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Post by mybudgee on Jul 5, 2018 17:46:06 GMT
Here's hoping Mr. Iger does something soon to correct this idiocy and puts this franchise back on track... [snip]
Like listening to whinny entitled fanboys who don't know what they want in a film (or about anything else) other than they want everything just like 1977 (which isn't going to happen) and then when they make a film for you like with TFA and then all they do is whine and bitch and want something "new and different" then when they do that and give them a superior and much better film like TLJ (which in my honest OPINION is the greatest Star Wars film ever made ...
This is your idea of greatness, huh? WOW. Just Wow... [img src="i.pinimg.com/originals/e6/ab/e4/e6abe40385ad5bcc703ca3000cbbb001.gif" height="24" width="24" src="http://i.imgur.com/tZow8hc.png"]
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Post by griffith82 on Jul 5, 2018 17:50:49 GMT
People these days have no idea what good storytelling is. They want everything laid out no assumptions or anything. I miss the good old days. Please enlighten me tö what goöd störytelling is. And höw TLJ accomplishes this. Good storytelling involves several things. One the story must have a beginning, middle and end. Characters must know their motivations and it must be obvious to the viewer/reader. Also the plot needs to be coherent but every single action does not need to be spelled out and can be left ambiguous.
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Post by CrutchCricket on Jul 5, 2018 17:57:03 GMT
Yeah, just like when Qui-Gon didn't want Amidala and the Naboo to rely on him because he couldn't "fight a war for them", he and Obi-wan fucked off to the planet's core to avoid- oh wait, no they didn't because Qui-Gon mastered the secret Force technique of telling people "yo, I'm not gonna carry your ass, find a way to deal with your shit." Dude this is Wiseau "logic" right here. Do you understand life? As a mod you really should know better not to insult people.
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Post by mybudgee on Jul 5, 2018 17:58:57 GMT
Please enlighten me tö what goöd störytelling is. And höw TLJ accomplishes this. Good storytelling involves several things. One the story must have a beginning, middle and end. Characters must know their motivations and it must be obvious to the viewer/reader. Also the plot needs to be coherent but every single action does not need to be spelled out and can be left ambiguous. Now this is contradictory, as earlier you claimed that ambiguity is better in movies. Everything DOES NOT need to be explicitly explained. So which is it??? Also, can I please try to guess your top 3 all-time movies based on your posts? Okay, here goes: Am I close?
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Post by Cyberstrike on Jul 5, 2018 18:01:53 GMT
Like listening to whinny entitled fanboys who don't know what they want in a film (or about anything else) other than they want everything just like 1977 (which isn't going to happen) and then when they make a film for you like with TFA and then all they do is whine and bitch and want something "new and different" then when they do that and give them a superior and much better film like TLJ (which in my honest OPINION is the greatest Star Wars film ever made ...
This is your idea of greatness, huh? WOW. Just Wow... [img src="i.pinimg.com/originals/e6/ab/e4/e6abe40385ad5bcc703ca3000cbbb001.gif" height="24" width="24" src="http://i.imgur.com/tZow8hc.png"]
As opposed to what? A New Hope A film made 41 years ago and is barely watchable in any version. 2D characters and wooden dialogue?
The Empire Strikes Back a film that is half a swamp movie and the other half is a riff on Rio Bravo and El Dorardo. The Return of the Jedi a bunch of plot contrivances and a climax that is just rehash of the original.
The prequels with more wooden dialogue and CGI
The Force Awakens a remix of A New Hope.
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Post by Cyberstrike on Jul 5, 2018 18:03:30 GMT
Good storytelling involves several things. One the story must have a beginning, middle and end. Characters must know their motivations and it must be obvious to the viewer/reader. Also the plot needs to be coherent but every single action does not need to be spelled out and can be left ambiguous. Now this is contradictory, as earlier you claimed that ambiguity is better in movies. Everything DOES NOT need to be explicitly explained. So which is it??? Also, can I please try to guess your top 3 all-time movies based on your posts? Okay, here goes: Am I close?
Got issues with women in leading roles?
Am I close?
