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Post by Syv on Dec 15, 2016 17:12:23 GMT
( over 20% non-straight people in France or San Francisco, to mention a couple) No idea what you are talking about, or where you got this idea. There are 66 millions of folks in France. I hope you realize how ridiculous your figures are, 20% of 66 millions of folks. If you do the mathematics, you'll see how much it's not realistic. We have more than 4 millions of muslims for example, and yet they only represent 7,5 % in the whole population. Last time I checked, there was a battle between 4%, 6% or 7%. But certainly less than 10%
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Post by warbaby2 on Dec 15, 2016 17:20:40 GMT
( over 20% non-straight people in France or San Francisco, to mention a couple) No idea what you are talking about, or where you got this idea. There are 66 millions of folks in France. I hope ou realize how ridiculous your figures are, 20% of 66 millions of folks. If you do the mathematics, you'll see how it's not realistic. We have more than 4 millions of muslims for example, and yet they only represent 7,5 % in the whole population. Last time I checked, there was a battle between 4%, 6% or 7%. But certainly less than 10% The figure isn't even true for San Francisco... as I stated earlier, the world wide population of LGBT people ranges anywhere from 3-8%, considering all the latest studies, but - as also stated earlier - statistics are not everything. Estimations place the actual numbers at around 6% on AVERAGE. In context, there are roughly 285 mil severely visually impaired people in the world, which amounts to approximately 4% of the world population, yet, the representation of those is basically non existent in the media. I'm one of them, that's where the comparison comes from...
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Post by Iakus on Dec 15, 2016 17:44:12 GMT
I find this not so difficult to believe, because I am used to space operas resorting to an even more implausible setup: in the globalized space-faring future, everyone you meet is white, and likely also male. Consider we haven't had a single Asian squad mate in ME, even though Han Chinese alone currently make up almost a fifth of the world's population, and the lore itself describes China as one of the spacefaring pioneers. Funnily enough, that bothers me a lot more than a seemingly inordinate number of LGB people. After all, as Daveliam has pointed out, there are places in the world with statistics one might deem impossible (over 20% non-straight people in France or San Francisco, to mention a couple) and historically cultures that were tolerant or even encouraging of homosexual relationships seemed to have more people willing to participate in them than we would expect. A pasty white future is ridiculous. BioWare avoided that one from the start, fortunately, with Mass Effect. They even tried to avoid it in the character creator. Sadly, they suck at hair and had an engine that couldn't handle non-white skin tones very well. We'll see how that goes this outing. That doesn't change the fact that not everyone who expresses disappointment with the heavy-handed approach is being intolerant, bigoted or whatnot. I want a well told, believable story in every facet; and I want to feel free to politely critique each facet of the game, in that regard. Even LGBT friends, here (technically old BSN) and elsewhere, have said that DAI felt unrealistic to them, in terms of the over-the-top delivery and ratio of representation. I should be able to say the same, politely, without it being twisted. I understand what BioWare is trying to do. I think they must be aware to balance this goal with story concerns. I felt ME3 was handled the best, in terms of orientations being present but not important to the story. I realize others may disagree, or feel it fell short in execution. QFT If we're dealing with a setting hundreds of years in the future, with interstellar (and now inter galactic) travel, with dozens of species of sapient life out there (some of which aren't even humanoid in appearance), with their own customs, religions, taboos, governments, and such, the differences between groups of humans should shrink away to triviality.
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“Major Wulf Khan and the 903rd Catachan ‘Night Shrikes’…”
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Mihura on Dec 15, 2016 17:55:08 GMT
Please numbers mean next to nothing, having more or less LGBTA+ in the world is irrelevant. For example there are more women in the world but lot of other games do not do a realistic representation of that number. So please this is all about cultural and social bias, not really numbers.
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Post by warbaby2 on Dec 15, 2016 18:01:12 GMT
Please numbers mean next to nothing, having more or less LGBTA+ in the world is irrelevant. For example there are more women in the world but lot of other games do not do a realistic representation of that number. So please this is all about cultural and social bias, not really numbers. Which is, of course, the simplest explanation we can come up with these days... you know what I almost never see in those discussion? People that are thankful for the fact that they - by shear luck - happen to life in a society and time, where their personal circumstances actually matter to ANYONE other then themselves. All I read is more more more better better better... you know why people call today's social advocates regressives? Because your judgmental narcissism will cost you everything previous generations have worked for. Social bias my a**...
