT
Probably true, but all the eggs are in Anthem’s basket right now. We’ll just have to wait until it releases and pray its success or failure doesn’t kill the Dragon Age series.
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Post by biggydx on Sept 24, 2018 15:33:51 GMT
Dragon Age 4 probably won't ship until 2021. Most likely, they'll want to bring it to next-gen consoles and based on Mike Laidlaws comments (regarding DA:I being on current and last gen platforms), it would probably be in their best interests
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Post by Hrungr on Sept 24, 2018 17:17:53 GMT
Dragon Age 4 probably won't ship until 2021. Most likely, they'll want to bring it to next-gen consoles and based on Mike Laidlaws comments (regarding DA:I being on current and last gen platforms), it would probably be in their best interests Agreed. And even in 2021 I'm sure it'll be long before ES6 hits the shelves. I'd be more concerned of DA4 and Starfield winding up releasing in the same timeframe.
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Post by Felya87 on Sept 24, 2018 18:11:43 GMT
The lack of actually important fantasy RPGs is probably one of the reasons I can see both AC Odyssey and Greedfall go well. I doubt both will be actually good in a memorable way, but surely can scratch the fantasy-sh itch for roleplayers, at least for the more action oriented ones. Sadly, I can't remember anything (soon to be released) shi-fi RPG to scratch the ME itch
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Twitter Guru
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More coffee...? More coffee.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem
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Post by Hrungr on Sept 24, 2018 18:20:40 GMT
The lack of actually important fantasy RPGs is probably one of the reasons I can see both AC Odyssey and Greedfall go well. I doubt both will be actually good in a memorable way, but surely can scratch the fantasy-sh itch for roleplayers, at least for the more action oriented ones. Sadly, I can't remember anything (soon to be released) shi-fi RPG to scratch the ME itch It's been interesting to watch AC inching their way towards becoming a BioWare-style game. I really liked Origins (& the Discovery Tour was a great addition), so I'm looking forward to see what they do with Odyssey. I seem to recall some mixed opinions on Greedfall, I'll have to look into it again...
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Post by Felya87 on Sept 24, 2018 18:49:18 GMT
The lack of actually important fantasy RPGs is probably one of the reasons I can see both AC Odyssey and Greedfall go well. I doubt both will be actually good in a memorable way, but surely can scratch the fantasy-sh itch for roleplayers, at least for the more action oriented ones. Sadly, I can't remember anything (soon to be released) shi-fi RPG to scratch the ME itch It's been interesting to watch AC inching their way towards becoming a BioWare-style game. I really liked Origins (& the Discovery Tour was a great addition), so I'm looking forward to see what they do with Odyssey. I seem to recall some mixed opinions on Greedfall, I'll have to look into it again... Yup. Odyssey feel more "BioWare" than Anthem...we'll see how the implimentation is. But surely it have captivated at least the curiosity of many BioWare/the Witcher fans. I haven't looked at Greedfall stuff lately, so I don't know.
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Post by SomberXIII on Sept 24, 2018 19:09:26 GMT
Probably true, but all the eggs are in Anthem’s basket right now. We’ll just have to wait until it releases and pray its success or failure doesn’t kill the Dragon Age series. It absolutely sucks to see my favorite series' fate more or less depends on a game I don't really care about. It hurts.
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Post by Sylvius the Mad on Sept 24, 2018 19:26:46 GMT
I'm concerned that a period this long without a successful AAA singleplayer CRPG will make it impossible to sell the projects to the marketing people who greenlight them.
Until Bethesda releases ES6, and then the marketing people will all want to copy it.
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Post by Nightscrawl on Sept 25, 2018 4:23:32 GMT
They've had the past 4 years to work on the next release Except that's just not true. While this will likely be (unfortunately) the public perception regardless of how the game is received, it's been well known for quite some time that the bulk of the team was moved over to work on Anthem. I'm sure the core members of the team remaining are using that time to work on some ideas, and there is some writing going on (keep in mind that some writers are also on Anthem), but it's just not accurate to say that they've been working on DA4 for the past four years as the very wording implies full production with a full team. They don't have that and won't have that until Anthem is nearing completion.
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Post by Elfen Lied on Sept 25, 2018 15:25:52 GMT
Probably true, but all the eggs are in Anthem’s basket right now. We’ll just have to wait until it releases and pray its success or failure doesn’t kill the Dragon Age series. It absolutely sucks to see my favorite series' fate more or less depends on a game I don't really care about. It hurts.
And then, if it has too much success you risk that the next DA game will be more similar to Anthem than to a traditional DA game. So far it looks like a lose-lose situation.
