illuminated11
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Post by illuminated11 on Sept 24, 2024 1:55:24 GMT
It's fair to say that Black bodies, much like hair styles, are often poorly represented in media, and BioWare has not always done well with POC representation. But that's not the same thing as complaining about "feminine" curves, whatever that even means.
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Post by githcheater on Sept 24, 2024 2:20:34 GMT
whatever that even means. "36-24-36" "Built like an Amazon" "There's a high pressure front coming up from the south... we'll have moisture as this swell pushes into the region... but we will have some relief after the squall pounds the northern tip of the peninsula." YOU'RE WELCOME ... and now illuminated ... Lionel Richie on sax
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Carcharoth
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Post by Carcharoth on Sept 24, 2024 5:51:33 GMT
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Post by smilesja on Sept 24, 2024 5:54:36 GMT
You know there is some irony that not only has this thread lasted eleven pages...well done everyone, seriously....but also that the same people who are complaining about not having enough options are also doing a lot of complaining about not having the breast surgery scars, IE a different set of options. Like I get it but there are also a lot of reasons those would exist in setting beyond just the trans issue. I don't believe a single person in this thread has argued against the top surgery scars. Nut jobs on youtube sure. But not here. But it is this kind of BS, accusing each side of being way more extreme than they are, is why we can't have civilized discussions. Actually there was a person who did argue against the surgical scars lol. But that comment was deleted.
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Post by RelevantRevenant on Sept 24, 2024 6:20:21 GMT
I'm still uncomfortable with uproar the chest scars are causing. I'm not Trans and they are fine as a on option to have. You can just ignore them and keep going, it is possible to not get mad at everything you don't like. For example, I don't care about all the several tattoo options, but I'm just going to play without them.
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Post by smilesja on Sept 24, 2024 6:37:44 GMT
I'm still uncomfortable with uproar the chest scars are causing. I'm not Trans and they are fine as a on option to have. You can just ignore them and keep going, it is possible to not get mad at everything you don't like. For example, I don't care about all the several tattoo options, but I'm just going to play without them. Bioware is the "woke" company and in the eyes of the fringes of the internet, that means they're the enemy of gaming lol. So best to drum up every little thing in order to bash them. It's also part of the reason why I'm having a hard time taking this thread seriously. If people are really up in arms over this, then it's likely they didn't want to play the game in the first place.
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helios969
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
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Post by helios969 on Sept 24, 2024 7:14:01 GMT
I'm still uncomfortable with uproar the chest scars are causing. I'm not Trans and they are fine as a on option to have. You can just ignore them and keep going, it is possible to not get mad at everything you don't like. For example, I don't care about all the several tattoo options, but I'm just going to play without them. Bioware is the "woke" company and in the eyes of the fringes of the internet, that means they're the enemy of gaming lol. So best to drum up every little thing in order to bash them. It's also part of the reason why I'm having a hard time taking this thread seriously. If people are really up in arms over this, then it's likely they didn't want to play the game in the first place. It's very simple. This thread is about boobs and butts...and the majority of gamers want that. Whatever peoples' reasons for wanting that I do not care. I know if I'm making a game and I know that helps sell it I'm doing it. The formula for success is pretty simple. Make a good product. Know your consumer base. Give them what they want. And you're just using woke to dismiss anyone's criticism...implying that anyone who criticizes anything you don't agree with as valid to be a hater.
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Post by Syv on Sept 24, 2024 7:54:31 GMT
I'm still uncomfortable with uproar the chest scars are causing. I'm not Trans and they are fine as a on option to have. You can just ignore them and keep going, it is possible to not get mad at everything you don't like. For example, I don't care about all the several tattoo options, but I'm just going to play without them. If you don't care you can leave the topic and enjoy other ones like I do. I'm sure you'll find something more to your liking. There are a lot of things I don't care you don't see me criyng over people wanting something or not. They are fine for you, they aren't fine for others. Why would you be more legetimate than others ? On what basis and criteria ? It's a thread about feminine curves, people are going to discuss the matter lol, the same way people in a romance thread are going to discuss about romance....
