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Post by smilesja on May 1, 2022 20:36:25 GMT
Honestly DA: O was pretty clunky for console, I've been playing it recently and I've been struggling to cycle through the characters efficiently. DA: 2 was better in terms that many abilities are more action oriented but it was still implemented with PC in mind. While DA: I was a little too simplistic, I finally felt like I wasn't fighting the game just to give out a command. I also love jumping around as well. That being said, I do hope Bioware tries to find a medium between console and PC players. I'd hate to see console abandoned just so they can cater to PC.
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Post by colfoley on May 1, 2022 20:43:17 GMT
The eight ability limit is fine. While it may not sound realisic it is all about balancing the experience. Not just between consoles and PC players but just in general and even for PC players in general. Origins was incredibly clunky and boring and the enemies were far too grindy because the ability limits were non existant in some versions. Hence, it was a much more enjoyable experience having fewer abilities to chose from.
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Post by smilesja on May 1, 2022 20:49:42 GMT
Also, the friendly fire was pretty annoying in DA: O, I had to constantly tweak my tactics just to prevent my characters from getting hit. Which why I was glad that DA:I finally introduced the pause and zoom out mechanic for console players.
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Post by smilesja on May 1, 2022 20:51:06 GMT
Good thing as a console player DA: I fit my needs. Bah, these days the peasants get all uppity! Don't upset the glorious PC master race!
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Post by Iakus on May 1, 2022 21:07:25 GMT
The eight ability limit is fine. While it may not sound realisic it is all about balancing the experience. Not just between consoles and PC players but just in general and even for PC players in general. Origins was incredibly clunky and boring and the enemies were far too grindy because the ability limits were non existant in some versions. Hence, it was a much more enjoyable experience having fewer abilities to chose from. With skill points being a limited resource, using any that doesn't provide a tangible benefit feels like a waste. Such as having a power you can't use anymore because you're out of slots. Especially since at least one of the eight slots pretty much HAD to be taken up by Mark of the Rift. Edit: if you absolutely HAVE to limit the number of powers, increase the number of passive skills available. Or be able to sink more points into an active power to further improve it, like Deus Ex.
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Post by Sanunes on May 2, 2022 0:37:05 GMT
The eight ability limit is fine. While it may not sound realisic it is all about balancing the experience. Not just between consoles and PC players but just in general and even for PC players in general. Origins was incredibly clunky and boring and the enemies were far too grindy because the ability limits were non existant in some versions. Hence, it was a much more enjoyable experience having fewer abilities to chose from. With skill points being a limited resource, using any that doesn't provide a tangible benefit feels like a waste. Such as having a power you can't use anymore because you're out of slots. Especially since at least one of the eight slots pretty much HAD to be taken up by Mark of the Rift. Edit: if you absolutely HAVE to limit the number of powers, increase the number of passive skills available. Or be able to sink more points into an active power to further improve it, like Deus Ex. All of those things exist in Inquisition already. It was just limited by the design of the skill tree for you would need to pick an active ability to ignore to get to the passives and there were a number of skills you could improve by spending another skill point to alter the ability in one of two ways while being able to switch between the variants at will.
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Post by githcheater on May 2, 2022 0:37:56 GMT
I think sixteen active abilities is doable but anything beyond that would be stretching it. Each of the four buttons pressed at the same time as one of the four D pad directions = 16. Add another four abilities when the pressing each of the four buttons without using the direction pad.
ie ... 20 abilities is doable if the D pad can be used this way ...
Bioware "should" be able to do more than eight abilities and not be limited by consoles ...
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Post by Absafraginlootly on May 2, 2022 1:39:21 GMT
One thing I will say about MEA's favourite system for switching between 4 sets of three powers is it does allow many power key bindings for console without requiring many buttons to do it. Requires refinement though.
Putting everything on cool down when you switch to a diff group of favorites? Annoying. Choose individual power cooldown or global cooldown, don't add a third type of cooldown that triggers when you haven't even done anything.
The way that you changed favorites in Andromeda by bringing up a menu, then selecting a second menu, then finally selecting the power set? Onerous, tiresome. What was the point in taking away my beloved pause button and control of my companions in the name of faster paced combat, only to slow everything down for this? Surely even the controller could spare one button or button combination to simply scroll through the favorites.
But if da4 had say 4 favorites with 4 powers each (so 16 total), with a button to switch/scroll through each set on console, and either the same on PC or even have a keybond for each favourite set (F1-4 spring to mind), then that would probably be a reasonable compromise to give both games versions a decent sized power bar.
