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Post by colfoley on Sept 25, 2024 20:29:34 GMT
Oh, this is going to be another Hawke situation where they don’t represent how a lot of players played them, isn’t it? Actually it’ll be worse since we have even less input now. I mean that boat has already sailed for mine since mine had no interest in going north to traipse after Solas and yet Corinne has mandated the arrogant suggestion that somehow she'll feel responsible.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 25, 2024 20:29:53 GMT
Oh, this is going to be another Hawke situation where they don’t represent how a lot of players played them, isn’t it? Actually it’ll be worse since we have even less input now. I read an interesting suggestion on another place, the Inquisitor might only show up in some Solas fade memory. So whatever representation of them in-game would be tainted by how Solas perceive the Inquisitor. How would that work since we see Inquisitor with a prosthetic hand which they only get after Solas leaves at the end of Trespasser. He only ever stalks a romanced Lavellan.
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Post by IllustriousT on Sept 25, 2024 20:30:26 GMT
Oh, this is going to be another Hawke situation where they don’t represent how a lot of players played them, isn’t it? Actually it’ll be worse since we have even less input now. I read an interesting suggestion on another place, the Inquisitor might only show up in some Solas fade memory. So whatever representation of them in-game would be tainted by how Solas perceive the Inquisitor. I would be interested in this perception. Not satisfied, but still...it could be cool and I would like to see it!
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 25, 2024 20:30:36 GMT
Oh, this is going to be another Hawke situation where they don’t represent how a lot of players played them, isn’t it? Actually it’ll be worse since we have even less input now. I mean that boat has already sailed for mine since mine had no interest in going north to traipse after Solas and yet Corinne has mandated the arrogant suggestion that somehow she'll feel responsible. I’m sorry your Inquisitor won’t be like how you played them.
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Post by azarhal on Sept 25, 2024 20:33:07 GMT
I read an interesting suggestion on another place, the Inquisitor might only show up in some Solas fade memory. So whatever representation of them in-game would be tainted by how Solas perceive the Inquisitor. How would that work since we see Inquisitor with a prosthetic hand which they only get after Solas leaves at the end of Trespasser. He only ever stalks a romanced Lavellan. Solas is well aware the Inquisitor lost an arm and he stilll probably has spies around who told him about the arm.
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Post by fraggle on Sept 25, 2024 20:34:28 GMT
Cameos are nice and all, but it has shown in the past that people a. want their characters back but then are unhappy if they're not portrayed as they played them b. are unhappy if a character is not referenced at all c. are unhappy for any other reasons (retconned characters etc.) It's a can of worms Bioware opened from time to time and I can understand why they leave it mostly behind now (some choices are surely questionable for DAV, but I intend to let the game speak for itself, not mad fans prior to release. I want to judge it myself first). I for one am fine with not touching most cameos anymore. I mean, some of the smaller ones like meeting drunk Alistair in DA2 were funny, but if there's no more cameos from now on, I'd also be content. Can't miss what's not there Besides I like making up my own endings for my characters and their LIs, so the less said about them, the better. And people still wanting the HoF back or mentioned is like people hoping for Shepard to be back. Just no. Their story is done...
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Post by Reznore on Sept 25, 2024 20:39:49 GMT
AS long as my Inquisitor looks pretty, and if Dorian is there still hot as a thousand suns, I will be fine. I don't expect much from Inky, the less they're on the screen the better, and if it's bad that's what brain bleach is for.
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Post by colfoley on Sept 25, 2024 20:46:49 GMT
I mean that boat has already sailed for mine since mine had no interest in going north to traipse after Solas and yet Corinne has mandated the arrogant suggestion that somehow she'll feel responsible. I’m sorry your Inquisitor won’t be like how you played them. it's not a big deal already adjusting my head cannon to match. Just given everything that happened in and post Trespasser I'm a little annoyed that now all inquisitors are cannonically that arrogant.
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Post by azarhal on Sept 25, 2024 20:51:48 GMT
I’m sorry your Inquisitor won’t be like how you played them. it's not a big deal already adjusting my head cannon to match. Just given everything that happened in and post Trespasser I'm a little annoyed that now all inquisitors are cannonically that arrogant." Overtime power becomes its own master" ~ Cassandra Pentaghast irc, Solas also warns about that.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 25, 2024 20:53:53 GMT
I’m sorry your Inquisitor won’t be like how you played them. it's not a big deal already adjusting my head cannon to match. Just given everything that happened in and post Trespasser I'm a little annoyed that now all inquisitors are cannonically that arrogant. Definitely. My Inquisitor was never arrogant, and wants to stop Solas not because of guilt or responsibility but because they want to save those they care about.
