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Post by armass81 on Jan 15, 2017 21:24:03 GMT
"The original endings were different, one of the leaked scripts even showed this. With an unconfirmed report that it was totally rewritten in the last minute because of the leak."Nope, i can confirm they were pretty much the same, talking about singularity and stuff, as I was one of the people who read the leaks. Nope. The copy of the leak I read alludes to a 'final decision' made in the 'Guardian's garden' on the Citadel, which you reach in a similar way to how you reach the Catalysts' chamber in the final game. The leak also says that Javik IS the Catalyst. It was different, the three core outcomes were there, but there was more context to it than a random child appearing out of the nowhere. Yeah i recall something like that. But the endings were not changed, really that much.
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Post by Andrew Lucas on Jan 15, 2017 21:27:11 GMT
Nope. The copy of the leak I read alludes to a 'final decision' made in the 'Guardian's garden' on the Citadel, which you reach in a similar way to how you reach the Catalysts' chamber in the final game. The leak also says that Javik IS the Catalyst. It was different, the three core outcomes were there, but there was more context to it than a random child appearing out of the nowhere. Then you read some leak ive never seen, can you provide evidence it exists? Here you go : pastebin.com/KYJNWGug
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2017 21:30:53 GMT
In the first leak what would end up being the Catalyst was then called the Guardian, It's role being pretty much identical to that of the Catalyst from the final product. The second leak was pretty much what we got the final game with only superficial differences. On a related note the Catalyst is still refered to as the guardian in some of the game's files.
All this clearly proves that the ending of the final product was thought up quite early, and didn't substantially change over time or because of the script leak. It only got more specific in the second leak.
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Post by armass81 on Jan 15, 2017 21:34:58 GMT
Oh it will. It will fail very hard, just as the first three games completely failed in every way. This is a certainty. The only thing that I'm waiting to find out is whether the multiplayer will be great or terrible. I already know that the single player campaign will be the worst game ever.
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Post by majesticjazz on Jan 15, 2017 21:41:04 GMT
Who the hell is even talking about your precious representation (which there is more than enough of in BW games if you compare it to actual percentages in population in the real world)? The topic here was a dumb-ass racist getting a pass because he targeted the only group you can be racist towards according to the regressive agenda. But you if even dare think there's enough of that, you're a sexist / homophobic / Racist / Xenophobic. Yes, I know. Bullshit. I stand my the reasoning thar if you get uncomfortable with LGBT characters in a videogame, by definition that makes you homophobic. I am not calling anyone homophobic. Besides, if you know you arent one, why even argue and try to "defend" a point?
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Post by Elessar on Jan 15, 2017 21:43:32 GMT
Wow, that's cold. Here's the poor guy hating white people, forced by a cruel fate to live in a mostly white country, working for a mostly white company... have some sympathy! Poor sod. I know we are being sarcastic with all this but in a more serious note, I see twitter as a personal space. It is just like shouting at home obscenities. As for the rest, people seem to forget that even the mythical The Witcher 3 had a huge drama before release and some shady excuses for downgrading the game, sure after that it was praise to high heavens but closer to the release date the overall feeling was negative as fuck, the forum at the time was hilarious with all the butthurt PC gamers. So this type of skepticism is normal. Oh and let us not forget about the season pass, that was the cherry on the cake, so much irony. Graphics whores being angry about the lack of some effects or the resolution of some textures is not equal to being generally underwhelmed by gameplay footage.
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Jan 15, 2017 21:46:30 GMT
Yeah, I mean the long and short is that gamers are just easily triggered.
I can totally buy into the idea that the ending was thought up really early. That would explain why the narrative doesn't support it because as they started fleshing out the plot of ME3 and then had to write the same ending they had planned from the get-go; it no longer fit -- there was too much dissonance between the bulk of the plot in relation to the last scene. The ending was too high-concept compared to the overall throughline in the plot. You can feel how the story goes in a straight line of logic from the early parts right until the finale and then it gets severed and confusion/frustration ensues.
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Post by Andrew Lucas on Jan 15, 2017 21:53:05 GMT
But you if even dare think there's enough of that, you're a sexist / homophobic / Racist / Xenophobic. Yes, I know. Bullshit. I stand my the reasoning thar if you get uncomfortable with LGBT characters in a videogame, by definition that makes you homophobic. I am not calling anyone homophobic. Besides, if you know you arent one, why even argue and try to "defend" a point? Bullshit again. You said that if one disagree with the amount of LGBT content in game, this person is homophobic. Instead of understanding people's reasons for thinking that way, which there are plenty of, you make assumptions. Not cool.
