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Post by AnDromedary on Nov 7, 2019 19:07:18 GMT
I was under the impression that: The nutrition problem had been known for a long time, and the Board had been importing food from Earth while they worked on the problem. But when Earth went dark, that supply was cut off, and after three years, they were running out of their reserves. I think Parvati even mentions kinda early on how people had been going hungry lately, which I suppose could be interpreted as the body craving nutrients it hasn't been getting. Yes, I got the exact same impression. However, I just didn't get where exactly the problem originated or why they couldn't fix it immediately. Nutrients are nothing more than a bunch of chemical compounds, proteins, carbs, a bunch of vitamins and so forth). As I wrote above, all you need to do is import a bunch of seeds (maybe even soil if necessary) and start growing. Hell, they even have a working animal farming system in place (though disgusting as it may be). I don't quite get where exactly this unsolvable nutrient deficiency is grounded in this world. 'cause you really don't need much to grow nutritious food. I mean, even Mat Damon and a few potatoes would do the trick. On the other hand, it would actually be quite hard to grow non-nutritious food, which apparently they managed to do somehow. I think some form of slow, hard-to-detect contamination of the food chain would have been more believable. EDIT: Just want to add that this "issue" is perfectly in the realm of normal scifi blabla, that I can easily excuse. I have suspended my disbelief for much worse (and at the very least, it's kind of a novel idea, so I'll give that as a plus even). So I wouldn't consider this anything to really hold against the game or the story. It was just a point of curiosity.
Fallout's gameplay is clunky as hell to this day. And a AA version of it I didn't expect to be any less clunky. I don't think I've ever played a AA game, especially an RPG, that wasn't clunky. As long as it's not downright annoying like in Vampyr, I don't care. I'm quite tolerant of mediocre gameplay if the art design, story and atmosphere is good. Oh, I didn't really mind either (though I would have liked a bit more of a throught through stealth system, IMO Fallout did it way better and e.g. Dishonored showed that even AAs can do it well). I am just mentioning the overall medicore gameplay because there are many reviews out there (by established publications no less) that give the game a 9 or 9.5. IMO, that's a bit much if you think about what it a little more objectively. I mean, I loved the game but I am very much a fan of the genre of dialogue heavy RPGs. For me, it's a great game. But objectively speaking it does have quite a few flaws and for me, a game that does very well but is more meant for people who are really into this sort of genre is something like a 7 or 8. Hence the 7.5 from me and not a 9 or something.
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Post by Iakus on Nov 7, 2019 19:56:00 GMT
Fallout's gameplay is clunky as hell to this day. And a AA version of it I didn't expect to be any less clunky. I don't think I've ever played a AA game, especially an RPG, that wasn't clunky. As long as it's not downright annoying like in Vampyr, I don't care. I'm quite tolerant of mediocre gameplay if the art design, story and atmosphere is good. I think I prefer VATS to TTD, but I wasn't too bothered by it.
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Post by Iakus on Nov 7, 2019 20:03:37 GMT
I was under the impression that: The nutrition problem had been known for a long time, and the Board had been importing food from Earth while they worked on the problem. But when Earth went dark, that supply was cut off, and after three years, they were running out of their reserves. I think Parvati even mentions kinda early on how people had been going hungry lately, which I suppose could be interpreted as the body craving nutrients it hasn't been getting. Yes, I got the exact same impression. However, I just didn't get where exactly the problem originated or why they couldn't fix it immediately. Nutrients are nothing more than a bunch of chemical compounds, proteins, carbs, a bunch of vitamins and so forth). As I wrote above, all you need to do is import a bunch of seeds (maybe even soil if necessary) and start growing. Hell, they even have a working animal farming system in place (though disgusting as it may be). I don't quite get where exactly this unsolvable nutrient deficiency is grounded in this world. 'cause you really don't need much to grow nutritious food. I mean, even Mat Damon and a few potatoes would do the trick. On the other hand, it would actually be quite hard to grow non-nutritious food, which apparently they managed to do somehow. I think some form of slow, hard-to-detect contamination of the food chain would have been more believable. That's why I was getting the impression that the Board was more incompetent than evil. Further reinforced by how stuff has been breaking and not being repaired for who-knows-how-long. Also, given the foods they have are things like "saltuna", "cystipigs", and "mock apples" tells me that a lot of what they eat are alien in origin. And yet The Dissidents found a way to grow crops that can actually feed them. And based on the ending slides, the problem was ultimately solved, or at least mitigated, with vitamin supplements. Much easier than genetically altering humans to be able to subsist on Halcyon's flora and fauna!
