Iakus
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Post by Iakus on Jan 8, 2020 5:32:30 GMT
Wait... baby Yoda can Force heal? I'm sure Anakin's force ghost head is spinning. Yeah. He tries to heal Mando in Episode 2 and heals the Guildmaster in Episode 7. So both in canon timeline and reality Rey wasn’t the first to have this power. In the DISNEY canon, at least...
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jan 8, 2020 5:33:12 GMT
Yeah. He tries to heal Mando in Episode 2 and heals the Guildmaster in Episode 7. So both in canon timeline and reality Rey wasn’t the first to have this power. Right, so for minute there Kylo finally became more powerful than Vader. Guess he checked that off his bucket list. ”I will finish...what you started” meant saving someone they cared about.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jan 8, 2020 5:33:47 GMT
Yeah. He tries to heal Mando in Episode 2 and heals the Guildmaster in Episode 7. So both in canon timeline and reality Rey wasn’t the first to have this power. In the DISNEY canon, at least... So canon then.
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Iakus
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Post by Iakus on Jan 8, 2020 6:21:57 GMT
In the DISNEY canon, at least... So canon then. Not to me. This is nothing more than Disney fanfiction.
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Post by colfoley on Jan 8, 2020 6:24:00 GMT
Not to me. This is nothing more than Disney fanfiction. you say that it's a bad thing.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jan 8, 2020 6:28:05 GMT
Not to me. This is nothing more than Disney fanfiction. Then you’re wrong. Which is fine so long as you acknowledge it.
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Iakus
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Post by Iakus on Jan 8, 2020 14:10:46 GMT
Not to me. This is nothing more than Disney fanfiction. you say that it's a bad thing. It wouldn't be a bad thing if they didn't treat the original characters and material like dirt.
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Iakus
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Post by Iakus on Jan 8, 2020 14:18:07 GMT
Not to me. This is nothing more than Disney fanfiction. Then you’re wrong. Which is fine so long as you acknowledge it. You probably think all the Highlander movies are canon, don't you?
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jan 8, 2020 14:41:30 GMT
Then you’re wrong. Which is fine so long as you acknowledge it. You probably think all the Highlander movies are canon, don't you? I don’t watch the Highlander movies.
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Post by masterwarderz on Jan 8, 2020 15:00:25 GMT
You probably think all the Highlander movies are canon, don't you? I don’t watch the Highlander movies. To be fair some of them are as bad as the new Star Wars movies so I don't blame you
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Post by masterwarderz on Jan 8, 2020 15:03:24 GMT
Not to me. This is nothing more than Disney fanfiction. Then you’re wrong. Which is fine so long as you acknowledge it. No. Actually it's Disney that's wrong. They try to pretend that all the old material doesn't exist. I mean in a literal rather then figurative fashion. Man Kennedy looks like a tard in the internet era. Seriously how deranged does a person have to be to rip off source material and then claim that what you stole from doesn't exist. ._. Pretty sure that 100 years ago that'd have been cited as some form of lunacy.
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Post by masterwarderz on Jan 8, 2020 15:04:40 GMT
Not to me. This is nothing more than Disney fanfiction. you say that it's a bad thing. Most fanfiction is just shipping so... I'd say yeah it is pretty bad.
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Post by KaiserShep on Jan 8, 2020 15:25:44 GMT
Regarding the Force, it's kind of a shame that it has no real consistency established throughout the franchise, thus just cannot be taken seriously to any degree anymore. Random characters just have these crazy powers that they can just wield with whatever ease or difficulty as the plot demands. Yoda, a seasoned Jedi veteran has to concentrate to pull an X-Wing out of a bog, but then Grampa Darko can just yank destroyers out of an icy abyss, or have Jake's sister Peter Pan her way to safety after being blown out into space. So long as all of these things are canon, the Force as a phenomenon within this fictional world is fundamentally broken. Any characters in the future that can wield it afterward will just be heavily nerfed scrubs that need to get their rookie midichlorian numbers up.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jan 8, 2020 15:28:26 GMT
Regarding the Force, it's kind of a shame that it has no real consistency established throughout the franchise, thus just cannot be taken seriously to any degree anymore. Random characters just have these crazy powers that they can just wield with whatever ease or difficulty as the plot demands. Yoda, a seasoned Jedi veteran has to concentrate to pull an X-Wing out of a bog, but then Grampa Darko can just yank destroyers out of an icy abyss, or have Jake's sister Peter Pan her way to safety after being blown out into space. So long as all of these things are canon, the Force as a phenomenon within this fictional world is fundamentally broken. Any characters in the future that can wield it afterward will just be heavily nerfed scrubs that need to get their rookie midichlorian numbers up. From the shot, it looked like the Star Destroyers lifted themselves from the ice. You even see the control tower that helps them navigate the atmosphere activated.