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Post by RelevantRevenant on Sept 24, 2024 7:57:53 GMT
Bioware is the "woke" company and in the eyes of the fringes of the internet, that means they're the enemy of gaming lol. So best to drum up every little thing in order to bash them. It's also part of the reason why I'm having a hard time taking this thread seriously. If people are really up in arms over this, then it's likely they didn't want to play the game in the first place. It's very simple. This thread is about boobs and butts...and the majority of gamers want that. Whatever peoples' reasons for wanting that I do not care. I know if I'm making a game and I know that helps sell it I'm doing it. The formula for success is pretty simple. Make a good product. Know your consumer base. Give them what they want. And you're just using woke to dismiss anyone's criticism...implying that anyone who criticizes anything you don't agree with as valid to be a hater. My comment, that smilesja replied to, wasn't really touching on this. It was about the intense hate one option available in game is generating. Like I've said before and I believe Unicephalon 40-D said something similar was that the lack of "boobs and butts" in game is likely due to clipping issues and therefore game performance. I'm not involved in game development so I can't say why this is, but I believe the clipping issues would be another thing to complain about.
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Post by RelevantRevenant on Sept 24, 2024 8:02:22 GMT
I'm still uncomfortable with uproar the chest scars are causing. I'm not Trans and they are fine as a on option to have. You can just ignore them and keep going, it is possible to not get mad at everything you don't like. For example, I don't care about all the several tattoo options, but I'm just going to play without them. If you don't care you can leave the topic and enjoy other ones like I do. I'm sure you'll find something more to your liking. There are a lot of things I don't care you don't see me criyng over people wanting something or not. They are fine for you, they aren't fine for others. Why would you be more legetimate than others ? On what basis and criteria ? It's a thread about feminine curves, people are going to discuss the matter lol, the same way people in a romance thread are going to discuss about romance.... What? I genuinely do not understand how what you're saying relates to my comment.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
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Post by helios969 on Sept 24, 2024 8:07:26 GMT
My comment, that smilesja replied to, wasn't really touching on this. It was about the intense hate one option available in game is generating. Like I've said before and I believe Unicephalon 40-D said something similar was that the lack of "boobs and butts" in game is likely due to clipping issues and therefore game performance. I'm not involved in game development so I can't say why this is, but I believe the clipping issues would be another thing to complain about. So is that because they just adapted male armor to skin female characters? If so that's pretty lame. Frankly if you're going to get complaints either way I think people complaining about clipping would be better for sales.
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Post by ClarkKent on Sept 24, 2024 8:42:15 GMT
I want massive shoulders on my men. I want them to be buff af. I want them to have thighs so thick they can destroy melons. I haven't seen a single male human that fits these requirements in the promotional material and in the few videos I've seen. You're damn right. I've been meaning to role play Ronnie Coleman in my DAV save and Bioware have disappointed me 😔 In all seriousness, it is a shame the purely good natured 'feminine curves' people are not getting the options they want. More options is generally a good thing in these sort of games. I can relate, to a certain extent, because I remember being mildly annoyed there was not one good short hair option in DAI. However, development limitations do come into play at a certain point, and the resources going into even more options in the character creator could go somewhere else more needed. The character creator they have made seems pretty damn robust however, and I'm looking forward to seeing other people's Rooks come launch.
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LogicGunn
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I'll relinquish one bullet. Where do you want it?
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Post by LogicGunn on Sept 24, 2024 10:55:24 GMT
In terms of where body sliders cut off on their extremes, I strongly suspect more to do with armour, clothing, and the fact that they've put a heck of a lot of effort into hair this time around, which would be negated if every time a Rook with an ample bosom so much takes a breath the longer hair styles either slipped into the avatar (à la the sims and BG3) or is ricocheted off of them like the ball in pong.
Ditto the hoppping, skipping and jumping in combat.
Considering how important realistic and varied representation is to Bioware, it's not likely a flippant sort of limitation or an easy decision. Hair physics is no joke, there's a reason longer hair in most games still looks either like a plastic headpiece or is an immovable updo in 2024. The way the hair moves with Rook in DTV is so far beyond anything I've ever seen in a video game.
If you're worried about it though, modders care less about clipping etc so give it a couple of weeks, there'll be tits and ass for days.
