akots
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Post by akots on Dec 11, 2016 17:01:03 GMT
At a guess, it is because whatever metric they are gathering tell them that the retention rate is low. Again, if you look at the leaderboards, it is only about 100K people who are in the top 10% of the players, and you can get into the top 10% by playing a few Bronze games for a few hours (I did, so... yeah, it was a bit of a surprise). Which means that most people gave it a shot, and dropped out after less than 100 games played. ... It is country-dependent and platform-specific. Let's take a look at N7. I am at 2280 for N7 and am in 2%. That means total number of people who actually tried ME3MP is around 15,000 x 50 in the USA alone and only on PC. That puts it at about 750,000. I'm not sure if there is overall statistics for all countries. Fuenf seemed to be able to get some numbers on old BSN. It were actually very impressive figures like 80K players (simultaneously or total, I don't remember) online on PC on weekends. That is pretty darn nice for a 4-year-old game. Heh, even BroJo is still playing occasionally and carrying some newbie pugs to their ultrarares. I quite frequently meet players who are just starting and they like it a lot. So, retention or no retention, ME3 MP is a huge success, there is no denial to that. I'm not sure if DAIMP can qualify as a total failure. But it certainly has not had even 1/20th of the numbers overall. Most of the people who might be willing to try most likely could not even connect. Yes, it were that bad. There are many factors of course, it is not that simple. Dragonracer knows better as there were some estimates as to how many people did the weekly challenges. I think peak was around 20K for playstation and it was quite in the beginning. Bioware did not know themselves as they could not set correct numbers for community challenges and in some cases, they were off by 5-fold, sometimes by 30-40%. There are no normal leader boards for DAIMP and there is no current data. But considering that 99% on my FL who ever played DAIMP are not playing it for the last year might tell something. IIRC, for example, Drasca stopped playing at about same time as me just because he got bored as he became completely invincible on any difficulty. Promotion lords have their own problems. He is still probably within top 100.
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Post by Tiberius on Dec 11, 2016 17:03:28 GMT
Note: Our prestige bonuses are capped, so you can't grind your way to unstoppable godliness. Player skill is intended to remain a key ingredient, even for long-term players.
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Filippopotame
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Post by Filippopotame on Dec 11, 2016 17:18:55 GMT
Note: Our prestige bonuses are capped, so you can't grind your way to unstoppable godliness. Player skill is intended to remain a key ingredient, even for long-term players. Hurray ! If you truly are Ian S. Frazier you just made me VERY happy.
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Post by spacev3gan on Dec 11, 2016 18:16:00 GMT
Note: Our prestige bonuses are capped, so you can't grind your way to unstoppable godliness. Player skill is intended to remain a key ingredient, even for long-term players. In a way you are pretty much telling us that these prestige bonuses (post-promotion a la Dragon Age Inquisition?) do exist and are in all likelihood permanent. Having a hard cap that is reasonably within reach even for the casual player is only sensible.
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Post by Abramsrunner on Dec 11, 2016 19:44:13 GMT
Note: Our prestige bonuses are capped, so you can't grind your way to unstoppable godliness. Player skill is intended to remain a key ingredient, even for long-term players. Hopefully it's hard capped to a small number then. I'm also glad that Player skill is still a thing, so we can remake stuff like the Thunder Dome, & our own themed challenges again for ME:AMP.
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Cyberzombie
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Post by Cyberzombie on Dec 11, 2016 20:33:06 GMT
Note: Our prestige bonuses are capped, so you can't grind your way to unstoppable godliness. Player skill is intended to remain a key ingredient, even for long-term players. Thanks for clearing that up. Is there any information pertaining to lag issues when playing off-host you can share with us?
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Post by Heroicmass on Dec 11, 2016 21:46:22 GMT
Note: Our prestige bonuses are capped, so you can't grind your way to unstoppable godliness. Player skill is intended to remain a key ingredient, even for long-term players. This is wonderful news. I definitely hope I have a chance to play the beta test. Any word on an NDA for the beta?