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Mihura
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“Major Wulf Khan and the 903rd Catachan ‘Night Shrikes’…”
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Mihura on Dec 15, 2016 18:19:32 GMT
Please numbers mean next to nothing, having more or less LGBTA+ in the world is irrelevant. For example there are more women in the world but lot of other games do not do a realistic representation of that number. So please this is all about cultural and social bias, not really numbers. Which is, of course, the simplest explanation we can come up with these days... you know what I almost never see in those discussion? People that are thankful for the fact that they - by shear luck - happen to life in a society and time, where their personal circumstances actually matter to ANYONE other then themselves. All I read is more more more better better better... you know why people call today's social advocates regressives? Because your judgmental narcissism will cost you everything previous generations have worked for. Social bias my a**... Humm? I am sure not thankful for living in a shitty society that only cares about being married with 2,5 kids and complains about the economy all the time. I have to work my ass off to even gain half of that, and even more for getting laws and rights that everyone should have. What I am saying is that numbers mean nothing in a realistic video game because of people views of the world and themselves, like, if it is a 90% male team, you can bet their female characters are going to be unrealistic, everyone has bias because everyone has different experiences. This is not some wild theory, it is just how things are, people cant create something realistic without some experience or at least a lot of research and help. And everyone experience does not represent reality and never will in its fullest.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 15, 2016 18:20:24 GMT
It's not always these genders that make people complain, as much as some parties often want to believe. I find my own verisimilitude stretched more than a bit when I have a relatively small group of adventurers around me, and yet this group manages to have a representative from every real world minority group imaginable. This is often what prompts people to complain. It's not the representation itself, it's how it's executed. A little bit goes a long way. Too much, while done with the best of intentions, can distract and detract from the actual story being told. DAI felt a bit heavy-handed, in this regard; but it also had some very good characters. So, what is the right balance? BioWare has clearly set this "cast diversity" as a priority. They must work to find the right balance between representation and believable presentation. I find this not so difficult to believe, because I am used to space operas resorting to an even more implausible setup: in the globalized space-faring future, everyone you meet is white, and likely also male. Consider we haven't had a single Asian squad mate in ME, even though Han Chinese alone currently make up almost a fifth of the world's population, and the lore itself describes China as one of the spacefaring pioneers. Funnily enough, that bothers me a lot more than a seemingly inordinate number of LGB people. After all, as Daveliam has pointed out, there are places in the world with statistics one might deem impossible (over 20% non-straight people in France or San Francisco, to mention a couple) and historically cultures that were tolerant or even encouraging of homosexual relationships seemed to have more people willing to participate in them than we would expect. Just to let you know, Kaidan was the Asian squadmate (He's half Singaporean on mom's side). He brought that up in ME1.
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Post by Catilina on Dec 15, 2016 18:26:13 GMT
Which is, of course, the simplest explanation we can come up with these days... you know what I almost never see in those discussion? People that are thankful for the fact that they - by shear luck - happen to life in a society and time, where their personal circumstances actually matter to ANYONE other then themselves. All I read is more more more better better better... you know why people call today's social advocates regressives? Because your judgmental narcissism will cost you everything previous generations have worked for. Social bias my a**... Humm? I am sure not thankful for living in a shitty society that only cares about being married with 2,5 kids and complains about the economy all the time. I have to work my ass off to even gain half of that, and even more for getting laws and rights that everyone should have. What I am saying is that numbers mean nothing in a realistic video game because of people views of the world and themselves, like, if it is a 90% male team, you can bet their female characters are going to be unrealistic, everyone has bias because everyone has different experiences. This is not some wild theory, it is just how things are, people cant create something realistic without some experience or at least a lot of research and help. And everyone experience does not represent reality and never will in its fullest. "I only believe in statistics that I doctored myself" – Sir Winston Churchill
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Post by Vortex13 on Dec 15, 2016 18:36:20 GMT
