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Post by hammerstorm on Mar 11, 2017 20:28:53 GMT
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Post by cloud9 on Mar 11, 2017 20:52:55 GMT
You again presume way too much, but I am not surprised since you did it from the start. For one, I am a 30 year old professor who can barely pay his bills in full and lives paycheck to paycheck to make ends meet. By no means do I have it good. I also work to bring actual change to the world through education where it counts; guidance for people in areas such as history, economics, politics and even a bit of sociology so they understand actual concepts in how the world works, and what they can do to effect change. Second, and more importantly, i'm pointing out the fallacy of intersectionality as the sole analysis of societal issues. It disregards conflicting data as abnormal because it presumes all forms of society are out to get someone because of people being in a minority. You're argument is built on studies that are at best, subjective data analysis, and at worst, opinionated pre-tenses based upon social and psychological stigmas to galvanize people, instead of addressing actual societal problems. In fact, it also encourages a de-facto form of acceptance of your lot in extreme cases and a perceived definition of their identity in the grand scheme of things. Yet a lot of the time such studies that champion such ideals fail to recognize the overlap of individuals overwhelmingly against their own trends, and often appeal to emotion instead to prove a point. This furthers socio-political splits amongst a population, which in turn is even worse because it breeds contempt between minority/majority groups in the long run due to the misuse of ideas like privilege and the CRT. Not once I noticed you saying at all how to fix such a problem, for example. You are quick to lay blame on society being dominantly white, and the presumption I have some form of privilege inherently because of that (or because of the society I live in) and instead ride in as if you are about to provide a teachable moment of some kind. However, you are saying everything i've heard before- and most of it is dismissed because things such as the CRT and societal studies regarding race are incredibly flawed in providing an objective analysis to their conclusions, and give few ways to move past racial constructs other than accepting they exist and relishing in it as our defining trait as a society. This is one of the first things I have to also teach my student's: subjective analysis is meaningless if evidence doesn't support such conclusions. Your bit about the dolls is good evidence of a problem that I agree with, but in the 1940s you had a good sample size to go by. The "Girl Like Me" test by Kiri Davis had 21 subjects...Clark had 300 with no control group nor actual theory behind it. Past uses of the Clark Doll test appealed to emotion by creating eye-catching statistics. Ultimately recent uses of the Clark Doll Test do the same thing with shakier pretense; small test groups which as far as a psychological studies go, is too small to be meaningful in an objective way. So let's cut to the chase: Your problem is injecting real-life race politics into a conversation where human race politics in a video game is non-existent. So yes, I can tell someone it doesn't matter for that game because by the game's own design, it doesn't. Nothing prevents players from fulfilling a power fantasy in the style of a BioWare game, and accusations over such hangups are ultimately meaningless, regardless of what your narrative is. If you make a black, white, asian and so forth is a choice of the player to skin that cat and role-play as they see fit. It has nothing to do with race and representation- and folks looking for that representation are missing the point of the game's own presentation. Nice red herring. In terms of the subject matter you do have it good. You, as a white person in the U.S., are privy to the lion's share of representation. any potential children you have will develop a healthy self image. I take it you're trying to change the subject because you know you can't win if you stay on subject. This is not about your financial situation.
I never said anyone was out to get anyone. However, the psychological effects of being bombarded with media that primarily features people who you do not relate to on a growing child are negative. That's just the results of capitalism and how it affects what is put out there. Whites represent the largest economic block so media tends to cater to whites. Whites make up the majority of creators and like any normal person when you have ideas they picture people like themselves as the default. Also, the majority of the talent pool will likewise be white. Louis CK admits it and he's telling the truth.
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Post by cloud9 on Mar 11, 2017 23:07:00 GMT
Racial diversity in this context is irrelevant, because the OP makes the false assumption that Humans in the Mass Effect universe possess physical features that would make them strictly unique to one only ethnic group. Its 2185 - I'd like to think that Humans have transcended the barrier of primitive tribalism such as ethnic groups. In other words: Colored people should forget their culture and identity and not embracing their heritage. Dude. Really???
