dmc1001
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Post by dmc1001 on Apr 4, 2017 16:31:41 GMT
So, now that I'm reading the book (not very far in), I'm starting to become slightly more sympathetic to her. She was optimistic about a bright new future in Andromeda and things didn't work out. I can understand leaving the Nexus but generally find her behavior on Kadara to be inexcusable.
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Post by raikas on Apr 11, 2017 19:12:30 GMT
I'm in the middle of the book, and I'm a little surprised by how many people I've seen say it makes them more sympathetic to Sloane. She seems competent enough within a limited role, but early on in it she has a conversation with Tann where he comments that he'd would rather sacrifice ten people in the present to save a thousand in the future. Her response (that she'd rather save one person immediately than consider the future, and the implied threat to Tann if he tried to make a different decision) really made her seem short-sighted. Maybe my opinion will change later in the book, but I came away from that thinking that she definitely shouldn't be in charge of more than a small team of individuals because she's clearly not capable of considering the greater good.
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Post by Catilina on Apr 11, 2017 19:25:35 GMT
Never let to rule a tyrant too long time. Unhealthy. Easily to grow insolent. I let the sharpshooter eliminate her. This always a good choice. Who will the next?
Sloane just cares about people, who loyal to her, and give a shit to others, and kills, who disagree. It should not be that people would believe these bastards shall be inviolable. No matter running the business or not, the long-term corruption is never good.
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Post by Ashii6 on Apr 11, 2017 19:32:28 GMT
I'm in the middle of the book, and I'm a little surprised by how many people I've seen say it makes them more sympathetic to Sloane. She seems competent enough within a limited role, but early on in it she has a conversation with Tann where he comments that he'd would rather sacrifice ten people in the present to save a thousand in the future. Her response (that she'd rather save one person immediately than consider the future, and the implied threat to Tann if he tried to make a different decision) really made her seem short-sighted. Maybe my opinion will change later in the book, but I came away from that thinking that she definitely shouldn't be in charge of more than a small team of individuals because she's clearly not capable of considering the greater good. She just didn't want to make this cold calculation at that moment. The exact same question Garrus asks Shepard in ME3. We can agree or disagree. That doesn't make a person shortsighted. That person doesn't want to already scratch these people if there IS a chance to save them. Sloane isn't very popular, but I like her. She's one of the most interesting character for me in ME. I'm saving her from that sniper shot and I'm repaying Reyes the favor with shooting him. Too bad we actually can't kill him, since Sloane can die. That scratches her chances to be in some DLC or Andromeda 2
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Post by raikas on Apr 11, 2017 20:34:58 GMT
She just didn't want to make this cold calculation at that moment. The exact same question Garrus asks Shepard in ME3. We can agree or disagree. That doesn't make a person shortsighted. That person doesn't want to already scratch these people if there IS a chance to save them. We can certainly agree or disagree, I just happen to personally disagree with her angle. The bit that I see in Tann's favour is his ability to quickly perform the math. In the moment, that means he is going to be able to quickly asses the probability of an action having long-term benefits. He's definitely socially obnoxious, but he's not wrong. Sloane wanting to go for the more immediate life-saving results is definitely short-term thinking. But yeah, I certainly think we're not presented with either as a clear right or wrong within the book or the game since some people are naturally going to care more about the person absolutely dying in front of them rather than the hypothetical people who live in a year. I definitely think Sloane is more interesting now that I've read more of her backstory - I feel like the in-game content game made her more of a cartoonish mob boss, so I like that there's more nuance to her story. As for Reyes, I assume he's unkillable because there are future plans for him (I'm assuming in DLC, although maybe in a sequel) and they don't want to have to spend double the money on writing and voice acting by setting up a Virmire situation where we could have one character versus another.
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Post by Ashii6 on Apr 12, 2017 5:42:29 GMT
As for Reyes, I assume he's unkillable because there are future plans for him (I'm assuming in DLC, although maybe in a sequel) and they don't want to have to spend double the money on writing and voice acting by setting up a Virmire situation where we could have one character versus another. Also, he's LI, so there's that. But how is this going to look in DLC/Sequel? People who decided to help Sloane will be forced to work with Reyes? I'd hate it.
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Post by davkar on Apr 12, 2017 5:44:58 GMT
I hate it when they try to force the fanfic book, comics, etc stories and characters on the game. Thankfully ingame Sloane has enough personality and interactions to make her likeable. Number8 and the leadership clearly beeped up the situation. She and my Ryders always become friends in the end. Freeing the angara from her prison and sassing her when it's possible adds a great dynamic to their relationship. Officially she won't return to the AI but through the friendship with Ryder they can be part of the envisioned future.