A pasty white future is ridiculous. BioWare avoided that one from the start, fortunately, with Mass Effect. They even tried to avoid it in the character creator. Sadly, they suck at hair and had an engine that couldn't handle non-white skin tones very well. We'll see how that goes this outing. That doesn't change the fact that not everyone who expresses disappointment with the heavy-handed approach is being intolerant, bigoted or whatnot. I want a well told, believable story in every facet; and I want to feel free to politely critique each facet of the game, in that regard. Even LGBT friends, here (technically old BSN) and elsewhere, have said that DAI felt unrealistic to them, in terms of the over-the-top delivery and ratio of representation. I should be able to say the same, politely, without it being twisted. I understand what BioWare is trying to do. I think they must be aware to balance this goal with story concerns. I felt ME3 was handled the best, in terms of orientations being present but not important to the story. I realize others may disagree, or feel it fell short in execution. QFT If we're dealing with a setting hundreds of years in the future, with interstellar (and now inter galactic) travel, with dozens of species of sapient life out there (some of which aren't even humanoid in appearance), with their own customs, religions, taboos, governments, and such, the differences between groups of humans should shrink away to triviality. Indeed. You want to know who the true minorities are in Mass Effect and many other science fiction settings? The aliens. And no, not ones who are just humans in green makeup or humans with pointy ears either; the 'alien' aliens. White/black, men/women straight/gay, etc. we are all equal in the sense that we are all equally boring. Who wants to sit there and listen to a group of people go on about how they view their view their gender roles, or about who they find sexually attractive when an alien that feeds on silicone and communicates via x-rays is right over there? What I wouldn't give to see an 'alien' like the Rachni given just half the screen time and narrative focus that all these human minorities and special interest groups have gotten.
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Post by warbaby2 on Dec 15, 2016 18:43:13 GMT
Which is, of course, the simplest explanation we can come up with these days... you know what I almost never see in those discussion? People that are thankful for the fact that they - by shear luck - happen to life in a society and time, where their personal circumstances actually matter to ANYONE other then themselves. All I read is more more more better better better... you know why people call today's social advocates regressives? Because your judgmental narcissism will cost you everything previous generations have worked for. Social bias my a**... Humm? I am sure not thankful for living in a shitty society that only cares about being married with 2,5 kids and complains about the economy all the time. I have to work my ass off to even gain half of that, and even more for getting laws and rights that everyone should have. What I am saying is that numbers mean nothing in a realistic video game because of people views of the world and themselves, like, if it is a 90% male team, you can bet their female characters are going to be unrealistic, everyone has bias because everyone has different experiences. This is not some wild theory, it is just how things are, people cant create something realistic without some experience or at least a lot of research and help. And everyone experience does not represent reality and never will in its fullest. Yea, such a shitty society... ok: judgmental, narcissistic AND delusional. Then go and make your own games, seriously... according to people like you, the games industry - just as the real world - will never live up to what you want it to be, nor would it have ever existed in the first place.
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Post by Gwydden on Dec 15, 2016 18:47:21 GMT
A pasty white future is ridiculous. BioWare avoided that one from the start, fortunately, with Mass Effect. They even tried to avoid it in the character creator. Sadly, they suck at hair and had an engine that couldn't handle non-white skin tones very well. We'll see how that goes this outing. That doesn't change the fact that not everyone who expresses disappointment with the heavy-handed approach is being intolerant, bigoted or whatnot. I want a well told, believable story in every facet; and I want to feel free to politely critique each facet of the game, in that regard. Even LGBT friends, here (technically old BSN) and elsewhere, have said that DAI felt unrealistic to them, in terms of the over-the-top delivery and ratio of representation. I should be able to say the same, politely, without it being twisted. I understand what BioWare is trying to do. I think they must be aware to balance this goal with story concerns. I felt ME3 was handled the best, in terms of orientations being present but not important to the story. I realize others may disagree, or feel it fell short in execution. Oh, I agree. People on either extremes wear on me easily. There are assholes on both sides, people who cannot imagine Bioware or any other company not catering to them in every insignificant detail and who will wail and bitch and whine whenever everything isn't up to their most minute specifications. Myself, I think Bioware can get preachy and show off their "progressiveness" exceedingly, and their attempts at being inclusive often miss the mark in other respects. I understand what they are trying to do, respect them for it even, but I am also glad their design philosophy is not the norm, seeing how awkward their approach ends up being more often than not. Take romances, a popular feature that is more fanservice than masterful storytelling. The developers admit as much, or at least Weekes