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Post by AnDromedary on Nov 7, 2019 21:26:06 GMT
Oh, by the way, there was one thing I ddin't quite get: So, the Groundbreaker and the Hope needed 10 years to get from Earth to Halcyon. Yet, according to Welles, the lost frigate was only traveling 2-3 months when contact was lost but he talks about it as if it had reached Earth after that time already. Or at least that was the impression I got, he speculates that whatever happened to the frigate might be what also happened to earth. This would not make sense if the ship only completed 1/30th of it's journey, especially since they still seem to have contact with other colonies out there. Also, Dr. Chartram has a conversation with a redacted board member, which you can read on her terminal on HRC1084, where she tried to inquire about an Earth Directorate assault cruiser called the Cornelius Vanderbilt. Given the timing of Chartrams's research, their escape from Cascadia and so forth, it also follows that the travel time between Earth and Halcyon at the time of the game is just a few months. So what's the difference? Did they improve skip drives amssively in the past years? Are the colony ships slower because they are bigger? What's going on?
On another note, I am not sure I remember this correctly but if you complete the quest about the Groundbreaker's backup comm relay, doesn't that comm officer tell you that there are 3 years worth of encrypted messages from Earth backlogged in that relay? Wouldn't that indicate that Earth is still out there and sending messages, they are just never came through? (wether by accident or due to someone interfering seems unclear.) Not sure I am geting this correctly though. I just rewatched the dialogue at the beginning and at the end of the quest and it's not super clear. She says that relay gets the majority of messages from earth and at the end she says all the messages in the past 36 months were encrypted. Whether those encrypted messages were from earth however is not not clear., so who knows. In any case, lot's of stuff there to work with in a DLC or better yet an improved TOW2
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Post by Deleted on Nov 7, 2019 22:27:10 GMT
Yeah after thinking on it for a day of two I would file the game under "Good but not quite great". It's fun and well worth the time of you're a fan of the genre, but don't expect it to blow your mind or anything. I do hope it sells a few copies though. I selfishly want more of this stuff
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Post by Iakus on Nov 7, 2019 23:31:45 GMT
Oh, by the way, there was one thing I ddin't quite get: So, the Groundbreaker and the Hope needed 10 years to get from Earth to Halcyon. Yet, according to Welles, the lost frigate was only traveling 2-3 months when contact was lost but he talks about it as if it had reached Earth after that time already. Or at least that was the impression I got, he speculates that whatever happened to the frigate might be what also happened to earth. This would not make sense if the ship only completed 1/30th of it's journey, especially since they still seem to have contact with other colonies out there. Also, Dr. Chartram has a conversation with a redacted board member, which you can read on her terminal on HRC1084, where she tried to inquire about an Earth Directorate assault cruiser called the Cornelius Vanderbilt. Given the timing of Chartrams's research, their escape from Cascadia and so forth, it also follows that the travel time between Earth and Halcyon at the time of the game is just a few months. So what's the difference? Did they improve skip drives amssively in the past years? Are the colony ships slower because they are bigger? What's going on?
On another note, I am not sure I remember this correctly but if you complete the quest about the Groundbreaker's backup comm relay, doesn't that comm officer tell you that there are 3 years worth of encrypted messages from Earth backlogged in that relay? Wouldn't that indicate that Earth is still out there and sending messages, they are just never came through? (wether by accident or due to someone interfering seems unclear.) Not sure I am geting this correctly though. I just rewatched the dialogue at the beginning and at the end of the quest and it's not super clear. She says that relay gets the majority of messages from earth and at the end she says all the messages in the past 36 months were encrypted. Whether those encrypted messages were from earth however is not not clear., so who knows. In any case, lot's of stuff there to work with in a DLC or better yet an improved TOW2 Not to mention It is never explained what messed with the Hope's skip drive. Somehow, I have a feeling it is related to what happened to Earth.
