Iakus
N7
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 20,886 Likes: 49,355
inherit
402
0
Dec 21, 2018 17:35:11 GMT
49,355
Iakus
20,886
August 2016
iakus
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
|
Post by Iakus on Nov 1, 2018 22:50:51 GMT
"Games as a service" to me, means that once the company decides to stop supporting it, you no longer have a game to play. Which is also true when the copy of my old game breaks, I no longer have a drive for it or it no longer works on OS I'm using. This is hardly a new problem. And we know from the existence of Vanilla WoW on private servers and licensed retro gaming platforms popping like mushrooms after rain that dedicated player bases can keep old titles alive if they want to. With basically all our computer activity probably migrating to cloud-based services one day, I'm fairly sure that we're going to see businesses and services that will keep many games people like on life support... that is if they're ever going to be NOT part of any library of active games of large publishers or platform owners. Baldur's Gate is still playable twenty years later. Deus Ex Fallout Arcanum If these were "games as service" These games would be nothing but a memory now.
|
|
inherit
3271
0
1,496
rras1994
856
February 2017
rras1994
|
Post by rras1994 on Nov 1, 2018 22:53:23 GMT
Which is also true when the copy of my old game breaks, I no longer have a drive for it or it no longer works on OS I'm using. This is hardly a new problem. And we know from the existence of Vanilla WoW on private servers and licensed retro gaming platforms popping like mushrooms after rain that dedicated player bases can keep old titles alive if they want to. With basically all our computer activity probably migrating to cloud-based services one day, I'm fairly sure that we're going to see businesses and services that will keep many games people like on life support... that is if they're ever going to be NOT part of any library of active games of large publishers or platform owners. Baldur's Gate is still playable twenty years later. Deus Ex Fallout Arcanum If these were "games as service" These games would be nothing but a memory now. You really don't know what GaaS is, do you?
|
|
Fen'Harel Faceman
N7
GIF Addict
Workin' so hard, to make it easy.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 13,331 Likes: 30,906
inherit
GIF Addict
374
0
30,906
Fen'Harel Faceman
Workin' so hard, to make it easy.
13,331
August 2016
almostfaceman
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
|
Post by Fen'Harel Faceman on Nov 1, 2018 22:53:32 GMT
Which is also true when the copy of my old game breaks, I no longer have a drive for it or it no longer works on OS I'm using. This is hardly a new problem. And we know from the existence of Vanilla WoW on private servers and licensed retro gaming platforms popping like mushrooms after rain that dedicated player bases can keep old titles alive if they want to. With basically all our computer activity probably migrating to cloud-based services one day, I'm fairly sure that we're going to see businesses and services that will keep many games people like on life support... that is if they're ever going to be NOT part of any library of active games of large publishers or platform owners. Baldur's Gate is still playable twenty years later. Deus Ex Fallout Arcanum If these were "games as service" These games would be nothing but a memory now. I don't know if I buy that last sentence. Steam has made a lot of these games playable on new OS's and there's also been Enhanced Editions that play on the newer machines/OS's. There's not really any reason that would be different with "games as service" as long as there's a market for them. If there's a market, somebody will provide the service.
|
|
inherit
3271
0
1,496
rras1994
856
February 2017
rras1994
|
Post by rras1994 on Nov 1, 2018 23:03:55 GMT
You really don't know what GaaS is, do you? It's a subscription service. You rent the ability to play games for a set amount of time instead of buying them once and having the ability to play them 20 years later. Nope
|
|
inherit
3271
0
1,496
rras1994
856
February 2017
rras1994
|
Post by rras1994 on Nov 1, 2018 23:28:27 GMT
Fair enough. It's not the only model, but that's where I see them going. Games like Anthem and Destiny could probably be cosidered GAAS as well. The main thing is recurring monetization, and online elements. Not even online elements - you are talking about supporting games for a long time period - that can come in many ways patches, DLC, expansions, MTXs, and various monetisation. I'd say subscription services are actually seperate from GaaS and have alot more to do with the possibiltiy of actually streaming games which will open the hobby up to more people as they can try bit without an expensive barrier infront of it (a $20 dollar a month subscription is alot cheaper to try then a $300 console) I rather suspect that publishers are going to go for the option of a subscription service or just buying the games outright for a long long time. It's two streams of revenue.
