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Post by Arijon van Goyen on Jan 20, 2018 21:14:52 GMT
Arrival and Blade Runner 2049 director Denis Villeneuve is tackling Frank Herbert’s novel Dune and has told FANDOM that he aims to make it the Star Wars movie he never saw. Although he admits that making a film that’s different to Star Wars won’t be easy.
“Most of the main ideas of Star Wars are coming from Dune so it’s going to be a challenge to [tackle] this,” the French-Canadian director says. “The ambition is to do the Star Wars movie I never saw. In a way, it’s Star Wars for adults. We’ll see.”fandom.wikia.com/articles/dune-adaptation-will-be-star-wars-for-adults-says-directorShots fired xD
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Post by mybudgee on Jan 20, 2018 21:18:17 GMT
Call her a generic action heroine if you must. It's perfectly valid criticism. But if you continue to maintain she is a Sue you have to answer who she is a self insert for. Until then your criticisms are invalid. ...dating back to the first Underworld filmLoLmillennials Ah... to be young & naive again
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Post by smilesja on Jan 20, 2018 21:18:21 GMT
Call her a generic action heroine if you must. It's perfectly valid criticism. But if you continue to maintain she is a Sue you have to answer who she is a self insert for. Until then your criticisms are invalid. This sums up Rey adequately. What gets me is all these "marysue omgz sjw shut up omgz" people are basically shitting themselves because Rey is female. It's fairly evident given that other "marysues" get a free pass, like Luke and Anakin. They're willing to overinflate the source material, even the lousy prequels because of it. If anything, Rey is not a symbol of a feminist agenda, she is a generic heroine template cynically put in place because, dating back to the first Underworld film, women have shown they can be in front of a profitable action franchise. I think if the most recent example of a lucrative (if not exactly good) franchise that is responsible for Rey having a vagina is The Hunger Games. If that series had tanked, Rey would probably have been a boy. And I bet even if said boy was characterized exactly like Daisy Ridley's character the "real fan" outrage would be at best a murmur. People have explained it over and over on why Rey is just inadequate compared to the previous trilogies.
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Post by Andrew Waples on Jan 20, 2018 21:29:51 GMT
Nobody hates Star Wars more then Star Wars fans.
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Post by mybudgee on Jan 20, 2018 21:38:53 GMT
Nobody hates Star Wars more then Star Wars fans. Oh just wait a few days until we see the SOLO trailer...
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Post by Andrew Waples on Jan 20, 2018 21:43:41 GMT
Nobody hates Star Wars more then Star Wars fans. Oh just wait a few days until we see the SOLO trailer...
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Post by Terminator Force on Jan 20, 2018 22:11:41 GMT
It's weird that Jyn Erso can be written as a nuanced female protagonist with grounded flaws and reasonable positive qualities, but that Rey can't. After all, Disney funded both films so surely they can see that no one is calling Rogue One's female lead a Mary Sue; why not make Rey more like her? Because Jyn was never going to be a bigger than life, bad arse hero. Rather Jyn was the main character of a darker, grittier movie where the main characters were all destined to die. The humanness of the main character helps audiences connect to them and ups the emotion ... something George could have learnt from when writing Anakin as Space Jesus in Phantom Menace. If you think Anakin is a Gary Stu just because of his intelligence (mechanically in this case), then you're wrong; Jacob Barnett is an American mathematician and child prodigy. At 8 years old, Jacob began sneaking into the back of college lectures at IUPUI. After being diagnosed with autism since the age of two and placed in his school's special ed. program, Jacob's teachers and doctors were astonished to learn he was able to teach calculus to college students. At age nine, while playing with shapes, Jacob built a series of mathematical models that expanded Einstein's field of relativity. A professor at Princeton reviewed his work and confirmed that it was groundbreaking and could someday result in a Nobel Prize. At age 10, Jacob was formally accepted to the University as a full-time college student and went straight into a paid research position in the field of condensed matter physics. For his original work in this field, Jacob set a record, becoming the world's youngest astrophysics researcher. His paper was subsequently accepted for publication by Physical Review A, a scientific journal shared on sites such as NASA, the Smithsonian, and Harvard's webpage. Jacob's work aims to help improve the way light travels in technology. Jacob is also CEO and founder of Wheel LLC, a business he started in his mom's garage, and is in the process of writing a book to help end "math phobia" in his generation. Pod race wise I believe he got some help, lucky or something. And that space fight it was pure luck plus he had R2D2. It's not like Anakin can grab a light saber for the first time and kick trained Jedi master butt and take one second to figure out how to be a better force use then anyone else.