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Post by SalMasRac on Dec 11, 2016 23:09:41 GMT
At a guess, it is because whatever metric they are gathering tell them that the retention rate is low. Again, if you look at the leaderboards, it is only about 100K people who are in the top 10% of the players, and you can get into the top 10% by playing a few Bronze games for a few hours (I did, so... yeah, it was a bit of a surprise). Which means that most people gave it a shot, and dropped out after less than 100 games played. ... It is country-dependent and platform-specific. Let's take a look at N7. I am at 2280 for N7 and am in 2%. Leaderboards mean nothing in ME3MP. I'm N7 120 and I'm in the top 0.0000001%
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akots
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by akots on Dec 11, 2016 23:20:21 GMT
Note: Our prestige bonuses are capped, so you can't grind your way to unstoppable godliness. Player skill is intended to remain a key ingredient, even for long-term players. Oh, OK, I think that semi-invincible demigod will suffice. And yes, it is sarcasm, and yes, I don't want to sound hostile and such. But you are such a tease, man. You post something and then disappear in the fog to leave people here wondering. At least tell the starving us where the margin is. Well, apparently, we'll know in due time on our own. So, then, keep your secret, fine.
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Post by Cirvante on Dec 12, 2016 0:46:45 GMT
Note: Our prestige bonuses are capped, so you can't grind your way to unstoppable godliness. Player skill is intended to remain a key ingredient, even for long-term players. That's good to hear, but still leaves a very important question unanswered. Will players be able to opt out of acquiring these bonuses by not promoting? Or are these prestige levels and bonuses not tied to promoting at all and will be acquired automatically even by playing Lv. 20 characters? I'd appreciate it, if you could clear that up. It's an issue that has been bothering a lot of us ME3MP veteran players.
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Post by crashsuit on Dec 12, 2016 7:12:07 GMT
I wish I could keep following this thread but my doctor told me I had to reduce my salt intake
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Cyberzombie
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Post by Cyberzombie on Dec 12, 2016 13:04:58 GMT
I think most of the people here are mature(ish) adults with genuine and legitimate concerns about the game. Maybe too critical and cynical, but if you played DAMP you would be cynical too.
When the devs are silent about critical glaring issues it causes concern. We have a shred of information now that there will be a cap, which is really great. Having a cap solves the major game breaking problems associated with the Prestige system. So we can all relax about that.
But there are still other issues. Well, one major issue for me/anyone not in the US/Canada, and that is the issue of LAG. This issue is really the paramount issue, because if you can't play with other people, then it doesn't really matter if the game is imbalanced or deeply flawed or whatever, because you can't play with other people anyway.
I have always been able to find ME3MP matches, and a good 80-90% of the time the lag is acceptable. I don't expect to be able to vanguard off-host, simply being able to hit things and not rubber-band is enough. Literally after 4 months of DAMP's release, it became problematic to find games. And again being literal, 90% of players on my friends list stopped playing. At this point I resorted to adding people from BSN from other countries to my list, and tried to play with them by joining their matches once they had started (since you would get a black screen if you tried to join from the lobby), but it was so terrible to try and play with the LAG that I gave up after about 2 weeks. I could play ME3MP on these exact same hosts just fine, with absolutely no problem. I could even run the pizza. But the netcode for DAMP was AWFUL. I quit playing when the Dragonslayer patch was released because I was disgusted that it didn't address any of the balance or connection issues (and it still crashed far too frequently to be tolerable). I fired it up a few times over the months after that and occasionally found the same 1 or 2 odd people playing, but there was really no hope for it, especially when I could still just fire up ME3MP and jump into a lobby straight up and just go for it.
The point of all that ranting being, DAMP had major issues. I'll be overjoyed if bioware learnt from DAMP and all the negativity is unwarranted, I'll be more than happy to admit that I was wrong if they do a really great job making a totally awesome game that surpasses ME3MP. But until there is more of this gamer-to-gamer talk where they tell us honestly and candidly how it's going to be, I will continue to assume to worst, with no hope for anything better.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 12, 2016 13:15:09 GMT
Well, we've got a bit more information now! That's great, yes?