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Post by spacebeetle on Jan 15, 2017 21:53:59 GMT
I know we are being sarcastic with all this but in a more serious note, I see twitter as a personal space. It is just like shouting at home obscenities. ... How is twatter a personal space exactly? Do I really need to point out how public twatter movements and trends are? When you shout your opinions at the world, you can't defend them with "personal space". And even then, I like to think everyone is responsible and accountable forever for whatever they say, both in private and in public. Try to insult your significant other and justify it with "Ehi! It was just my personal space". A punch in the underbelly would be completely justified. Completely. And make it double if you were right.
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Post by majesticjazz on Jan 15, 2017 22:01:53 GMT
I stand my the reasoning thar if you get uncomfortable with LGBT characters in a videogame, by definition that makes you homophobic. I am not calling anyone homophobic. Besides, if you know you arent one, why even argue and try to "defend" a point? Bullshit again. You said that if one disagree with the amount of LGBT content in game, this person is homophobic. Instead of understanding people's reasons for thinking that way, which there are plenty of, you make assumptions. Not cool. Understanding people's reasoning? Lol what is there to understand? Are you uncomfortable with heterosexual players? If not, then why is it okay to "disagree" with LGBT content?
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Post by Cyonan on Jan 15, 2017 22:03:52 GMT
This always happens around a new BioWare game for a few reasons:
First off, the current version of BioWare isn't making games that are like the old version of BioWare. This isn't inherently a bad thing, but there is however still a number of the "old guard" around that wants BioWare to be making games like Baldur's Gate and Neverwinter Nights, which BioWare has been wanting to go more action/cinematic since about KotoR(We can blame EA for some things, but it's pretty clear they wanted to be more cinematic with KotoR).
Secondly, the last few games were received very poorly by some people. Dragon Age 2 was rushed and showed it in a number of places, the ending to ME3 pissed a lot of people off, and DA:I was a pretty mixed response on the forums at the time. As a result, there are a number of people who feel that BioWare has "lost it" in terms of being able to make high quality AAA RPGs.
As for me I'm still gonna get ME:A and I suspect that I'll still enjoy it. If nothing else, very little out there right now has the gameplay style of mixing powers and gunplay that Mass Effect does and does it as well as Mass Effect does.
Also I generally prefer sci-fi over fantasy and I really can't find any new sci-fi RPGs to play.
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Post by Gileadan on Jan 15, 2017 22:04:01 GMT
I know we are being sarcastic with all this but in a more serious note, I see twitter as a personal space. It is just like shouting at home obscenities. As for the rest, people seem to forget that even the mythical The Witcher 3 had a huge drama before release and some shady excuses for downgrading the game, sure after that it was praise to high heavens but closer to the release date the overall feeling was negative as fuck, the forum at the time was hilarious with all the butthurt PC gamers. So this type of skepticism is normal. Oh and let us not forget about the season pass, that was the cherry on the cake, so much irony. Hah, I remember that load of drama about the visual downgrade well. I have to admit, I was a butthurt PC gamer back then too, even though I barely posted about it. I still had a bad taste in my mouth from Watchdogs and its forced console parity, and I was plenty grumpy that apparently not even the vaunted CDPR seemed to be above those bum deals. Surely these were the end times and PC gaming was going to hell in a handbasket. Good fun.
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Post by Andrew Lucas on Jan 15, 2017 22:09:45 GMT
Bullshit again. You said that if one disagree with the amount of LGBT content in game, this person is homophobic. Instead of understanding people's reasons for thinking that way, which there are plenty of, you make assumptions. Not cool. Understanding people's reasoning? Lol what is there to understand? Are you uncomfortable with heterosexual players? If not, then why is it okay to "disagree" with LGBT content? If you actually had any knowledge outside your safe space, you would know that I, and other people, rather Bioware focus more in anything else than romances of all kinds to please just about everyone, aka DAI, a date fest with barely any other memorable side quest alonside a short main storyline and its boring antagonist. But sure, pretending you're fighting some fictional oppression by calling random people with different and reasonable thoughts homophobic will surely get you anywhere.
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Post by majesticjazz on Jan 15, 2017 22:15:24 GMT
Understanding people's reasoning? Lol what is there to understand? Are you uncomfortable with heterosexual players? If not, then why is it okay to "disagree" with LGBT content? If you actually had any knowledge outside your safe space, you would know that I, and other people, rather Bioware focus more in anything else than romances of all kinds to please just about everyone, aka DAI, a date fest with barely any other memorable side quest alonside a short main storyline and its boring antagonist. But sure, pretending you're fighting some fictional oppression by calling random people with different and reasonable thoughts homophobic will sure get you anywhere. No, you said that I was in the wrong for saying that people are homophobic if they are uncomfortable with LGBT characters. You said that I need to "understand" why people may feel that way which is funny. I guess if a person can make someone "understand" their racist, sexist, or homophobic feelings....that somehow makes them not racist, sexist, or homophobic.