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Post by Iakus on Jan 20, 2018 22:53:50 GMT
Call her a generic action heroine if you must. It's perfectly valid criticism. But if you continue to maintain she is a Sue you have to answer who she is a self insert for. Until then your criticisms are invalid. This sums up Rey adequately. What gets me is all these "marysue omgz sjw shut up omgz" people are basically shitting themselves because Rey is female. It's fairly evident given that other "marysues" get a free pass, like Luke and Anakin. They're willing to overinflate the source material, even the lousy prequels because of it. If anything, Rey is not a symbol of a feminist agenda, she is a generic heroine template cynically put in place because, dating back to the first Underworld film, women have shown they can be in front of a profitable action franchise. I think if the most recent example of a lucrative (if not exactly good) franchise that is responsible for Rey having a vagina is The Hunger Games. If that series had tanked, Rey would probably have been a boy. And I bet even if said boy was characterized exactly like Daisy Ridley's character the "real fan" outrage would be at best a murmur. I have explained several times how Luke and Anakin are not Sues. I have never stated Rey is part of some feminist agenda. I HAVE stated that she is portrayed as being virtually flawless, superpowered even by Jedi standards, and is essentially taking up the banner of both Han Solo and Luke Skywalker (who ended up broken old men who have abandoned their responsibilities). Even to the point of grabbing up R2D2 and Chewbacca as her companions, and taking ownership of the Millennium Falcon and the old Skywalker lightsaber
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Post by mannyray on Jan 20, 2018 23:02:53 GMT
...dating back to the first Underworld film LoLmillennials Ah... to be young & naive again Not a millenial. All those films you show above made money, but a third Alien film ended up in development hell until 1992 because studio suits were bullheadedly pushing for Michael Biehn to become the new protagonist in the series. If you don't believe me, read William Gibson's contracted Alien 3 script. You'll notice Linda Hamilton's character was dead and buried for T3 also. The Fifth Element was a moderate success financially and never got a sequel. The trend goes back to the dollar volume for Underworld. Granted, that success was built on a foundation started with Ripley, LeeLoo Dallas and Sarah Connor, but women gained little ground in the action arena on film until the late 90's/early 2000's.
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Post by mannyray on Jan 20, 2018 23:05:18 GMT
This sums up Rey adequately. What gets me is all these "marysue omgz sjw shut up omgz" people are basically shitting themselves because Rey is female. It's fairly evident given that other "marysues" get a free pass, like Luke and Anakin. They're willing to overinflate the source material, even the lousy prequels because of it. If anything, Rey is not a symbol of a feminist agenda, she is a generic heroine template cynically put in place because, dating back to the first Underworld film, women have shown they can be in front of a profitable action franchise. I think if the most recent example of a lucrative (if not exactly good) franchise that is responsible for Rey having a vagina is The Hunger Games. If that series had tanked, Rey would probably have been a boy. And I bet even if said boy was characterized exactly like Daisy Ridley's character the "real fan" outrage would be at best a murmur. People have explained it over and over on why Rey is just inadequate compared to the previous trilogies. You still the prequels aren't shit? wow. Anyway, it's been explained over and over again why she doesn't fit the definition of Marysue but all we get is " OMGZ SJW SHUT UP MARYSUEMARYSUEEUBOOKSGREATWHAAA!" There are plenty of actual valid criticisms that apply to all the good star wars films as well as the dogshit prequels.
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Post by mannyray on Jan 20, 2018 23:09:59 GMT
This sums up Rey adequately. What gets me is all these "marysue omgz sjw shut up omgz" people are basically shitting themselves because Rey is female. It's fairly evident given that other "marysues" get a free pass, like Luke and Anakin. They're willing to overinflate the source material, even the lousy prequels because of it. If anything, Rey is not a symbol of a feminist agenda, she is a generic heroine template cynically put in place because, dating back to the first Underworld film, women have shown they can be in front of a profitable action franchise. I think if the most recent example of a lucrative (if not exactly good) franchise that is responsible for Rey having a vagina is The Hunger Games. If that series had tanked, Rey would probably have been a boy. And I bet even if said boy was characterized exactly like Daisy Ridley's character the "real fan" outrage would be at best a murmur. I have explained several times how Luke and Anakin are not Sues. I have never stated Rey is part of some feminist agenda. I HAVE stated that she is portrayed as being virtually flawless, superpowered even by Jedi standards, and is essentially taking up the banner of both Han Solo and Luke Skywalker (who ended up broken old men who have abandoned their responsibilities). Even to the point of grabbing up R2D2 and Chewbacca as her companions, and taking ownership of the Millennium Falcon and the old Skywalker lightsaber It seemed it was implied Chewie was the owner of the Falcon. To me anyway. The ship is still there for fanservice regardless. How was R2D2 suddenly her perpetual companion? Anyone with eyes and ears can see that Poe Dameron is the dashing rogue archetype in this film, he's just a military pilot instead of a merc smuggler. And yes, you've inadequately explained her marysueness many times already, and while you may not see a feminist agenda, there's been a lot of butthur rhetoric here from others who do. You may not notice because you agree with them about Rey in other regards. And hey, I can't change your mind if you're angry that the masterworks of art known as the EU novels weren't rigidly adapted for the big screen. *shrug*
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Post by colfoley on Jan 20, 2018 23:11:01 GMT
A slight correction/ appology. The criticism of Rey is valid, even calling her a Mary Sue, to the invididual, if that is what you feel that is what you feel. However, as Andrew Waples pointed out where we differ is on a manner of definition. Our definitions of what constitutes a 'Mary Sue' differs.