|
|
inherit
8885
0
7,212
river82
4,948
July 2017
river82
|
Post by river82 on Nov 1, 2018 23:40:51 GMT
Well, new quests can just be done via patches. Same with new events. Same with eventful encounters. This sort of thing should be in the base game btw. You shouldn't need to be always online for that. But yeah, changes in weather and environment don't mean too much for me. The modding community certainly helps Skyrim stay alive, the point is you don't need to be always online for it. I don't require their constant input, their constant switches, their constant insertion of cool factors, just let me play my game please. You need an online connection for patches tho, and it's quite possible that online component can offer way more than what any offline game could provide. Even without being a game dev it's not hard to imagine that there are technological and financial limits to how big or complex an offline game can be, especially with everything and a kitchen sink thrown at the player. Also: even before the whole idea of live services took shape we've been way past the idea that 'something should be part of the base game' btw. I know, because 'alive' games, with content stream flowing - be it modded or made by the studio - was one of the main points that made games attractive for me as entertainment, and that was almost 10 years ago. Online connection is never an issue, being constantly online is for numerous reasons. Also being live was never a component I'm happy about in games, not just because I live in Australia and we're 10 years behind everyone technology wise. I think in January we were 55th in the world for internet speeds, behind Kazakstan, behind Slovakia ... it's not pretty. And Australia's Government has wisely decided to roll out this National Broadband Network people need to connect to, and some of my friends have had no internet and phones for months. So I'm on a wireless connection at the moment because I have no trust in the cabled internet at the moment. And that wireless internet is slow. But let's put that aside for the moment, let's put aside that America and Canada constantly service themselves and Europe and forget that not all countries have wonderful internet. Constant online encourages social aspects in games. I don't like interacting socially with people because it tires me out. Social interaction exhausts me. Sport is fine, and I like to read, write and do that. I do not like to interact socially with people because now I'm no longer enjoying my time. So the combination of living in a technologically backward, desert wasteland combined with not being a social creature means EA's future social, always online world is horrible to me.
|
|
inherit
3271
0
1,496
rras1994
856
February 2017
rras1994
|
Post by rras1994 on Nov 1, 2018 23:42:05 GMT
Not even online elements - you are talking about supporting games for a long time period - that can come in many ways patches, DLC, expansions, MTXs, and various monetisation. I'd say subscription services are actually seperate from GaaS and have alot more to do with the possibiltiy of actually streaming games which will open the hobby up to more people as they can try bit without an expensive barrier infront of it (a $20 dollar a month subscription is alot cheaper to try then a $300 console) I rather suspect that publishers are going to go for the option of a subscription service or just buying the games outright for a long long time. It's two streams of revenue. As long as both options are available, I don't really care. I'm not interested in streaming or always online personally. Anyway, according to your description, Dragon Age Origins was "GaaS"... They didn't invent this new term just in order to describe something they did in the past. Mere DLC and expansions is not enough for EA's appetite anymore. You need to guarantee "engagement" with grinding and online elements, and capitalize with various MTX and psychological shenanigans. You're really aiming for more than a years support tbh. Sims 4 is described as a GaaS and has 4 years content at the moment and they are still planning to release content for years to come. It's about making a good base you can continue to keep players engaged and thus continue support. That tends to be easier to do with multiplayer games but simulation/strategy games have been doing it for years. Which is way none of the Dragon Age games are really GaaS as they don't have that long a support - you currently expect about 3 major DLCs with them and that's it. A service aims for something regularly for a long time. I wouldn't say Dragon AGe is there at the moment. I'd actually argue that there'd be quite a few hardcore fans that would be really happy if DA did become a GaaS if they didn't have to wait years with no content in their franchise.
