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Post by Beerfish on Sept 18, 2020 14:41:20 GMT
Ah, the age old question. Why is Harding so popular again? I ask in earnest - She has cute freckles - She has a calming voice - She is a bit of a bad ass, she scouts all that bad places before hand. - She has cute freckles. - She doesn't like Leliana - Did I mention She has cute freckles?
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Post by alanc9 on Sept 18, 2020 14:56:06 GMT
Also, what was that GoT line... "men want what they haven't had," right? We haven't had a female dwarf as an actual party member since Dorna Trapspringer, and Bio's never done a dwarf LI.
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Post by Nightscrawl on Sept 18, 2020 16:26:16 GMT
Also, what was that GoT line... "men want what they haven't had," right? We haven't had a female dwarf as an actual party member since Dorna Trapspringer, and Bio's never done a dwarf LI. Sigrun...
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Post by Deleted on Sept 18, 2020 16:45:40 GMT
Good grief …
I'd say a non-trivial number of women I've dated … know, associate with and hang out with each other.
No big fights because someone I dated and broke up with (and yes, that includes sex), bumps into someone I'm currently dating. Holy farkin' cow. It doesn't require hand waving or ignoring … people date multiple people (shocking, I know) before perhaps finding "the one" … if they ever do.
The flirtation one of my inkys had with Harding (and only Harding in that run) … sadly went nowhere, other than a slight extension in JoH … I don't expect it to be any kind of issue in DA4 if inky shows up and the DA4 protag has Harding as an LI.
Not because of some degraded lack of carryover of consequences on the part of BioWare … but because if inky and the DA4 protag are adults and not infantile middle schoolers, they will … deal with it.
Yeesh.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 18, 2020 16:54:35 GMT
Most likely BioWare will just act like Lace and Inquisitor dating never happened.
Maybe they broke up.
Maybe they went out a few times but it was never a serious romance.
Maybe they have an open relationship.
Maybe the Inquistor is dead by the time DA4 starts.
Maybe it was just rumors and it never happened.
Maybe Harding won't be a romance character or even in the game at all. The first three should have been up to the player not forced on them. Remember the justified outrage with Jacob in ME3? Only being dead is a different way BioWare would fuck over the players. There are scenes that confirm it so not just rumors. Possibly, but with how much BioWare fawns over her and wants everyone to feel the same way I doubt it.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 18, 2020 16:56:51 GMT
And yet Trespasser literally has Vivienne and Inquisitor comment how they and Harding were dating. Faith in DA4 respecting player choice from DAI continuing to dwindle. Never saw that clip. Thanks. Not all dating relationships actually go anywhere. OTOH, they could lock Harding out in such cases. You'd have to use the Keep to have the romance even import, right? It's not like a player can reduce the open romances without doing it deliberately before game start. I suppose there will be a fair number of people who go into DA4 unspoiled WRT romances, but what percentage of them are going to set the Inquisitor up with Harding? But yeah, it's unlikely that this is going to make it into the Keep. You're welcome. Again, that should be up to the player. If not, what other things are they going to force?
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Post by gervaise21 on Sept 18, 2020 17:06:12 GMT
Ah, the age old question. Why is Harding so popular again? I ask in earnest - She has cute freckles - She has a calming voice - She is a bit of a bad ass, she scouts all that bad places before hand. - She has cute freckles. - She doesn't like Leliana - Did I mention She has cute freckles?
Don't forget her sense of humour over our continual quest for elfroot. Also she is sensitive to other people's feelings and apologises if she says something out of place, e.g. to Lavellan in the Emerald Graves.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 18, 2020 17:06:49 GMT
There is a HUGE difference between a character who was an official romance and one who you could just flirt a bit with. Comparing them is a total fallacy.
Jacob was an official romance; had a romance subplot; and unlocked the romance achievement. Plus, the PC is literally the SAME person in ME2 & ME 3. It’s not two different PCs.