To me all the criticisms of Rey are more along the lines of 'cliche generic OP action hero/oine' (thank you Heathenoxman). Now I still disagree with that, to me there is still some nuance and depth to Rey's character (at least as much as can be done in a modern movie given movies only have AT MOST TWO AND A HALF HOURS to tell their respective stories).
As far as the lol millenials argument is concerned mannray is right. Yes Ripley did exist and probably paved the way but then it really did not gain traction until fairly recently. Just like how serialized television probably goes all the way back to the original Battlestar Galactica and...Dallas I think? (1980s cop dramas aren't my thing) but they didn't gain traction until the likes of Babylon 5, Deep Space 9, Fraisier (to some extent) and then up through the modern day with Thrones, Walking Dead, Breaking Bad, etc etc.
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Post by smilesja on Jan 20, 2018 23:46:31 GMT
People have explained it over and over on why Rey is just inadequate compared to the previous trilogies. You still the prequels aren't shit? wow. Anyway, it's been explained over and over again why she doesn't fit the definition of Marysue but all we get is " OMGZ SJW SHUT UP MARYSUEMARYSUEEUBOOKSGREATWHAAA!" There are plenty of actual valid criticisms that apply to all the good star wars films as well as the dogshit prequels.The prequels are very good especially since TLJ was released it made the prequels even better. Rey may not fit the definition but she comes close.
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Post by Andrew Waples on Jan 20, 2018 23:46:47 GMT
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Post by Iakus on Jan 20, 2018 23:46:51 GMT
I have explained several times how Luke and Anakin are not Sues. I have never stated Rey is part of some feminist agenda. I HAVE stated that she is portrayed as being virtually flawless, superpowered even by Jedi standards, and is essentially taking up the banner of both Han Solo and Luke Skywalker (who ended up broken old men who have abandoned their responsibilities). Even to the point of grabbing up R2D2 and Chewbacca as her companions, and taking ownership of the Millennium Falcon and the old Skywalker lightsaber It seemed it was implied Chewie was the owner of the Falcon. To me anyway. The ship is still there for fanservice regardless. How was R2D2 suddenly her perpetual companion? Anyone with eyes and ears can see that Poe Dameron is the dashing rogue archetype in this film, he's just a military pilot instead of a merc smuggler. And yes, you've inadequately explained her marysueness many times already, and while you may not see a feminist agenda, there's been a lot of butthur rhetoric here from others who do. You may not notice because you agree with them about Rey in other regards. Nowhere was it implied. R2 went with her throughout TLJ Rey is the new hotshot pilot of the Falcon If you can't see it at this point I can't help you
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Post by mannyray on Jan 20, 2018 23:51:49 GMT
You still the prequels aren't shit? wow. Anyway, it's been explained over and over again why she doesn't fit the definition of Marysue but all we get is " OMGZ SJW SHUT UP MARYSUEMARYSUEEUBOOKSGREATWHAAA!" There are plenty of actual valid criticisms that apply to all the good star wars films as well as the dogshit prequels.The prequels are very good especially since TLJ was released it made the prequels even better. Rey may not fit the definition but she comes close. You sound like those who defend the cringy flirting in ME:A beyond reason.
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Post by mannyray on Jan 20, 2018 23:52:36 GMT
It seemed it was implied Chewie was the owner of the Falcon. To me anyway. The ship is still there for fanservice regardless. How was R2D2 suddenly her perpetual companion? Anyone with eyes and ears can see that Poe Dameron is the dashing rogue archetype in this film, he's just a military pilot instead of a merc smuggler. And yes, you've inadequately explained her marysueness many times already, and while you may not see a feminist agenda, there's been a lot of butthur rhetoric here from others who do. You may not notice because you agree with them about Rey in other regards. Nowhere was it implied. R2 went with her throughout TLJ Rey is the new hotshot pilot of the Falcon If you can't see it at this point I can't help you Pilot. Not owner. R2 went with her to see Luke so? Keep the visuals coming. This is fun.
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Post by Terminator Force on Jan 21, 2018 0:00:58 GMT
Darth Zhorrid looks better by comparison. So does Dath Fatass Baras Fatass You mean Darth Volus?