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Post by majesticjazz on Jan 15, 2017 22:23:53 GMT
I will say this, given the success of TW3, we could be seeing a changing of the guard in regards to the WRPG genre. If MEA fails and Cyberpunk 2077 succeeds, along with games like Horizon Zero Dawn among others....nobody will ever look to Bioware as the flagship developer for WRPGs and. Furthermore, the fate of Dragon Age 4 may be in question along with their still unannounced new IP.
In other words, in a lot of ways, the fate of Bioware really lies on MEA.
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Post by majesticjazz on Jan 15, 2017 22:26:49 GMT
No, you said that I was in the wrong for saying that people are homophobic if they are uncomfortable with LGBT characters. Dude. You called me homophobic while I was talking about something that had nothing to do with gays. Your fanatic assumptions only make you look like a radical regressive. Also, criticism on the handling of gay characters and "representation" in general hardly always comes from a bigoted standpoint. Lol funny how you never hear anything about the "handling" of heterosexual characters.
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Post by majesticjazz on Jan 15, 2017 22:36:09 GMT
Lol funny how you never hear anything about the "handling" of heterosexual characters. Lol. Funny how you dodge the issue post after post because you can't muster a coherent response. I am not dodging any issue. I am pointing out a FACT that you never hear the term "handling of heterosexual romances" but only that of LGBT romances. Adjectives like: Pandering, forced, pushing an agenda....are all terms you always see when talking a out LGBT characters... So yes, if some gay character makes you unfomfortable, by definition that makes you homophobic.
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Post by Mihura on Jan 15, 2017 22:42:39 GMT
And even then, I like to think everyone is responsible and accountable forever for whatever they say, both in private and in public. Try to insult your significant other and justify it with "Ehi! It was just my personal space". A punch in the underbelly would be completely justified. Completely. And make it double if you were right. Don't mistake my intention, I support freedom of speech. What I don't support is double standards in regards to racism. Are you going to tell me you guys never rant or bad mouth a group of people or a specific one in private or public? like never?
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Post by majesticjazz on Jan 15, 2017 22:42:40 GMT
I am not dodging any issue. I am pointing out a FACT that you never hear the term "handling of heterosexual romances" but only that of LGBT romances. Adjectives like: Pandering, forced, pushing an agenda....are all terms you always see when talking a out LGBT characters... How is this connected to Manveer the asshole, and why did you jump to accuse me of homophobia because I mentioned him? If I specifically accused you personally as homophobic then my apologies. I am just saying from a blanket general perspective, if someone is uncomfortable with LGBT characters in a videogame, that does make them homophobic in the same way someone who is unfomfortable with female leaders is sexist.
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Post by Mihura on Jan 15, 2017 22:46:28 GMT
I know we are being sarcastic with all this but in a more serious note, I see twitter as a personal space. It is just like shouting at home obscenities. As for the rest, people seem to forget that even the mythical The Witcher 3 had a huge drama before release and some shady excuses for downgrading the game, sure after that it was praise to high heavens but closer to the release date the overall feeling was negative as fuck, the forum at the time was hilarious with all the butthurt PC gamers. So this type of skepticism is normal. Oh and let us not forget about the season pass, that was the cherry on the cake, so much irony. Hah, I remember that load of drama about the visual downgrade well. I have to admit, I was a butthurt PC gamer back then too, even though I barely posted about it. I still had a bad taste in my mouth from Watchdogs and its forced console parity, and I was plenty grumpy that apparently not even the vaunted CDPR seemed to be above those bum deals. Surely these were the end times and PC gaming was going to hell in a handbasket. Good fun. Man those were the days, I kinda of miss it! It was a ride to go there. I do understood why people were pissed but some PC gamers were just over the top with the ravaging.
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Post by Mihura on Jan 15, 2017 22:50:13 GMT
Are you going to tell me you guys never rant or bad mouth a group of people or a specific one in private or public? like never? A "group of people"? Depends on what you mean. I certainly don't denounce any group of people based on their race or gender. Well a group of people is a group of people, like bioware devs or jesus followers. It does not depend on anything I mean, it is assuming something about them because one person of the group behaves stupidly.
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Post by Gileadan on Jan 15, 2017 22:58:22 GMT
Man those were the days, I kinda of miss it! It was a ride to go there. I do understood why people were pissed but some PC gamers were just over the top with the ravaging. Yeah... some people just don't know when to quit and shut up and give common sense a chance to reassert itself. Now that I think about it, bitching about even well received games is a long standing, time honored tradition, especially in the BioWare fandom. Remember Knights of the Old Republic, cited as one of their immortal classics today? Back then, the old BioWare forums were full of XBox players claiming to have been cheated out of DLC (which came later to their platform than it did to PC), and those turret shooting sequences, where you had to move the crosshairs of the Ebon Hawk's gun turret all manual like and shoot at enemy fighters! RPGs were dead.
