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Post by QuizzyBunny on Mar 7, 2022 20:02:28 GMT
I'm hoping for more "deep" quests this time around, even if it means the game as a whole is shorter. I'm fine with some filler, but I don't want it clogging my quest log.
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Post by Heimdall on Mar 7, 2022 20:19:47 GMT
We all hope for more in depth quests, I just hope they have time to build all that out before a probable late 2023 release date.
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Post by necrowaif on Mar 7, 2022 20:22:50 GMT
Inquisitor, I need you to bury my husband’s petrified ballsack next to the tree where we tried foot play for the first time. I’d do it myself but my shoelaces are untied.
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Post by colfoley on Mar 7, 2022 20:24:54 GMT
I'm hoping for more "deep" quests this time around, even if it means the game as a whole is shorter. I'm fine with some filler, but I don't want it clogging my quest log. I was just thinking about this and chatting about it with my wife. And really if I'm going to wait 6-7 years for this game along with paying 100 dollars for it. I want an experience that is at least 100 hours long. Now there is some tongue wedged firmly in cheekadge here since what the hell do I know about game design...but the two aren't mutually exclusive and we have seen I think a lot of tripplevA games go anywhere from 80-150 hours with great quests throughout and some that don't. It's not the length that matters but how its used.
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Post by githcheater on Mar 8, 2022 0:04:05 GMT
I'm hoping for more "deep" quests this time around, even if it means the game as a whole is shorter. I'm fine with some filler, but I don't want it clogging my quest log. I was just thinking about this and chatting about it with my wife. And really if I'm going to wait 6-7 years for this game along with paying 100 dollars for it. I want an experience that is at least 100 hours long. Now there is some tongue wedged firmly in cheekadge here since what the hell do I know about game design...but the two aren't mutually exclusive and we have seen I think a lot of tripplevA games go anywhere from 80-150 hours with great quests throughout and some that don't. It's not the length that matters but how its used.Don' take offense at ...
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Post by colfoley on Mar 8, 2022 0:22:44 GMT
I was just thinking about this and chatting about it with my wife. And really if I'm going to wait 6-7 years for this game along with paying 100 dollars for it. I want an experience that is at least 100 hours long. Now there is some tongue wedged firmly in cheekadge here since what the hell do I know about game design...but the two aren't mutually exclusive and we have seen I think a lot of tripplevA games go anywhere from 80-150 hours with great quests throughout and some that don't. It's not the length that matters but how its used.Don' take offense at ...
Hey trust me my mind made the same joke.
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Post by Hrungr on Mar 8, 2022 14:09:11 GMT
A Happy 11th Anniversary to Dragon Age II
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Post by Sartoz on Mar 8, 2022 14:32:17 GMT
I'm hoping for more "deep" quests this time around, even if it means the game as a whole is shorter. I'm fine with some filler, but I don't want it clogging my quest log.
Hm... No loyalty quests then... we had them in ME. Mind, I like meaningful quests .. something new and not a re-thread.
So, what kind am I thinking? let's see....
1- Find a powerful NPC to strengthen your party? 2- Destroy a red lirium mining ring that blocks a critical taget goal. 3- Sabotage a Qunari operation that if successful can set you back big time 4- Assassinate a powerful political/mage foe hell bent against you.
These and smaller quests are opportunities to develop the NPC characters. Now if Bio adds another Pink Rose establishment, there is additonal opportunities to further delve deeper into our characters.
Prioritizing these "deep" quests should come from an Operational Control Centre where information from intelligenge assets can be analyzied, prioritized and presented to our main character to choose (could have consequences for wrong priority selections). No freaking War Room crapola like operation as in DA:I. I found it to be simplistic. I'd like to see the people in the OCC discuss pros and cons... you want deep?.. this is the way to do it, imo. Oh,.. add cinematics and a little drama... just like the movies..(word budget not withstanding).
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Post by Sartoz on Mar 8, 2022 14:34:33 GMT
A Happy 11th Anniversary to Dragon Age II
Oh, yes... I love this game!
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Post by gervaise21 on Mar 8, 2022 18:49:13 GMT
No loyalty quests then... we had them in ME. Mind, I like meaningful quests .. something new and not a re-thread. I don't think "deep" quests and loyalty quests are mutually exclusive. I liked the loyalty quests in ME and, correct me if I'm wrong, I liked the fact that you are given the option of doing them without it being dependent on reaching a certain level of approval, just talking with your companions enough that they open up. It has always irked me that first run in DAI I didn't get Bull's personal quest because I had failed to take him on a dragon hunt, which I discovered subsequently was all I needed to do to get my approval high enough.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 8, 2022 20:22:48 GMT
Prioritizing these "deep" quests should come from an Operational Control Centre where information from intelligenge assets can be analyzied, prioritized and presented to our main character to choose (could have consequences for wrong priority selections). Oh, so you want a complete rehash of the DAI wartable? But... Why?