Harding had a few flirt lines; the Inquisitor has a single optional line where they went on a single off-screen date; she doesn’t unlock the romance achievement; and she’s not in the keep as a love interest for the inquisitor. Plus this is two completely different PCs.
It boggles my mind that people can think that these are comparable scenarios. That sounds to me like people who are absolutely determined to be a victim when DA4 comes out. Never change, BSN, never change.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 18, 2020 17:12:41 GMT
Ah, the age old question. Why is Harding so popular again? I ask in earnest For me, it’s a combination of things; 1.) We’ve yet to have a dwarf love interest and I’m a huge dwarf fan, so it would be great to have one in DA4. 2.) She was cute; short, freckles, gingery hair, scarred face because she’s also a badass. 3.) She’s also a badass; she is tough and capable 4.) But she also seems kind and compassionate. I’d be interested in seeing how she reconciles those aspects. 5.) I’d like to learn more about her. She’s a Ferelden surface dwarf shepherd turned scoutmaster for the Inquisition. It’s an interesting story. And the LIs tend to get the lion’s share of backstory. Is she the MOST interesting character from DA4? No way. If that were the criteria then I’d be asking for Vivienne because, love HER or hate her, no one can say that’s she’s not interesting. Harding’s a little vanilla but I don’t mind that. ETA: oh, she’s bisexual, which is great because I typically don’t play any straight characters and only do one female playthrough so I typically only get to romance a female character if she’s into ladies. I’ve romanced Leliana, Isabela, & Vetra. And what do they all have in common (other than being awesome)? Into ladies.
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Post by Cyberstrike on Sept 18, 2020 17:18:39 GMT
Maybe they broke up.
Maybe they went out a few times but it was never a serious romance.
Maybe they have an open relationship.
Maybe the Inquistor is dead by the time DA4 starts.
Maybe it was just rumors and it never happened.
Maybe Harding won't be a romance character or even in the game at all. The first three should have been up to the player not forced on them. Remember the justified outrage with Jacob in ME3? Only being dead is a different way BioWare would fuck over the players. There are scenes that confirm it so not just rumors. Possibly, but with how much BioWare fawns over her and wants everyone to feel the same way I doubt it.
Then why were non romanced Inquisitors forced into a romance with her anyway? And not given a choice with other characters like Vivienne, Cole, Varric, Dagna or the bartender?
Since all my Inquisitors wound up with Josie or married to Sera, and that they never dated Harding so why should I be denied a dwarven LI with a character that I already like?
So-called "player choices" are becoming a burden for the series they need to a 20-40 year time jump to get rid of that stuff and make DA4 a jumping on for new players or for players like me who are sick of all the damn continuity and "player choices" or a jumping off point for players who don't like the direction it's going in.
I romanced with Jacob and that Shepard as evil bitch (honestly what Kaiden and Jacob ever saw in her is beyond me).
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 18, 2020 17:24:46 GMT
The first three should have been up to the player not forced on them. Remember the justified outrage with Jacob in ME3? Only being dead is a different way BioWare would fuck over the players. There are scenes that confirm it so not just rumors. Possibly, but with how much BioWare fawns over her and wants everyone to feel the same way I doubt it.
Then why were non romanced Inquisitors forced into a romance with her anyway? And not given a choice with other characters like Vivienne, Cole, Varric, Dagna or the bartender?
Since all my Inquisitors wound up with Josie or married to Sera, and that they never dated Harding so why should I be denied a dwarven LI with a character that I already like?
So-called "player choices" are becoming a burden for the series they need to a 20-40 year time jump to get rid of that stuff and make DA4 a jumping on for new players or for players like me who are sick of all the damn continuity and "player choices" or a jumping off point for players who don't like the direction it's going in.
I romanced with Jacob and that Shepard as evil bitch (honestly what Kaiden and Jacob ever saw in her is beyond me).