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bladefist
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
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Post by bladefist on Nov 11, 2019 2:28:27 GMT
Glad they're not pushing for open world. Keep everything nice and compact like the older classics
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Post by Deleted on Nov 11, 2019 14:16:52 GMT
"Bigger, but still on the smaller side"
"Open ended, but still structured"
Sounds good to me. They don't have to go open world, go anywhere, do anything for part 2. In fact, as Leonard Boyarsky said, it wouldn't actually make sense for the setting.
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Post by theratpack55 on Nov 11, 2019 15:09:40 GMT
So, I'm playing it now and while I do like the overall feel of the game, I admittedly have some issues with the gameplay.
Idk if I'm just bad at it or if it's the game's fault, but I often get into encounters where I'll get killed in five seconds flat, unsure of what exactly killed me or how I could have avoided it, then redo the same encounter and somehow I'm the one who kills everything in five seconds, through no skills or superior tactics of my own. It just... happens that way.
Now, like it was mentioned before, Fallout also has pretty clunky gunplay, but I feel like in FO I at least always had a better general idea of how to approach a situation differently if I was facing tough enemies or the like. Also sneaking and sniping was quite intuitive, even if not exactly at stealth game level. In TOW I often have no clue what I could be doing better or differently, and sneaking only seems good for getting one initial shot off... are there even any silenced sniper weapons in the game?
On the plus side, I like the writing and the dialog options, and of course the ability to not be the good hero guy. Which is fitting, because I seem to have accidentally made my guy look like Ted Bundy...
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by dmc1001 on Nov 11, 2019 19:53:39 GMT
I liked it. It was pretty short. Takes away from the idea of "Fallout in Space". FO is a vast, open world. TOW is very hub-based. Could be fine if the game weren't so short.
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Post by Iakus on Nov 11, 2019 19:57:36 GMT
I liked it. It was pretty short. Takes away from the idea of "Fallout in Space". FO is a vast, open world. TOW is very hub-based. Could be fine if the game weren't so short. It's reasonably long if you do all the side quests. But there's definitely room for DLC. A coupe of worlds don't even get used.
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Post by AnDromedary on Nov 11, 2019 22:33:10 GMT
So, I'm playing it now and while I do like the overall feel of the game, I admittedly have some issues with the gameplay. Idk if I'm just bad at it or if it's the game's fault, but I often get into encounters where I'll get killed in five seconds flat, unsure of what exactly killed me or how I could have avoided it, then redo the same encounter and somehow I'm the one who kills everything in five seconds, through no skills or superior tactics of my own. It just... happens that way. Now, like it was mentioned before, Fallout also has pretty clunky gunplay, but I feel like in FO I at least always had a better general idea of how to approach a situation differently if I was facing tough enemies or the like. Also sneaking and sniping was quite intuitive, even if not exactly at stealth game level. In TOW I often have no clue what I could be doing better or differently, and sneaking only seems good for getting one initial shot off... are there even any silenced sniper weapons in the game? On the plus side, I like the writing and the dialog options, and of course the ability to not be the good hero guy. Which is fitting, because I seem to have accidentally made my guy look like Ted Bundy... Yep, that's pretty much exactly my impression on the gameplay as well.
As for silenced sniper rifles, yes, they are in the game. The sniper rifle is called a hunting rifle (there is a mk.2 with higher damage later). And there is a barrel mod that is a silencer (I think it's called "Mr. Quiet"). However, you still want to stay far awaya not to be heard and if another enemy sees one of their collegues go down, they'll still zero in on you very quickly. Also, I found the initial damage output of the hunting rifle to be underwhelming honestly. If you really want to go down that route, tinker with it to up the damage 'cause you will need to do one shot kills to stay hidden. Otherwise, it's far easier to take the over powered machine guns and maw your way through. IMO, combat stealth really is only useful if you plan to got for an allout pacifist run.