I would also like to know if the prestige accumulates via playing the "end=game" character through advancing to the higher difficulties, or through promoting/re-leveling on the lower difficulties, or both. Both would be nice, no?
In terms of lag and connectivity, and is it going to be addressed in the player-host environment, and how, this is a separate issue, and seeing how a thematic thread got a response, well... new thread?
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Post by Pounce de León on Dec 12, 2016 19:14:55 GMT
Note: Our prestige bonuses are capped, .. ... so you can't grind your way to unstoppable godliness... YES! Goddess bless you!
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Ernie
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Post by Ernie on Dec 12, 2016 20:50:11 GMT
Note: Our prestige bonuses are capped, so you can't grind your way to unstoppable godliness. Player skill is intended to remain a key ingredient, even for long-term players. May I ask a question unrelated to the prestige system. Will Andromeda's equivalent of seeker swarms have jetpack to climb on elevated ground since there will be no ladders for them to take?
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Cyberzombie
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Post by Cyberzombie on Dec 12, 2016 23:07:45 GMT
Well, we've got a bit more information now! That's great, yes? I would also like to know if the prestige accumulates via playing the "end=game" character through advancing to the higher difficulties, or through promoting/re-leveling on the lower difficulties, or both. Both would be nice, no? In terms of lag and connectivity, and is it going to be addressed in the player-host environment, and how, this is a separate issue, and seeing how a thematic thread got a response, well... new thread? There is this thread over here, but it does have a moderately high level of cynicism. Given that MEAMP is likely to have a much larger player base than DAMP, the inability to play with people from other countries may not be such a gigantic problem, as there could be a critical mass of players. It would still be nice though. Interacting on the forum is fun, but getting to complain about how bad the game is while playing it together is better Also if you play non-standard hours, and only have the same 3 douchebags available to play with. Like that guy who is always broadcasting his music into that game, that guy who lives in his mum's basement and talks about C4 every game, and that guy who doesn't ever help with objectives.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2016 1:57:57 GMT
It is country-dependent and platform-specific. Let's take a look at N7. I am at 2280 for N7 and am in 2%. Leaderboards mean nothing in ME3MP. I'm N7 120 and I'm in the top 0.0000001% Fuck yeah you are.
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JackD4n13ls
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Post by JackD4n13ls on Jan 9, 2017 16:13:17 GMT
would someone care to explain to me the downside of this system? cuz i honestly see nothing wrong with it. A. yea u getting huge advantage over the rest of players but damn its just typical co-op so a slight advantage is actually good for the whole team, right? or is a killstealing/score whoring still a thing? B. you gotta work so hard to get that. I mean aint nobody got time for that. I mean in my experience back in the day when Black Ops II came out I've stopped all that prestige thing in a halfway just because it got boring and annoying real quick.
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Post by Darks1te on Jan 9, 2017 16:49:09 GMT
would someone care to explain to me the downside of this system? cuz i honestly see nothing wrong with it. A. yea u getting huge advantage over the rest of players but damn its just typical co-op so a slight advantage is actually good for the whole team, right? or is a killstealing/score whoring still a thing? B. you gotta work so hard to get that. I mean aint nobody got time for that. I mean in my experience back in the day when Black Ops II came out I've stopped all that prestige thing in a halfway just because it got boring and annoying real quick. U r not played DAIMP isn't u?
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Post by JackD4n13ls on Jan 9, 2017 17:08:04 GMT
would someone care to explain to me the downside of this system? cuz i honestly see nothing wrong with it. A. yea u getting huge advantage over the rest of players but damn its just typical co-op so a slight advantage is actually good for the whole team, right? or is a killstealing/score whoring still a thing? B. you gotta work so hard to get that. I mean aint nobody got time for that. I mean in my experience back in the day when Black Ops II came out I've stopped all that prestige thing in a halfway just because it got boring and annoying real quick. U r not played DAIMP isn't u? Yea well u got me here, never played DAI but iv seen some MP streams of the game, and it looked like a complete and utter trashy clown fiesta but yea i have no idea what is this prestige system looks like...