For me I've never seen Twilight and Fifty Shades and have no plans to because they're not for me, now I've seen Ghostbusters and it is just as funny as the original. and a lot of fun.
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Post by Iakus on Jul 5, 2018 18:04:25 GMT
>>Since when assuming is part of a good story telling? I think it's literally a rule for good story telling, don't waste time explaining something so obvious that it can be assumed. Its, like, more important than the "show don't tell" rule. The whole scene is Luke going to confront Ben, so obviously he knew of the dark in Ben and tried to reach out to him earlier. >> Also he insists in reaching out to his father who has already killed indiscriminately children (and Sand people and God knows who else) and he'll try to murder his nephew who actually did nothing? Yeah, Luke was probably much less idealistic at this stage of life anyway, and was far more aware of what was at stake. And he didn't try to murder him, the thought crossed his mind for a moment. Obi-Wan and Yoda have a conversation in the novelization of The Revenge of the Sith that each would kill the other if they thought it would end the war, and that Anakin was different because he was more loyal to people than principals. Not sure what Luke saw in Ben, but if it was a dark future, in that moment he chose Ben, and Ben chose himself. People these days have no idea what good storytelling is. They want everything laid out no assumptions or anything. I miss the good old days. Character consistency is the death of good storytelling. True story.
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Post by CrutchCricket on Jul 5, 2018 18:04:26 GMT
Qui-Gon lived at a time when Jedi were more common and not the singular savior of the Republic. He could say that and people would accept it, or learn to accept it. Luke killed the Emperor and Vader, savior of the Republic that, from his point of view, would not stop relying on him unless he was removed. Hell, he left and they were STILL looking for him to save them. It's really not that hard to understand. Qui-Gon was the only Jedi Master available to Amidala during the Naboo crisis. Same context, different scale. Never mind that "numbers" is a complete non-factor to asking people to leave you alone. Also never mind that you're contradicting yourself: "singular savior of the Republic" vs "one guy taking on the Empire? lol" of a few posts earlier. But speaking of leaving people alone, I guess I gotta stop, since proving you wrong = insulting you, according to some people. good memes though.
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Post by Iakus on Jul 5, 2018 18:05:26 GMT
As opposed to what? A New Hope A film made 41 years ago and is barely watchable in any version. 2D characters and wooden dialogue?
The Empire Strikes Back a film that is half a swamp movie and the other half is a riff on Rio Bravo and El Dorardo. The Return of the Jedi a bunch of plot contrivances and a climax that is just rehash of the original.
The prequels with more wooden dialogue and CGI
The Force Awakens a remix of A New Hope.
TLJ: the movie for Star Wars fans who hate Star Wars?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 5, 2018 18:05:46 GMT
Yeah, just like when Qui-Gon didn't want Amidala and the Naboo to rely on him because he couldn't "fight a war for them", he and Obi-wan fucked off to the planet's core to avoid- oh wait, no they didn't because Qui-Gon mastered the secret Force technique of telling people "yo, I'm not gonna carry your ass, find a way to deal with your shit." Dude this is Wiseau "logic" right here. Do you understand life? As a mod you really should know better not to insult people.
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Post by docsteely on Jul 5, 2018 18:06:10 GMT
Since when assuming is part of a good story telling?
Also he insists in reaching out to his father who has already killed indiscriminately children (and Sand people and God knows who else) and he'll try to murder his nephew who actually did nothing? >>Since when assuming is part of a good story telling? 1. I think it's literally a rule for good story telling, don't waste time explaining something so obvious that it can be assumed. Its, like, more important than the "show don't tell" rule. The whole scene is Luke going to confront Ben, so obviously he knew of the dark in Ben and tried to reach out to him earlier.