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Just a flip of the coin.
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Post by Sanunes on Mar 8, 2022 21:22:17 GMT
I'm hoping for more "deep" quests this time around, even if it means the game as a whole is shorter. I'm fine with some filler, but I don't want it clogging my quest log. I was just thinking about this and chatting about it with my wife. And really if I'm going to wait 6-7 years for this game along with paying 100 dollars for it. I want an experience that is at least 100 hours long. Now there is some tongue wedged firmly in cheekadge here since what the hell do I know about game design...but the two aren't mutually exclusive and we have seen I think a lot of tripplevA games go anywhere from 80-150 hours with great quests throughout and some that don't. It's not the length that matters but how its used. Its all about what people are willing not to see in the games. Using Inquisition as an example versus a fixed protagonist game with Inquisition there were four races that you could pick male or female so they would have to at least verify and probably tweak each quest conversation eight times. Then you had to make sure the four voice options worked as well. With the fixed protagonist where they just need it to work for one character so even being able to put twice the work into each quest would be a big difference. Then going into the forbidden zone of how much time they are stuck with romances for with Andromeda it was said by someone from BioWare (I cannot find the comment), but most romances are completely hand built because there is a lot of custom and unique work due to the amount of interactions and doing their best to minimize character clipping. I would really enjoy deeper quests and a game of decent length, but they have to make a game that appeals to more then just me for I would be okay with a much smaller window for what we can pick for protagonists. As you said its all about how the development time is used.
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Post by QuizzyBunny on Mar 9, 2022 7:40:10 GMT
I know removing 20 filler quests won't automatically result in one "longer" quest (simply because filler quests involves fewer people and are done super fast), but I'm a completionist so for me having a ton of small non-lore fetch quests feels like wasting time (not doing them at all makes me feel wrong on the inside). So I'm fine with some filler as they help leveling fast, but I really don't want them to be pages on pages in the journal - I want to feel motivated to continue the main story.
I think that is what caused some issues in the Hinterlands, people got bogged down with these quests instead of going to the juicy parts.
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Post by gervaise21 on Mar 9, 2022 9:09:47 GMT
So I'm fine with some filler as they help leveling fast, but I really don't want them to be pages on pages in the journal - I want to feel motivated to continue the main story. One of the problems I have had with more open world games is the fact that exploration off the main path only seems valid if you are looking for something or someone related to the main story. I found this with the first Baldurs Gate game where I couldn't see the point of my character heading off into the wilds without a good reason, for example searching for someone whose partner had agreed to help me if I did. So first run there were some areas that I didn't visit until my next character run. With DAI I did stick to the main plot on my first run because it seemed to me there was an urgency in finding and stopping Corypheus. I ran around the Hinterlands until I had enough points to move on and so there were parts I never even visited, like the dragon lair. Why would my character risk their life hunting a dragon that was not actively threatening the refugees? Why would I bother completing the Hissing Wastes until after his defeat when there was nothing there to assist with it? In both these instances, the final boss battle was harder because I had mostly stuck to the main path but that was good in a way because at least it was challenging. My second run with DAI, I did everything I possibly could before the final battle and as a result it was ridiculously easy. On the other hand, trying to do Jaws of Hakkon off a basic completion level was tricky. I do think that the boss at the main game should level with you, so if you meet them after completing every quest in the game, they are still just as difficult.
