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Post by gervaise21 on Nov 6, 2024 8:05:59 GMT
Even without Tevinter Nights, Trespasser set the stage for a banger of a game set on northern Thedas. A war everyone can see between Tevinter and the Qun, because even if they Ben-Hassrath said they didn't vouch for the Viddasala, they absolutely wanted to fuck up the south in one single move. Tevinter cities are being looted, citizens forced to become viddathari, mages lobotomized and we could have had Minrathous as a cornered rat. Meanwhile Varric/Harding/Charter, basically the Inquisition, are fighting a shadow war against Solas and his agents. Running against time to stop Solas and the Agents of the Dreadwolf who are disrupting things so the war will keep going and Varric's group cannot interfere with Solas' ritual. Maybe Solas didn't yet acquired his dagger in this scenario? Anyway, could have even thrown a slave uprising in Minrathous and we would be conflicted because the commotion would also help to mask Solas' and his agents' movements. Anyway, I say all of this because I cannot stop thinking about how there are no Agents of the Dread Wolf in Veilguard. How the war between Tevinter and the Qunari basically doesn't exist anymore and all of that. You are quite correct. Everything you list is what I was expecting DA4 to be. Yet DA2 had more depth to it and it was written and released in 18 months. Every other DA game had political intrigue going on that we had to navigate. However, it was already showing signs of slipping into cliche in DAI. Think of Florianne and Erimond. Also, the ridiculous time travel plot. That was totally out of place in the world they had originally set up. However, Champions of the Just was more in keeping with what came before. It showed at least something of the mind of Corypheus beyond just a cackling evil villain and it introduced Calpernia, who also had potential. Since you never actually see her dead, I thought they were setting her up to return in DA4, either as an antagonist or as an ally against her former faction. I even thought that perhaps the Viper would turn out to be her. Instead it was just a very generic good versus evil story and no real variation in outcomes except if you basically don't bother to get to know their generic band of heroes. I actually think the final epilogue screen that goes with that pretty much sums up the franchise. A tombstone
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Post by Liepsnele on Nov 6, 2024 8:16:31 GMT
Someone posted early companion concept art for Veilguard (there aren't any spoilers, it's just concept art of potential companions): www.reddit.com/r/dragonage/s/DYQM6pKMEr 2/3 of the companions were scrapped, the rest were re-done except for Harding. I guess the initial story Bioware had in mind was completely different than the end product. All that wasted potential makes me sad, at least the game was singe player in the end. although Imshael as acompanion would be a questionable choice ngl
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Post by fylimar on Nov 6, 2024 8:31:08 GMT
Someone posted early companion concept art for Veilguard (there aren't any spoilers, it's just concept art of potential companions): www.reddit.com/r/dragonage/s/DYQM6pKMEr 2/3 of the companions were scrapped, the rest were re-done except for Harding. I guess the initial story Bioware had in mind was completely different than the end product. All that wasted potential makes me sad, at least the game was singe player in the end. although Imshael as acompanion would be a questionable choice ngl This would have been so much better. Ishmael and Calpernia as companions would have made so much sense.
About Taash: I said it yesterday, I'm pretty ok with them being non binary, but try to make it fit into the world. I find it troublesome, that they did set up the most diverse companion as a character, most people don't like. They made Taash an abrasive childlike person, who wants recognition for themselves, but is constantly questionig companions for their life choices.
It is as if they wanted that character to fail somehow. Taash should be a fan favourite: badass qunari warrior with a unique touch, but the writing made that character a total train wreck - and as someone happy to see LGBTQ+ stuff in media well written (looking at Krem, Sera, Aylin and Isobel, Lucretious, Nocturne), I'm really sad that Taash turns out to be the biggest dissapointment. And yes, I can't believe this was an accident, sorry.
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Post by gervaise21 on Nov 6, 2024 8:36:46 GMT
I really don't care much for Weekes' writing tbh, it's why I dislike The Masked Empire. Solas is a good character, I get it, but I would have liked him more as the main villain. I don't know if you remember but PW admitted back in 2014 that Solas was originally meant to be more obviously shifty in DAI and that either PW or the team (not sure which) decided to introduce the romance in order to make him a more sympathetic villain but only after the game was delayed year, so allowed them the opportunity to do so. Whilst this possibly made for a more interesting villain in DA4, it did mean that the focus was very much on Solas and not always in a good way. Everything in the narrative really centred around Solas' memories and his regrets. When they said we would see the past in the Fade, I thought we would see actual scenes where we witnessed events. Instead, apart from the Ghil one, it was all shown through the murals and then sitting around discussing them with the team. The other evil gods and factions were just inconveniences that the team had to overcome in order to get to the next reveal about Solas.