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Post by Andrew Waples on Jan 21, 2018 0:02:52 GMT
It seemed it was implied Chewie was the owner of the Falcon. To me anyway. The ship is still there for fanservice regardless. How was R2D2 suddenly her perpetual companion? Anyone with eyes and ears can see that Poe Dameron is the dashing rogue archetype in this film, he's just a military pilot instead of a merc smuggler. And yes, you've inadequately explained her marysueness many times already, and while you may not see a feminist agenda, there's been a lot of butthur rhetoric here from others who do. You may not notice because you agree with them about Rey in other regards. Nowhere was it implied. R2 went with her throughout TLJ Rey is the new hotshot pilot of the Falcon If you can't see it at this point I can't help you I don't recall R2 doing much other then the "you're my only hope" message. As i recall, it was originally supposed to BB-8 to be on the Falcon (at the end of TFA), but Rian said it should be R2. So, for R2 being there- it was not there for Rey's sake, but for Luke's sake.
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Post by decafhigh on Jan 21, 2018 0:06:07 GMT
No: That witch is cray cray. Just started playing TOR again recently and only part way through my IA storyline (no spoilers please), its pretty good so far.
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Post by Terminator Force on Jan 21, 2018 0:12:48 GMT
LoLmillennials *snip* *snip* Ah... to be young & naive again Not a millenial. All those films you show above made money, but a third Alien film ended up in development hell until 1992 because studio suits were bullheadedly pushing for Michael Biehn to become the new protagonist in the series. If you don't believe me, read William Gibson's contracted Alien 3 script. You'll notice Linda Hamilton's character was dead and buried for T3 also. The Fifth Element was a moderate success financially and never got a sequel. The trend goes back to the dollar volume for Underworld. Granted, that success was built on a foundation started with Ripley, LeeLoo Dallas and Sarah Connor, but women gained little ground in the action arena on film until the late 90's/early 2000's. Linda Hamilton was written off because she didn't want to reprise her role.
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Post by Terminator Force on Jan 21, 2018 0:17:12 GMT
People have explained it over and over on why Rey is just inadequate compared to the previous trilogies. You still the prequels aren't shit? wow. Anyway, it's been explained over and over again why she doesn't fit the definition of Marysue but all we get is " OMGZ SJW SHUT UP MARYSUEMARYSUEEUBOOKSGREATWHAAA!" There are plenty of actual valid criticisms that apply to all the good star wars films as well as the dogshit prequels.
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Post by heathenoxman on Jan 21, 2018 0:37:00 GMT
People have explained it over and over on why Rey is just inadequate compared to the previous trilogies. You still the prequels aren't shit? wow. Anyway, it's been explained over and over again why she doesn't fit the definition of Marysue but all we get is " OMGZ SJW SHUT UP MARYSUEMARYSUEEUBOOKSGREATWHAAA!" There are plenty of actual valid criticisms that apply to all the good star wars films as well as the dogshit prequels.She's not a Sue, she's just a vehicle to sell action figures. Most of the female fans I encounter outside of SW forums love Rey. If I was a little girl, I'd love Rey too, but I'm not. She's "plucky generic action hero #45,876. Maybe the books and comic books will give her more depth. Personally, I'm just picky when it comes to my literary references. For example, the ending to ME3 wasn't good, but it wasn't necessarily a "dues ex machina" either.
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Post by alanc9 on Jan 21, 2018 0:41:46 GMT
Not a millenial. All those films you show above made money, but a third Alien film ended up in development hell until 1992 because studio suits were bullheadedly pushing for Michael Biehn to become the new protagonist in the series. If you don't believe me, read William Gibson's contracted Alien 3 script. You'll notice Linda Hamilton's character was dead and buried for T3 also. The Fifth Element was a moderate success financially and never got a sequel. The trend goes back to the dollar volume for Underworld. Granted, that success was built on a foundation started with Ripley, LeeLoo Dallas and Sarah Connor, but women gained little ground in the action arena on film until the late 90's/early 2000's. Linda Hamilton was written off because she didn't want to reprise her role. IIRC she didn't like the particular script.
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Post by mannyray on Jan 21, 2018 0:59:00 GMT
Not a millenial. All those films you show above made money, but a third Alien film ended up in development hell until 1992 because studio suits were bullheadedly pushing for Michael Biehn to become the new protagonist in the series. If you don't believe me, read William Gibson's contracted Alien 3 script. You'll notice Linda Hamilton's character was dead and buried for T3 also. The Fifth Element was a moderate success financially and never got a sequel. The trend goes back to the dollar volume for Underworld. Granted, that success was built on a foundation started with Ripley, LeeLoo Dallas and Sarah Connor, but women gained little ground in the action arena on film until the late 90's/early 2000's. Linda Hamilton was written off because she didn't want to reprise her role. This renders my point about Underworld being the pivot point how?
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