(Though I'd prefer no 'choose any profile and any power' option though. I want the option to not be a mage and Andromeda didn't let me not be a biotic. You could be a sucky biotic and choose no biotic abilities but you still were one.) Edit: Just saw a post on Reddit that you can switch profiles with keybindings on pc, i look forward to seeing if this is true when i finish my mele playthrough.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on May 2, 2022 1:46:49 GMT
(Though I'd prefer no 'choose any profile and any power' option though. I want the option to not be a mage and Andromeda didn't let me not be a biotic. You could be a sucky biotic and choose no biotic abilities but you still were one.) If you never put any points in the biotics area, you weren't a biotic. It's only when you start pointing points there that you are, like shields being replaced with barriers.
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Post by Solas on May 2, 2022 7:54:19 GMT
Solas will end up having his head on a spike when I get my hands on him. There won't be enough left to involve a spike. mods this is targeted personal harassment
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Post by DragonKingReborn on May 2, 2022 10:39:04 GMT
There won't be enough left to involve a spike. mods this is targeted personal harassment You know what you did.
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Post by Sartoz on May 2, 2022 12:07:40 GMT
There won't be enough left to involve a spike. mods this is targeted personal harassment
Since I intensily dislike Baldy, I don't care. (◔‿◔)
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Post by Sartoz on May 2, 2022 12:23:02 GMT
The eight ability limit is fine. While it may not sound realisic it is all about balancing the experience. Not just between consoles and PC players but just in general and even for PC players in general. Origins was incredibly clunky and boring and the enemies were far too grindy because the ability limits were non existant in some versions. Hence, it was a much more enjoyable experience having fewer abilities to chose from.
Butchering the DA:O - DA2 combat mechanic and replaced with 8 ability points in DA:I is not fine. I liked the combat AI scripts available in the first two. Had a grand 'ole time with the feature. Also had tons of mage spells available to me. DA:I combat mechanic was castrated for some reaon(s).
Mage class is the easiest to play (for me anyway). Thus I'm very biased when I'm hampered by crappy mage combat implementations.
Just adding a counter point....... (◔‿◔)
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Post by Sartoz on May 2, 2022 12:31:41 GMT
(Though I'd prefer no 'choose any profile and any power' option though. I want the option to not be a mage and Andromeda didn't let me not be a biotic. You could be a sucky biotic and choose no biotic abilities but you still were one.) If you never put any points in the biotics area, you weren't a biotic. It's only when you start pointing points there that you are, like shields being replaced with barriers.
Aah... the Adept Fury class. My super favourite in ME3MP. (◔‿◔)
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Post by Hrungr on May 2, 2022 16:36:53 GMT
Kala Elizabeth @kalaelizabethLiterally gasped when I saw this new Dragon Age Inquisition print from @biowaregear 🥺😭😍 would love if there was artist credit though! BioWare Gear Store @biowaregearYour companions welcome you to join them in their First Day of Summer celebrations in this individually numbered, limited edition fine art print. Only 400 available! Grab yours today!🖼️ Volta Artist = Marion Kivits Volta Art Director = Stéphanie Bouchard gear.bioware.com/products/dragon-age-first-day-of-summer-lithograph
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Post by Iakus on May 2, 2022 17:41:23 GMT
The eight ability limit is fine. While it may not sound realisic it is all about balancing the experience. Not just between consoles and PC players but just in general and even for PC players in general. Origins was incredibly clunky and boring and the enemies were far too grindy because the ability limits were non existant in some versions. Hence, it was a much more enjoyable experience having fewer abilities to chose from.
Butchering the DA:O - DA2 combat mechanic and replaced with 8 ability points in DA:I is not fine. I liked the combat AI scripts available in the first two. Had a grand 'ole time with the feature. Also had tons of mage spells available to me. DA:I combat mechanic was castrated for some reaon(s).
Mage class is the easiest to play (for me anyway). Thus I'm very biased when I'm hampered by crappy mage combat implementations.
Just adding a counter point....... (◔‿◔)
_____________________
Maker, yes! I loved the flexibility of mages before they became "Kill it with fire, kill it with frost, kill it with lighting" pew-pewers And please bring back the old Tactics menu! The current one consists of "use power. Use this power a lot. or "don't use this power. The old way gave me far more control over the companions and minimized micromanaging.