Non-romanced Inquisitors aren’t forced into a relationship with her. Because other players already romances Harding. Same reason why people couldn’t romance Leliana in DAI. If they did that Harding wouldn’t be an option anyway. Meanwhile losing what makes BioWare unique.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 18, 2020 17:30:08 GMT
Nobody ‘romanced’ Harding. At most, some inquisitors flirted with her. Per the devs.
It’s no different than a previous flirt option (like Isabela or Cullen) being a full romance for a different PC in a later game.
The only people who will feel like their decisions aren’t being respected are people who ignored all of the signs that she’s not a romance option and head-cannoned themselves into thinking that an optional off-screen date was a full romance. And that’s on them. BioWare can’t be expected to account for head canon.
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Post by cuthbertbeckett on Sept 18, 2020 17:33:04 GMT
Non-romanced Inquisitors aren’t forced into a relationship with her. Because other players already romances Harding. Same reason why people couldn’t romance Leliana in DAI. If they did that Harding wouldn’t be an option anyway. Meanwhile losing what makes BioWare unique. Why is this a discussion again? Bioware said like we all (except you and few other people) already suspected that Harding was just a flirt in DAI but not a real romance.
l
Also with your unique point of view Bioware already broke this "rule" with Cullen. But hey i imagine that this doesn´t count.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 18, 2020 17:36:02 GMT
Nobody ‘romanced’ Harding. At most, some inquisitors flirted with her. Per the devs. It’s no different than a previous flirt option (like Isabela or Cullen) being a full romance for a different PC in a later game. The only people who will feel like their decisions aren’t being respected are people who ignored all of the signs that she’s not a romance option and head-cannoned themselves into thinking that an optional off-screen date was a full romance. And that’s on them. BioWare can’t be expected to account for head canon. Last I checked, Cullen and Isabela didn’t have comments on their being in a relationship. And again, what other things in other romances are they going to force on the players? After all those details are just “headcanon” too right? Will Sera dump Inky for Dagna? Will Josephine get married and have kids with someone else? Will Dorian end his relationship with a Skype crystal text message? Will Iron Bull decide he’s been exclusive long enough? And so on.
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Post by alanc9 on Sept 18, 2020 17:36:33 GMT
Also, what was that GoT line... "men want what they haven't had," right? We haven't had a female dwarf as an actual party member since Dorna Trapspringer, and Bio's never done a dwarf LI. Sigrun... Whoops! Quite right. LI thing still stands -- I actually ship Sigrun and one of my Wardens, but I don't pretend it's canon. Concerning that convo with Vivienne, I wonder if maybe the Inquisitor is supposed to be lying about having an actual date. That reply seemed a little off.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 18, 2020 17:38:07 GMT
Non-romanced Inquisitors aren’t forced into a relationship with her. Because other players already romances Harding. Same reason why people couldn’t romance Leliana in DAI. If they did that Harding wouldn’t be an option anyway. Meanwhile losing what makes BioWare unique. Why is this a discussion again? Bioware said like we all (except you and few other people) already suspected that Harding was just a flirt in DAI but not a real romance.
l
Also with your unique point of view Bioware already broke this "rule" with Cullen. But hey i imagine that this doesn´t count. Show me where it is stated the Warden and Cullen were ever in a relationship. You cannot, for it does not exist.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 18, 2020 17:39:10 GMT
Whoops! Quite right. LI thing still stands -- I actually ship Sigrun and one of my Wardens, but I don't pretend it's canon. Concerning that convo with Vivienne, I wonder if maybe the Inquisitor is supposed to be lying about having an actual date. That reply seemed a little off. Why would they lie? What purpose does it serve?