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Post by colfoley on Sept 25, 2024 20:54:40 GMT
it's not a big deal already adjusting my head cannon to match. Just given everything that happened in and post Trespasser I'm a little annoyed that now all inquisitors are cannonically that arrogant." Overtime power becomes its own master" ~ Cassandra Pentaghast irc, Solas also warns about that. oof. You are very right given Trespasser and its themes but oof. Which is why I am definitely considering disbanding the Inquisition in my current run I'll be taking into Tresspasser just gonna be real tragic if Kara succumbs anyways.
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Post by Croatsky on Sept 25, 2024 21:29:03 GMT
Not gonna lie, I really hate that this is all we'll gonna get.
And I truly dislike Epler's reasoning, honestly comes of condescending by claiming it's to improve player's experience and it doesn't invalidate our past choices( it does).
It's really is just BioWare being terrified of doing importing feature just because of marketing research in past showing sequels hurt sales if new potential players feel pressured to play previous title(s). Despite the fact ME Trilogy being a huge success and Inquisition being their best selling title while using Keep to import tons of choices.
I hate it.
All I can hope for now that game is a huge success and BioWare can be pressured to do an expansion that will let you import past games decisions, perhaps play as Inquisitor in parallel and/or post Rook's timeline. But this will depend a lot on how DAVG ends, because it's an unknown at this moment.
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Post by bierkrug on Sept 25, 2024 21:29:55 GMT
So tell me what's the birth name of the Black Divine. Or the current Archon. Or who rules Rivain. Who sit on the throne of Antiva... What's the name of the king of the Anderfels It's been a decade ingame as well, how would I know XD For real though, think of Josy's indepth knowledge of every noble family and their connections. She always seems up to date. The games never had any trouble with letting information flow across the map, yet now the marketing talks about how removed north and south are? If they had wanted, they could have integrated the keep and former decisions. But for some reason they did not. Bioware used to be better about this. Of course people are disappointed.
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Post by Andrew Waples on Sept 25, 2024 22:06:24 GMT
I get people are attached to their romances (raises hand) and what not, but of all the choices they could've brought. Why was the Inquisitor's romance choice one them? When at most they'll get a verbal mention.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 25, 2024 22:09:31 GMT
I get people are attached to their romances (raises hand) and what not, but of all the choices they could've brought. Why was the Inquisitor's romance choice one them? When at most they'll get a verbal mention. Because Solas. Guaranteed. The others will just be lip service but his will affect his and Inky’s character.
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Post by illuminated11 on Sept 25, 2024 22:12:00 GMT
I don't like the way BioWare handled this. Both in the decision itself and the obfuscation around the decision. They made reviewers agree not to show this...only to tell us a few days later. So that becomes very transparently an attempt to control negativity around the reviews, making them feel less authentic. Also Corinne's description of this from the Discord Q&A now makes my eyes roll a bit...like this is really overselling something that is 3 decisions. "As you go through it"...you mean as you go through 3 decisions? lol "The thing I love about it is, it’s very highly visual, it uses the familiar tarot card aesthetic, so it’s actually really visual and playful experience as you go through it." In their defense, the NDA probably has more to do with their contract with IGN than intent to obfuscate. There are plenty of choices that would likely be unpopular with returning players that they've revealed right away. But I agree that Corrine has made a decent number of PR gaffes and should probably have been more careful with her language.
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Post by Andrew Waples on Sept 25, 2024 22:28:21 GMT
Not gonna lie, I really hate that this is all we'll gonna get. And I truly dislike Epler's reasoning, honestly comes of condescending by claiming it's to improve player's experience and it doesn't invalidate our past choices( it does). It's really is just BioWare being terrified of doing importing feature just because of marketing research in past showing sequels hurt sales if new potential players feel pressured to play previous title(s). Despite the fact ME Trilogy being a huge success and Inquisition being their best selling title while using Keep to import tons of choices. I hate it. All I can hope for now that game is a huge success and BioWare can be pressured to do an expansion that will let you import past games decisions, perhaps play as Inquisitor in parallel and/or post Rook's timeline. But this will depend a lot on how DAVG ends, because it's an unknown at this moment. This sounds what players hate as "fan service" like Citadel dlc "fan service."