|
|
midnight tea
Twitter Guru
gateway beverage
Posts: 7,095 Likes: 16,598
inherit
gateway beverage
109
0
16,598
midnight tea
7,095
August 2016
midnighttea
|
Post by midnight tea on Nov 2, 2018 0:02:14 GMT
Good for me that I CAN'T play games I want ATM...? You choose not to due to different priorities. Just like me. If I follow that logic I could also say somebody *chose* living somewhere with crappy Internet, but I think we both know this often isn't how it works, right? I'm fairly certain I wrote exactly why I'm baffled. I'm also fairly sure that you switched goalpost. We were initially talking about games going predominantly in multiplayer direction rather than SP, not the vague 'online' idea of games as it pertains to them being streamed (I can play Skyrim via Geforce NOW you know, and it's an entirely SP game with no multiplayer components...) Dunno - will monetization mean that modders will also get their share? There are entire sections of the article telling us that people will be able to publish mods on their accounts and share them with people that way. I assume that whether they'd be monetized or not may depend on the decision of the creator, similarly to how it is with other creations or resources made by individuals or teams today. IMO I doubt that individual mods will be monetized by the publisher (unless mods are created and licensed by them or 3rd party devs they hire?). Creation Club didn't work out so far, but it seems that right now developers and publishers are happy so long as it keeps the game alive (why do you think many developers today also offer free patches and upgrades?). In that regard mods may as well act in similar fashion console exclusives do - so long as they bring people to play their games and use their platforms/services, they pay that way for themselves even if they're free. Hey, what you like is what you like. But there are also many people who find convenience and relative safety or existing community one of the major draws of in-built modding services. I mean, it's not like it's a thing that would matter for long. If the engine is not suitable for modding - and many of them aren't, given their growing complexity and use of 3rd party software - no amount of offline mode and lack of curation/censorship will make the game malleable to modding (unless somebody has serious tech knowledge and skills and probably time). LOL, well then do you know or can you just guess? Because one of these things is not like the other, regardless of the degree of certainty. As for me - I have a high degree of certainty that neither of us knows what really will be doable in the future. Yes, because Frostbite is such a moddable engine, even in SP games Haha, their enthusiasm waned a little when rumblings of legislation hit loot-crates like a hammer not so long ago, didn't it? And lol, it's not a schtick - apparently, you can't seem to get unstuck from 'the now' even when we're talking about future-oriented technology that is clearly designed to support upcoming games of increasing scope and complexity. The fact that we have an inkling of how online games work NOW doesn't mean that we know how they'll work in next few years or decades - especially that the article does state that they're building tools to open Frostbite for people to customize their games in ways that weren't doable before. Whether they succeed is anybody's guess right now, but a significant chunk of the article is about being able to mod and customize games via Atlas/Frostbite. I don't use them myself, but I definitely see why people would. Issues with grindy content aside, not only cheating can be complicated or can break the game, but it's usually not available on consoles. And I personally know people who'd LOVE to play longer games, but can't, for different IRL reasons. Speeding the game lets them experience them, even if the experience is "cheated" or sped up. It's not in me to deny those who want to play, but have time constraints or other disadvantages (one of my friends in MMO I play is an army vet only able to use a few fingers on his one hand due to severe injuries. He appreciates any convenience he gets to not make his half-working hand hurt so much from overuse), to not enjoy what other gamers do. It baffles me why this is hard to understand for some... Hey, whatever floats your boat. The only thing left for is us see where exactly the demand, and thus market, will follow. Passive-aggressive today, aren't you? I'm not sure where did you get the idea that I somehow worship change for its own sake, but I'm glad that strawmaning me for a cheap jab brought you joy! (this isn't just about 'corporate daring and innovations', hon - progress in technology and other aspects of current civilization simply happen to strongly affect intrinsically tech-based mediums like games and I, for one, am simply not afraid of it).