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Post by Hrungr on Mar 9, 2022 18:13:47 GMT
Gaming Heads @gamingheadsow.ly/rh2550H3lYBBeat the price rise and pre-order your Dragon Age: Inquisition - Solas statue now. 24.5"/62cm tall. Hand made. Worldwide Shipping. Limited Edition. Polystone resin. @gamingheads #dragonage #dragonageinquisition #solas #replica #resinstatue #collectible
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Post by Hrungr on Mar 9, 2022 18:27:06 GMT
Emily C Taylor 💉💉💉 pentapod"I'm worried that 'stroke the door for 3 minutes and lick it a little bit' was the first example of how to open a door that came to mind 🤔" "Yeah, me too, actually" "Yes, just licking the door would work" #overheardintheoffice #gamedev
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Post by Solas on Mar 9, 2022 18:52:32 GMT
DRAGON AGE DREAD WOLF TEE FEN’HAREL HAS ARRIVED It was a beast unlike any I had ever seen. Lupine in appearance, but the size of a high dragon, with shaggy spiked hide and six burning eyes like a pride demon… whatever fear the name Dread Wolf carries, he has earned. — Dragon Age: Tevinter Nights Whether you commend or condemn the Dread Wolf for his rebellion against the gods, it’s hard not to be feel captivated by his face. It incites fear and inspires awe with six eyes and blood-red maw. It pulls you in, like an invitation to discover the tangle of stories it represents. Make this captivating artwork part of your style with your Dragon Age Dread Wolf Tee. Its black color allows the illustration’s limited palette really stand out and give the illusion of Fen’Harel emerging from the shadows, as you can see in the gallery above. Aside from the awesome graphic, this tee offers a light and comfortable feel. Because it’s made with combed and ring-spun yarn, it is smoother, finer, and stronger than regular 100% cotton shirts. This also gives it a drape that feels and looks good even when you wear it under a few layers of clothes. Wear your Dragon Age Dread Wolf Tee whenever you want the elven god of rebellion to be with you in the waking world. gear.bioware.com/products/dragon-age-dread-wolf-tee
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Post by q5tyhj on Mar 10, 2022 1:02:09 GMT
I know removing 20 filler quests won't automatically result in one "longer" quest (simply because filler quests involves fewer people and are done super fast), but I'm a completionist so for me having a ton of small non-lore fetch quests feels like wasting time (not doing them at all makes me feel wrong on the inside). So I'm fine with some filler as they help leveling fast, but I really don't want them to be pages on pages in the journal - I want to feel motivated to continue the main story. I think that is what caused some issues in the Hinterlands, people got bogged down with these quests instead of going to the juicy parts. Yeah I don't think there's any tight relation between the number of "deep" quests vs. "fetch"-type quests, so its not as if cutting out the fetch quests will result in more deep quests. So we're probably getting fetch quests regardless, that's sort of why they exist in the first place- they're the very definition of "filler", as they require relatively little effort to include. And just think of the Bioware canon- how many games do NOT have fetch quests? Every Bioware game I've ever played has had them, the best case scenario is something like ME2 where you have a bare handful of "fetch" quests (e.g. buying Serrice Ice Brandy for Dr. Chakwas, or Normandy parts for the engineers) that don't really effect anything. One thing that makes a big difference, at least for me, is having the quest log better organized to differentiate between real quests and the fetch quests, so you can easily ignore the latter if you're not interested (which, most of the time, I'm not).
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Post by Lebanese Dude on Mar 10, 2022 4:47:18 GMT
Playing God of War and despite being linear there's tons of collection quests for xp.
I feel that's just how games promote exploration and curiosity. It seems to work apparently otherwise it wouldnt keep popping up.
Perhaps next DA should just provide more carrots. Add xp for every find. Make maps more linear to reduce effective search time. Etc
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N6
Just a flip of the coin.
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Post by Sanunes on Mar 10, 2022 6:00:39 GMT
I know removing 20 filler quests won't automatically result in one "longer" quest (simply because filler quests involves fewer people and are done super fast), but I'm a completionist so for me having a ton of small non-lore fetch quests feels like wasting time (not doing them at all makes me feel wrong on the inside). So I'm fine with some filler as they help leveling fast, but I really don't want them to be pages on pages in the journal - I want to feel motivated to continue the main story. I think that is what caused some issues in the Hinterlands, people got bogged down with these quests instead of going to the juicy parts. Yeah I don't think there's any tight relation between the number of "deep" quests vs. "fetch"-type quests, so its not as if cutting out the fetch quests will result in more deep quests. So we're probably getting fetch quests regardless, that's sort of why they exist in the first place- they're the very definition of "filler", as they require relatively little effort to include. And just think of the Bioware canon- how many games do NOT have fetch quests? Every Bioware game I've ever played has had them, the best case scenario is something like ME2 where you have a bare handful of "fetch" quests (e.g. buying Serrice Ice Brandy for Dr. Chakwas, or Normandy parts for the engineers) that don't really effect anything. One thing that makes a big difference, at least for me, is having the quest log better organized to differentiate between real quests and the fetch quests, so you can easily ignore the latter if you're not interested (which, most of the time, I'm not). ME2 was different because instead of fetch quests they had all kinds of companion quests that weren't related to the main story so had the same level of impact on the critical path as a fetch quest in the other games. I also don't see them labeling a quest as less important unless its a pinned quest at the top that is the critical path quest and everything else is below it. Otherwise they are just opening themselves up for criticisms.