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Post by Obadiah on Jan 8, 2020 15:31:03 GMT
Right, so for minute there Kylo finally became more powerful than Vader. Guess he checked that off his bucket list. ”I will finish...what you started” meant saving someone they cared about. Pfft! I WISH the new trilogy paid enough attention to the prequels to have used that reference as part of the climax of Ben Solo's twisted journey. Speaking of missed prequel references... you say that it's a bad thing. It wouldn't be a bad thing if they didn't treat the original characters and material like dirt.
Guess who is probably still buried in it at the Skywalker homestead on Tatoooine that Rise of Skywalker completely doesn't acknowledge? Shmi Skywalker! Yet another simple reference this movie could have added that would have made it a more fitting and complete finale.
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Post by Obadiah on Jan 8, 2020 15:38:05 GMT
Regarding the Force, it's kind of a shame that it has no real consistency established throughout the franchise, thus just cannot be taken seriously to any degree anymore. Random characters just have these crazy powers that they can just wield with whatever ease or difficulty as the plot demands. Yoda, a seasoned Jedi veteran has to concentrate to pull an X-Wing out of a bog, but then Grampa Darko can just yank destroyers out of an icy abyss, or have Jake's sister Peter Pan her way to safety after being blown out into space. So long as all of these things are canon, the Force as a phenomenon within this fictional world is fundamentally broken. Any characters in the future that can wield it afterward will just be heavily nerfed scrubs that need to get their rookie midichlorian numbers up. To be fair, less powerfull characters would probably make them part of a more interesting story. Poe is another example of someone overpowered in the new trilogy. The way he handles the X-Wing (which, I admit, I don't actually know how to fly) looks absurd. A movie about someone with less flying skill who doesn't win every fight he is in is probably more interesting.
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Post by Iakus on Jan 8, 2020 16:11:41 GMT
Regarding the Force, it's kind of a shame that it has no real consistency established throughout the franchise, thus just cannot be taken seriously to any degree anymore. Random characters just have these crazy powers that they can just wield with whatever ease or difficulty as the plot demands. Yoda, a seasoned Jedi veteran has to concentrate to pull an X-Wing out of a bog, but then Grampa Darko can just yank destroyers out of an icy abyss, or have Jake's sister Peter Pan her way to safety after being blown out into space. So long as all of these things are canon, the Force as a phenomenon within this fictional world is fundamentally broken. Any characters in the future that can wield it afterward will just be heavily nerfed scrubs that need to get their rookie midichlorian numbers up. To be fair, less powerfull characters would probably make them part of a more interesting story. Sanderson's Second law "Limitations are more important than powers" Thus why Finn was the more interesting character.
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Post by KaiserShep on Jan 8, 2020 16:51:59 GMT
To be fair, less powerfull characters would probably make them part of a more interesting story. Sanderson's Second law "Limitations are more important than powers" Thus why Finn was the more interesting character. My problem with Finn goes back to TFA. The fast pacing of the plot just didn't allow us to see the progression from indoctrinated drone to someone breaking free and joining the resistance. I guess it doesn't help that the First Order is basically just space nazis, with Hux being Ginger Hitler on the Starkiller base.
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Post by Iakus on Jan 8, 2020 17:38:44 GMT
Sanderson's Second law "Limitations are more important than powers" Thus why Finn was the more interesting character. My problem with Finn goes back to TFA. The fast pacing of the plot just didn't allow us to see the progression from indoctrinated drone to someone breaking free and joining the resistance. I guess it doesn't help that the First Order is basically just space nazis, with Hux being Ginger Hitler on the Starkiller base. True. But we do get to see him grow from a deserter without a real identity to a genuine hero of the Rebellion Resistance. He started out just wanting to get as far away from the Empire First Order as possible, to eventually taking a stand against them.