|
|
midnight tea
Twitter Guru
gateway beverage
Posts: 7,095 Likes: 16,598
inherit
gateway beverage
109
0
16,598
midnight tea
7,095
August 2016
midnighttea
|
Post by midnight tea on Nov 2, 2018 0:15:58 GMT
Which is also true when the copy of my old game breaks, I no longer have a drive for it or it no longer works on OS I'm using. This is hardly a new problem. And we know from the existence of Vanilla WoW on private servers and licensed retro gaming platforms popping like mushrooms after rain that dedicated player bases can keep old titles alive if they want to. With basically all our computer activity probably migrating to cloud-based services one day, I'm fairly sure that we're going to see businesses and services that will keep many games people like on life support... that is if they're ever going to be NOT part of any library of active games of large publishers or platform owners. Baldur's Gate is still playable twenty years later. Deus Ex Fallout Arcanum If these were "games as service" These games would be nothing but a memory now. Did you use your magic mirror and peeked into the future to claim so? No, I'm fairly sure you didn't - you're just making unsubstantiated claims now. Also - games like Baldur's Gate or Arcanum work not because they're not 'game as service' games, but because they're simple. Should I understand that you'd prefer for all games to be using technologies from 2 decades ago? And how many games you didn't mention that either don't work anymore, work awfully due to lack of optimization or require some tech knowledge to cough them up to life?
|
|
midnight tea
Twitter Guru
gateway beverage
Posts: 7,095 Likes: 16,598
inherit
gateway beverage
109
0
16,598
midnight tea
7,095
August 2016
midnighttea
|
Post by midnight tea on Nov 2, 2018 0:56:55 GMT
You need an online connection for patches tho, and it's quite possible that online component can offer way more than what any offline game could provide. Even without being a game dev it's not hard to imagine that there are technological and financial limits to how big or complex an offline game can be, especially with everything and a kitchen sink thrown at the player. Also: even before the whole idea of live services took shape we've been way past the idea that 'something should be part of the base game' btw. I know, because 'alive' games, with content stream flowing - be it modded or made by the studio - was one of the main points that made games attractive for me as entertainment, and that was almost 10 years ago. Online connection is never an issue, being constantly online is for numerous reasons. Also being live was never a component I'm happy about in games, not just because I live in Australia and we're 10 years behind everyone technology wise. I think in January we were 55th in the world for internet speeds, behind Kazakstan, behind Slovakia ... it's not pretty. And Australia's Government has wisely decided to roll out this National Broadband Network people need to connect to, and some of my friends have had no internet and phones for months. So I'm on a wireless connection at the moment because I have no trust in the cabled internet at the moment. And that wireless internet is slow. But let's put that aside for the moment, let's put aside that America and Canada constantly service themselves and Europe and forget that not all countries have wonderful internet. Constant online encourages social aspects in games. I don't like interacting socially with people because it tires me out. Social interaction exhausts me. Sport is fine, and I like to read, write and do that. I do not like to interact socially with people because now I'm no longer enjoying my time. So the combination of living in a technologically backward, desert wasteland combined with not being a social creature means EA's future social, always online world is horrible to me. You're talking to a massive introvert whose social energy can be drained to zero in no time (I'm getting there now after writing so many responses ...), who only recently exchanged her 10 (but more like 8) MB rickety connection to fiberoptic one and is living in a place that is not necessarily fast in terms of catching up with other places technology or overall progress-wise. I share many of your problems - what I don't share is your fear that games will be how you think they're going to be. The fact that they're building tools relevant for building community doesn't mean that we will be forced to be socially active, and especially forced in a way you keep expecting them to be. There are ways to build community or for our activity to be relevant without our active participation (even social platforms offer stuff of that kind, like gauging our preferences or purchases and so on). There's a reason they mention even seemingly unrelated stuff like achievements, social graphs, play across devices, preferences and personalization, data protection or sharing content between users. You don't have to talk to somebody to find their profile via client and download a publicly available mod that you like from their account or view their published screenshots or view a video of difficult quest walkthrough, for example. You may say that all of this is available on other places, like mod nexus or youtube or this forum... but that's exactly what this article is about - they're planning to create a cloud-based technology where all those things are rolled into one platform/integrated into the engine. It both allows devs to use standardized tools (and not own or 3rd party ones that can be difficult or expensive to integrate or maintain) and for players to spend more time within the platform.