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Post by Iakus on Sept 25, 2018 16:37:56 GMT
It absolutely sucks to see my favorite series' fate more or less depends on a game I don't really care about. It hurts.
And then, if it has too much success you risk that the next DA game will be more similar to Anthem than to a traditional DA game. So far it looks like a lose-lose situation.
Yeah, I know in my bones that if Anthem is a success, Bioware will be copy/pasting it onto Dragon Age and Mass Effect.
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Post by thats1evildude on Sept 25, 2018 16:55:57 GMT
It’s far more likely that if Anthem is a huge success, EA simply cancels Dragon Age.
Sure, the sales for a DAI were good, but EA wants a highly-profitable continuing live service franchise and DA is a poor fit for that particular mold.
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Post by TabithaTH on Sept 25, 2018 17:44:27 GMT
It’s far more likely that if Anthem is a huge success, EA simply cancels Dragon Age. Sure, the sales for a DAI were good, but EA wants a highly-profitable continuing live service franchise and DA is a poor fit for that particular mold. This is my fear as well.
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Post by themikefest on Sept 25, 2018 17:52:47 GMT
And then, if it has too much success you risk that the next DA game will be more similar to Anthem than to a traditional DA game. So far it looks like a lose-lose situation.
Yeah, I know in my bones that if Anthem is a success, Bioware will be copy/pasting it onto Dragon Age and Mass Effect. I like for Anthem to succeed, but I won't buy into the copy/paste thing. For now, at least for me, it's a wait and see what happens.
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Post by KaiserShep on Sept 25, 2018 17:52:54 GMT
There's a fair share of examples that show that singleplayer-focused games can kick the shit out of competitors and sell a veritable fuck-ton. I really hope EA/BioWare get a clue and don't give up on that end. Perhaps I don't fear Anthem's success because the alternative leaves us less likely to get any new titles from BioWare, and to be honest I don't really see EA cannibalizing into Anthem by repurposing their old flagship IP's into a gutted online versions of themselves.
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Post by thats1evildude on Sept 25, 2018 18:13:30 GMT
There's a fair share of examples that show that singleplayer-focused games can kick the shit out of competitors and sell a veritable fuck-ton. But those are ONE-TIME profits. Sure, you can sell a fuck-ton of copies of God of War 4, but generally speaking, each person is only buying those games once, not including any post-game DLC. The big publishers are focused right now on developing franchises that offer a continuous stream of profits so they can make more money while developing fewer games. Hence the emphasis on “live services," which theoretically entices players into repeatedly handing over money after that initial purchase. Maybe I’ve watched too many Jim Sterling videos, but I agree with him that the industry thinks it’s happened upon the financial equivalent of a perpetual motion machine. And it’s hard to argue against them, when microtransactions yield literally billions of dollars in profit.
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Post by isaidlunch on Sept 26, 2018 1:35:40 GMT
They've already waited too long. By the time DA4 is ready, they'll be competing with CDPR and/or Bethesda.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2018 7:17:05 GMT
like I say, I do not hope for the best with DA and ME...
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Post by Iakus on Sept 26, 2018 14:56:25 GMT
like I say, I do not hope for the best with DA and ME...
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Post by Cyberstrike on Sept 26, 2018 16:48:45 GMT
I'm concerned that a period this long without a successful AAA singleplayer CRPG will make it impossible to sell the projects to the marketing people who greenlight them. Until Bethesda releases ES6, and then the marketing people will all want to copy it.
I think what we will see (and are already beginning to see truth be told) is a push towards singleplayer action/adventure/survival horror/open world games with some RPG elements games like Shadow of the Tomb Raider, Horizon Zero Dawn, GTA V, Assassin's Creed: Odyssey, Spider-Man, God of War, Devil May Cry 5, Kingdom Hearts III, and the Resident Evil 2 remake than whatever your definition is of a traditional CRPG games is.
Sure players will get games like Cyberpunk 2077 and The Elder Scrolls VI and chances are real good that those games will be big hits (regardless of what anybody's personal opinions of these games and the companies making them are) and they will probably get even a lot of critical acclaim and awards, maybe a few others here and there and that might be a good thing, I think CRPGs have been getting stale and they need a chance to be recharged. I can't miss you if you never go away and maybe that is what CRPGs need to do for a little awhile go away and make their fans realize how much they miss them and then have a developer make a great one and restart the cycle again.
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Post by linksocarina on Sept 29, 2018 23:52:49 GMT
It’s far more likely that if Anthem is a huge success, EA simply cancels Dragon Age. Sure, the sales for a DAI were good, but EA wants a highly-profitable continuing live service franchise and DA is a poor fit for that particular mold. But if they have that with Anthem, they got what they wanted no? Anthem checks the boxes for EA, and until Andromeda EA has been more or less laizze fire with the main studios. What I see is Anthem as the BioWare/EA production with Dragon Age closer to a pure BioWare game. Of course we will have overlap of some mechanics, but it won't be dead like many foresee I'd argue.