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Always teacher, sometimes writer
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
PSN: LinksOcarina
Posts: 3,186 Likes: 4,072
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Post by linksocarina on Mar 11, 2017 23:20:45 GMT
This describes this thread best. But no one here is denying any form of suffering or erasing any cultural history with what they said. To say they are by proxy of arguing that race is a non-issue in a video game...isn't that presuming way too much there?
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Post by kotoreffect3 on Mar 11, 2017 23:56:25 GMT
Walks into thread. Slowly turns around and walks out.
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Post by cloud9 on Mar 12, 2017 3:54:47 GMT
This describes this thread best. But no one here is denying any form of suffering or erasing any cultural history with what they said. To say they are by proxy of arguing that race is a non-issue in a video game...isn't that presuming way too much there? The whole "We're all human" and "transcended color and just call yourself human" thing is just another form of denying the evils of racism inflicts damage on people of color in a emotional, mental and spiritual and a way to say that colored people should shut up get over it.
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Post by maximusarael020 on Mar 12, 2017 4:03:19 GMT
Walks into thread. Slowly turns around and walks out. You chose... Wisely.
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Post by darcon on Mar 12, 2017 4:48:31 GMT
Walks into thread. Slowly turns around and walks out. You chose... Wisely. wish I made the same choice T_T
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Post by cloud9 on Mar 12, 2017 5:06:32 GMT
I see why your people frowned on you. My people did that to me long ago. The majority of them treat me like a white guy and say racist things to me. When they see that my grandfather is darker skinned than them and the rest of my family they shut their faces. Then white peoples treat me like a white guy and start saying racist things about natives around me. Until they see my family or know I'm native. Then they start throwing those at me. Or treating me like a minority. I'm sick of most people in general these days kid. I just stick to myself and my learning. Everyone else seems to have the chips on their shoulder. Not me. I'm just trying to enjoy life until sanctimonious assholes come along telling me what's right and wrong for me when they got no clue. In real life and out native and not. That's unfortunate but that doesn't mean that you dismiss your culture and identity, and you should keep what you have and don't let anyone take it from you.
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Post by farsight on Mar 12, 2017 7:27:18 GMT
My people did that to me long ago. The majority of them treat me like a white guy and say racist things to me. When they see that my grandfather is darker skinned than them and the rest of my family they shut their faces. Then white peoples treat me like a white guy and start saying racist things about natives around me. Until they see my family or know I'm native. Then they start throwing those at me. Or treating me like a minority. I'm sick of most people in general these days kid. I just stick to myself and my learning. Everyone else seems to have the chips on their shoulder. Not me. I'm just trying to enjoy life until sanctimonious assholes come along telling me what's right and wrong for me when they got no clue. In real life and out native and not. That's unfortunate but that doesn't mean that you dismiss your culture and identity, and you should keep what you have and don't let anyone take it from you. Don't even realize the irony. Now that's funny. Your taking away my identity as a person to try and force me to fit inside another identity. If that's not authoritarian and counter-intuitive to your goals I don't know what else is.
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Post by Abramsrunner on Mar 12, 2017 8:48:54 GMT
The Humans should take up Self Contained Envirosuits, & keep the visor at 99.1% opaqueness.