|
|
midnight tea
Twitter Guru
gateway beverage
Posts: 7,095 Likes: 16,598
inherit
gateway beverage
109
0
16,598
midnight tea
7,095
August 2016
midnighttea
|
Post by midnight tea on Nov 2, 2018 2:18:26 GMT
If I follow that logic I could also say somebody *chose* living somewhere with crappy Internet, but I think we both know this often isn't how it works, right? To some degree this is a choice as well, yes. And to be honest, as long as all this streaming business is merely another choice (as in, another distribution format rather than a replacement), I will have no issue with it. Well, I don't expect for this thing to catch on tomorrow or for us to move wholesale from one thing or another in the next few years. A lot can happen, and such high-technology solutions will not be impervious to whatever stuff will be happening around the globe. We likely have quite a few years before we see streaming services and virtual platforms become main forms of distribution for entertainment and whatnot... but I think it's very possible that we're heading in that direction anyhow, whether Atlas lives up to its ambitious vision or fizzles out. Referring to both would be tricky given that these are two quite different things, so you'll excuse my failings in that regard. You know there aren't that many when people use words like 'respectable' to denote amount Let's face it - there's not much out there and mods for FB are usually way more limited in scope or the way they affect games they're made for. So monetization and exploitation have always been the same? Strange, I didn't know that microtransactions or loot crates or multiplayer games have led to gaming market crash in 80-ties... Even with being this cynical about corporate greed, somehow I don't believe you believe that methods of monetization and exploitations remain the same at all times. Corporations and their methods also change, even if they serve the same principle - and they will change whenever they figure out new ways to make money or have to change in order to keep making money So my anecdote was the ONLY thing I've written in that paragraph - or did I simply use it as an example when describing a wider problem? Also... hmmm... you do seem to have skipped most of what I've written there because you missed what I wrote about cheats and some problems with them. Cheats actually began disappearing from games before 'time savers' ever appeared. I'm surprised you don't seem to know about this, given that I remember people widely discussing the waning of presence of cheats years ago (thread from 2011. I recommend reading responses by ZorbaTHut right below original comment). So no, 'free cheats' aren't a viable solution simply because technology has moved on (an issue virtually unrelated to corpo greed). Time savers are actually a thing on their own rather than being an artifact of past programming. Of course, the discussion of whether things like time savers should exist or be monetized is another issue, but I did notice that more and more games prefer the way of carrot rather than stick and encourage players with occasional gifts and freebies rather erecting paywalls everywhere. Doing something that occasionally benefits both player and corpo can ultimately bring even more money sometimes. Shocking, I know.
|
|
mmoblitz
N3
USN-Retired
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: mmoblitz
PSN: NotPC
Posts: 515 Likes: 590
inherit
1777
0
Jan 20, 2022 10:02:17 GMT
590
mmoblitz
USN-Retired
515
Oct 11, 2016 11:10:36 GMT
October 2016
mmoblitz
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
mmoblitz
NotPC
|
Post by mmoblitz on Nov 2, 2018 11:47:11 GMT
I only need to know that if EA is behind it, it's anti-consumer and I want nothing to do with it.
|
|
inherit
♨ Retired
24
0
24,298
themikefest
14,826
August 2016
themikefest
21,655
15,426
|
Post by themikefest on Nov 2, 2018 12:18:55 GMT
Curious why he didn't mention MEA. Not that it matters.
Anyways. After reading the article, it will be a wait and see for me.
|
|
inherit
3439
0
9,198
alanc9
Old Scientist Contrarian
7,839
February 2017
alanc9
|
Post by alanc9 on Nov 3, 2018 17:28:21 GMT
We likely have quite a few years before we see streaming services and virtual platforms become main forms of distribution for entertainment and whatnot Isn't television just about there now?
|
|
midnight tea
Twitter Guru
gateway beverage
Posts: 7,095 Likes: 16,598
inherit
gateway beverage
109
0
16,598
midnight tea
7,095
August 2016
midnighttea
|
Post by midnight tea on Nov 4, 2018 5:38:11 GMT
We likely have quite a few years before we see streaming services and virtual platforms become main forms of distribution for entertainment and whatnot Isn't television just about there now? Basically. So is music. And the film industry is doing what it can to try and prolong the life of well-known formulas, but unless they invent something that will draw people to theaters, soon most of us will be watching movie premieres on our computers. I mean... we already rent or watch most movies that way anyway. And I don't think people really mourn the death of VHS or CDs. At best they'll become hipster niche products, like vinyl records.
