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Post by SirSourpuss on Sept 3, 2019 16:34:24 GMT
There is no canon within the games themselves, outside of a basic outline and even that does not in its entirety. Everything after the SM is non canon, even the entirety of ME3 is non canon. The books and comic books exist outside the games.
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Hope for the best, plan for the worst
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Post by griffith82 on Sept 3, 2019 16:42:05 GMT
There is no canon within the games themselves, outside of a basic outline and even that does not in its entirety. Everything after the SM is non canon, even the entirety of ME3 is non canon. The books and comic books exist outside the games. Wrong.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 3, 2019 16:48:48 GMT
Well, except the creators sayig it never happened They've stated that Kelly is asexual and has never had sex with anyone? The writer on the old BSN answered saying that the romance was left ambiguous so that players could have the kind of relationship with her they wanted. That was part of why there wasn’t a dinner scene. BioWare has done that with a few romances now, like Suvi in MEA and especially Josephine in DAI (with her they went one further and even said seeing her as a character not just the relationship as Ace/Demi was a valid interpretation).
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Post by SirSourpuss on Sept 3, 2019 16:53:33 GMT
So Shepard dying at the end of the SM in ME2 is non canon?
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Post by SirSourpuss on Sept 3, 2019 16:55:51 GMT
the romance was left ambiguous So asexual Kelly is not canon and open to interpretation. Which is fine, so don't get upset over not everyone subscribing to that.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 3, 2019 16:58:39 GMT
the romance was left ambiguous So asexual Kelly is not canon and open to interpretation. Which is fine, so don't get upset over not everyone subscribing to that. I don’t see myself ever making that assertion. Someone else did by putting words in my mouth. All I said was the relationship can be like that and how there was no evidence she was like how you and others were saying, both true statements.
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Post by SirSourpuss on Sept 3, 2019 17:05:43 GMT
I don’t see myself ever making that assertion So why stir up all this fush over what two-three people that don't subscribe to your opinion think? Fuck 'em. And I'm one of those two-three people. Tell me to go fuck myself, I'd absolutely love you, if you did. Say it, get it out of your system.
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Post by alanc9 on Sept 3, 2019 17:18:35 GMT
Jeez... what are you two even talking about?
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Post by griffith82 on Sept 3, 2019 19:10:47 GMT
So Shepard dying at the end of the SM in ME2 is non canon? Correct.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Sept 3, 2019 21:46:04 GMT
Jeez... what are you two even talking about? They're talking about if Kelly and Shep banged.... OK. 😉
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Post by SirSourpuss on Sept 4, 2019 12:17:28 GMT
So Shepard dying at the end of the SM in ME2 is non canon? Correct. So Shepard dying in ME3 should also be considered non canon.
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N5
Dr Obfuscate
Don't knock the little winds. They're important - for morale.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
Origin: correctamundo1
Prime Posts: A thousand and then some.
Prime Likes: They never liked me! No one likes me!
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Don't knock the little winds. They're important - for morale.
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correctamundo
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
correctamundo1
A thousand and then some.
They never liked me! No one likes me!
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Post by correctamundo on Sept 4, 2019 13:16:23 GMT
So Shepard dying in ME3 should also be considered non canon. Nope.
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Post by SirSourpuss on Sept 4, 2019 13:40:35 GMT
So Shepard dying in ME3 should also be considered non canon. Nope. Why not? Why are you invalidating people's choice in ME2 over one criteria and not the other over the same criteria?
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correctamundo
N5
Dr Obfuscate
Don't knock the little winds. They're important - for morale.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
Origin: correctamundo1
Prime Posts: A thousand and then some.
Prime Likes: They never liked me! No one likes me!
Posts: 2,830 Likes: 5,270
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Don't knock the little winds. They're important - for morale.
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August 2016
correctamundo
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
correctamundo1
A thousand and then some.
They never liked me! No one likes me!
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Post by correctamundo on Sept 4, 2019 14:11:16 GMT
Why not? Why are you invalidating people's choice in ME2 over one criteria and not the other over the same criteria? I ran the BO test.
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Post by SirSourpuss on Sept 4, 2019 14:24:01 GMT
So we run it post ME3 ending again, then. I don't see the problem.
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Post by alanc9 on Sept 4, 2019 14:41:24 GMT
I don't see how Shepard dying in ME2 is any more or less canon than anything else which can happen in the games. In those timelines ME3 doesn't happen -- not even Refuse, since Liara never gets off Mars. So what?