does. Once you have decided that fanservice is a big part of your design philosophy, does it really matter once you take it to absurd extremes, be it by making almost every lady bangable for the benefit of straight dudes, as in the first Witcher game, or by meticulously planning which characters will be romanceable by whom and inflating the LGB demographic so everyone gets a fair shot, as in recent Bioware games? Fanservice is absurd by its very nature. I am not indifferent to being catered to (when it is my tastes specifically and not those of a nebulous group I belong to supposed to all have homogeneous inclinations like "straight male geeks all love blue space bisexual babes, right?"), but at the end of the day I care most about a quality story, and the gender, sexuality, or ethnicity of the characters factors little into it. I am guessing we agree on that. No idea what you are talking about, or where you got this idea. There are 66 millions of folks in France. I hope you realize how ridiculous your figures are, 20% of 66 millions of folks. If you do the mathematics, you'll see how much it's not realistic. We have more than 4 millions of muslims for example, and yet they only represent 7,5 % in the whole population. Last time I checked, there was a battle between 4%, 6% or 7%. But certainly less than 10% I misquoted a previous poster. The actual statistic referred to a particular age group. At any rate, my point is that regardless of the specific numbers, outliers do exist. That is to be expected, and I don't find the idea of a small squad where half the people are something other than heterosexual implausible. Just to let you know, Kaidan was the Asian squadmate (He's half Singaporean on mom's side). He brought that up in ME1. Yeah, I suppose I counted him more as mixed race. So was Ashley, by the way: ME1 gave a better impression of a globalized humanity than the later games did. I also forgot Kasumi, since I never got that DLC. Even so, my point still stands that there are a lot less Asian people and a lot more of European descent than you might expect.
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Post by Element Zero on Dec 15, 2016 18:52:42 GMT
QFT If we're dealing with a setting hundreds of years in the future, with interstellar (and now inter galactic) travel, with dozens of species of sapient life out there (some of which aren't even humanoid in appearance), with their own customs, religions, taboos, governments, and such, the differences between groups of humans should shrink away to triviality. Indeed. You want to know who the true minorities are in Mass Effect and many other science fiction settings? The aliens. And no, not ones who are just humans in green makeup or humans with pointy ears either; the 'alien' aliens. White/black, men/women straight/gay, etc. we are all equal in the sense that we are all equally boring. Who wants to sit there and listen to a group of people go on about how they view their view their gender roles, or about who they find sexually attractive when an alien that feeds on silicone and communicates via x-rays is right over there? What I wouldn't give to see an 'alien' like the Rachni given just half the screen time and narrative focus that all these human minorities and special interest groups have gotten. Yeah, I'd prefer to see more focus on aliens and #space (their favorite hashtag), and less on romance arcs. This is a good example of prioritizing game content. Which type of story is BioWare trying to tell? Is it about 21C social issues? Is it about space, aliens and discovery? Is it going to be a confused jumble of things, because they aren't good at finding a balance in their narratives? Again, I think the ME team has a better track record than the DA team, so there is some room for optimism. ME has not yet had a heavy-handed, inappropriate-to-setting character-approach or storyline. Now, if we could get them to focus on plot instead of romance, we might get one hell of a game out of them.
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Mihura
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“Major Wulf Khan and the 903rd Catachan ‘Night Shrikes’…”
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Mihura on Dec 15, 2016 18:54:41 GMT
Humm? I am sure not thankful for living in a shitty society that only cares about being married with 2,5 kids and complains about the economy all the time. I have to work my ass off to even gain half of that, and even more for getting laws and rights that everyone should have. What I am saying is that numbers mean nothing in a realistic video game because of people views of the world and themselves, like, if it is a 90% male team, you can bet their female characters are going to be unrealistic, everyone has bias because everyone has different experiences. This is not some wild theory, it is just how things are, people cant create something realistic without some experience or at least a lot of research and help. And everyone experience does not represent reality and never will in its fullest. "I only believe in statistics that I doctored myself" – Sir Winston Churchill Not really, you just have to go to google and type, Canidian population by gender a see if there is more women or men, than look at Dragon Age Inquisition cast of companions. Again just because there are more women in Canada does not mean Bioware is going to make a game with more female companions, that is the whole point of numbers having no meaning. Also there are still less devs and female gamers, this is not new. All this problems with diversity come from changing things, unless those articles about diversity in gaming being a big lie, and it was 50/50 all along.