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Post by raikas on Apr 12, 2017 16:24:18 GMT
As for Reyes, I assume he's unkillable because there are future plans for him (I'm assuming in DLC, although maybe in a sequel) and they don't want to have to spend double the money on writing and voice acting by setting up a Virmire situation where we could have one character versus another. Also, he's LI, so there's that. But how is this going to look in DLC/Sequel? People who decided to help Sloane will be forced to work with Reyes? I'd hate it. I think there are interesting things they could do with that, but yeah, it could just as easily be done poorly. But then I felt like the main crew was pretty bland overall, so I've missed having someone around that creates that kind of love/hate reaction.
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Post by Ashii6 on Apr 12, 2017 16:29:21 GMT
Also, he's LI, so there's that. But how is this going to look in DLC/Sequel? People who decided to help Sloane will be forced to work with Reyes? I'd hate it. I think there are interesting things they could do with that, but yeah, it could just as easily be done poorly. But then I felt like the main crew was pretty bland overall, so I've missed having someone around that creates that kind of love/hate reaction. Really? I actually liked our crew. I still don't know what to think of Liam, he's too chaotic imo, just like Sera, but the rest? Love them. Sloane is hated by a lot of people, so there it is. I don't think she would fit as our companion, but damn, it would be fun as fuck to have her. I love her reactions when my FemRyder is all sassy. It's literally... " It's not that I like you... baka!" I'm not much into japanese stuff, but tsundere describes her pretty well towards Ryder
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Post by raikas on Apr 12, 2017 17:10:39 GMT
Really? I actually liked our crew. I still don't know what to think of Liam, he's too chaotic imo, just like Sera, but the rest? Love them. Sloane is hated by a lot of people, so there it is. I don't think she would fit as our companion, but damn, it would be fun as fuck to have her. I love her reactions when my FemRyder is all sassy. It's not that I disliked them, they just felt like a bunch of vaguely friendly coworkers to me. But a nice divisive character like Reyes or Sloane would have changed the dynamic, which would have been interesting. We're probably not going to get Sloane in a DLC or sequel given her potential fate (I'd be interested to know what percentage of people let her die), but I figure we may get Reyes and I look forward to the drama (for the sake of replayability, assuming that happens, I think it's too bad that didn't turn out to be a true Virmire situation, but hey).
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Apr 13, 2017 0:28:51 GMT
As for Reyes, I assume he's unkillable because there are future plans for him (I'm assuming in DLC, although maybe in a sequel) and they don't want to have to spend double the money on writing and voice acting by setting up a Virmire situation where we could have one character versus another. Also, he's LI, so there's that. But how is this going to look in DLC/Sequel? People who decided to help Sloane will be forced to work with Reyes? I'd hate it. Yeah, I would be livid if they force us to work with and support Reyes especially if they force him on us as a squadmate.
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Post by gaycaravaggio on Apr 17, 2017 23:28:27 GMT
Anyways, I headcanon that Sara and Sloane totally had some hate sex at one point or another.
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Post by raikas on Apr 18, 2017 3:54:42 GMT
Anyways, I headcanon that Sara and Sloane totally had some hate sex at one point or another. Did Sloane's turian boyfriend get to watch?
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Post by gaycaravaggio on Apr 18, 2017 4:32:51 GMT
Anyways, I headcanon that Sara and Sloane totally had some hate sex at one point or another. Did Sloane's turian boyfriend get to watch? Nah. What's-His-Name can take a hike.
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Post by elanor on Apr 18, 2017 8:19:35 GMT
I think there are interesting things they could do with that, but yeah, it could just as easily be done poorly. But then I felt like the main crew was pretty bland overall, so I've missed having someone around that creates that kind of love/hate reaction. Really? I actually liked our crew. I still don't know what to think of Liam, he's too chaotic imo, just like Sera, but the rest? Love them. Sloane is hated by a lot of people, so there it is. I don't think she would fit as our companion, but damn, it would be fun as fuck to have her. I love her reactions when my FemRyder is all sassy. It's literally... " It's not that I like you... baka!" I'm not much into japanese stuff, but tsundere describes her pretty well towards Ryder I have a lot of laughs when my Ryder talk to her so I saved her, it was an impulse but in next playtrought I'm going to let her die.