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Post by SirSourpuss on Sept 4, 2019 15:03:13 GMT
Well, the problem is that Bioware claimed to respect player choice, but didn't respect the dead Shepard choice of ME2 in ME3.
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Post by griffith82 on Sept 4, 2019 16:05:49 GMT
Well, the problem is that Bioware claimed to respect player choice, but didn't respect the dead Shepard choice of ME2 in ME3. Because that was the fail ending. Like refuse is in me3.
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Post by SirSourpuss on Sept 4, 2019 16:11:18 GMT
Because that was the fail ending. Like refuse is in me3. So what stops Control, Synthesis and Destroy from being fail endings?
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Post by alanc9 on Sept 4, 2019 17:48:22 GMT
Well, the problem is that Bioware claimed to respect player choice, but didn't respect the dead Shepard choice of ME2 in ME3. How didn't they repect it? Your character is dead, so naturally you can't import him to the sequel. I mean, it'd have been funny if you could, and the game just ends with the Reapers arriving and trashing Sol system. Could even do a cutscene on Mars with Liara dying and the last hope for this cycle dying with her. But that's a stupid thing to expect of Bio; the RoI just isn't there.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2019 18:02:36 GMT
Well, the problem is that Bioware claimed to respect player choice, but didn't respect the dead Shepard choice of ME2 in ME3. How didn't they repect it? Your character is dead, so naturally you can't import him to the sequel. I mean, it'd have been funny if you could, and the game just ends with the Reapers arriving and trashing Sol system. Could even do a cutscene on Mars with Liara dying and the last hope for this cycle dying with her. But that's a stupid thing to expect of Bio; the RoI just isn't there. Regardless, canon is what remains possible to have happened based on what path the story takes after that point. The story continuing with a living Shepard in ME3 made it impossible for ME2's dead Shepard ending to have happened. That ending is no longer canon. Any ending of the ME2 suicide mission remained possible BECAUSE Bioware accommodated the deaths of the other squad mates in ME3. IF X died, X(sub) took the place in the narrative.
It's not that nothing is canon... It's the reverse - Everything in the games is canon... until it becomes impossible to have happened that way by a future game. Then it becomes invalid.
The ME2 dead Shepard ending became invalid the moment ME3 released without any accommodation for that ending to remain possible. Had they, for example, allowed the import, Shepard's funeral to have taken place, and the player play through ME3 with a Shep(sub), that ending would not have been invalidated. It would have remained canon... just like all the other ME2 endings are still currently canon.
So let's make a course correction regarding the ME3 ending choices. ALL are currently canon. ME:A was released in such a way that all ME3 endings remain possible to have happened. However, the moment Bioware produces a sequel that does not accommodate in any way the non-selected endings, those endings become impossible to have happened... they become invalidated and are no longer canon to the series. It is impossible for a destroy ending to have happened if a subsequent game declares that the Reapers were synthesized. It's impossible for a synthesis ending to have happened if a subsequent game tells us the Reapers were annihilated, etc. Only what remains possible to have happened in the light of those subsequent events can remain as canon.
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Post by SirSourpuss on Sept 4, 2019 18:02:46 GMT
How didn't they repect it? Your character is dead, so naturally you can't import him to the sequel. So where's my non-Shepard sequel? Where's my non Shepard ME3?
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 4, 2019 18:10:24 GMT
How didn't they repect it? Your character is dead, so naturally you can't import him to the sequel. So where's my non-Shepard sequel? Where's my non Shepard ME3? ME3 was a hallucination the Shepards who die in ME2 experience as their life fades away. There, you have your sequel.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2019 18:21:49 GMT
Because that was the fail ending. Like refuse is in me3. So what stops Control, Synthesis and Destroy from being fail endings? Bioware moving forward with a sequel that makes it impossible for Shepard to have made such a choice would invalidate them as endings... taking them out of the canon for the MEU. Selecting one ending would invalidate the others. Writing a new ending would invalidate them all.
If Bioware is going to do that, my preference would be they invalidate all of the existing ones rather than pick one to not invalidate. My overall preference is what they did... moved to a new galaxy and wrote the franchise forward in such a way that none of ME3's endings became invalid. At this point, even though the timeline is 600 years after the Reaper War, all of Shepard's choices are still possible to have happened.
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Post by alanc9 on Sept 4, 2019 18:30:03 GMT
How didn't they repect it? Your character is dead, so naturally you can't import him to the sequel. So where's my non-Shepard sequel? Where's my non Shepard ME3? Am I supposed to take this seriously? It's hard to tell with you, sometimes.
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