Have I understood this wrong or was Solas responsible for everything evil that had happened to the world? I'm not sure but did he originally give them the knowledge how to create bodies from lyrium? Anyway, then he left the Fade and took on a body because Mythal asked him. Then he helped her make the Titans tranquil. This caused their mental and physical decay that resulted in the blight. So they sealed it away. Elgar'nan decided he wanted to become tyrant overlord of the elves. Why didn't Mythal and Solas just kill him with his dagger at that point if they were both against it? Or why didn't Solas just take that action on his own? Instead Mythal seemed to be in favour so long as she could rule alongside him. Solas disagreed and started his rebellion. The other gods found the blight (red lyrium?) and started using it. Solas told Mythal who tried to stop them but they killed her. So he locked them away which somehow resulted in the Veil, which was an unintended side effect. Still not clear how he accomplished that. If he was that powerful, surely he did have other options? Anyway, it drained him so much he needed to take a nap for several millennia. Then he woke up, messed up with Cory, lost his orb, so he killed Flemeth/Mythal instead in order to steal her power.
Anyway, based on how she is presented in DAV, it seems Flemeth was actually the hero in all this. Working with Mythal all those years. Nudging events in the direction she wanted them to take. Helping the Wardens against the Blight
I've one big problem though. When we see her in DAI, who was she planning on having vengeance against? Why would that confrontation shake the very heavens? That sounded like she wanted the Veil to come down, particularly as that would be a side-effect of killing her old enemies. So, what happened? Did Solas killing Flemeth change her outlook on life?
Once again, it all comes back to that very contrived scene with the ritual. If Solas had successfully transferred the gods to their new prison, Mythal would never have her heaven shaking confrontation with them. If Rook hadn't disturbed that ritual then Solas could never have brought down the Veil because it was quite clearly stated that if Elgar'nan died, Solas could complete his ritual to destroy the Veil. So long as there was a god alive, that couldn't happen. So, if Rook had just stood and watched at the beginning instead of intervening what then? The only way for the plot to work is for Solas to have set the whole thing up so Rook would interrupt the ritual and allow the gods to escape so they could be killed. Is that it? Or am I missing something?
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Post by gervaise21 on Nov 6, 2024 8:41:36 GMT
Someone posted early companion concept art for Veilguard (there aren't any spoilers, it's just concept art of potential companions): www.reddit.com/r/dragonage/s/DYQM6pKMEr 2/3 of the companions were scrapped, the rest were re-done except for Harding. I guess the initial story Bioware had in mind was completely different than the end product. All that wasted potential makes me sad, at least the game was singe player in the end. although Imshael as acompanion would be a questionable choice ngl That was the sort of companion line up I was expecting. They look awesome. I bet they would have been more interesting too. So that was what was lost because they dumped Joplin. It is like the loss of Exalted March all over again. How sad. No wonder so many of the original team left when it was dumped. Also: I was right. Calpernia was meant to be a companion. Imshael would at least have been a proper demon with his own agenda.
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Post by gervaise21 on Nov 6, 2024 8:52:48 GMT
Also about Lucanis Has it occurred to anyone else that Rook had the perfect opportunity to kill Spite when Spite takes them to the Fade? Instead, we help him get even closer to Lucanis.
And I thought Hawke was stupid. Nothing really makes sense in this game. Yes, that was the perfect opportunity to exorcise the demon. Rook was even told that early on. Instead they exorcise Lucanis' inner demons that have nothing to do with Spite. I couldn't understand why if Spite was so unhappy with their relationship he didn't either a) possess Lucanis completely or b. ask Rook to liberate him (assuming that there must be still some sort of binding in place which is why he can't just leave). Alternatively, show that Spite is no longer a demon but has transformed back into whatever spirit he was originally, I don't know, Loyalty or Honour or something that would make his continued mutually beneficial partnership with Lucanis believable.