|
|
mmoblitz
N3
USN-Retired
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: mmoblitz
PSN: NotPC
Posts: 515 Likes: 590
inherit
1777
0
Jan 20, 2022 10:02:17 GMT
590
mmoblitz
USN-Retired
515
Oct 11, 2016 11:10:36 GMT
October 2016
mmoblitz
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
mmoblitz
NotPC
|
Post by mmoblitz on Nov 10, 2018 12:28:38 GMT
It's affect replayability, because on the first playthrough you'd obviously wouldn't care that encounters and missions are different from previous playthroughs. And to be honest, I'd take the radiant quests from Skyrim in a single player game. I don't need to be always online just so they can switch things up on me. So you'd take radiant fetch quests (because that's what mostly is there in Skyrim) rather than, say - a dramatic change in weather or environment or sudden, eventful encounters or even new quests and challenges (given that they'd likely come with the game being frequently updated)? I have a hard time believing that. Skyrim is played till these days thanks to modding community shaking things around and providing new content for the game. One could easily see that the game's greatest legacy isn't open world, but devs noticing how long the game lives thanks to it being, well, 'alive'... hence the current emphasis on live services, which Project Atlas seems to be largely built for. One they can easily monetize if they have total control of your gaming experience. As already mentioned, modding a game that is cloud based is nearly impossible and for PC gamers, that is a big deal, while console players are used to it. I have 2000+ hrs in skyrim and 45 hrs in Anthem and maybe 50 hrs in DAI. The biggest reasons for that is the ability to mod new content and even dynamic content into the game and it costs me nothing unless I throw some cash to the modders which I do for some of the larger mods that I just can't live without. I know there are mod tools for frostbite, but they are extremely limited and you can't use it to fix what bioware didn't bother to or extend the life of the game. If comes down to more control for devs/publishers. Cloud gaming has very few benefits for consumers. The biggest I think, being able to play from more than one location or maybe device. In all other aspects it's anti-consumer. It gives them all the control and if they decide that the game has lived out it's usefulness then it can be gone in seconds. You are no longer buying the game, your leasing it for however long they let you. I know mmo's are this way now, but I'm stilling playing Pirates of the Caribbean Online and Warhammer Online via private servers. If those were cloud based games, I wouldn't have that option. The negatives far out weight the positives where the consumer is concerned, imo.
|
|
Sanunes
N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Prime Posts: 4392
Prime Likes: 882
Posts: 5,916 Likes: 8,947
inherit
1561
0
8,947
Sanunes
Just a flip of the coin.
5,916
Sept 13, 2016 11:51:12 GMT
September 2016
sanunes
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
4392
882
|
Post by Sanunes on Nov 10, 2018 14:21:27 GMT
So you'd take radiant fetch quests (because that's what mostly is there in Skyrim) rather than, say - a dramatic change in weather or environment or sudden, eventful encounters or even new quests and challenges (given that they'd likely come with the game being frequently updated)? I have a hard time believing that. Skyrim is played till these days thanks to modding community shaking things around and providing new content for the game. One could easily see that the game's greatest legacy isn't open world, but devs noticing how long the game lives thanks to it being, well, 'alive'... hence the current emphasis on live services, which Project Atlas seems to be largely built for. One they can easily monetize if they have total control of your gaming experience. As already mentioned, modding a game that is cloud based is nearly impossible and for PC gamers, that is a big deal, while console players are used to it. I have 2000+ hrs in skyrim and 45 hrs in Anthem and maybe 50 hrs in DAI. The biggest reasons for that is the ability to mod new content and even dynamic content into the game and it costs me nothing unless I throw some cash to the modders which I do for some of the larger mods that I just can't live without. I know there are mod tools for frostbite, but they are extremely limited and you can't use it to fix what bioware didn't bother to or extend the life of the game. If comes down to more control for devs/publishers. Cloud gaming has very few benefits for consumers. The biggest I think, being able to play from more than one location or maybe device. In all other aspects it's anti-consumer. It gives them all the control and if they decide that the game has lived out it's usefulness then it can be gone in seconds. You are no longer buying the game, your leasing it for however long they let you. I know mmo's are this way now, but I'm stilling playing Pirates of the Caribbean Online and Warhammer Online via private servers. If those were cloud based games, I wouldn't have that option. The negatives far out weight the positives where the consumer is concerned, imo. Just because they are looking at cloud based gaming doesn't mean they are going to replace PC or Console based gaming. Its the same as when they introduced consoles, it never fully replaced PC gaming just slowed it down for awhile or mobile gaming never replaced the home experience either. I am pretty sure that EA knows that there will be a market for both types of players, but they do want to reach out to those that might not want to make the investment in a PC or console for the one game they buy a year. Its all about expanding their reach for customers using the technology that is at their disposal. In a way EA is already starting down this path with Origin Premiere for you are just renting time with the games without spending $60+ dollars for it already and it seems they are throwing in all the bonus content as well since they are showing that you will have access to the Deluxe version of Anthem with the service.