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Post by Lebanese Dude on Sept 24, 2024 11:12:34 GMT
I want massive shoulders on my men. I want them to be buff af. I want them to have thighs so thick they can destroy melons. I haven't seen a single male human that fits these requirements in the promotional material and in the few videos I've seen. You're damn right. I've been meaning to role play Ronnie Coleman in my DAV save and Bioware have disappointed me 😔 In all seriousness, it is a shame the purely good natured 'feminine curves' people are not getting the options they want. More options is generally a good thing in these sort of games. I can relate, to a certain extent, because I remember being mildly annoyed there was not one good short hair option in DAI. However, development limitations do come into play at a certain point, and the resources going into even more options in the character creator could go somewhere else more needed. The character creator they have made seems pretty damn robust however, and I'm looking forward to seeing other people's Rooks come launch. Yeah I'll be a bit disappointed if I can't get the body type option I want, but I'll just make do with something else. I did see some *great* short hair options so I'm actually satisfied in that regard. The hair in my avatar is the only remotely usable one in DAI for me.
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Post by colfoley on Sept 24, 2024 12:24:10 GMT
In terms of where body sliders cut off on their extremes, I strongly suspect more to do with armour, clothing, and the fact that they've put a heck of a lot of effort into hair this time around, which would be negated if every time a Rook with an ample bosom so much takes a breath the longer hair styles either slipped into the avatar (à la the sims and BG3) or is ricocheted off of them like the ball in pong. Ditto the hoppping, skipping and jumping in combat. Considering how important realistic and varied representation is to Bioware, it's not likely a flippant sort of limitation or an easy decision. Hair physics is no joke, there's a reason longer hair in most games still looks either like a plastic headpiece or is an immovable updo in 2024. The way the hair moves with Rook in DTV is so far beyond anything I've ever seen in a video game. If you're worried about it though, modders care less about clipping etc so give it a couple of weeks, there'll be tits and ass for days. This is the only real source of amusement i get out of this situation that game dev is literally playing whack-a-mole with audience expectations since it is VERY LIKELY that audience demands for great hair is what is now causing the current issues about not being able to have big bossomed Rooks. Also worth noting that is also probably why, at least to me, the butt shots I have seen look quite...plump in their own way.
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ergates
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Post by ergates on Sept 24, 2024 13:10:53 GMT
Hot take: It basically boils down to 'pornification' of women.
What these angry "WHERE R MY OPSHUNZ 2 MAKE HAWT BABEZ IN SKIMPI LINGERY WHIT MASSIVE 58-DD BEWBS AND MASSIV BUTTS LYK KIM KARDASUYN???" are actually thinking of when they imagine female character are porn stars, who generally tend to have exaggerated 'feminine features'. They've become normalised to this image of women, until they feel that this kind of thing is the standard when it comes to female body shapes.
In reality relatively few women resemble porn actresses - who are often cosmetically enhanced in various ways. That's fine, it's their life - but it does create problems when it comes to shaping people's perceptions.
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Post by Iakus on Sept 24, 2024 13:18:11 GMT
Hot take: It basically boils down to 'pornification' of women. What these angry "WHERE R MY OPSHUNZ 2 MAKE HAWT BABEZ IN SKIMPI LINGERY WHIT MASSIVE 58-DD BEWBS AND MASSIV BUTTS LYK KIM KARDASUYN???" are actually thinking of when they imagine female character are porn stars, who generally tend to have exaggerated 'feminine features'. They've become normalised to this image of women, until they feel that this kind of thing is the standard when it comes to female body shapes. In reality relatively few women resemble porn actresses - who are often cosmetically enhanced in various ways. That's fine, it's their life - but it does create problems when it comes to shaping people's perceptions. Umm, I have been outspoken about not liking graphic sex or nudity in games. I don't play dating sims. I ALSO think people should be allowed to make curvy female characters if they want. So am I far-right or far-left? I can't keep track anymore.
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Post by biggydx on Sept 24, 2024 14:04:37 GMT
This might be completely unreasonable as a take, and it's purely speculative (not malicious). While I suspect clipping is primarily why they could extend the magnitude of these sliders, I also wonder if it's also because having larger breasts would also entail needing to impart jiggle physics to them (which I don't think any of the games have ever bothered with).