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Post by colfoley on Jan 8, 2020 18:32:24 GMT
Regarding the Force, it's kind of a shame that it has no real consistency established throughout the franchise, thus just cannot be taken seriously to any degree anymore. Random characters just have these crazy powers that they can just wield with whatever ease or difficulty as the plot demands. Yoda, a seasoned Jedi veteran has to concentrate to pull an X-Wing out of a bog, but then Grampa Darko can just yank destroyers out of an icy abyss, or have Jake's sister Peter Pan her way to safety after being blown out into space. So long as all of these things are canon, the Force as a phenomenon within this fictional world is fundamentally broken. Any characters in the future that can wield it afterward will just be heavily nerfed scrubs that need to get their rookie midichlorian numbers up. This kind of thing does show up quite often whether its Oliver Queen getting beat up by street thugs and then two episodes later going through a phalanx of corrupt cops (ok maybe not that bad) or Voyager having way more then 32 torpedoes. I wouldn't worry over much about nerfs. Even in SWs its maddening that Obi-wan, one of the strongest councilors ever, gets tossed around like a rag doll by Dooku and yet is able to go toe to toe with the Chosen One. Or I was watching an episode of Clone Wars the other day and it was established that size matters not AND YET it took both Obi-wan and Anakin to lift a boulder. Fortunatley though Disney has written themselves an out. Even Rey for all her power is destined to be less so.
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Post by skekSil on Jan 8, 2020 20:55:54 GMT
Truly? Because that line got abandoned in a hurry as its not implied how long he spent there save the time it took the Falcon to get to Cloud City, that's the only metric of time presented in the films and you asserting that it was two days goes contrary to literally everything ever written about it back in the EU, by Lucas, or even the new shit. The high end water mark as I said before was half a year. Im not discussing canon I am discussing a movie. When people went to movie theatre in 1980 they didn't have access to comics, novels or wikipedia articles, they had to infer pacing of time from what they had seen on screen. And what is shown there does not suggests that Millenium Falcon spent months getting to Bespin. They didn't do any setup to indicate this was a case: Han does not say "well, it'll take us two months but we will get there", There is no text on a screen "two months later", we dont see Han or Luke growing a proper beard, they dont even change clothes since Hoth. And Lando doesn't hug Han and say "Its good to see you - Gee you should take a bath!" Furthermore if they spent so much time on Falcon Han's romance with Leia should have advanced quite far. Also they had Boba Fett folowing them, by second week he should have figured out that their hyperdrive is out, where they are heading, when will they be there and called Vader to tell him coordinates whre to intercept them rather then wait another month or so till they get to Bespin. That canon material you are talking about was made to cover Kershner's and Lucas's screw up. So they're loads of functioning, unscavenged droids all around, and she's dirt poor, turning in scraps, only able to afford a portion of a meal? I didn't say they are all functioning but there should be enough of them for her to find some in working or fixable condition.As to their value - Anakin built one from scrapyard parts, I doubt they are very valuable. And then there is a fact that she had to sell everything to a single fence which made her profit even smaller.
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Post by Evil on Jan 8, 2020 21:55:59 GMT
Even in SWs its maddening that Obi-wan, one of the strongest councilors ever, gets tossed around like a rag doll by Dooku and yet is able to go toe to toe with the Chosen One. That's only an issue if one assumes that the force works by just making wishes and believing. If one ignores such an idiotic concept and instead goes by the older idea of raw potential not meaning much without learning how to properly apply it then it makes perfect sense. Dooku is far older than Obi-Wan, and he's spent pretty much his entire life learning how to maximise his potential, especially when up against other force users. That's why he's one of very, very few makashi/form 2 users. Its an anti-lightsabre sightsabre style. Imagine watching an arm wrestling competition between 2 other people. One is a weight lifting champion, the other is a arm wrestling professional of mid tier level. I'd bet on the arm wrestler winning, despite the weight lifter having more muscle and more trophies. Looking at just the Lukas films, Obi-Wans performance VS those two is internally consistent. If its inconsistent with the Disney "films" then that's a Disney problem, not a Star Wars problem.
