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Post by SofaJockey on Aug 20, 2016 12:04:25 GMT
Just for fun (because this ship really has sailed hasn't it) but what if the Ryder trailer was a trolling cutscene for a protagonist that was actually silent? If BioWare did make the protagonist silent (incredibly unlikely as that is) would it have any advantages, or would the games market and players universally believe BioWare were off their head?
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Post by goishen on Aug 20, 2016 12:56:56 GMT
IMO, the game would suffer. In fact, I don't even think I would buy the game. It would have advantages, but only to the people that actually roleplay in their own heads. When I'm discussing books or movies with another person, we can always come to some sort of conclusion about what they were talking about, or at least on the surface what they were talking about. (see the final scene in No Country For Old Men for what I'm talking about here)
In video games with a silent protagonist with so much roleplaying going on, you can't do that. I'd much rather hear the voice of the protagonist so that we can all get on the same page. Even if people disagree about it.
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Post by Reznore on Aug 20, 2016 13:21:47 GMT
ME use lots and lots of cinematics so it would be very awkward at this point.They'd need to redesign a lot of stuff. Silent protag has some advantages for roleplay and strangely enough lots of people didn't appreciate having a voiced protag in FO4.For some it killed replay value too.
I can appreciate both but voiced protag has a list of "meh": If you don't like the PC voice actor it's annoying. Bland lines are less jarring when not voiced.(you can always imagine your pc say something a bit different ,way more difficult when voiced) Voice actor performance .In DAI I enjoyed the male British voice actor but Jeez , don't let this guy yell orders he's terrible at it...and for some exchanges during Trespasser he sounded super posh.I don't think my dalish is "posh".Broke mah immersion. Voice acting for the PC has a cost ,it means every word is more pricey.It usually translate in less words.Less words tends to translate in less quests or quests more streamlined.
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Post by Lavochkin on Aug 20, 2016 13:37:22 GMT
There were times in the trilogy where I wish Shepard was a silent protagonist due to a lot of the dumb shit he would say, from comparing the genophage to the first contact war, acting surprised that the Asari can reproduce with each other and asking Tali if she's royalty, and that's just in the first game.
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Post by Rascoth on Aug 20, 2016 13:46:49 GMT
I would throw this game out the airlock But honestly, I prefer games with voiced protagonist. The game would lose some of its appeal to me. I don't have that much problem with it if other characters are also silent, but when they're fully voiced... I know there're people who liked this, but one of my main problems with DAO is exactly silent protag (in fully voiced world).
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Atomkick Shinoski
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Never stop doing your best just because someone doesn't give you credit.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Jade Empire
Origin: AtomkickN7
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Never stop doing your best just because someone doesn't give you credit.
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Post by Atomkick Shinoski on Aug 20, 2016 13:49:12 GMT
If Ryder turns out to be a silent protagonist then without hesitation I would throw ME:A out of the airlock.
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Affectionately: Look deep into my eyes and acknowledge my existence......... now give me your soul.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age Inquistion
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Affectionately: Look deep into my eyes and acknowledge my existence......... now give me your soul.
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Post by Grim on Aug 20, 2016 14:27:53 GMT
Sarcastically: Yes, I would love to have one especially during key moments in the story &/or cinematic cutscenes where it looks like I'm contemplating everything. I would be as deep as a black and white filter. In fact, if this was the case the game would greatly benefit from having the whole game be in black and white like cat vision from The Witcher.
(Ex.)
LI - You think we'll make it Ryder - ...(yeah) LI - You're always keeping a level head about all this, even when you started the war. Ryder - *looks at plant* ...(plant is cool) LI - Why did you start the war anyway? Did you think it would really help us find peace with the ********? Ryder - ...(plants are nice) LI - Are you listening to me? Ryder - ...(yeah) LI - Been cheating on you with the Asaru. Ryder - ...(what) LI - She listens to me, and talks to me, unlike you, what do you even sound like? Ryder - ...(plant) LI - I'm leaving you. *walks out of airlock* Ryder - ...(the asaru was a girl?)
They said it would be more realistic, so there you go. LI can cheat on you, be stupid, and die in an non-cinematic way. All because you look at plants all day.
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Post by themikefest on Aug 20, 2016 14:45:34 GMT
What if the main character has a voice and all the other characters don't? hahahahaha
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Affectionately: Look deep into my eyes and acknowledge my existence......... now give me your soul.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age Inquistion
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Affectionately: Look deep into my eyes and acknowledge my existence......... now give me your soul.
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Post by Grim on Aug 20, 2016 15:03:09 GMT
What if the main character has a voice and all the other characters don't? hahahahaha Devilishly: Then they couldn't say no.
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Larry-3
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Make it simple but significant.