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Post by ellanathehamster on Sept 25, 2024 22:31:05 GMT
I dislike Epler’s post because he mentions they took effort to not invalidate previous choices, yet: - emphasised Inquisitor is interested and involved in how Rook and Solas story will go - Inq has a personal connection to Solas - DAV is very connected to Solas - he decided to carry over only choices that will be properly addressed in game narrative, implying codex or extra dialogue isn’t the way
All of it is impossible to achieve with uncontrollable Inquisitor. Or without more in depth questionnaire to determine Inq personality. Even in relation to Solas: you can hate him, befriend him,become romantically involved with. In romance, you can be more stoic, mad at him, sad over his lies, alerted or cool with it. How can they possibly do justice to this variety of reactions? You can be friend, but vow to stop him. You can dislike him as a person, but try to talk him out of destroying the world. With Solas we only choose if he was romanced (the romance itself can be played with different dynamics) and is we hunt him/try to save. How is this enough? At this moment Inq feels only as a tool or foil to show an aspect of Solas character in DAV. We are completely stripped of any agency. And while it may be okay for companios cameos, it feels too wrong for a character every one of us created. We are their authors, not bioware. I am baffled, as Epler voiced intentions for Inq in DAV directly contradict with how they are implemented it.
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Post by Andrew Waples on Sept 25, 2024 22:40:24 GMT
I dislike Epler’s post because he mentions they took effort to not invalidate previous choices, yet: - emphasised Inquisitor is interested and involved in how Rook and Solas story will go - Inq has a personal connection to Solas - DAV is very connected to Solas - he decided to carry over only choices that will be properly addressed in game narrative, implying codex or extra dialogue isn’t the way All of it is impossible to achieve with uncontrollable Inquisitor. Or without more in depth questionnaire to determine Inq personality. Even in relation to Solas: you can hate him, befriend him,become romantically involved with. In romance, you can be more stoic, mad at him, sad over his lies, alerted or cool with it. How can they possibly do justice to this variety of reactions? You can be friend, but vow to stop him. You can dislike him as a person, but try to talk him out of destroying the world. With Solas we only choose if he was romanced (the romance itself can be played with different dynamics) and is we hunt him/try to save. How is this enough? At this moment Inq feels only as a tool or foil to show an aspect of Solas character in DAV. We are completely stripped of any agency. And while it may be okay for companios cameos, it feels too wrong for a character every one of us created. We are their authors, not bioware. I am baffled, as Epler voiced intentions for Inq in DAV directly contradict with how they are implemented it. Devil's advocate here for a second. We already know those choices, those backgrounds etc. We already have that attachment to these characters like that's not gone. The best way I can describe it is like serialized story telling that took ten years to finish. There's no import decisions for those stories yet you're expected to get it. If that makes any sense.
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Post by ellanathehamster on Sept 25, 2024 22:48:32 GMT
I dislike Epler’s post because he mentions they took effort to not invalidate previous choices, yet: - emphasised Inquisitor is interested and involved in how Rook and Solas story will go - Inq has a personal connection to Solas - DAV is very connected to Solas - he decided to carry over only choices that will be properly addressed in game narrative, implying codex or extra dialogue isn’t the way All of it is impossible to achieve with uncontrollable Inquisitor. Or without more in depth questionnaire to determine Inq personality. Even in relation to Solas: you can hate him, befriend him,become romantically involved with. In romance, you can be more stoic, mad at him, sad over his lies, alerted or cool with it. How can they possibly do justice to this variety of reactions? You can be friend, but vow to stop him. You can dislike him as a person, but try to talk him out of destroying the world. With Solas we only choose if he was romanced (the romance itself can be played with different dynamics) and is we hunt him/try to save. How is this enough? At this moment Inq feels only as a tool or foil to show an aspect of Solas character in DAV. We are completely stripped of any agency. And while it may be okay for companios cameos, it feels too wrong for a character every one of us created. We are their authors, not bioware. I am baffled, as Epler voiced intentions for Inq in DAV directly contradict with how they are implemented it. Devil's advocate here for a second. We already know those choices, those backgrounds etc. We already have that attachment to these characters like that's not gone. The best way I can describe it is like serialized story telling that took ten years to finish. There's no import decisions for those stories yet you're expected to get it. If that makes any sense. Not really, sorry. Sn example: Inq who had friendly relationship with Solas, chose to try to save him. In DAV, the way Solas background is being explained and his real plans become clear, supporting him goes agains everything Ink fought for, put his and people he cares about in danger. Simply put, he can’t keep supporting Solas. Yet the game will push this narrative because of a choice made a decade ago, based on aspects of whole story? This totally invalidates how I would roleplay my character.
