The Halla Enigma

The problem I have with the Knights' Tomb is that the Dalish in general don't seem to have been familiar with it but it does seem to have been used exclusively by the Emerald Knights. So if their order did start getting involved in some dodgy worship towards the end, possibly it was because they had discovered this ancient site and started being influenced by it. You will recall that there were elves involved in doing some illicit magic connected with the Sulevin blade and this also seemed associated with the time of the war with Orlais. I find it peculiar that the group associated with Red Crossing were buried in the tomb and left the record of what happened there, yet other members of the Emerald Knights, before and after, were buried out in the Emerald Graves and seemed unaware of what really happened as it was never passed on to the Keepers of the Lore, who were the priesthood of the Creators in the time of the Dales.   Either that or they chose to forget the information because of the bad associations that particular group of Emerald Knights had formed.

   No need if you just check out the DA Wiki there's a good screen capture there. google image search even suggests that someone has put together all the murals from Trespasser in one image so I may use that. I'll look at your other comments in-depth later. Thanks. 

     Well of course not! If I wanted to Joust, I would have posted in the Ostrich Conundrum.   

You could be right about this; these were possibly a remnant of Emerald Knights who made their last stand here, although it is rather convenient they are also the ones who provoked the war with the attack on Red Crossing. However, since they appear to feel some sense of shame over this, at least with respect to Elandrin, that could explain why the other Dalish were not aware of the details because this group vowed to keep it between them. We should also remember the mantra of the Dalish is "Never again will we submit." This would be particularly applicable to the Emerald Knights, so they would likely go down fighting rather than surrender.

So, by this reasoning, it is possible that the Din'an Hanin was considered a holy site by the Dalish but the likely presence of spirits within it may have made them reluctant to use it except during a time of extreme need. The wolf statue was likely an ancient one and it is possible they thought it an indication of an association with an earlier group of protectors in view of their own use of wolves. Which brings me back to my idea that it could have been the burial chamber for the Arcane Warriors of ancient times and this area generally was their main training ground and base of operations. Hence the giant wolf statue on the hilltop of the adjacent Exalted Plains (that clearly would have been called something else during the elven empire). If Fen'Harel was originally an Arcane Warrior who went rogue and led many of his fellow warriors in rebellion against their corrupt rulers, then this complex could have been associated with his followers and thus the Forgotten Ones as well.

The Dalish seem to have forgotten the close association the elves used to have with spirits, from which the most powerful ones likely derived much of their knowledge and power. If the Creators were really simply powerful leaders who gradually increased their status to that of gods, it could explain the Dalish equating the Forgotten Ones with godhood as well, through the simply assumption that only one set of gods would be capable of challenging another. Fen'Harel denied he was really a god or that the other Evanuris were and we know that Gelduran shared the latter sentiment, rejecting the right of the Evanuris to lord it over him. He speaks of claiming a power of his own after their downfall, which Fen'Harel managed to foil by locking the Forgotten Ones away as well.

Part of the association with godhood seems to have been the use of special sites where the faithful could petition the "god" for assistance. Gelduran mentions them building temples to lure the faithful with promises and, of course, we use such a site connected with Mythal in DAI. By making the correct invocation we can summon forth the god. Flemeth says she only came because she was curious to see who was summoning her, which would suggest that the "god" could resist the summons. Perhaps later they made the process another step removed by having their priesthood act as intermediaries. Still, if it was possible for the Creators to do this, maybe the Forgotten Ones did so as well, to offer favours to those who called on them and this helped feed into the idea of them being gods too. So BG may have not been associated with a specific god so much as being a place where any of the Forgotten Ones could be called upon (or alternatively one of the Creators specifically). Spirits in the vicinity would be familiar with the process, so might well respond to the specific ritual required.

If BG is not a Forgotten One, could he be June? There has been speculation that June may not have been an elf. Certainly the only image we have of him is this mosaic. I would also mention that according to Gelduran, June is also known for his fires. I think there is going to be some sort of reveal about June eventually because of that cryptic codex in DAI which says how little is known about him. What is that item before him? Is it an anvil (possible the original anvil of the void)? If that is the case, why does he appear to be holding his hands over it as though dipping them into it?  Notice how his face has white stones, possibly suggesting a mask. Ghilan'nain has something similar and whilst it could be to do with her connection with the halla, that are also white, the one she is riding is not. I wonder if this choice of colour for their faces is significant.

Another wild theory to throw out here.   Looking at the headdress on Sylaise, it looks very similar to the figure on the far right of the data mined mosaic I posted on the previous page.  There are also certain similarities between the inner halla horn and the image next to Fen'Harel in that mosaic, whilst at a pinch I can also see shades of the other figure on June, in which case is the sanctuary mosaic a reverse of the 4 at the far end of the Evanuris?      So could Solas' co-conspirators be Sylaise, June and Ghilan'nain?

I always wondered about Fen'Harel's sanctuary. Was it always his or did he take over it after it was long abandoned? In it, we see mosaics of him, Mythal, Falon'Din and Dirthamen. Could they have been working together up until and it was Falon'Din/Dirthamen have been the one to forewarn the other Evanuris of their plans? I am reminded of Flemeth's domain in the Fade she's under Dirthamen's statue with a sword in his back. Could symbolize betrayal? Either being betrayed or the betrayer Although it seems hard to believe they worked together considering Falon'Din tried to invade Mythal's lands and she had to rally the other gods to beat him.