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bladefist
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Post by bladefist on Nov 12, 2019 1:56:57 GMT
To sneak and snipe I had to pick every TTD perk available.
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Post by flyingsquirrel on Nov 12, 2019 2:22:50 GMT
I liked it. It was pretty short. Takes away from the idea of "Fallout in Space". FO is a vast, open world. TOW is very hub-based. Could be fine if the game weren't so short. How quickly did you finish it? I just started this weekend and I've put in about 9 hours total.
I think it's "Fallout in Space" in terms of the aesthetic - all of the locations I've visited so far have a somewhat run-down feel and something of the retro-futuristic style - and the gameplay mechanics of dialogue, exploration, and combat. 95% of the time, I feel like I could be playing FO3, FONV, or FO4. Even some of the corporate satire feels like it could have come out of a pre-war terminal entry somewhere. Not that this a bad thing - I like Fallout, and I like games in space - just that its creative debst are fairly obvious. The main improvement over Fallout that I've seen is the handling of the companions - they chime in on the dialogue scenes a lot more often than they do in Fallout, and they don't stumble into combat when you're trying to sneak.
I remember reading a description of it a while back as "what would happen if Fallout and Mass Effect had a baby," but I don't really see too much of the ME influence. It's in space, it allows for two companions at once, and as you pointed out, it's a series of self-contained maps rather than an open world, but that's about it. The player-character is nowhere near as powerful as Shepard or Ryder, and the stakes seem considerably lower than in an ME game, and I have yet to see any sort of cinematic cut scene or even a scene where the player-character is visible at all.
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Post by biggydx on Nov 12, 2019 14:10:28 GMT
I'm having a generally good time with the game so far. I've made it past the first planet, and I've mainly been running a stealth/firearms playstyle for much of my time. Also, Spacers Choice is pretty f'd up.
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Post by Iakus on Nov 12, 2019 17:08:58 GMT
I'm having a generally good time with the game so far. I've made it past the first planet, and I've mainly been running a stealth/firearms playstyle for much of my time. Also, Spacers Choice is pretty f'd up. "It's not the best choice-it's SPACER'S CHOICE!"
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Post by AnDromedary on Nov 12, 2019 17:37:19 GMT
I'm having a generally good time with the game so far. I've made it past the first planet, and I've mainly been running a stealth/firearms playstyle for much of my time. Also, Spacers Choice is pretty f'd up. "It's not the best choice-it's SPACER'S CHOICE!" Ironically, a great slogan to actually sum up the game itself.
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Post by biggydx on Nov 12, 2019 18:08:46 GMT
I'm having a generally good time with the game so far. I've made it past the first planet, and I've mainly been running a stealth/firearms playstyle for much of my time. Also, Spacers Choice is pretty f'd up. "It's not the best choice-it's SPACER'S CHOICE!" I'm on the Groundbreaker, and my god do I feel bad for the guy wearing the Spacer's Choice moon hat
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Post by Iakus on Nov 12, 2019 19:52:33 GMT
"It's not the best choice-it's SPACER'S CHOICE!" I'm on the Groundbreaker, and my god do I feel bad for the guy wearing the Spacer's Choice moon hat I bought one
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Post by biggydx on Nov 12, 2019 22:13:25 GMT
I'm on the Groundbreaker, and my god do I feel bad for the guy wearing the Spacer's Choice moon hat I bought one Yup!
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Post by bladefist on Nov 13, 2019 3:56:00 GMT
Parvati's had enough
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Post by Kabraxal on Nov 13, 2019 8:41:32 GMT
Recently beat it... it was okay, but it never truly captured the magic of Alpha Protocol or New Vegas. I enjoyed it, but the characters were caricatures and nothing more and the story fizzled out sadly. I never felt fully engaged because of that. And the ending was just flat... it really felt like they needed to wrap it up but didn’t know how. I do like the visuals for the world’s though. They just need to beef up the story and characters while respecting the roleplaying of the gamer.