>> Also he insists in reaching out to his father who has already killed indiscriminately children (and Sand people and God knows who else) and he'll try to murder his nephew who actually did nothing? 2. Yeah, Luke was probably much less idealistic at this stage of life anyway, and was far more aware of what was at stake. And he didn't try to murder him, the thought crossed his mind for a moment. 3.Obi-Wan and Yoda have a conversation in the novelization of The Revenge of the Sith that each would kill the other if they thought it would end the war, and that Anakin was different because he was more loyal to people than principals. Not sure what Luke saw in Ben, but if it was a dark future, in that moment he chose Ben, and Ben chose himself.1. Not when the assumption is so big as to contradict the whole character building that came before. You jump directly to a conclusion without exposing your arguments first. And Luke is not going to confront Ben, he's pulled out his lightsaber to strike him in his sleep and that is outright attempted murder.
2. Why should Luke become less idealistic at that stage of life? What happened to turn him into an impulse driven idiot? Even if you argue that in the end he did not intend to murder Kylo the fact remains that he pulled out his lightsaber to strike him in his sleep. That's acting on impulse and is light years away from anything a Jedi ever was. 3. I fail to see the connection so please elaborate. And I suppose you mean more loyal to principles not principals.
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Post by Qui-Gon GlenN7 on Jul 5, 2018 18:06:54 GMT
Millennial misses good old days.
This thread has it all.
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Post by mybudgee on Jul 5, 2018 18:07:15 GMT
This is your idea of greatness, huh? WOW. Just Wow... [snip]
As opposed to what? A New Hope A film made 41 years ago and is barely watchable in any version. 2D characters and wooden dialogue?
The Empire Strikes Back a film that is half a swamp movie and the other half is a riff on Rio Bravo and El Dorardo. The Return of the Jedi a bunch of plot contrivances and a climax that is just rehash of the original.
I cannot take you kids seriously when you say this type of shit. It boggles my mind that standards can actually be this low ...
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Post by Cyberstrike on Jul 5, 2018 18:11:34 GMT
As opposed to what? A New Hope A film made 41 years ago and is barely watchable in any version. 2D characters and wooden dialogue?
The Empire Strikes Back a film that is half a swamp movie and the other half is a riff on Rio Bravo and El Dorardo. The Return of the Jedi a bunch of plot contrivances and a climax that is just rehash of the original.
The prequels with more wooden dialogue and CGI
The Force Awakens a remix of A New Hope.
TLJ: the movie for Star Wars fans who hate Star Wars?
I don't hate Star Wars I just don't make a damn religion out of it like a lot of people here do.
To me it's a bunch of movies some better than others and a few video games and comic books outside of that I find a lot of the so called "fans" are the real haters, while casual fans are bullied because they don't follow "Disney raped my childhood" bullshit.
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Post by Arijon van Goyen on Jul 5, 2018 18:12:12 GMT
Truth & logic do not exist or if they do they are so relative they're just opinions. #postmodernism #hashtag Postmodernism is a concept. Logic is not, Logic is not relative. That's the point of logic. God damn. Pretty sure you know this. Irony post? Kinda simple/meme-posting. Back in 2005 b4 going to university I learned some Aristotelian logic for the final exam which was very useful and slightly revolutionized my mind. Quite sufficient I say, I didn't even bother to learn Kant's system of logic. I actually needed to learn some philosophy of history and economics to achieve my final form!
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Post by HK90210 on Jul 5, 2018 18:12:41 GMT
As opposed to what? A New Hope A film made 41 years ago and is barely watchable in any version. 2D characters and wooden dialogue?
The Empire Strikes Back a film that is half a swamp movie and the other half is a riff on Rio Bravo and El Dorardo. The Return of the Jedi a bunch of plot contrivances and a climax that is just rehash of the original.
The prequels with more wooden dialogue and CGI
The Force Awakens a remix of A New Hope.
Ah, so you just don't like Star Wars. Fair enough. I've been on board with everything up until TLJ. Loved them for all their(few) flaws. Heck, I liked Solo, too. But what do I know about good Star Wars movies. I've only loved all but one of them.
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Post by Andrew Waples on Jul 5, 2018 18:13:23 GMT
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Post by CrutchCricket on Jul 5, 2018 18:14:19 GMT
As a mod you really should know better not to insult people. The more you know More people here should watch the glorious negaverse badness that is The Room. I get the feeling it would explain so much about the nature of shittiness and when it's ok to revel in it.