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Post by gervaise21 on Sept 18, 2020 17:39:54 GMT
Because other players already romances Harding. Same reason why people couldn’t romance Leliana in DAI. It's not the same. Leliana was in a full romance with the Warden in the main game in DAO. Harding is a couple of lines in two DLCs. There is no comparison there. If Harding is in DA4 as a companion or even as an advisor role, that should not preclude her from being a romance option just because she had a very short relationship (one date) with the Inquisitor. As others have said, on the whole people do have dates with different people before they settle on one for a longer relationship, so why shouldn't Harding be the same? This would not be a case of ignoring player choices in DAI because you couldn't even romance her in DAI but the later DLC, which many people didn't even play and would not even be aware that Lace was an option there. Now if they brought back Dorian as a companion or advisor and then had him cheat on the Inquisitor, that would be a big deal.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 18, 2020 17:41:49 GMT
Nobody ‘romanced’ Harding. At most, some inquisitors flirted with her. Per the devs. It’s no different than a previous flirt option (like Isabela or Cullen) being a full romance for a different PC in a later game. The only people who will feel like their decisions aren’t being respected are people who ignored all of the signs that she’s not a romance option and head-cannoned themselves into thinking that an optional off-screen date was a full romance. And that’s on them. BioWare can’t be expected to account for head canon. Last I checked, Cullen and Isabela didn’t have comments on their being in a relationship. And again, what other things in other romances are they going to force on the players? After all those details are just “headcanon” too right? Will Sera dump Inky for Dagna? Will Josephine get married and have kids with someone else? Will Dorian end his relationship with a Skype crystal text message? Will Iron Bull decide he’s been exclusive long enough? And so on. Last I checked, BioWare has confirmed that you are wrong. Harding was never presented as a romance option. She didn’t unlock the achievement and she’s not in the keep. If someone took a single optional line and turned it into a full-blown romance, then that’s their own fault. And BioWare isn’t obligated to account for head canon. Stop using fallacies please. Your slope is so slippery that’s it’s not functional. None of the examples that you mentioned are the same thing. Although I suspect you know that already, in which case, just stop.
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Post by Gwydden on Sept 18, 2020 17:45:48 GMT
Show me where it is stated the Warden and Cullen were ever in a relationship. You cannot, for it does not exist. There's a massive gap between flirting and going on a date on one side and a relationship on the other. I realize failure states are rare in video game romances, but realistically most first dates go nowhere and flirting is no guarantee that two people will hook up.
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Post by cuthbertbeckett on Sept 18, 2020 17:46:20 GMT
Show me where it is stated the Warden and Cullen were ever in a relationship. You cannot, for it does not exist. Of course Cullen and the Warden aren´t really in a relationship that is the point. Its just a flirt nothing more nothing less. The same goes for Harding. I don´t get it why you want make a big deal out of this every time. Bioware / Patrick Weekes already confirmed that was just a flirt jeez (unlike Tallis who was also a flirt) there wasn´t even a kiss.