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Post by colfoley on Mar 10, 2022 6:02:52 GMT
Yeah I don't think there's any tight relation between the number of "deep" quests vs. "fetch"-type quests, so its not as if cutting out the fetch quests will result in more deep quests. So we're probably getting fetch quests regardless, that's sort of why they exist in the first place- they're the very definition of "filler", as they require relatively little effort to include. And just think of the Bioware canon- how many games do NOT have fetch quests? Every Bioware game I've ever played has had them, the best case scenario is something like ME2 where you have a bare handful of "fetch" quests (e.g. buying Serrice Ice Brandy for Dr. Chakwas, or Normandy parts for the engineers) that don't really effect anything. One thing that makes a big difference, at least for me, is having the quest log better organized to differentiate between real quests and the fetch quests, so you can easily ignore the latter if you're not interested (which, most of the time, I'm not). ME2 was different because instead of fetch quests they had all kinds of companion quests that weren't related to the main story so had the same level of impact on the critical path as a fetch quest in the other games. I also don't see them labeling a quest as less important unless its a pinned quest at the top that is the critical path quest and everything else is below it. Otherwise they are just opening themselves up for criticisms. they already did it for Inquisition and Andromeda though.
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Post by colfoley on Mar 10, 2022 6:39:10 GMT
Honestly probably something that has been mentioned before but I do wonder if its not so much the fetch quests and the length of the game and things isn't so much how much of them busy work but how 'tightly' everything relates. Does everything feel like it matters to the larger game world even if superficially? That was Inquisition's problem because far too many of the zones had pretty much nothing to do with the war against Corypheus and the larger plot of the game other then some nebulous 'power' counter. Sure this had its fun too, Hissing Wastes was a terrific map...as well as a few others ...but they were esentially busy work in the end. Cool busy work. But busy work. Now milleage will vary on what I am probably about to say...but compare this to Origins, Andromeda, and the Witcher 3. These games had busy work and fetch quests but in the end each one of their maps the players had a reason to be there. And the rest of the structure filled into place from there. Each zone had something for you to do in each zone to secure the thing you needed to help you out in the rest of the game, several of the side quests supported these basic zone storylines and themes and even the ones that didn't even helped flesh out the world or give us something to do. Maybe we'd be a lot more forgiving of fetch quests if even installing a bunch of coolant pipes on terraformers can help us make our home more habital to live?
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Post by dadithinkimgay on Mar 10, 2022 8:01:38 GMT
Why does that sound so scary
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August 2016
gervaise21
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by gervaise21 on Mar 10, 2022 10:00:04 GMT
Wear your Dragon Age Dread Wolf Tee whenever you want the elven god of rebellion to be with you in the waking world. Would that necessarily be something desirable? Fen'Harel is the scary aspect you don't want to mess with. Why does that sound so scary Because it is. Solas in full on Fen'Harel mode is definitely someone you'd want to avoid.
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inherit
1033
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Sept 29, 2024 3:21:01 GMT
35,101
colfoley
18,354
Aug 17, 2016 10:19:37 GMT
August 2016
colfoley
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Post by colfoley on Mar 10, 2022 10:40:10 GMT
As an addendum to my previous post I just realized that there is another layer in this hiearchy that is very likely. Since DA4 is likely to continue Inquisition's tradition of being multi national that is just another bit to loop into the overall progression of the game. That the main character will get to go to each country on the map for a reason that connects overall to the hunt for the Dread Wolf or the Qunari Invasion. Then they get there they get pointed to a different zone since I hope to goodness each country does not represent its own zone. So from there you basically have a national storyline/ conflict the PC will have to solve that will feed back into the plot then hopefully a zonal storyline. From there you just sprinkle in a few side quests relating to and supporting to why you are there in the first place and then from there you sprinkle in random world bosses or bandit camps to clear or the like and this has the making of one satisfying gameplay loop.
Like initially the PC can hear about the spread of Red Lyrium in the Anderfels and since Red Lyrium we have heard is something that could help the Dread Wolf in their plan we decide to investigate. We do and find the Wardens besieged but they point us in the direction of what they believe to be the soource, maybe a new resurgence of weird darkspawn or one of Ghil'linan's lab. As a hopeful bonus on my part maybe after going back to the Tevinter Imperium and dealing with the Qunari for a bit we discover that they have a Red Lyrium mining operation within the Anderfels. So not only does each zone have their own story but we can criss cross and have multiple zones support each other's story to, as well as the game narrative.
(Though to anyone who is reading this I will say as hyped for the possibility of this I am it should be noted they kind of already did this in Andromeda. Just my idea is a little more grand so going to reserve hype.)
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