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Post by Amirit on Apr 18, 2017 14:54:40 GMT
She just didn't want to make this cold calculation at that moment. The exact same question Garrus asks Shepard in ME3. We can agree or disagree. That doesn't make a person shortsighted. That person doesn't want to already scratch these people if there IS a chance to save them. We can certainly agree or disagree, I just happen to personally disagree with her angle. The bit that I see in Tann's favour is his ability to quickly perform the math. In the moment, that means he is going to be able to quickly asses the probability of an action having long-term benefits. He's definitely socially obnoxious, but he's not wrong. Sloane wanting to go for the more immediate life-saving results is definitely short-term thinking. But yeah, I certainly think we're not presented with either as a clear right or wrong within the book or the game since some people are naturally going to care more about the person absolutely dying in front of them rather than the hypothetical people who live in a year. I definitely think Sloane is more interesting now that I've read more of her backstory - I feel like the in-game content game made her more of a cartoonish mob boss, so I like that there's more nuance to her story. As for Reyes, I assume he's unkillable because there are future plans for him (I'm assuming in DLC, although maybe in a sequel) and they don't want to have to spend double the money on writing and voice acting by setting up a Virmire situation where we could have one character versus another. In my books (I mean in my games - now and in the future PT) Sloane was dead the moment I heard about whole "new Omega with new Aria" thing. It's so out of place and such a horrible cliche\trope\fan service\bad primitive taste that it had to be removed. But feelings (and calculations - because in game she is obviously a bad news) aside - speaking of DLC. On one hand, yes, Sloane can be dead. And Reyes is indeed unkillable and potential LI. But (!) - and this is a big but - we have way to many possibilities here. 1) Sloane is dead - Reyes is friendly (let's put LI option here as well) 2) Sloane lives - Reyes is friendly (you flirted with him) 3) Sloane lives - Reyes is an enemy (you shot him) 4) Sloane lives - Reyes is neutral (no flirt, no shot) Do you really believe they can afford 4 different stories? It's even worse than Virmire since there they could at least use the same script for both characters.
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Post by raikas on Apr 18, 2017 15:18:54 GMT
On one hand, yes, Sloane can be dead. And Reyes is indeed unkillable and potential LI. But (!) - and this is a big but - we have way to many possibilities here. 1) Sloane is dead - Reyes is friendly (let's put LI option here as well) 2) Sloane lives - Reyes is friendly (you flirted with him) 3) Sloane lives - Reyes is an enemy (you shot him) 4) Sloane lives - Reyes is neutral (no flirt, no shot) Do you really believe they can afford 4 different stories? It's even worse than Virmire since there they could at least use the same script for both characters. I don't think they would have four different stories. I think they'd have some new crisis on Kadara, Sloane would get killed off in the introduction, and you'd be forced to work with Reyes either way. Some of the dialogue would be different if he were an enemy, but if the story was action-driven a lot of that would be the same (like working with the different relationships with Legion in ME3). It's definitely not worse than Virmire, since there they needed to both account for two sets of relationships with each character plus recording all of the dialogue twice with two separate voice actors. Even if they went all out and made four or five sets of unique dialogue, it's still just one body to use in cutscenes and one voice actor to record it all. That's a shame for anyone who wants to see more of Sloane (or who just likes replaying scenarios with different characters to see how they play out), but from a resource perspective I think it's clearly an easier path.
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Post by Amirit on Apr 18, 2017 17:32:04 GMT
On one hand, yes, Sloane can be dead. And Reyes is indeed unkillable and potential LI. But (!) - and this is a big but - we have way to many possibilities here. 1) Sloane is dead - Reyes is friendly (let's put LI option here as well) 2) Sloane lives - Reyes is friendly (you flirted with him) 3) Sloane lives - Reyes is an enemy (you shot him) 4) Sloane lives - Reyes is neutral (no flirt, no shot) Do you really believe they can afford 4 different stories? It's even worse than Virmire since there they could at least use the same script for both characters. I don't think they would have four different stories. I think they'd have some new crisis on Kadara, Sloane would get killed off in the introduction, and you'd be forced to work with Reyes either way. Some of the dialogue would be different if he were an enemy, but if the story was action-driven a lot of that would be the same (like working with the different relationships with Legion in ME3). It's definitely not worse than Virmire, since there they needed to both account for two sets of relationships with each character plus recording all of the dialogue twice with two separate voice actors. Even if they went all out and made four or five sets of unique dialogue, it's still just one body to use in cutscenes and one voice actor to record it all. That's a shame for anyone who wants to see more of Sloane (or who just likes replaying scenarios with different characters to see how they play out), but from a resource perspective I think it's clearly an easier path. All sounds very reasonable and a good way to cut some corners, but this way they would be screaming "choices do not matter". Sure, nothing new about that, yet, it would be too direct. You are right, of course, and in reality there are 2 choices - who is ruling Kadara. I'd say most likely it will remain the way it is now - Kadara is just an insignificant port, Reyes is a silent LI and Sloane is just there. If anything, it's not fair to those romancing Reyes, but who cares about not the most popular (according to general statistic from first week) romance?