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Post by Iakus on Jan 8, 2020 22:08:24 GMT
Truly? Because that line got abandoned in a hurry as its not implied how long he spent there save the time it took the Falcon to get to Cloud City, that's the only metric of time presented in the films and you asserting that it was two days goes contrary to literally everything ever written about it back in the EU, by Lucas, or even the new shit. The high end water mark as I said before was half a year. Im not discussing canon I am discussing a movie. When people went to movie theatre in 1980 they didn't have access to comics, novels or wikipedia articles, they had to infer pacing of time from what they had seen on screen. And what is shown there does not suggests that Millenium Falcon spent months getting to Bespin. They didn't do any setup to indicate this was a case: Han does not say "well, it'll take us two months but we will get there", There is no text on a screen "two months later", we dont see Han or Luke growing a proper beard, they dont even change clothes since Hoth. And Lando doesn't hug Han and say "Its good to see you - Gee you should take a bath!" Furthermore if they spent so much time on Falcon Han's romance with Leia should have advanced quite far. Also they had Boba Fett folowing them, by second week he should have figured out that their hyperdrive is out, where they are heading, when will they be there and called Vader to tell him coordinates whre to intercept them rather then wait another month or so till they get to Bespin. That canon material you are talking about was made to cover Kershner's and Lucas's screw up. Traveling light years at sublight speeds is gonna take a while. That's not an implication, that's a fact. Granted there are few external clues, such as beards or changes of clothes. But Han and Leia remain remarkably clean while hanging with the Ewoks too. And there are no changes of clothes When the Falcon travels from Tatooine to Alderaan. Or from Alderaan to Yavin. For that matter, the prequels didn't show much of the passage of time from Naboo to Tatooine, from Tatooine to Coruscant (particularly interesting given Coruscant being the capital of the Republic and Tatooine being "if there is a bright center of the universe, you're on the planet it's furthest from"), etc. I'd say the Han and Leia romance advances quite far given they started out on Hoth with "I'd rather kiss a Wookie!" and ends on Bespin with "I love you" As for the Boba Fett thing, once they know where they are headed, why not let then feel like they had succeeded? Capturing Han and Leia was never the goal. They were just bait to get Luke.They had already proven resourceful in eluding the Imperial FLeet even without a hyperdrive. Why keep chasing them, lose more fighters, tie up the Executer and the rest of its flotilla, when they could beat them to Bespin set a trap for them, AND set up a trap for Luke all on one go?
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Post by Iakus on Jan 8, 2020 22:10:36 GMT
Even in SWs its maddening that Obi-wan, one of the strongest councilors ever, gets tossed around like a rag doll by Dooku and yet is able to go toe to toe with the Chosen One. Or I was watching an episode of Clone Wars the other day and it was established that size matters not AND YET it took both Obi-wan and Anakin to lift a boulder. My understanding was that Obi Won was only of average strength. The reason he could hold out so long against Anakin was because he trained him, and knew all his moves, strengths, and weaknesses better than anyone else.
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Post by Hier0phant on Jan 8, 2020 22:27:13 GMT
Truly? Because that line got abandoned in a hurry as its not implied how long he spent there save the time it took the Falcon to get to Cloud City, that's the only metric of time presented in the films and you asserting that it was two days goes contrary to literally everything ever written about it back in the EU, by Lucas, or even the new shit. The high end water mark as I said before was half a year. Im not discussing canon I am discussing a movie. When people went to movie theatre in 1980 they didn't have access to comics, novels or wikipedia articles, they had to infer pacing of time from what they had seen on screen. And what is shown there does not suggests that Millenium Falcon spent months getting to Bespin. They didn't do any setup to indicate this was a case: Han does not say "well, it'll take us two months but we will get there", There is no text on a screen "two months later", we dont see Han or Luke growing a proper beard, they dont even change clothes since Hoth. And Lando doesn't hug Han and say "Its good to see you - Gee you should take a bath!" Furthermore if they spent so much time on Falcon Han's romance with Leia should have advanced quite far. Also they had Boba Fett folowing them, by second week he should have figured out that their hyperdrive is out, where they are heading, when will they be there and called Vader to tell him coordinates whre to intercept them rather then wait another month or so till they get to Bespin. That canon material you are talking about was made to cover Kershner's and Lucas's screw up. 6 months is the high end estimate before Disney canon which is now the new canon via Pablo Hidalgo (time runs differently on Dagobah), while the approximate for the pre Disney canon was 1 month. About the hygiene during the trip, the Falcon has a bathroom (called the Head) a cargo bay that's potentially filled with supplies, while Han has a wardrode of unknown size as evidenced by Luke wearing one of his outfits to the award ceremony at the end of ANH. Luke and Han shaving could easily take place offscreen nevermind Lucas potentially halting production so that Ford and Hamill could properly grow beards that will promptly be shaven would be costly for such a little detail that the majority of the audience wouldn't notice or care for. Lucas fucking up with the pacing in TESB is one of the legitimate criticisms of the film that still holds true 4 decades later, and him not knowing the time it will take a sublightspeed ship to cover the distance of a light-year or few to the next star system, beyond having Han state "It's a long way but i think we can make it". 2 days won't cover it.
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