|
|
midnight tea
Twitter Guru
gateway beverage
Posts: 7,095 Likes: 16,598
inherit
gateway beverage
109
0
16,598
midnight tea
7,095
August 2016
midnighttea
|
Post by midnight tea on Nov 10, 2018 22:34:19 GMT
So you'd take radiant fetch quests (because that's what mostly is there in Skyrim) rather than, say - a dramatic change in weather or environment or sudden, eventful encounters or even new quests and challenges (given that they'd likely come with the game being frequently updated)? I have a hard time believing that. Skyrim is played till these days thanks to modding community shaking things around and providing new content for the game. One could easily see that the game's greatest legacy isn't open world, but devs noticing how long the game lives thanks to it being, well, 'alive'... hence the current emphasis on live services, which Project Atlas seems to be largely built for. One they can easily monetize if they have total control of your gaming experience. As already mentioned, modding a game that is cloud based is nearly impossible and for PC gamers, that is a big deal, while console players are used to it. I have 2000+ hrs in skyrim and 45 hrs in Anthem and maybe 50 hrs in DAI. The biggest reasons for that is the ability to mod new content and even dynamic content into the game and it costs me nothing unless I throw some cash to the modders which I do for some of the larger mods that I just can't live without. I know there are mod tools for frostbite, but they are extremely limited and you can't use it to fix what bioware didn't bother to or extend the life of the game. You didn't read the article, did you? Or you didn't read it carefully. I say so because a considerable chunk of it is dedicated to modding and altering content by players and them building advanced tools for it!Whether they succeed is anyone's guess... but why shouldn't they, given how much games like Skyrim or Cities: Skylines are profiting from mods existing, as well as dedicated playerbase that use them, which prolongs game's lifespan (something that appears to be one of the most valuable vectors for game developers and publishers, as well as the basis under the whole live service strategy). I mean... nevermind that many modern engines are largely pretty hard to mod anyway - current Frostbite being a prime example, as you've pointed out yourself. And one of the aims of Atlas Project is them working on opening it for modding. In other words: you're wasting your energy at pointless grumbling at something that is - one day - going to provide the very thing you care about "Cloud gaming has very few benefits for consumers" is a claim that needs a bit more backing up. And calling it anti-consumer is just plain BS. Plus, the fact that 'it gives them more control' is hardly something that should be framed as a negative - because game developers/publishers having more control over the product CAN mean good things. More ability to fix the game or react to playerbase's whims. More updates, more goodies, more stability and more effort made to keep the player interested in their product - rather than shipping the thing wholesale and making us buy it... and if there are any problems - sorry hon, you either take it or fix it yourself! Don't tell me that it wasn't like that way too often. It got to a point where demos or promo materials were manipulated or simply not what got shipped in full product, simply to make people purchase the game because initial sales and amount of physical copies sold was what mattered a few years back. Now we're simply entering different times, with different challenges, problems, and different solutions. It's as simple as that. Well, that makes no sense. Isn't the existence of private servers for MMOs tells you what is the future of cloud gaming? I'm fairly confident we will see the emergence of the secondary market and businesses offering access to games preserved on their servers and so on. That's just what happens. It was mentioned multiple times - if there's a demand, there will be a market. Just like there's a market now for retro gaming and games on cartridges... even if they're mostly things of the past and unlikely to make a mainstream comeback.