Also, so far as I am aware, they never explained why Lucanis had supernatural powers in Tevinter Nights. He wasn't possessed then. So why did he have the sensitivity to magic, the enhanced hearing and an apparent command over the vengeance demons that they just went away when he ordered it? That was the most interesting and intriguing aspect of him. Had he been possessed by a spirit/demon then, that would have made sense.
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Post by Kappa Neko on Nov 6, 2024 8:54:14 GMT
Someone posted early companion concept art for Veilguard (there aren't any spoilers, it's just concept art of potential companions): www.reddit.com/r/dragonage/s/DYQM6pKMEr 2/3 of the companions were scrapped, the rest were re-done except for Harding. I guess the initial story Bioware had in mind was completely different than the end product. All that wasted potential makes me sad, at least the game was singe player in the end. although Imshael as acompanion would be a questionable choice ngl Wow, these characters all look great. What happened?? Did they fire everyone who knew how to design beautiful armor or what? Yesterday I received my first Lord Of Fortune armor and I had to laugh so hard how hideous it is. I have gone back to using the starter rags as transmog because in over 20h I have not found a single armor I didn't find ridiculous and ugly AF except the veiljumper light armor. But it's immersion breaking to run around like an elf as a LoF. How do you even fuck up pirates this badly? I want these companions and these outfits. I want to look at my companions and my Rook and not laugh out loud. It's like one of these fashion show absurdities nobody would ever wear in real life because most people wouldn't be able to properly move.
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Post by gervaise21 on Nov 6, 2024 9:01:40 GMT
I want these companions and these outfits. I want to look at my companions and my Rook and not laugh out loud. It's like one of these fashion show absurdities nobody would ever wear in real life because most people wouldn't be able to properly move. What is even more annoying is that they actually pretty much showed this line up in the 2020 Behind the Scenes video concept art. Remember all our speculation back then.
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Post by LawBringerSR2 on Nov 6, 2024 9:03:11 GMT
Someone posted early companion concept art for Veilguard (there aren't any spoilers, it's just concept art of potential companions): www.reddit.com/r/dragonage/s/DYQM6pKMEr 2/3 of the companions were scrapped, the rest were re-done except for Harding. I guess the initial story Bioware had in mind was completely different than the end product. All that wasted potential makes me sad, at least the game was singe player in the end. although Imshael as acompanion would be a questionable choice ngl Female two handed sword warrior and female Qunari warrior... what could have been. Wasted potential indeed
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Kamisama
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
Origin: helios969
Prime Posts: No Clue
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Post by helios969 on Nov 6, 2024 9:06:53 GMT
Well that didn't take long...precipitous drop to 10th on Steam. Dear EA, please just fire all the people at the top for this abomination and replace them with people interested in producing a game for dragon age fans, you know...mature dark fantasy filled with rich lore, realistic and interesting characters, and deep story telling. I guarantee you'll sell more copies than this crap.
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Post by witchcocktor on Nov 6, 2024 9:07:30 GMT
The dapper qunari spy has my heart. But concept art will always be concept art, and it's almost always superior to the final product because it's not necessarily dragged down by what the people working the actual final product can realistically do with the money and time they are given.
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emissaryoflies
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire
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Post by emissaryoflies on Nov 6, 2024 9:09:10 GMT
Wtf. Why didn’t we get those companions? Why not THAT kossith? Their fucking silhouettes have more charisma than the Dragon Age killers.
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Post by fylimar on Nov 6, 2024 9:13:04 GMT
Another thing that I find pretty questionable is the handling of Lucanis and Emmerich and their 'baggage'
Emmrich becoming a lich should be a big nono in the World of Thedas. I can't believe the reaction to that being the companions making good natured fun and Harding jsut apologizing for spoiling the news.
Lucanis having a frigging demon inside him: No one is bothered by that? None at all? Harding witnessed demons pouring out of the sky and destroying and killing everything in Ferelden - and no one is even fazed by that information?
I'm sorry, but this is just so stupid. Both of those characters could have set up a big controversy among the companions, but they are treated as if they have loveable quirks - a lich and a demon!