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Post by Pearl on Jan 9, 2017 17:21:06 GMT
U r not played DAIMP isn't u? Yea well u got me here, never played DAI but iv seen some MP streams of the game, and it looked like a complete and utter trashy clown fiesta but yea i have no idea what is this prestige system looks like... Basically, in DAI, there's no cap on how strong your character can become. If you put enough time into the game, your level one character can take and deal more damage on the highest difficulty than an entire team of max level characters who are a lower prestige than you. It dries up the playerbase since the only people who will be able to compete with you are people who have a similar amount of prestige; if they're markedly lower, you're going to dominate the game; markedly higher and you're going to get carried whether you like it or not. All semblance of skilled gameplay dries up because the system actively discourages you from being good at the game, all you have to do to crush everything in your path is play enough and eventually you'll become practically invincible, even if your brain was surgically removed and replaced with a potato. Treating the symptoms of the problem, rather than attempting to cure the disease, Bioware introduced additional difficulty settings through patches and DLC. These settings were designed in such a way that they would be effectively impossible for people to play on until they reached a certain amount of prestige. This is just what I've picked up from talking to people about it around the time the game came out, and reading this thread. Once I caught wind of how it worked, I lost all interest in DAI, and Bioware exacerbated the problem instead of fixing it.
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Post by JackD4n13ls on Jan 9, 2017 17:51:32 GMT
Yea well u got me here, never played DAI but iv seen some MP streams of the game, and it looked like a complete and utter trashy clown fiesta but yea i have no idea what is this prestige system looks like... Basically, in DAI, there's no cap on how strong your character can become. If you put enough time into the game, your level one character can take and deal more damage on the highest difficulty than an entire team of max level characters who are a lower prestige than you. It dries up the playerbase since the only people who will be able to compete with you are people who have a similar amount of prestige; if they're markedly lower, you're going to dominate the game; markedly higher and you're going to get carried whether you like it or not. All semblance of skilled gameplay dries up because the system actively discourages you from being good at the game, all you have to do to crush everything in your path is play enough and eventually you'll become practically invincible, even if your brain was surgically removed and replaced with a potato. Treating the symptoms of the problem, rather than attempting to cure the disease, Bioware introduced additional difficulty settings through patches and DLC. These settings were designed in such a way that they would be effectively impossible for people to play on until they reached a certain amount of prestige. This is just what I've picked up from talking to people about it around the time the game came out, and reading this thread. Once I caught wind of how it worked, I lost all interest in DAI, and Bioware exacerbated the problem instead of fixing it. yea it doesnt sounds good like not at all...thanks for clearing it up to me, bud hopefully that was just a test and they learn from their mistakes
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zorinho20
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Post by zorinho20 on Jan 9, 2017 17:52:06 GMT
So, there is no way to become an unkillable Promotion god/Lord. Pre-order cancelled
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Post by Spectr61 on Jan 9, 2017 20:16:12 GMT
Note: Our prestige bonuses are capped, so you can't grind your way to unstoppable godliness. Player skill is intended to remain a key ingredient, even for long-term players. Great news. Thank you. Now, for the sake of clarity, mind tipping us on who was responsible for the decision to enable the "grind your way to God-mode" in DAIMP, and what role this genius has in MEAMP, if any?
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Post by spacev3gan on Jan 15, 2017 19:58:57 GMT
So, there is no way to become an unkillable Promotion god/Lord. Pre-order cancelled While promotion grinding was fun in the beginning (at least for me and most people I remember playing with), soon it started to feel absolutely silly. Also it divides the community in such a way that even recommending builds became something impractical. In DAMP we never had a serious Youtuber coming up with builds for a reason: they don't really matter! Promoting is far more important and effective than builds. It feels like Bioware purposefully made everything in their power to fragment DAMP's community as thin as possible: Lack of dedicated servers, Region-locked matchmaking (Black Screen of Death for those who dared trespass it), one of the poorest if not the poorest netcoding in recent gaming, an extremely divisive loot progression, infinite power grinding via Promotions and 100-only Global Leaderboards. I hope by now they have learned their lesson.
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