|
|
mmoblitz
N3
USN-Retired
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: mmoblitz
PSN: NotPC
Posts: 515 Likes: 590
inherit
1777
0
Jan 20, 2022 10:02:17 GMT
590
mmoblitz
USN-Retired
515
Oct 11, 2016 11:10:36 GMT
October 2016
mmoblitz
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
mmoblitz
NotPC
|
Post by mmoblitz on Nov 11, 2018 21:06:24 GMT
We will have to agree to disagree.
Amazons Lumberyard game engine is modular I believe and already does some of the things that Project Atlas is going for. Many features are cloud based. Look at the games being made already with that game and it should give you an idea on how that type of tech is being used right now. The engine is also free to anyone that wants it. I have no interest in any of the game being made with it as they are all multiplayer or co-op games from what I can tell.
If it seems like I have a negative outlook toward publishers, it's because I do and I also have access to information that the public doesn't in some cases via a cousin who is a software engineer in the gaming industry. Most publishers aren't as consumer friendly as you might think they are.
I hope I'm wrong and nothing but good comes from it, but I have my doubts.
|
|
Iakus
N7
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 20,886 Likes: 49,355
inherit
402
0
Dec 21, 2018 17:35:11 GMT
49,355
Iakus
20,886
August 2016
iakus
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
|
Post by Iakus on Nov 13, 2018 21:37:46 GMT
|
|
Wildfire
N2
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 219 Likes: 799
inherit
2795
0
Jul 16, 2021 22:39:12 GMT
799
Wildfire
219
January 2017
wildfire
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
|
Post by Wildfire on Nov 14, 2018 7:00:05 GMT
No. Friends and games don't go together.
|
|
inherit
7535
0
2,066
abaris
2,013
April 2017
abaris
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda
|
Post by abaris on Nov 14, 2018 11:16:30 GMT
If they go through with that it's bye bye to each and every product labeled EA. I don't care to share my game experience with friends around the world. I want a compelling single player experience on my hard drive and not in some internet connection depending cloud.
Thanks, but no thanks. This is clearly catering to a different audience. One I'm no longer part of. I started to suspect as much with Andromeda and the direction they took with Anthem. Time for me to enjoy my older games. Or the old school ones that are still published by different developers.
|
|
sjsharp2010
N7
Go Team!
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Posts: 10,665 Likes: 18,567
inherit
2309
0
May 14, 2024 21:39:57 GMT
18,567
sjsharp2010
Go Team!
10,665
December 2016
sjsharp2010
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
|
Post by sjsharp2010 on Nov 14, 2018 18:25:49 GMT
If they go through with that it's bye bye to each and every product labeled EA. I don't care to share my game experience with friends around the world. I want a compelling single player experience on my hard drive and not in some internet connection depending cloud.Thanks, but no thanks. This is clearly catering to a different audience. One I'm no longer part of. I started to suspect as much with Andromeda and the direction they took with Anthem. Time for me to enjoy my older games. Or the old school ones that are still published by different developers. Exactly asme here. I don't mind them doing things like full gam e and DLC we can buy and download them onto our systems and give us a spot like they do where we can store our game saves on the cloud for if our computer goes down like they do with Steam and Origin clients and stuff but as far as I'm concerned that should be it Also Steam and Origin can be good for the Multiplayer side of things as it gives you a network/server to play on for that. But when it comes to singleplayer I'd rather download it onto my system so I can play the game privately on my own and in my own time and delete it when I'm done. right now we can do this but if that changes then I'm out to find a new hobby. Probably just reading books or something
|
|
midnight tea
Twitter Guru
gateway beverage
Posts: 7,095 Likes: 16,598
inherit
gateway beverage
109
0
16,598
midnight tea
7,095
August 2016
midnighttea
|
Post by midnight tea on Nov 14, 2018 18:39:13 GMT
(I'm sorry but... this is just too perfect not to use )
|
|