Why the ending did not work (repost)

Are people still going on about this? The Extended Cut fixed all that, but apparently, it just didn't wasn't designed to your exact specifications listed here.

The EC fixed a lot of things in the ending, but unfortunately not the nonsense at its core,  nor the fact that every high-EMS outcome, while obviously intended as good, still left a bad taste in people's mouths, for the reasons I outlined in the OP.

Regarding the main plot: we have six outcomes: Destroy and Control in the high- and low-EMS variants, Synthesis and Refuse. That absolutely would have been enough, had any of them conveyed an emotionally satisfying (not necessarily happy, but satisfying) impression of victory or untainted continuance of a core of civilization. Instead, the only outcome that feels untainted is Refuse, and that's not a victory by any measure. The future is outlined by the Reaper Controller, but at least, if you choose Refuse, you aren't complicit in creating it.

Not that I chose Refuse. I chose to accept the taint for a hopefully better future. I might have considered this a worthwhile sacrifice, had the exposition not been as nonsensical as it was. As I said elsewhere, I can live with some emotional fallout, but not with insults to my intelligence.

I forget, is it possible to get all of that now with DLC? No MP at all?

Really? Crazy..

I uploaded a lot of N7s in MP at the time, thinking I had to. I guess not.

I would care about the varied endings (or lack thereof) even less, if Earth was simply fun to play through. They could have made use of the EMS more in that section.. but instead it's just some flat number. The individual EMS assets end up meaning nothing in themselves.


This is what makes the Suicide Mission is so much better. It's not on the same scale, but all of your actions and characters become assets in one way or another. Ship upgrades, choices, living crew.. They could have done the same in ME3, depending on what you saved.

Extended cut was like putting ribbon on a burnt cake. It maybe looks a little better but it's still broken.
Yes we have 3 choices, yes these choices alone are somewhat logical (not really), but this ending has many, many diffrent problems that EC did not even touch. Sole existence of Catalyst creates massive plot holes. Run to conduit looks even sillier now, with Normandy landing right in front of Harbinger. TIM and Anderson on Citadel, another nonsense. Even the place makes no sense because... Where do we actually are? When we talk to the Catalyst we are standing in open space. Where you can't breathe.

Let's also remember about reapers being complete idiots all the time. Why didn't they just turned off the conduit? Why we want to run into it, if we have conduit on Ilos? Why reapers didn't turned off mass relays? Why didn't they attack the Crucible? How did they move the Citadel and why to Earth? This ending is just a massive plot hole and the only thing you can do, is create crazy ideas to justify all this nonsense (indoctrination theory was born this way).

Also community would probably ignore all that, but this ending is still very lacking when it comes to showing our crew actually doing something. BW created amazing characters, that people were happy just reading about (Shadow Broker), yet we don't see them doing shit. Also all those war assets that we collected - you won't see them also for the most part. Shepard has only this "hyyyy" scene at the end (and even this scene makes no sense), Joker just flies away ignoring Shepard. Then slide show. Hooraayy.

So yea, ending still is a big let down.

There are four lights endings.  All based on what color you want, and with minor differences based on an arbitrary number.

Well, three and passive-aggressive "Cupcakes, huh?  Well FU!" from Bioware.

Logic = Reaper Kryptonite

I have this idea that the reason why reapers didn't go straight for the Citadel was because this was a risky thing to do. Races would have time to coordinate defense. Yes, slim chances of winning a fight like that, but even if reapers would win it,  council could just close the Citadel. Easy as that, you see reaper, you close it. Then again, how exactly reapers got control of the Citadel later is beyond me. 

I remember being somewhat let down by the idea of Crucible. You are telling me there is magic plot device that can destroy all reapers?

 

Well that's not my point. If Catalyst was always on the Citadel he should be able to just let reapers go through relay without help from Sovereign in the first game. This is never explained. Protheans altered the signal that compels the keepers to activate the Citadel relay. Why would Catalyst allow that to happen? It could be explained in game, but it wasn't.



I don't think reapers would care about collateral damage. But ok, let's say aiming at the Normandy wasn't a logical thing to do for Harbinger. Then why didn't he just aim at Shepard to kill him. He was standing, having his touchy feely scene in the middle of the death zone. Harbinger ignored that and stopped shooting.



I think mass effect fields don't protect you from radiation and also we are not standing in space ship that covers his holes with mass effect fields. We are standing in open space with no visible mass effect fields. Also at the beggining of ME2 Shepard has helmet and Joker this breathing thing. This implies there is no air in the ship and they need their helmets. In ME3 ending Shepard is fine without it.



Fair, but still, they could just turn it off while attack is made. Reapers are risking getting Shepard to the Citadel. Turn it off, kill everyone, then turn it on again. Easy. Also why do you start talking about ME1 here all of the sudden. I am talking about ME3 run to conduit, not this from the first game. In the first game they simply couldn't turn it off, in third game they should be able to.



Well they have power to turn them on and off again as they wish. Also they could just turn off the relay near Earth and stop fleets from attacking the Citadel at all.



Really? I have never heard of them.



Heh. Great storytelling. "It's whatever you want it to be".



Really? Hundreds? They either can be dead or alive, their arcs are pretty much the same, only diffrence exists if you romance one of them and it would not be hard to include. They did it before, this kind of closure was made for example in Dragon Age.