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Post by thats1evildude on Sept 30, 2018 1:29:23 GMT
But if they have that with Anthem, they got what they wanted no? Exactly the problem. If EA gets its successful perpetual money-making machine with Anthem, then why bother with Dragon Age? Imagine, if you will, a high-level EA exec in his office, smoking rolled-up hundred-dollar bills and going over Anthem’s financials while an expensive hooker gives him head under his desk: “Goddamnit! Anthem’s making us money hand over fist. If we release Age of Dragons 4, we run the risk of another Mass Effect Andromeda shitshow. Why bother? Nobody cares about that fantasy crap except a bunch of virgins and queers anyway.” “What about Skyrim?” the hooker asks. “Eh, that was a fluke. We tried to sandbox the hell out of Dragon Rage: Imposition and it still failed to make ALL THE MONEY IN THE WORLD. Also, I don’t remember paying you to talk.” On the other hand, if Anthem lands on its face, then that same EA exec decides to cut their losses with Bioware and liquidate the studio. Then he calls it a day at noon and retires to his penthouse, satisfied with having done his part to advance the cause of evil. Our only hope is landing somewhere in the middle. Anthem needs to succeed, but not so much that it smothers DA with its success.
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Post by arvaarad on Sept 30, 2018 2:04:20 GMT
But if they have that with Anthem, they got what they wanted no? Exactly the problem. If EA gets its successful perpetual money-making machine with Anthem, then why bother with Dragon Age? Imagine, if you will, a high-level EA exec in his office, smoking rolled-up hundred-dollar bills and going over Anthem’s financials while an expensive hooker gives him head under his desk: “Goddamnit! Anthem’s making us money hand over fist. If we release Dragon Fucker 4, we run the risk of another Mass Effect Andromeda shitshow. Why bother? Nobody cares about that fantasy crap except a bunch of virgins and queers anyway.” “What about Skyrim?” the hooker asks. “Eh, that was a fluke. We tried to Skyrim up Dragon Fucker and it only drove up the sales somewhat. Also, I don’t remember paying you to talk.” On the other hand, if Anthem lands on its face, then that same EA exec decides to cut their losses with Bioware and liquidate the studio. Then he calls it a day at noon and retires to his penthouse, satisfied with having done his part to advance the cause of evil. Our only hope is landing somewhere in the middle. Anthem needs to succeed, but not so much that it smothers DA with its success. Orrrrr... we could assume that EA has a basic understanding of what makes companies successful, and that always includes diversifying their offerings. Disney isn’t successful because they specialized in one profitable thing. They’re successful because they have their hands in every type of media known to man. Google didn’t hyper-specialize into search/advertising when it was making ungodly buckets of money. They invested that money into all sorts of other weird shit to make sure they didn’t have all their eggs in the search/ads basket. Monocultures are fragile, constantly vulnerable to competition from larger, more diversified companies. A multifaceted company has enough other streams of revenue to run their offering at a loss until they kill the specialists. If Anthem is successful, we can be pretty confident that EA wouldn’t respond by minmaxing into that one type of game. It’s simply not good business.
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Post by thats1evildude on Sept 30, 2018 3:13:13 GMT
Orrrrr... we could assume that EA has a basic understanding of what makes companies successful, and that always includes diversifying their offerings. Ah, but you forget that EA already has Battlefield, The Sims, Titanfall and numerous successful sports franchises. FIFA in particular is EA's golden goose; it would sell well even if buying a copy came with a punch to the face.
And in case you forgotten last year's Battlefront debacle, they still have the exclusive rights to produce Star Wars games too. So their portfolio is pretty diverse.
On the flip side, EA has indicated they don't see single-player games as profitable anymore, as indicated by their justification for shuttering Visceral Games just as the studio was making a linear single-player Star Wars game.
Let's be realistic: Dragon Age has always been BioWare's red-headed stepchild, and EA has even less interest in the franchise than BioWare. They certainly wouldn't have kept it on the backburner for four years and counting if they actually cared about it. Dragon Age is a niche franchise, and EA wants blockbusters.
I have no doubt in my mind that if Mass Effect Andromeda hadn't shit the bed, DA would already be dead and buried. As it is, we have a SMALL chance of seeing DA4 released one day, though only with great reluctance on EA's part, and with the understanding that if Bioware fails to move X number of copies, the studio is going bye-bye.
Even then, we'll probably have to buy extra healing potions with our credit cards.
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