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Post by Iakus on May 2, 2022 18:18:00 GMT
(Though I'd prefer no 'choose any profile and any power' option though. I want the option to not be a mage and Andromeda didn't let me not be a biotic. You could be a sucky biotic and choose no biotic abilities but you still were one.) If you never put any points in the biotics area, you weren't a biotic. It's only when you start pointing points there that you are, like shields being replaced with barriers. I ended up taking biotic passive abilities simply because there was nothing left to take as an Infiltrator, and it's pointless to take more than three active powers.
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Post by Hrungr on May 3, 2022 2:51:47 GMT
Mark Darrah @biomarkdarrah Tomorrow we'll wrap up Mage Tower. (May 3, 8am PT) That should leave enough time to do Warden's Keep
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Post by colfoley on May 3, 2022 2:55:43 GMT
The eight ability limit is fine. While it may not sound realisic it is all about balancing the experience. Not just between consoles and PC players but just in general and even for PC players in general. Origins was incredibly clunky and boring and the enemies were far too grindy because the ability limits were non existant in some versions. Hence, it was a much more enjoyable experience having fewer abilities to chose from. With skill points being a limited resource, using any that doesn't provide a tangible benefit feels like a waste. Such as having a power you can't use anymore because you're out of slots. Especially since at least one of the eight slots pretty much HAD to be taken up by Mark of the Rift. Edit: if you absolutely HAVE to limit the number of powers, increase the number of passive skills available. Or be able to sink more points into an active power to further improve it, like Deus Ex. Sure on the general I think I can agree with you. But it also didn't work that way for me when it came to Inquisition, at least for my canon Inquisitor. She always had points left over in the build which I just ended up dumping into random passives. Now as far as the general is concerned I think Bio could go about doing this a couple of ways and a couple of things they could try based on everything else people are doing. From AC Od their skill trees weren't limbered to anything else. You could spend your skill points whereever you wanted in the tree you didn't have to buy a previous skill to unlock it. And this went tree to tree you didn't have to spend a single point in the Assassin tree and then spend for a top tier points for a top tier ability. And from AC in general granted maybe not what you were talking about maybe but then they have the system where if you max out your skill trees you get more points you can just start dumping into your stats. Similar to that though I have wondered, just myself, if BioWare gives us the ability to control our attribute points again then I think maybe as an option or maybe like the above case if you get extra points and do not want to spend them on an ability...you can chose to spend it on an attribute instead. And the one I think I am more in favor of though then at least two two above is that fewer abilities but more evolutions, borrow a page from MEs book. Have different evolutions. Maybe it won't work for mages since mages probably will have the need and desire for a lot of abilities but I can see it working. Have like a 'throwing knife' that you can then pick and choose wat you do, maybe add more bleeding, maybe add an ability to have the player charge. Fewer things for the button prompts at least starting, but more overall variety. The eight ability limit is fine. While it may not sound realisic it is all about balancing the experience. Not just between consoles and PC players but just in general and even for PC players in general. Origins was incredibly clunky and boring and the enemies were far too grindy because the ability limits were non existant in some versions. Hence, it was a much more enjoyable experience having fewer abilities to chose from.
Butchering the DA:O - DA2 combat mechanic and replaced with 8 ability points in DA:I is not fine. I liked the combat AI scripts available in the first two. Had a grand 'ole time with the feature. Also had tons of mage spells available to me. DA:I combat mechanic was castrated for some reaon(s).
Mage class is the easiest to play (for me anyway). Thus I'm very biased when I'm hampered by crappy mage combat implementations.
Just adding a counter point....... (◔‿◔)
_____________________
Well I will heartily and respectfully disagree with that. Now I suppose in some ways its a system which shouldn't work...and in comparison to a lot of the games that have come after it (Witcher, Andromeda, both the ACs,) it doesen't...but I just really did not like the Origins combat system. So super clunky and just was so easy to mock on just how bad it was along with the music that was. And while it could get easier if you crawl around in the menus and set up tactics that is game design I never liked. I want tactics to be moment to moment decisions on the field, not crawling around in menus for half an hour at a time to tell the AI what to do. DA 2 was a lot better but still way too many enemies in each combat encounter and Inquisition's was comparatively a lot better. They still have a lot to improve on and it will be curious to see which combat systems they borrow from when it comes to 4 and how they graft it into the strong foundations Inquisition has left them and it will be curious to see if they bring back some of the stuff from Origins... But I guess the big thing I want combat to depended on my skill (or lack there of) and just not random dice rolls be they obvious ones or behind the scenes.