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Post by mgsmsc on Sept 24, 2024 14:24:15 GMT
This might be completely unreasonable as a take, and it's purely speculative (not malicious). While I suspect clipping is primarily why they could extend the magnitude of these sliders, I also wonder if it's also because having larger breasts would also entail needing to impart jiggle physics to them (which I don't think any of the games have ever bothered with). The veil is wobbly here.
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Post by q5tyhj on Sept 24, 2024 14:50:55 GMT
Do you have confirmation that body presets do not influence sliders? Nope. However a french reviewer who is not into politics specifically made a video to point out the fact that it was impossible to create a sexually appealing character ( meaning curvy I think ), that the game was purposely made that way and how it seemed problematic to him. This is such absurd hyperbole we've seen plenty of examples of "curvy" and "sexually appealing" characters, so saying its impossible to create them in DAV is about as credible as saying its impossible to wield a sword or fight dragons in DAV- we already know its in the game, so saying otherwise just proves that someone is either misinformed or plain dishonest
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Post by ergates on Sept 24, 2024 15:25:48 GMT
Umm, I have been outspoken about not liking graphic sex or nudity in games. I don't play dating sims. I ALSO think people should be allowed to make curvy female characters if they want. Has anyone said anything to the contrary? Makes no difference to me what body shape people's characters have.
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Post by fairdragon on Sept 24, 2024 15:26:52 GMT
Most complains comes from the IGN video. And they only complain because of what the person said.
Is that the one with the Qunari? Could be. It is the one with the CC where the person create a elve and said: "hell of an ass"
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Post by Element Zero on Sept 24, 2024 15:29:31 GMT
Dragon's Dogma 2 T&A min/max with bonus height difference. I didn't play DD2, so I haven't seen their CC, but this is more what I was expecting when they said Veilguard has body sliders. From what I'm seeing, the hair (for non-Qunari) is vastly improved, and the faces look good (again, non-Qunari). The body proportions are the new "BioWare hair", as in they look goofy. In this type of game, better faces and hair are probably more important for me, but I am a little disappointed that my Mages and Warriors are going to look so physically similar. I was looking forward to using the sliders to emphasize the physical differences. 😕🤷🏻♂️ I'm really disappointed by the Qunari, and will probably skip them again. The horns look good, but they don't blend believably into the head, in my opinion. Their hairstyles look poor. That's not new, but it's even more disappointing alongside the strong options for the other three species. I think this CC will end up be a step forward, but not as dramatically positive as it could've been it they'd used more lifelike body proportions; allowed for more heroic builds; etc... The internet will claim it's terrible, because hating BioWare is popular, but I think it's going to be easy to make cool looking protagonists.
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Post by fairdragon on Sept 24, 2024 15:33:55 GMT
Do you have confirmation that body presets do not influence sliders? Nope. However a french reviewer who is not into politics specifically made a video to point out the fact that it was impossible to create a sexually appealing character ( meaning curvy I think ), that the game was purposely made that way and how it seemed problematic to him. Which was surprising coming from him, he doesn't make that type of comment usually. And a few female reviewers seemed unhappy too and said they couldn't create a character like them, which means they tried. I mean, I'd be surprised that so many reviewers couldn't succeed such thing. But we'll see, it remains one month and one week anyway. Can you give us the link to the video?
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Post by fairdragon on Sept 24, 2024 15:36:17 GMT
I found this thread by looking to see if anyone had commented on it yet. Yes, the boobs look weird to me, and to my non-gamer wife. It's not just the boobs, though. The body proportions look weird. Everyone has big heads and odd proportions. I've only seen female characters in the CC, but I'm expecting the males to look odd, as well. Everyone just looks a little stubby, oddly proportioned, and fat-headed, with narrow, rounded shoulders. It's an interesting stylistic choice. I doubt I'll ever love it, but the CC looks really cool in other ways. I'm excited to play the game. I have some gripes, with weird boobs being the least important among them, but overall this game looks like it's going to be a good one. And i don't get this they have motion technic. proportion shouldn't be a problem for them. Unless they wanted it for some reason. And no i don't see any reason for this.
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