I have a theory that Solas allied himself with the Forbidden Ones. It might explain why Imshael had that keystone and Gaxkang dropped the "Fade Wall" shield that has a wolf design on it. They both share the same enemy and while they may be dangerous they can still be defeated or bound, I'm also reminded of what Solas taught Sera about useful agents that liked causing chaos for its own sake: "move to a place where they can't do any harm or removed if necessary" I guess this is what Solas did to his more uncontrollable agents once they outlived their usefulness.

As for Dirthamens statue, I supposed it could be both since both are reflections of each other, unless there was a falling out between the 2 brothers.

Okay I just had an epiphany.

The Elven orb can create a bond between two living beings, as said by Solas. So I wonder if Dirthamen used said orb to send part of himself into another being - but the being was an empty vessel. So it was literally the same spirit of Dirthamen split into two vessels. And the purpose was to find knowledge hidden in The Void. However, the vessel that traveled slowly became corrupted and became unrecognizable - thus, Falon'din.

Though, it's possible they could still share knowledge somehow, and maybe that's where most of Dirthamen's secrets came from. If Falon'Din could go where Dirthamen couldn't, what secrets could Dirthamen possibly know that others didn't? How that specific relationship worked is still beyond me.

But I also think that relationship could explain the bond between Solas and his wolf. I'm going to come out and say Solas does not take up the entire Dread Wolf identity - and while he claims that he is not like Mythal, he may still be bonded to something - like an actual wolf. And to be honest, when Solas' Orb broke, I think that may have screwed up that connection. So now something has gotta give.

It could honestly just be a preference. Just like how Mythal seems to have a preference for dragons (though there may be something else going on with them). But for the sake of expanding this discussion....what if Solas made wolves? As in, wolves were his creation that he made in his Dread Wolf image. 

We always ascribe creature creation to Ghilan'nan, but it only stands to reason that other gods could theoretically be capable of something similar even if they never reach Ghil's level of skill. And it is entirely possible that Solas at least had some interest in artificial creatures back in the day if you believe that "Pride" (capital P) was referring to his own person in the Ascension of Ghilan'nan codex.

Alternately, we can theorize that wolves were yet another creation of Ghilan'nan--but were intentionally created to not be "too well-wrought" so that spirits can inhabit them easily and so magic can manipulate them. Something that spirits can inhabit to experience the material world in a different sense without having to either take a form themselves or possess a mortal. It might not have even been wolves per se, but the first werewolf strain. It always struck me as odd that were have werewolves...but not were-nugs, were-cows,were-lions and whatever else.

Are normal creatures magical constructs? I don't think so. Just as the halla are different from normal deer, I think a magical wolf would be different from a normal one. That is not to say that the original werewolves weren't the result of Ghilan'nain messing with nature.

I wonder if the Lady of the Forest has any relevance to this discussion or the magic used by Zathrian to bind her to his curse and the form of Witherfang. Once bound, the Lady/Witherfang was able to act independently of their creator but his existence was also bound to them. The Dalish elders subsequently condemned what he did as a crime against nature but that doesn't mean Zathrian hadn't uncovered some ancient magical ritual or been instructed in it by a demon. The Dalish do seem to have a prohibition against interaction with spirits that runs contrary to the relationship between elves and spirits in ancient times but, apart from the risk of possession, that could have something to do with Fen'Harel. You would only need one Keeper to come to a bad end through binding spirits, like the Mortalitasi in Tevinter Nights, for the word to get out. The Keepers certainly believe that Fen'Harel prowls the Fade and I think that is likely the result of an actual experience rather than just conjecture. Zathrian probably escaped his notice because he wasn't binding a spirit of the Fade but a spirit of the land, so Fen'Harel wasn't aware of it.

Speaking of The Sinner, I'm reminded of this entry in the last part of Solassan


I see some parallels, although I don't think The Sinner ended up in Solassan. Perhaps a similar fate happened to them where they were sealed?

I do wonder what Solas true name could be and why is it important? Does knowing his true name give you power over him like in some real life beliefs? 

Solas = Pride in Elvhen and Pride is the corruption of Wisdom when denied its purpose. "He didn't want a body, but he asked her to come" " He wanted to give Wisdom, not orders" its probably much more complex, but could serving Mythal have turned whatever Spirit he originally was into Solas?

I think the Qunari are out of their element. They fight an enemy they are incapable of fighting conventionally or conceptually. The Vidasalla, the main Qunari whose job is to fight magic, used unconventional, even treasonous methods to fight Solas, and wasted most of her efforts fighting the Inquisition.
Regarding Halla, there may have been proto Halla in the early days of Thedas, similar to proto horses in our own ancient history. Ghilan'nain might have modified these creatures for various purposes, some for war, some for pleasure (nice animals to look and hunt), and others as beasts of burden. The Halla that exists in modern times could only be a fraction of the diversity the animals may have once been.