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Post by Evamitchelle on Dec 15, 2016 18:54:47 GMT
I find this not so difficult to believe, because I am used to space operas resorting to an even more implausible setup: in the globalized space-faring future, everyone you meet is white, and likely also male. Consider we haven't had a single Asian squad mate in ME, even though Han Chinese alone currently make up almost a fifth of the world's population, and the lore itself describes China as one of the spacefaring pioneers. Funnily enough, that bothers me a lot more than a seemingly inordinate number of LGB people. After all, as Daveliam has pointed out, there are places in the world with statistics one might deem impossible (over 20% non-straight people in France or San Francisco, to mention a couple) and historically cultures that were tolerant or even encouraging of homosexual relationships seemed to have more people willing to participate in them than we would expect. Just to let you know, Kaidan was the Asian squadmate (He's half Singaporean on mom's side). He brought that up in ME1. Kaidan's mom was in Singapore when she was pregnant, but it's never confirmed anywhere that she is from Singapore. For what it's worth Kaidan's face model is Brazilian, but otherwise we don't have any concrete information about his ethnicity.
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Post by Catilina on Dec 15, 2016 19:00:23 GMT
"I only believe in statistics that I doctored myself" – Sir Winston Churchill Not really, you just have to go to google and type, Canidian population by gender a see if there is more women or men, than look at Dragon Age Inquisition cast of companions. Again just because there are more women in Canada does not mean Bioware is going to make a game with more female companions, that is the whole point of numbers having no meaning. Also there are still less devs and female gamers, this is not new. All this problems with diversity come from change things, unless those articles about diversity in gaming being a big lie, and it was 50/50 all along. I mean I don't care about statistics, especially not the real world's statistic in game (except the reality simulation, but I don't like simulations too much).
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Post by Catilina on Dec 15, 2016 19:04:17 GMT
Just to let you know, Kaidan was the Asian squadmate (He's half Singaporean on mom's side). He brought that up in ME1. Kaidan's mom was in Singapore when she was pregnant, but it's never confirmed anywhere that she is from Singapore. For what it's worth Kaidan's face model is Brazilian, but otherwise we don't have any concrete information about his ethnicity. So he probably have Ukrainian/Brazilian origin (based on his family name).
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Mihura
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“Major Wulf Khan and the 903rd Catachan ‘Night Shrikes’…”
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: MihuraL
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Post by Mihura on Dec 15, 2016 19:15:12 GMT
Humm? I am sure not thankful for living in a shitty society that only cares about being married with 2,5 kids and complains about the economy all the time. I have to work my ass off to even gain half of that, and even more for getting laws and rights that everyone should have. What I am saying is that numbers mean nothing in a realistic video game because of people views of the world and themselves, like, if it is a 90% male team, you can bet their female characters are going to be unrealistic, everyone has bias because everyone has different experiences. This is not some wild theory, it is just how things are, people cant create something realistic without some experience or at least a lot of research and help. And everyone experience does not represent reality and never will in its fullest. Yea, such a shitty society... ok: judgmental, narcissistic AND delusional. Then go and make your own games, seriously... according to people like you, the games industry - just as the real world - will never live up to what you want it to be, nor would it have ever existed in the first place. No really, just that numbers mean nothing. It is not about realism it is about artists and devs bias and experiences.