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Post by illuminated11 on Sept 25, 2024 22:56:47 GMT
I think Epler and co. definitely underestimated how much even just little details like codex entries (or war table missions, although I'm in minority in liking them) make the world feel more fleshed out.
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Post by Oswin on Sept 25, 2024 22:57:41 GMT
I have had too many years in my own headcanon for my inquisitors that I've always known that I would inevitably be disappointed by whatever gets brought over to this - which I guess is what Epler is trying to get at with their reasoning as to why there is so little. Can't be mad stuff isn't how you imagined it would be if it's just not mentioned at all, right!? But man, to get so little is a bitter disappointment. I am an absolute sucker for a bit of fanservice. Just a sliver in a codex. A throwaway comment by an NPC. A little mention of the world I built in Thedas in each game and I'm thrilled to have it. Then of course there is the bigger stuff - The well? The wardens? The Divine? If we had no one coming back from Inquisition then I'd accept it a bit more - but the return of some of them makes those choices worth mentioning, no? Also, I know I need to let go of my HOF and that world state, but with Morrigan being back and the Antivan Crows now being a faction, it's just making me sulk about Zevran. Zevran is my favourite DAO romance - and to my fellow Zevran lovers - we have been done such a dirty have we not? A broken cameo in DA2. A War table mission in DAI. My man gets so little air time compared to the others. I thought maybe now there would be a good reason for a lil something something but with no Origins data coming over and people forgetting who he is... I guess not. Seeing as my two favourite Inquisitors I am bringing over are a Dorian romancer and a Solas romancer - I can only hope I get a bit more content out of that with them both being up north...
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Post by Andrew Waples on Sept 25, 2024 23:25:46 GMT
Let me just be clear that I'm disappointed like everyone else is okay? Got it? Good. Adding on, what other choices that we made in the main story of Inquisition that would've been important to Veilguard? There's very little in each game. Same with Hawke in DAI and Origins into 2 for that matter. I probably would've thought The Divine, because of Vivienne, maybe who the King or Queen of Oralis is. That said, it depends on the context of those two. However, there's very little that would need to be imported over that effects Solas. If you're a new player and want more Solas you can play Inquisition. For a returning player you already know the context of his decisions.
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Post by Absafraginlootly on Sept 25, 2024 23:54:52 GMT
Oh, this is going to be another Hawke situation where they don’t represent how a lot of players played them, isn’t it? Actually it’ll be worse since we have even less input now. I've been bracing myself for my inquisitors to be ooc like my Hawkes were since they revealed they were in the CC. I held out some hope we might get control of their dialogue to mitigate that but they've said the Inquisitors isn't playable and that only applying to combat/movement seems unlikely.
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Post by SofaJockey on Sept 26, 2024 0:11:47 GMT
Maybe I'm going to be called mean, but I have an issue with inconsequential cameos.
Let's take Andromeda.
I found Bain Massani and Cassandra Verner rather forced. Ryder has no connection with Zaeed and Conrad so any story about that is gratuitous and I felt it was.
In Veilguard, Rook has no known connection with the past cast of Dragon Age except for Varric and Harding (and via them to Cassandra, Leliana, Josie and Dorian.)
Unless they were romanced (you can specify that)
We're unlikely to see (because they might be dead) Iron Bull, Blackwall and Cullen. And we're unlikely to see (because they might never have been recruited) Sera, Cole and Vivienne.
On the other hand, Tevinter Nights and Vows & Vengeance could be ripe for cameos.
Who is ruling in which southern country is irrelevant to the plot. Divine Victoria can be referred to by that name, whoever it is. Kieran is an adult and does not need to be trailing after his mother. Given what happened to Mythal, does it matter who drank from the well?
After all that I kind of get why we are where we are.
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