I guess, in many ways, it fell into the trap of Greedfall: tried living up to a behemoth in gaming but just couldn’t nail what made that inspiration great. Greedfall tried to be Inquisition but couldn’t flesh out the characters and interaction enough to live up to the GOAT while Outer Worlds tried to be New Vegas but failed to create the characters, story, or branching paths that made New Vegas a classic. I respect the attempt and they were fun... butI have no strong urge to replay either.
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Post by flyingsquirrel on Nov 14, 2019 17:40:06 GMT
Recently beat it... it was okay, but it never truly captured the magic of Alpha Protocol or New Vegas. I enjoyed it, but the characters were caricatures and nothing more and the story fizzled out sadly. I never felt fully engaged because of that. And the ending was just flat... it really felt like they needed to wrap it up but didn’t know how. I do like the visuals for the world’s though. They just need to beef up the story and characters while respecting the roleplaying of the gamer. I guess, in many ways, it fell into the trap of Greedfall: tried living up to a behemoth in gaming but just couldn’t nail what made that inspiration great. Greedfall tried to be Inquisition but couldn’t flesh out the characters and interaction enough to live up to the GOAT while Outer Worlds tried to be New Vegas but failed to create the characters, story, or branching paths that made New Vegas a classic. I respect the attempt and they were fun... butI have no strong urge to replay either. One thing I'm finding interesting about it is that it does make you think twice about the human cost before you go the obvious route of flipping the middle finger to the big corporations. I initially intended to divert the power to the deserters' camp on the first map, but eventually I decided to send it to Edgewater instead because it seemed like they wouldn't all necessarily reunite at the deserters' colony and that the corps might treat the Edgewater population even more harshly if they appeared no longer to be of use to the bottom line. I'd have liked to be able to just free everybody from corporate subservience altogether, but that didn't appear to be an option. Similarly, I've been returning the recovered research data on Roseway to the scientists rather than pocketing and selling it. Again, if I were in charge, I wouldn't have let Auntie Cleo leave so many people in such a dangerous situation in the first place, but selling the research data seemed like it would probably hurt the scientists themselves and the other Roseway residents more than it would hurt the company's bigwigs. I agree that I'm not sure I'll want to play it again when it's over, though I'm curious as to what happens if you report Phineas to the Board after arriving at Groundbreaker. Can you play as someone who initially trusts the corps and then later turns against them, or does that choice send you inexorably down the corporate lackey path? As for Greedfall, I haven't played it, though if it's trying to emulate Inquisition, I'm not especially eager. I don't *dislike* Inquisition - in fact I just recently played it again and would rate it a solid 7 out of 10 - but there's way too much filler content that serves no purpose other than making the game "more and bigger," as also happened with Andromeda. Maybe Bioware just isn't that great at open worlds and should stick to the tighter narrative structures of the Shepard trilogy and the first two Dragon Age games.
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dmc1001
N7
Biotic Booty
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: ferroboy
Prime Posts: 77
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Post by dmc1001 on Nov 14, 2019 19:34:46 GMT
I liked it. It was pretty short. Takes away from the idea of "Fallout in Space". FO is a vast, open world. TOW is very hub-based. Could be fine if the game weren't so short. It's reasonably long if you do all the side quests. But there's definitely room for DLC. A coupe of worlds don't even get used. I did. I did every side quest. Everyone survived. Well, except one, but it turns out to be a glitch.
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Post by AnDromedary on Nov 14, 2019 20:34:17 GMT
I decided to send it to Edgewater instead because it seemed like they wouldn't all necessarily reunite at the deserters' colony and that the corps might treat the Edgewater population even more harshly if they appeared no longer to be of use to the bottom line. Oh you've got no idea my friend! I directed the power to the deserters and much much later in the game, one of the main board execs will give you a mission to literally wipe the now unproductive Edgewater from the map and kill everyone in the town. I refused to do it, which lead to a big fight in HHC headquarters but yea, they are not really fond of Edgewater when it doesn't pump out the saltuna anymore Well, you are again right on the money. I sold the data to the lady on the Groundbreaker. If you do that and then return to Roseway later, the chief scientist that used to hang out in the comm tower committed suicide. So yea, while I do agree with Kabraxal that the characters are often too much like caricatures, they did put a lot of effort into the choices and consequences. Gotta give'em that.
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