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Post by majesticjazz on Jan 15, 2017 23:19:32 GMT
If I specifically accused you personally as homophobic then my apologies. I am just saying from a blanket general perspective, if someone is uncomfortable with LGBT characters in a videogame, that does make them homophobic in the same way someone who is unfomfortable with female leaders is sexist. Again, this has nothing to do with the topic which was Manveer being a racist. And I would like to ass that while objecting to gays or women in various roles because of their sexuality or gender is bigoted, it has nothing to do with having specific objections. Like objecting to the female candidate in the US election because of her personal traits rather than the fact that she has a vagina, or objecting to hamfisted representation characters or representation related preaching that is obviously in a game just as preaching, rather than good characters which are interesting characters first and only happen to be XYZ. Ah so now I see you. People are unfomfortable with LGBT characters cause they see them as being there for "preaching". Again, I dont see the problem. I know Krem was there to preach about Transgender people and being accepted. I know Dorian's arch was about his sexuality and being accepted. However, that didnt bother me because I am not bothered by LGBT people or their representation. At the end of the day, Dorian or Krem or even Steve from ME3 did not forced themselves onto you. So I do not see the problem. But ymmv.
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Post by Garo on Jan 15, 2017 23:27:19 GMT
"Can't wait for more SJW propoganda, meaningless choices, tons of boring fetch quests, 0 straight romance options, microtransactions, Tumblr fanfic level writing and dialogue, characters whose sole purpose is being a token gay/transsexual/bisexual/pansexual/asexual/apache helicopter and either a cliffhanger or ABC ending."
Comment from YouTube, has 168 likes at the moment. I think it summs up well what some people think. Let's break it down, shall we:
1. SJW - I would dismiss that claim. We have 2 white, hot protagonists, PeeBee is only like 5% less hot than standard Asari and after last gameplay I think even that is not accurate anymore, beacause they tweaked her appearance a little.
2. Meaningless choices - Exaggerated, Mass Effect had impactful and fun choices, even if ending didn't show it too well. Also, this can be applied to any Tell Tale game, yet people still love those. Guess why. Because it's about fun.
3. Tons of boring fetch quests - I think someone at BW already said that they are moving away from this because Dragon Age. Also, did anyone played the game already to know that?
4. 0 straight romance options - ???
5. Microtransactions - In Multiplayer it's optional. Singleplayer has none.
6. Tumblr fanfic level writing and dialogue - Well Life is Strange sold well. Also if you liked ME1 or 2 then don't bother telling me how *bad* third one is or Andromeda will be.
7. Characters whose sole purpose is being a token gay/transsexual/bisexual/pansexual/asexual/apache helicopter - So far no information about that. Also no characters so far that sole purpose were being gay. Yes, BW is too politically correct but you can mostly ignore that stuff. Like you do in real life. Also apache helicopter for Andromeda FTW.
8. Cliffhanger or ABC ending. - Hurr, durr endings of ME3 *SQUEAK*. Get real, at least you had something to talk about for past 4 years.
Yea so, here you go. Also main trailer for Andromeda now has 6 588 492 views 64 995 thumbs up and 1 789 tumbs down. I think we good.
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Post by stealthfox94 on Jan 15, 2017 23:27:51 GMT
This always happens around a new BioWare game for a few reasons: First off, the current version of BioWare isn't making games that are like the old version of BioWare. This isn't inherently a bad thing, but there is however still a number of the "old guard" around that wants BioWare to be making games like Baldur's Gate and Neverwinter Nights, which BioWare has been wanting to go more action/cinematic since about KotoR(We can blame EA for some things, but it's pretty clear they wanted to be more cinematic with KotoR). Secondly, the last few games were received very poorly by some people. Dragon Age 2 was rushed and showed it in a number of places, the ending to ME3 pissed a lot of people off, and DA:I was a pretty mixed response on the forums at the time. As a result, there are a number of people who feel that BioWare has "lost it" in terms of being able to make high quality AAA RPGs. As for me I'm still gonna get ME:A and I suspect that I'll still enjoy it. If nothing else, very little out there right now has the gameplay style of mixing powers and gunplay that Mass Effect does and does it as well as Mass Effect does. Also I generally prefer sci-fi over fantasy and I really can't find any new sci-fi RPGs to play.If I'm being bluntly honest that's a big reason why I'll buy this game no matter what. Kind of hope a new cool sci-fi game comes out soon. Kind of lacking in that department. Never got why so many people prefer zombie games to sci-fi games.
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