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Post by cloud9 on Mar 12, 2017 8:52:03 GMT
The highlighted part presents the issue imo, since some races are generally percieved as less attractive by people from other races. So a black woman would have to be a lot more attractive than a white woman relatively speaking for me (as a white male) to find her attractive. Same goes for asians. The top percentage of women of other races look great, but once you go into average territory it's a whole other story. It has nothing to do with racism either, it's a matter of preference. You can't tell people what they should find attractive the same way you can't tell them what food or music they should enjoy. Another thing to consider is that while race-mixing is heavily pushed in the media nowadays, the majority of people prefer to have partners of their own race. That's why I don't buy the "everyone is mixed-race in the future" line. White people are a minority in the world and we have the lowest birth rates. In most western countries these birth rates aren't high enough to sustain a stable population size anymore, so unless something changes we'll gradually go extinct over hundreds or thousands of years. I get what you're saying, but it's not just a matter of preference, and a lot of it has to do with inherent social bias, especially in regards to the "unattractiveness" of sects of minorities like black, middle eastern, etc. Anyone growing up in a "western" society or a society with heavy western influence is brought up with the preconceived notion that white people are the default and white women--blonde white women especially--are the baseline for attractiveness. it's why those who tend to adopt default white women features, straight hair, for example, tend to be deemed more attractive than the ginger with curls or the black girl with a fro. And while plenty of people can bypass these biases, they're very much a heavy influence on attractiveness. Precisely why black males, who grow up in a community of nothing but black people, interact with nothing but black people on a daily basis, always tend to make a beeline for your fair skinned blonde white women at the first opportunity with little to no variation; we're programmed to. I know this from firsthand experience as being a black male who had a stretch where everyone who wasn't a blonde white girl with long hair was unattractive to me until I had an epiphany and actually opened myself up to paying attention to others and actually identifying features I actually find attractive more on others than on white women. I rather date my own than white women. Too much bad blood especially when they'll scream "rape".
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Post by cloud9 on Mar 12, 2017 8:54:31 GMT
That's unfortunate but that doesn't mean that you dismiss your culture and identity, and you should keep what you have and don't let anyone take it from you. Don't even realize the irony. Now that's funny. Your taking away my identity as a person to try and force me to fit inside another identity. If that's not authoritarian and counter-intuitive to your goals I don't know what else is. Dude I'm not making do anything I'm just encouraging you by giving you an advice. But that's up to you whether you want to or not.
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N5
Always teacher, sometimes writer
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
PSN: LinksOcarina
Posts: 3,186 Likes: 4,072
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Post by linksocarina on Mar 12, 2017 15:55:44 GMT
But no one here is denying any form of suffering or erasing any cultural history with what they said. To say they are by proxy of arguing that race is a non-issue in a video game...isn't that presuming way too much there? The whole "We're all human" and "transcended color and just call yourself human" thing is just another form of denying the evils of racism inflicts damage on people of color in a emotional, mental and spiritual and a way to say that colored people should shut up get over it. So your pride is your own form of racism them? I have to ask, what is your heritage then and what does it mean to you?
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Post by cloud9 on Mar 12, 2017 19:09:13 GMT
The whole "We're all human" and "transcended color and just call yourself human" thing is just another form of denying the evils of racism inflicts damage on people of color in a emotional, mental and spiritual and a way to say that colored people should shut up get over it. So your pride is your own form of racism them? I have to ask, what is your heritage then and what does it mean to you? Wow your ignotance is showing and We're not even friends so why should I tell you?
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linksocarina
N5
Always teacher, sometimes writer
Teaching Mode Activated
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
PSN: LinksOcarina
Posts: 3,186 Likes: 4,072
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Post by linksocarina on Mar 12, 2017 19:18:49 GMT
So your pride is your own form of racism them? I have to ask, what is your heritage then and what does it mean to you? Wow your ignotance is showing and We're not even friends so why should I tell you? Why should you hide it to anyone, friend or not, if you're so proud then? This is the part I don't understand, you are quick to judge others for what they said but you have not provided much actual discourse outside of such judgements. You are basically being prejudiced to others in that regard.
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Post by Arijon van Goyen on Mar 12, 2017 19:26:11 GMT
All characters are pygmies it seems. :lmfao:
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Post by ToLazy4Name on Mar 12, 2017 19:30:16 GMT
white people are the best yo
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Post by fromthealps on Mar 12, 2017 19:45:49 GMT
pygmies... Obviously they have already adapted to the future, where you need really big heads, for thinking'n'stuff...