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Iakus
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
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Post by Iakus on Dec 15, 2016 19:15:39 GMT
Indeed. You want to know who the true minorities are in Mass Effect and many other science fiction settings? The aliens. And no, not ones who are just humans in green makeup or humans with pointy ears either; the 'alien' aliens. White/black, men/women straight/gay, etc. we are all equal in the sense that we are all equally boring. Who wants to sit there and listen to a group of people go on about how they view their view their gender roles, or about who they find sexually attractive when an alien that feeds on silicone and communicates via x-rays is right over there? What I wouldn't give to see an 'alien' like the Rachni given just half the screen time and narrative focus that all these human minorities and special interest groups have gotten. Yeah, I'd prefer to see more focus on aliens and #space (their favorite hashtag), and less on romance arcs. This is a good example of prioritizing game content. Which type of game is BioWare trying to tell? Is it about 21C social issues? Is it about space, aliens and discovery? Is it going to be a confused jumble of things, because they aren't good at finding a balance in their narratives? Again, I think the ME team has a better track record than the DA team, so there is some room for optimism. ME has not yet had a heavy-handed, inappropriate-to-setting character-approach or storyline. Now, if we could get them to focus on plot instead of romance, we might get one hell of a game out of them. Even romance arcs with aliens can be interesting if they actually acknowledge the alienness of the LI. I mean, with Liara, she's gonna outlive Shepard by a number of centuries. Shep's going to die of old age before Liara even reaches the matron stage. and any kids they have will not be human. How would they deal with these things? How would they shape the relationship? That Liara can romance a female Shepard isn't even a blip on the radar as far as ramifications go. Or Garrus. Turians and humans were AT WAR a generation ago. And there are people of both races who hold grudges. Then there are dietary restrictions. They can't digest each others' food, so wherever they live, someone's food has to be imported from offworld. And, while it's made something of a joke in ME2, Mordin points out certain difficulties in physical compatibility between humans and turians ("chafing" and "do not ingest") Much the same would also apply to Tali, plus the whole immune system complication would make any physical contact very dangerous for her. Of course, this was handwaved away when Tali banged Shepard twice and developed an immunity to him So yeah, inter-species romance could actually be quite fascinating, if it were taken more seriously.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 15, 2016 19:25:06 GMT
It makes me laugh when people say DAI has a bias towards LGBT people Its actually biased towards straight female elves, they get the same amount of possible options as same-sex options for males and females added together, and twice as many as a straight male Inquisitor (because they get the same each)... yet like... apparently im the only one who has noticed??? Also I think next in line is straight female humans who get 3 which is one less than elves because of Solas Personally, so long as I get plenty of options (which is the point of an rpg) im a happy person and like having LGBT people (especially romance options) adds more options to the game, and theyre options for everyone not just LGBT people and im all for having more LGBT people in (and hey, its MEA, it could actually make sense to have lots of people of different types because personally if I was planning a space mission id take loottttsss of people from all different backgrounds and stuff because I wouldnt know what id face and you never know where different perspectives could come in useful)
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Post by Element Zero on Dec 15, 2016 19:27:27 GMT
Kaidan's mom was in Singapore when she was pregnant, but it's never confirmed anywhere that she is from Singapore. For what it's worth Kaidan's face model is Brazilian, but otherwise we don't have any concrete information about his ethnicity. Ukrainian/Brazilian (based on his family name). I don't think we can assume Kaidan is Brazilian simply because his model is Brazilian. Those features could come from any number of combinations. My wife is a mixture of Irish, Italian, Spanish, Moroccan, West African and Native American grandparents. She is regularly asked, "What part of X are you from?," in which X has been Brazil, Pakistan, Middle Eastern countries and various other South American countries. One could "head-canon" Brazil, as the kids here like to say. I thing it makes little sense, though, to just toss away the lore that his mother gave birth to him in Singapore. It seems logical to speculate that he might be, at least in part, of "Singaporean decent". That's not really an ethnicity, of course, and would leave it open to the player to guess from which ethnic group or groups Kaidan might carry some heritage. Anyway, I guess we've strayed off-topic. I always enjoyed the bits of lore we had about 22C Earth. We really should've seen more Asians and Africans, if they wanted to reflect their lore in-game; but they failed to reflect lore in-game in myriad ways, not just in this case. The old U3 engine really did play a part, I believe. It was terrible for many non-white skin tones.
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Post by Catilina on Dec 15, 2016 19:40:42 GMT
Ukrainian/Brazilian (based on his family name). I don't think we can assume Kaidan is Brazilian simply because his model is Brazilian. Those features could come from any number of combinations. My wife is a mixture of Irish, Italian, Spanish, Moroccan, West African and Native American grandparents. She is regularly asked, "What part of X are you from?," in which X has been Brazil, Pakistan, Middle Eastern countries and various other South American countries. One could "head-canon" Brazil, as the kids here like to say. I thing it makes little sense, though, to just toss away the lore that his mother gave birth to him in Singapore. It seems logical to speculate that he might be, at least in part, of "Singaporean decent". That's not really an ethnicity, of course, and would leave it open to the player to guess from which ethnic group or groups Kaidan might carry some heritage. Anyway, I guess we've strayed off-topic. I always enjoyed the bits of lore we had about 22C Earth. We really should've seen more Asians and Africans, if they wanted to reflect their lore in-game; but they failed to reflect lore in-game in myriad ways, not just in this case. The old U3 engine really did play a part, I believe. It was terrible for many non-white skin tones. Honestly? I don't care about Kaidan's origin so much, I only guessed. Kaidan just fine. The engine was shitty at white skin as well: most character's face and hand seems dirty... I hope we get much better character creator and possiblity and type. And the new engine will better handle all skin tones.