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Post by emissaryoflies on Nov 6, 2024 9:16:01 GMT
Well that didn't take long...precipitous drop to 10th on Steam. Dear EA, please just fire all the people at the top for this abomination and replace them with people interested in producing a game for dragon age fans, you know...mature dark fantasy filled with rich lore, realistic and interesting characters, and deep story telling. I guarantee you'll sell more copies than this crap. Not that it matters, but I can’t wait for it to win goty. And you know it will. It hasn’t even been a week yet. Can’t wait for the lies and spin to come out. ‘Gamers just weren’t ready for Veilguard’.
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Post by gervaise21 on Nov 6, 2024 9:16:17 GMT
The dapper qunari spy has my heart. But concept art will always be concept art, and it's almost always superior to the final product because it's not necessarily dragged down by what the people working the actual final product can realistically do with the money and time they are given. They had 4 years! If you look at concept art for earlier games you can see something of the original concept in what we finally get. Nothing was left of these characters. Why not? They pretty much managed to reproduce Harding okay. Would it really have been more difficult to reproduce the look of those characters than the ones the game finally got? It was a similar thing with the villains. There was lots of cool concept art for the Venatori/people from Tevinter originally and instead we got standard grey garbed, masked mobs with glowing red swords. Remember there were already Venatori in DAI. They looked better. So, they already had the designs and the technical expertise to do it. The game engine was still Frostbite, so there was no excuse.
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Post by gervaise21 on Nov 6, 2024 9:18:27 GMT
Another thing that I find pretty questionable is the handling of Lucanis and Emmerich and their 'baggage' I've already ranted about this. You are really flogging a dead horse. Accept it, they are no longer in the Thedas we knew. This is a completely new setting with the old names.
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Post by fylimar on Nov 6, 2024 9:23:44 GMT
Another thing that I find pretty questionable is the handling of Lucanis and Emmerich and their 'baggage' I've already ranted about this. You are really flogging a dead horse. Accept it, they are no longer in the Thedas we knew. This is a completely new setting with the old names. Yeah, I fear, you are right. I just ignore this game and pretend the series ended with DAi - which wasn't even a favourite game of mine, but compared to this one, it just did raise a lot in my personal ranking.
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...lives for biotic explosions. And cheesecake!
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Post by Kappa Neko on Nov 6, 2024 9:24:00 GMT
I need to progress faster in this game to partake in the full horror of the plot points and lore assassination...
Don't know why I'm even searching for all the treasure chests! Ugh.
I am having more fun now since the game opened up and the plotting is OKish so far. I mean, everything is so cliche but at least the story isn't as horribly as the companions...
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Post by LawBringerSR2 on Nov 6, 2024 9:30:07 GMT
I've already ranted about this. You are really flogging a dead horse. Accept it, they are no longer in the Thedas we knew. This is a completely new setting with the old names. Yeah, I fear, you are right. I just ignore this game and pretend the series ended with DAi - which wasn't even a favourite game of mine, but compared to this one, it just did raise a lot in my personal ranking. I've never been a huge fan of DA2 and DAI but DAV is making me see them in a much more positive light. I actually like DAI graphics/artistic direction so much better than DAV's cartoony aesthetics
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Post by witchcocktor on Nov 6, 2024 9:35:09 GMT
I need to progress faster in this game to partake in the full horror of the plot points and lore assassination... Don't know why I'm even searching for all the treasure chests! Ugh. I am having more fun now since the game opened up and the plotting is OKish so far. I mean, everything is so cliche but at least the story isn't as horribly as the companions... Yeah. I don't think the general main story beats are aggressively bad or anything, and when people said '' after 50 hours it gets interesting '' they were sort of right. The '' final mission '' (and the main story mission before it), which is actually a pretty long series of events and quests, kind of feels like what Trespasser is to Inquisition in many ways. But the companions remain dull, the writing is sanitized and the lore assassination is relentless regardless of the highs the main story accomplishes in it's final 5-10(ish) hours or so.