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Post by cloud9 on Mar 12, 2017 20:00:59 GMT
Wow your ignotance is showing and We're not even friends so why should I tell you? Why should you hide it to anyone, friend or not, if you're so proud then? This is the part I don't understand, you are quick to judge others for what they said but you have not provided much actual discourse outside of such judgements. You are basically being prejudiced to others in that regard. Typical slandering.
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Post by slimgrin on Mar 12, 2017 20:02:43 GMT
This looks like a fun thread.
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linksocarina
N5
Always teacher, sometimes writer
Teaching Mode Activated
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
PSN: LinksOcarina
Posts: 3,186 Likes: 4,072
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Post by linksocarina on Mar 12, 2017 21:46:25 GMT
Why should you hide it to anyone, friend or not, if you're so proud then? This is the part I don't understand, you are quick to judge others for what they said but you have not provided much actual discourse outside of such judgements. You are basically being prejudiced to others in that regard. Typical slandering. Typical non-answer. I typically hate the horseshoe theory, but as of late it has been patently obvious how the far right and far left have become too defensive and controlling in the real world. It makes true liberalism hard to come by nowadays.
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Post by obatalaryder on Mar 13, 2017 1:03:57 GMT
There's nothing realistic about white people being the majority of humanity in space when even now white people are the least-populated race/group on the planet. Indian and Chinese people alone garner the majority of humanity.
Also nothing in Mass Effect's lore implies that humans have somehow transcended tribalism or group-thinking. The majority of nation-states in 2183 still resemble the same volatile globalizing world what we have today.
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Post by obatalaryder on Mar 13, 2017 1:10:28 GMT
I get what you're saying, but it's not just a matter of preference, and a lot of it has to do with inherent social bias, especially in regards to the "unattractiveness" of sects of minorities like black, middle eastern, etc. Anyone growing up in a "western" society or a society with heavy western influence is brought up with the preconceived notion that white people are the default and white women--blonde white women especially--are the baseline for attractiveness. it's why those who tend to adopt default white women features, straight hair, for example, tend to be deemed more attractive than the ginger with curls or the black girl with a fro. And while plenty of people can bypass these biases, they're very much a heavy influence on attractiveness. Precisely why black males, who grow up in a community of nothing but black people, interact with nothing but black people on a daily basis , always tend to make a beeline for your fair skinned blonde white women at the first opportunity with little to no variation; we're programmed to. I know this from firsthand experience as being a black male who had a stretch where everyone who wasn't a blonde white girl with long hair was unattractive to me until I had an epiphany and actually opened myself up to paying attention to others and actually identifying features I actually find attractive more on others than on white women. How about you just speak for yourself, breh. Stop presenting your internal issues as universal to all black folks.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, KOTOR, Jade Empire
Origin: ItsFreakinJesus
XBL Gamertag: ItsFreakinJesus
PSN: TheMadTitan
Posts: 848 Likes: 1,024
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Post by Cypher on Mar 13, 2017 1:19:00 GMT
I get what you're saying, but it's not just a matter of preference, and a lot of it has to do with inherent social bias, especially in regards to the "unattractiveness" of sects of minorities like black, middle eastern, etc. Anyone growing up in a "western" society or a society with heavy western influence is brought up with the preconceived notion that white people are the default and white women--blonde white women especially--are the baseline for attractiveness. it's why those who tend to adopt default white women features, straight hair, for example, tend to be deemed more attractive than the ginger with curls or the black girl with a fro. And while plenty of people can bypass these biases, they're very much a heavy influence on attractiveness. Precisely why black males, who grow up in a community of nothing but black people, interact with nothing but black people on a daily basis , always tend to make a beeline for your fair skinned blonde white women at the first opportunity with little to no variation; we're programmed to. I know this from firsthand experience as being a black male who had a stretch where everyone who wasn't a blonde white girl with long hair was unattractive to me until I had an epiphany and actually opened myself up to paying attention to others and actually identifying features I actually find attractive more on others than on white women. How about you just speak for yourself, breh. Stop presenting your internal issues as universal to all black folks. In retrospect, I worded that all wrong, lmao. I'll take that shade.
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