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Post by Evamitchelle on Dec 15, 2016 19:43:13 GMT
Ukrainian/Brazilian (based on his family name). I don't think we can assume Kaidan is Brazilian simply because his model is Brazilian. Those features could come from any number of combinations. My wife is a mixture of Irish, Italian, Spanish, Moroccan, West African and Native American grandparents. She is regularly asked, "What part of X are you from?," in which X has been Brazil, Pakistan, Middle Eastern countries and various other South American countries. One could "head-canon" Brazil, as the kids here like to say. I thing it makes little sense, though, to just toss away the lore that his mother gave birth to him in Singapore. It seems logical to speculate that he might be, at least in part, of "Singaporean decent". That's not really an ethnicity, of course, and would leave it open to the player to guess from which ethnic group or groups Kaidan might carry some heritage. Anyway, I guess we've strayed off-topic. I always enjoyed the bits of lore we had about 22C Earth. We really should've seen more Asians and Africans, if they wanted to reflect their lore in-game; but they failed to reflect lore in-game in myriad ways, not just in this case. The old U3 engine really did play a part, I believe. It was terrible for many non-white skin tones. The fact that his mother was in Singapore while pregnant - it's not actually confirmed that he was born there - doesn't really tell us anything about her ethnicity either. I think Kaidan was meant to be the sort of ambiguously mixed-race person that is common in ME rather than specifically Asian. My point is, it's not really accurate to call him "the Asian squadmate" - especially not when Kasumi's there.
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Iakus
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
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Post by Iakus on Dec 15, 2016 19:46:14 GMT
I don't think we can assume Kaidan is Brazilian simply because his model is Brazilian. Those features could come from any number of combinations. My wife is a mixture of Irish, Italian, Spanish, Moroccan, West African and Native American grandparents. She is regularly asked, "What part of X are you from?," in which X has been Brazil, Pakistan, Middle Eastern countries and various other South American countries. One could "head-canon" Brazil, as the kids here like to say. I thing it makes little sense, though, to just toss away the lore that his mother gave birth to him in Singapore. It seems logical to speculate that he might be, at least in part, of "Singaporean decent". That's not really an ethnicity, of course, and would leave it open to the player to guess from which ethnic group or groups Kaidan might carry some heritage. Anyway, I guess we've strayed off-topic. I always enjoyed the bits of lore we had about 22C Earth. We really should've seen more Asians and Africans, if they wanted to reflect their lore in-game; but they failed to reflect lore in-game in myriad ways, not just in this case. The old U3 engine really did play a part, I believe. It was terrible for many non-white skin tones. The fact that his mother was in Singapore while pregnant - it's not actually confirmed that he was born there - doesn't really tell us anything about her ethnicity either. I think Kaidan was meant to be the sort of ambiguously mixed-race person that is common in ME rather than specifically Asian. My point is, it's not really accurate to call him "the Asian squadmate" - especially not when Kasumi's there. My Shepard's from Mindoir. What does that make him?
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Post by Syv on Dec 16, 2016 0:30:40 GMT
It makes me laugh when people say DAI has a bias towards LGBT people Its actually biased towards straight female elves, they get the same amount of possible options as same-sex options for males and females added together, and twice as many as a straight male Inquisitor (because they get the same each)... yet like... apparently im the only one who has noticed??? Also I think next in line is straight female humans who get 3 which is one less than elves because of Solas There were actually quite a lot of straight males who complained about the fact that straight females had four options, compared to them with two options, only one being a companion in the past with DA:I. You can be certain that nobody cried for them, dismissing their complaints, a lot were even happy that it happened that way lol.
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Post by SofaJockey on Dec 16, 2016 18:45:15 GMT
There were actually quite a lot of straight males who complained about the fact that straight females had four options, compared to them with two options, only one being a companion in the past with DA:I. You can be certain that nobody cried for them, dismissing their complaints, a lot were even happy that it happened that way lol. And I recall BioWare's response was something like: - Straight males get at least 2 choices, like usual.
- In the past straight males invariably got the most choices
- This time someone else gets more for plot reasons but you still get two.
- Chill out, you don't have a right to the most choices every time.
I'm personally not troubled by that logic (and I tend to play female protagonists anyway).
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