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Post by LawBringerSR2 on Nov 6, 2024 9:35:26 GMT
Well that didn't take long...precipitous drop to 10th on Steam. Dear EA, please just fire all the people at the top for this abomination and replace them with people interested in producing a game for dragon age fans, you know...mature dark fantasy filled with rich lore, realistic and interesting characters, and deep story telling. I guarantee you'll sell more copies than this crap. Not that it matters, but I can’t wait for it to win goty. And you know it will. It hasn’t even been a week yet. Can’t wait for the lies and spin to come out. ‘Gamers just weren’t ready for Veilguard’. Sucks that they'd give goty to DAV when there are other 2024 games far more deserving of that title, and they are games I don't even like that much personally
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Post by cribbian on Nov 6, 2024 9:36:41 GMT
Someone posted early companion concept art for Veilguard (there aren't any spoilers, it's just concept art of potential companions): www.reddit.com/r/dragonage/s/DYQM6pKMEr 2/3 of the companions were scrapped, the rest were re-done except for Harding. I guess the initial story Bioware had in mind was completely different than the end product. All that wasted potential makes me sad, at least the game was singe player in the end. although Imshael as acompanion would be a questionable choice ngl So this is what could have been, had Anthem not fucked everything up?
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Kamisama
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
Origin: helios969
Prime Posts: No Clue
Prime Likes: Who Cares
Posts: 2,178 Likes: 3,170
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Post by helios969 on Nov 6, 2024 9:36:44 GMT
Well that didn't take long...precipitous drop to 10th on Steam. Dear EA, please just fire all the people at the top for this abomination and replace them with people interested in producing a game for dragon age fans, you know...mature dark fantasy filled with rich lore, realistic and interesting characters, and deep story telling. I guarantee you'll sell more copies than this crap. Not that it matters, but I can’t wait for it to win goty. And you know it will. It hasn’t even been a week yet. Can’t wait for the lies and spin to come out. ‘Gamers just weren’t ready for Veilguard’. Ugh, kill me now. You're right though...especially since they've already blocked Black Myth which has sold like 25M copies in 2 months. I guess if you're going to eliminate all the competition...yeah, it's a shoe in. That's why the media has no credibility.
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Post by witchcocktor on Nov 6, 2024 9:50:05 GMT
Regarding an end game choice I still find it incredibly silly that you have to sacrifice either Davrin or Harding. It feels very forced, because the entire reason for this outcome seems to be so Rook can feel the weight of regret, while they are stuck in the fade prison Solas got out of and left Rook in after the sacrifice of Davrin/Harding, all in order to create this parallel between Solas and Rook. But that whole fade sequence was kind of a let down to begin with, as I feel like even Inquisition is better at handling the responsibility and burden of leadership.
And what's worse, is that Lucanis fails to get a hit on Ghilly AGAIN, gets trapped by her tentacles so Davrin or Harding needs to distract her and get impaled by her tentacles so that Lucanis is able to break free and finally land the hit, while Davrin/Harding die. Third times the charm I guess, but I thought it was laughable how amateurish they made Lucanis look, failing twice in a row.
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Post by Reznore on Nov 6, 2024 10:13:47 GMT
Regarding an end game choice I still find it incredibly silly that you have to sacrifice either Davrin or Harding. It feels very forced, because the entire reason for this outcome seems to be so Rook can feel the weight of regret, while they are stuck in the fade prison Solas got out of and left Rook in after the sacrifice of Davrin/Harding, all in order to create this parallel between Solas and Rook. But that whole fade sequence was kind of a let down to begin with, as I feel like even Inquisition is better at handling the responsibility and burden of leadership.
And what's worse, is that Lucanis fails to get a hit on Ghilly AGAIN, gets trapped by her tentacles so Davrin or Harding needs to distract her and get impaled by her tentacles so that Lucanis is able to break free and finally land the hit, while Davrin/Harding die. Third times the charm I guess, but I thought it was laughable how amateurish they made Lucanis look, failing twice in a row. Big spoiler for the end I'm romancing Harding, and If I ever manage to finish this game, she's a sacrifice i'm willing to make. I can't deal with Davrin death scene with Assan plunging into some abyss after him. Cannot deal. Nope. Do not want.
It seems the main romance scene happens after that boss fight, so yeah..my Rook is going to stare at a wall or a dead body.
There's no burden of leadership in this game, the world is ending and that's the team of "expert" (lol) you're given. I aren't no miracle worker.
There's no parallel between Solas and Rook. I've been hitting Solas is an asshole every chance i got and I got lectured by Morrigan about it. Poor Solas iuWU
Mythal taking responsability for Solas action makes me want to vomit. Yes you can redeem Solas because really poor baby not his fault, a woman forced him. Hate her, yeah. That woman who can get murdered 3 times already. What a bitch.
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