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Post by Ashii6 on Apr 18, 2017 17:40:01 GMT
Anyways, I headcanon that Sara and Sloane totally had some hate sex at one point or another. My FemRyder would tap that, too
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Post by raikas on Apr 18, 2017 18:08:47 GMT
All sounds very reasonable and a good way to cut some corners, but this way they would be screaming "choices do not matter". Sure, nothing new about that, yet, it would be too direct. You are right, of course, and in reality there are 2 choices - who is ruling Kadara. I'd say most likely it will remain the way it is now - Kadara is just an insignificant port, Reyes is a silent LI and Sloane is just there. If anything, it's not fair to those romancing Reyes, but who cares about not the most popular (according to general statistic from first week) romance? People will be screaming "choices do not matter" either way. Even aside from the game-wide "Ryder can't make renegade choices" complaints, the Kadara-specific complaints are already out there in the form of "why won't you let me kill Reyes?". Maybe it's cynical, but that's why I assume we'll go back there at some point (and on the flip side, why I assume we're not going to get much content related to the Salarian pathfinder).
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Apr 18, 2017 18:18:24 GMT
More likely they'll just have a common threat, external or internal, hit Kadara and Sloane and Reyes have a Virmire situation where the one you chose is a temporary squadmate. That'd work better than just forcing choices. Each could have a couple dialogue differences, for example Sloane would have differences depending on if you stayed out of the whole side quest chain or if you sided with her during High Noon, and Reyes would have differences depending on if you are in a romance or not.
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Post by Ashii6 on Apr 18, 2017 18:29:51 GMT
More likely they'll just have a common threat, external or internal, hit Kadara and Sloane and Reyes have a Virmire situation where the one you chose is a temporary squadmate. That'd work better than just forcing choices. Each could have a couple dialogue differences, for example Sloane would have differences depending on if you stayed out of the whole side quest chain or if you sided with her during High Noon, and Reyes would have differences depending on if you are in a romance or not. And that would be a good solution, but let's be real - too good to be true. BioWare already proved they have no idea how to handle a situation like that.
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Post by davkar on Apr 18, 2017 19:09:45 GMT
More likely they'll just have a common threat, external or internal, hit Kadara and Sloane and Reyes have a Virmire situation where the one you chose is a temporary squadmate. That'd work better than just forcing choices. Each could have a couple dialogue differences, for example Sloane would have differences depending on if you stayed out of the whole side quest chain or if you sided with her during High Noon, and Reyes would have differences depending on if you are in a romance or not. I think if they couldn't make it work with separate starting point they'll just pick a 'destroy everything' route. When the cats return they'll hit the colonies with full force. On Eladeen it opens up the option for a save the krogan take 2. Bonus if you have an outpost, "okay, you can help us nexus" if you don't. Kadara is always a loss - if Sloane is in charge they're killed, if Reyes is the boss he sells out the colony and the port to the kett so he can escape. It would give the chance for the similar outcomes-starting point, with Sloane being dead and Reyes on the run. I would prefer she live though, she's awesome. I just love sassing her and in her own hostile way she cares about Ryder.
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raikas
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Post by raikas on Apr 18, 2017 19:11:56 GMT
More likely they'll just have a common threat, external or internal, hit Kadara and Sloane and Reyes have a Virmire situation where the one you chose is a temporary squadmate. That'd work better than just forcing choices. Each could have a couple dialogue differences, for example Sloane would have differences depending on if you stayed out of the whole side quest chain or if you sided with her during High Noon, and Reyes would have differences depending on if you are in a romance or not. And that would be a good solution, but let's be real - too good to be true. BioWare already proved they have no idea how to handle a situation like that. Yeah, I think Sloane is an interesting character and it would be entertaining to have her as an optional squadmate (so if you replayed you could do one round with her and then another with Reyes), but the fact that only she is killable suggests to me that even if she returns in DLC/a sequel she's probably not long for this world.
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Amirit
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Post by Amirit on Apr 18, 2017 19:19:46 GMT
More likely they'll just have a common threat, external or internal, hit Kadara and Sloane and Reyes have a Virmire situation where the one you chose is a temporary squadmate. That'd work better than just forcing choices. Each could have a couple dialogue differences, for example Sloane would have differences depending on if you stayed out of the whole side quest chain or if you sided with her during High Noon, and Reyes would have differences depending on if you are in a romance or not. I agree it's too good to be true - companions are highly unlikely. Though, another all out attack where you get help from either of them is possible. And you remind me that there are actually 5 outcomes - you can leave Kadara unresolved. I wish you were right and until DLC comes out will hope for the best.
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