My point exactly. You see there is a clear diffrence between ME2 and 3 in that regard. If I upgrade ship in ME2, I see it making a difference in suicide mission. If I have Rachni in ME3 I have to belive they made some diffrence. It's not that big of deal but this makes ending less special.



Nooo, I mean after Hackett says: "The Crucible is armed". Joker looks sad then, you know, flies away. Shepard who?




This game went from mass effect fields to green space magic. I call bullshit on that.

Well, good to know ^^

It was never explained how thousands of years of existence they could some how miss the rather important set up of what the Citadel really is. THE Citadel it self is far more of a plot hole the Catalyst is. I mean it would be one thing if it was a recent find and the Council and everything was maybe a dozen years old or something. But you are talking about thousands of years of occupation with no one vaugly understanding what everyone is living on.

And to put it simply the Catalyst is the brains. The Reapers are arms. They decide if and when a cycle has for filled the needed criteria to be harvested or not. At that point they signal the Citadel and it activates. The Catalyst isn't required to do any of that because that is why it created the Reapers. Munch in the same way a manager doesn't do all the work like cleaning up, closing doors to store at the end of the day, etc.



When the collateral damage could have effect on Citadel and by extension the Catalyst. On top of that while Shep is having his emotional moment there are still ground troops attempting to make it into the beam. Meaning Harbinger has to keep shooting at them and can not target Shep specifically. Once he gets to the ramp on Normandy any shot taken at Shep would either be taken by the Normandy's shields or damage leading to massive explosion.

Remember Reapers have access to same level weaponry as everyone else in the game if not several magnitudes better. A single round from a Dreadnought class ship could have wiped that entire area out from orbit. Hitting with a force equal to that of the atomic bombs dropped on Japan in WW2. Harbinger or literally any other Reaper not firing a few rounds off from orbit to strike at it means there was something special about that spot. Something the Reapers were not willing to risk damaging. Which is why Harbinger came down and fired the very precised beams taking out individuals. Rather then nuke it from orbit.



Not all ME fields are visible though. Any time from ME 1 though 3 when you are on a planet with gravity that is greater then 1.5g your suit has an ME field on it that reduces or increases it to standard 1g. That fields is separate from the kinetic barrier used to stop bullets. Every weapon used involves manipulating a ME fields to accelerate the rounds to the high velocity speeds. The entire Citadel has one massive ME field around it. That is how breathable atmosphere is kept in it and everyone can walk around on the arms without a breather mask. The energy discharge from the Crucible being attached could easily cover that up. If it was ever visible at all.



If i remember right as you make the final run up to the Conduit there is a cinematic moment showing the starting assault on the Citadel and Saren closing off the flight controls. Then when it returns to player control there is a count down timer saying the Conduit is closing. And you mentioned the Conduit. It is entirely possible after that final burst it was rendered inoperable. Although that would be an interesting set up that the Reapers went to Ilos and repaired and reactivated it and used it to sneak troops onto the Citadel to allow them to attack it. After all they would understand the technology far better then even Protheans who were in very early stages of recreating and mastering that technology.

Oh you are talking about the beam run. Never heard anyone refer to it as conduit before since that already has a very specific meaning in lore. They could very easily have shut it off. But then it would have been game over. I mean I would be very interested and would enjoy a game were right at the end the door is slammed shut on you and you lose. But I can't say I speak for the majority of players who would enjoy that. You get right to the beam and it shuts off then suddenly Harbinger and 3 other Reapers land around and then end credits roll. I mean players complain about the ending enough already and that is with a happy ending.



Why? The Reapers set them up in a perfect trap. In one decisive battle they would effectively eliminate the races of the galaxy's ability resist them. And right up till Shep makes the choice that is exactly what is happening. The Reapers while taking casualties of their own are effectively tearing apart the combined fleets of all races in the galaxy.



Yes when you have a game based on choices and no 2 people's choices or reasons for those choices are ever the same. It is a fairly good ending set up. Because then the fans can speculate what happened to who. Now if this was a game with a predestined story where your choices were already defined for you and all you really do is just shoot people in between cut scenes. Then I would agree that is terrible set up.



Not really each ending has dozens of possible out comes for each of the main characters. Romancing them or not could determine if they hook up with someone or not. On top of that choices and determine what they would do post Reaper War. Tali for example if certain choices could post destroy be a voice firmly against the creations of further synthetic life. Or if peace was made post destroy she could be a voice firmly in favor of creating synthetic life and treating them as equals rather then slaves. She could be firmly against AI shep seeing it as another synthetic problem but on a larger scale. Or she could be for it since it was Shepard and it would help prevent conflict between other Organic and synthetic life. Preventing a repeat of what happened to Quarians. She could equally be firmly against synthesis or firmly for it depending on choices made during the trilogy. That is a lot of option for just 1 character.



And if you don't get war assets in ME 3 it makes a difference in the suicide mission as well.



Yes Joker was circling waiting to hear something from Shepard. He only turns away once another crew member shows up and tells him in an unspoken glance they have to leave. That Shepard wouldn't want to see all of his friends killed for his/her sake. If he got a radio message I'm more then sure that Joker would have tried to save Shepard. But there was radio silence, no way of knowing if he was still alive still. So he waited till the last minute before finally leaving.

This was a pretty emotion moment and I'm really surprised you some how managed to interpret is vastly different then what it was clearly intended to be.



And ME fields are space magic as well. So really it went from one form of space magic to another form of space magic.