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Post by griffith82 on Jul 5, 2018 18:15:03 GMT
Good storytelling involves several things. One the story must have a beginning, middle and end. Characters must know their motivations and it must be obvious to the viewer/reader. Also the plot needs to be coherent but every single action does not need to be spelled out and can be left ambiguous. Now this is contradictory, as earlier you claimed that ambiguity is better in movies. Everything DOES NOT need to be explicitly explained. So which is it??? Also, can I please try to guess your top 3 all-time movies based on your posts? Okay, here goes: Am I close? First I hate Twilight and Fifty Shades and the new Ghostbusters pale in comparison so nice try. Also I said all the motivation doesn’t need to be spelled out.
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Post by Cyberstrike on Jul 5, 2018 18:15:08 GMT
As opposed to what? A New Hope A film made 41 years ago and is barely watchable in any version. 2D characters and wooden dialogue?
The Empire Strikes Back a film that is half a swamp movie and the other half is a riff on Rio Bravo and El Dorardo. The Return of the Jedi a bunch of plot contrivances and a climax that is just rehash of the original.
I cannot take you kids seriously when you say this type of shit. It boggles my mind that standards can actually be this low ...
Actually I'm 40 years old. Maybe you need to expand your movie tastes.
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Post by mybudgee on Jul 5, 2018 18:15:56 GMT
Millennial misses good old days. This thread has it all.
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Post by Arijon van Goyen on Jul 5, 2018 18:16:06 GMT
No, Obi Wan and Yoda just went off into hiding for 20 years while the galactic republic collapsed and was ruled by the Empire. Wasn't Yoda the one who told Luke to GTFO? wat Obi-wan kept watch over Luke, he didn't fuck off to a rando rock in the middle of the ocean. Yoda tried to kill the Emperor but failed. He had to hide on Dagobah to mask his Force presence or he would've been found and killed (or be forced to uselessly kill wave after wave of mooks sent after him). Again, didn't just fuck off for no reason. And what movie were you watching where Yoda told Luke to GTFO? Oh the same Disney crap. Yeah, checkmate there I guess
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Post by warden on Jul 5, 2018 18:18:54 GMT
Anyone remembers how Mara Jade goes from Emperor's Hand to Master Jedi? That one, was one hell of a ride to read in the past.
If I can be cheesy, the romance between her and Luke was very cool. At some points there was a bit of cliche (again, at some points only) but when you do them correctly it pays off.
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Post by Iakus on Jul 5, 2018 18:21:59 GMT
TLJ: the movie for Star Wars fans who hate Star Wars?
I don't hate Star Wars I just don't make a damn religion out of it like a lot of people here do.
To me it's a bunch of movies some better than others and a few video games and comic books outside of that I find a lot of the so called "fans" are the real haters, while casual fans are bullied because they don't follow "Disney raped my childhood" bullshit.
Funny, I see a lot of "casual" fans bullying so-called "haters" as being racist, sexist misogynistic, homophobic, and of -ists and -phobes for daring to have wrongthink concerning Disney Wars. Star Wars is one of the older fandoms. It spans two full generations who have grown up with the adventures of Luke Skywalker, Han Solo, Leia Organa, etc. You don't treat it with respect, there will be pushback. This isn't "toxicity", it's a natural freaking reaction! A SMART writer or director would have realized they were caretakers every bit as much as they were creators and would have worked on shaping a trilogy that reflected the original trilogy's magic, not as a chance to canonize their fanfiction. DC comics made teat mistake a few years ago, and ended up creating a whole "Rebirth" launch to try and roll back some of their more egregious missteps. Unfortunately, Star Wars doesn't deal so much with time travel, parallel universes, and such. So they're kinda stuck with the dumpster fire they've created.
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Post by Qui-Gon GlenN7 on Jul 5, 2018 18:22:33 GMT
A New Hope is unwatchable, wooden, etc.
Noted.
I will absolutely not enjoy it when I choose to watch it again, for the 18 millionth time, for the unassailable logic presented without premise.
Glad I own the VHS trilogy, where Han shoots Greedo in the balls because he's a badass space pirate. Wooden as fuck.
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