The truth is you don´t like Harding and really don´t want as companion and Love interest. That´s totally fine but doesn´t change the fact that Harding is just a flirt. By the way facts within the Dragon Age are made by Bioware staff and not from us.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 18, 2020 17:46:24 GMT
Because other players already romances Harding. Same reason why people couldn’t romance Leliana in DAI. It's not the same. Leliana was in a full romance with the Warden in the main game in DAO. Harding is a couple of lines in two DLCs. There is no comparison there. If Harding is in DA4 as a companion or even as an advisor role, that should not preclude her from being a romance option just because she had a very short relationship (one date) with the Inquisitor. As others have said, on the whole people do have dates with different people before they settle on one for a longer relationship, so why shouldn't Harding be the same? This would not be a case of ignoring player choices in DAI because you couldn't even romance her in DAI but the later DLC, which many people didn't even play and would not even be aware that Lace was an option there. Now if they brought back Dorian as a companion or advisor and then had him cheat on the Inquisitor, that would be a big deal. And as I said, them breaking up should have been up to the player. Unless Harding is just a bitch. Ah, so it's just another way Trespasser says fuck you to the players. That actually makes sense, considering what else from that DLC they are ignoring. Good to know nothing in that DLC will be honored because "well most people didn't play it." Last I checked, Cullen and Isabela didn’t have comments on their being in a relationship. And again, what other things in other romances are they going to force on the players? After all those details are just “headcanon” too right? Will Sera dump Inky for Dagna? Will Josephine get married and have kids with someone else? Will Dorian end his relationship with a Skype crystal text message? Will Iron Bull decide he’s been exclusive long enough? And so on. Last I checked, BioWare has confirmed that you are wrong. Harding was never presented as a romance option. If someone took a single optional line and turned it into a full-blown romance, then that’s their own fault. And BioWare isn’t obligated to account for head canon. Stop using fallacies please. Your slope is so slippery that’s it’s not functional. None of the examples that you mentioned are the same thing. Although I suspect you know that already, in which case, just stop. No, Patrick said I was wrong. And yet I have actual evidence on my side that refutes his words. Why aren't they? You said they don't have to respect player headcanon. Well, anything after the game is headcanon right? I remember that argument being used before, for example in defense of the bastardization of characters like Revan and Hawke. Show me where it is stated the Warden and Cullen were ever in a relationship. You cannot, for it does not exist. There's a massive gap between flirting and going on a date on one side and a relationship on the other. I realize failure states are rare in video game romances, but realistically most first dates go nowhere and flirting is no guarantee that two people will hook up. I don't see a massive gap. Also considering their relationship has been going on for two and a half years, that's more than just a first date. Show me where it is stated the Warden and Cullen were ever in a relationship. You cannot, for it does not exist. Of course Cullen and the Warden aren´t really in a relationship that is the point. Its just a flirt nothing more nothing less. The same goes for Harding. I don´t get it why you want make a big deal out of this every time. Bioware / Patrick Weekes already confirmed that was just a flirt jeez (unlike Tallis who was also a flirt) there wasn´t even a kiss. The truth is you don´t like Harding and really don´t want as companion and Love interest. That´s totally fine but doesn´t change the fact that Harding is just a flirt. By the way facts within the Dragon Age are made by Bioware staff and not from us. So you have no point. Got it. This has nothing to do with my opinion of Harding. What it does have to do is Bioware ignoring player choice, and many of you being seemingly perfectly fine with getting fucked over as ling as you get to fuck something else.
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Post by gervaise21 on Sept 18, 2020 17:51:48 GMT
Bioware said like we all (except you and few other people) already suspected that Harding was just a flirt in DAI but not a real romance. Can someone explain how that video clip is meant to be showing the Scout Harding romance? So far as I can tell I had everyone of those conversations with her and I was in a relationship with Dorian or Cassandra at the time, so does that make me a cheater? No, just someone who had a good friendship with Lace.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 18, 2020 17:52:37 GMT
It’s pointless to argue with someone who refuses to use facts. When you are literally the ONLY person in a conversation who is arguing something and everyone is telling you are wrong, including the head writer of the series, then you need to take a step back, take a deep breath, and listen. If you can’t see that you are wrong here, then what’s the point in this discussion.
You don’t have to LIKE the idea. But your argument as to why it shouldn’t happen is wrong. There are characters that I have no interest in seeing in DA4. But that’s all that is — my opinion. I can’t get mad at BioWare for not respecting my head canon.
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Post by cuthbertbeckett on Sept 18, 2020 17:54:06 GMT
And as I said, them breaking up should have been up to the player. Unless Harding is just a bitch. Ah, so it's just another way Trespasser says fuck you to the players. That actually makes sense, considering what else from that DLC they are ignoring. Good to know nothing in that DLC will be honored because "well most people didn't play it." No they were at no time in DAI and Trespasser together as couple. It´s just a flirt with no consequences. So what you are saying is that you know it better than Lead Writer? I think i get it we all are wrong but only you is right.
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