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Post by Deleted on May 3, 2022 4:06:00 GMT
...but I just really did not like the Origins combat system. So super clunky and just was so easy to mock on just how bad it was along with the music that was. And while it could get easier if you crawl around in the menus and set up tactics that is game design I never liked. I want tactics to be moment to moment decisions on the field, not crawling around in menus for half an hour at a time to tell the AI what to do. I honestly have no idea what you are talking about. I snipped the rambling that came beforehand, that was incomprehensible. DA:O tactics were perfect. You specified a behavior, the NPC followed that behavior. If you invested in their tactics, you could further that management, but it was entirely set it and forget it. The tactics for these players never change, only evolve as I choose (or not) to invest in them. It is not an ongoing process of endless tweaking, unless you are bad at math and just can't figure out what you're doing. There's no shame in that, but don't blame the system for being broken. If your complaint stopped at having to spend time once to set things up, I would have still disagreed but given you validity. Your post just doesn't ring true of someone that has actually understood and used tactics properly, sorry.
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Post by smilesja on May 3, 2022 16:51:13 GMT
Honestly the system felt clunky especially when it came to targeting. Yesterday, I had a tough time getting my warrior in position, Dragon Age 2 and DA: I did a better job with the tactics and yeah the constant management of tactics especially if you wanted an ability for yourself or your companion can feel tedious at times. It doesn't help on Origins and 2 you have a hard positioning your group constantly which often leads to friendly fire.
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Post by themikefest on May 3, 2022 17:15:22 GMT
(Though I'd prefer no 'choose any profile and any power' option though. I want the option to not be a mage and Andromeda didn't let me not be a biotic. You could be a sucky biotic and choose no biotic abilities but you still were one.) If you never put any points in the biotics area, you weren't a biotic. It's only when you start pointing points there that you are, like shields being replaced with barriers. Look at t'soni. If I don't put any points into her talents, does that mean she isn't a biotic? And yes, I did that for one playthrough.
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Post by necrowaif on May 3, 2022 18:28:52 GMT
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Post by Sharable Horizon on May 3, 2022 19:10:18 GMT
...but I just really did not like the Origins combat system. So super clunky and just was so easy to mock on just how bad it was along with the music that was. And while it could get easier if you crawl around in the menus and set up tactics that is game design I never liked. I want tactics to be moment to moment decisions on the field, not crawling around in menus for half an hour at a time to tell the AI what to do. I honestly have no idea what you are talking about. I snipped the rambling that came beforehand, that was incomprehensible. DA:O tactics were perfect. You specified a behavior, the NPC followed that behavior. If you invested in their tactics, you could further that management, but it was entirely set it and forget it. The tactics for these players never change, only evolve as I choose (or not) to invest in them. It is not an ongoing process of endless tweaking, unless you are bad at math and just can't figure out what you're doing. There's no shame in that, but don't blame the system for being broken. If your complaint stopped at having to spend time once to set things up, I would have still disagreed but given you validity. Your post just doesn't ring true of someone that has actually understood and used tactics properly, sorry. Yo! Just a heads up. Did you realise you could state your opinion without sounding like a total asshole? Just wondering. Because at this point, no matter how valid you think your points are, your particular brand of “IMMA GUN TELL IT REALZ” is in danger of sounding very dated by BSN/internet edge lord standards and also quite eye rollingly familiar to a few other Alt accounts from the past. Might want to mix it up a bit me old son.
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Sharable Horizon
N3
Lvl 31 Rogue God Emperor
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem
Posts: 600 Likes: 1,969
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Sharable Horizon
Lvl 31 Rogue God Emperor
600
December 2016
sharablehorizon
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem
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Post by Sharable Horizon on May 3, 2022 19:23:18 GMT
If you never put any points in the biotics area, you weren't a biotic. It's only when you start pointing points there that you are, like shields being replaced with barriers. Look at t'soni. If I don't put any points into her talents, does that mean she isn't a biotic? And yes, I did that for one playthrough. Nope, because all asari are biotic from birth. Whereas with Ryder, you actually get dialogue that relates to them being biotic or not. For example during the Asari ark mission, when Cora experiences extreme pain from the device, Ryders dialogue changes depending on whether you have points in biotics (from Ryder asking Cora what’s wrong/ too experiencing the same discomfort.) Plus Jaal’s dialogue changing if your also a biotic.
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