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Post by Larry-3 on Aug 20, 2016 15:04:09 GMT
Why not make it optional? Turning off character audio would bring up a list of unique text options; while turning on character audio would bring up a dialog wheel. Each one could have their advantages and disadvantages.
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is wanting to have some fun!
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
XBL Gamertag: cyberstrike nTo
PSN: cyberstrike-nTo
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Post by Cyberstrike on Aug 20, 2016 15:10:21 GMT
IMO, the game would suffer. In fact, I don't even think I would buy the game. It would have advantages, but only to the people that actually roleplay in their own heads. When I'm discussing books or movies with another person, we can always come to some sort of conclusion about what they were talking about, or at least on the surface what they were talking about. (see the final scene in No Country For Old Men for what I'm talking about here) In video games with a silent protagonist with so much roleplaying going on, you can't do that. I'd much rather hear the voice of the protagonist so that we can all get on the same page. Even if people disagree about it. There is also the aspect of interpretation that comes reading that cause huge misunderstandings and headaches. Some of that is why social media is such a pain in ass right now. A joke or a sarcastic comment doesn't work very well when it's read but when you get spoken dialogue you can hear inflections, the tone of the voice, and other such things. Unless it's spelled out literally, you get blown up outrages over what is really a joke. Now I'll try to explain this with a simple two word example: no. Can anybody honestly tell if am I being snarky, angry, sarcastic, seductive, intelligent, stupid, loud, and quite? I can vocalize the differences in just saying the word "no" in ways that I can never do typing the word. I know adding different punctuation marks and capitalizing the letters can tell you what I mean but that actually just makes my strengthens point. Someone speaking can put more meaning in one simple two letter word, and give an exact emotional meaning that reading can't and never will. Now I understand the appeal the silent protagonist but when you have other NPCs talking and the PC can't it looks and feels off putting to me, I would like to one day play a game where the silent protagonist can be silent for a reason in the game and has to interact with others in an interesting way, (i.e. writing stuff down and having people read it, sign and body language, interpreters, telepathy) but you all will pardon if I'm not holding my breath on that happening anytime soon because of technology limits or the sheer cost of making that actually work in a game that I would want to buy and play.
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Post by goishen on Aug 20, 2016 15:46:16 GMT
Why not make it optional? Turning off character audio would bring up a list of unique text options; while turning on character audio would bring up a dialog wheel. Each one could have their advantages and disadvantages. That would mean that one, BioWare would have a spend a ton more money on voice acting, because I'm assuming that you want KoToR like dialogue options which take up half of your screen? This would mean a ton of dialogue responses to a ton of questions that they wouldn't have had to make if they had simply left the protagonist's VA on. And two, BioWare's voice actor for the main protagonist would go vitally under used. If even twenty percent of people turned it off, what's the point of bringing in the voice actor?
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Post by davesin on Aug 20, 2016 16:18:22 GMT
That depends... I prefer no voice acting for characters who have little to no history. Let's take Warden as an example - yes, you have six origins for him (or her), but most of the information about his childhood, friends, etc. is unknown. The Warden has no standard character traits - you can make him a charismatic leader, a simple thug, a powerhungry overlord, a sadistic bastard, a goody-two-shoes kind of hero, a womanizer, anything that dialogue options allows you to do (and that's A LOT in Origins).
Voice acting works better for characters with character traits that he/she has no matter what. Commander Shepard is a charismatic leader with an ability to solve difficult problems. Whether you solve these problems with bullets or red/blue yelling is up to you but it doesn't matter that much. Commander is simply "the only person who can save the galaxy" and "the one who can bang anyone". And (s)he also makes A LOT of motivational speeches.
I usually prefer Warden-like-characters but I doubt we will get that in Andromeda. Just, for a **** sake, write decent dialogue lines for our character. Make him/her look smart! Jesus! "Can Asari reproduce with each other?"
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Affectionately: Look deep into my eyes and acknowledge my existence......... now give me your soul.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age Inquistion
Posts: 57 Likes: 72
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Affectionately: Look deep into my eyes and acknowledge my existence......... now give me your soul.
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Post by Grim on Aug 20, 2016 16:59:05 GMT
IMO, the game would suffer. In fact, I don't even think I would buy the game. It would have advantages, but only to the people that actually roleplay in their own heads. When I'm discussing books or movies with another person, we can always come to some sort of conclusion about what they were talking about, or at least on the surface what they were talking about. (see the final scene in No Country For Old Men for what I'm talking about here) In video games with a silent protagonist with so much roleplaying going on, you can't do that. I'd much rather hear the voice of the protagonist so that we can all get on the same page. Even if people disagree about it. There is also the aspect of interpretation that comes reading that cause huge misunderstandings and headaches. Some of that is why social media is such a pain in ass right now. A joke or a sarcastic comment doesn't work very well when it's read but when you get spoken dialogue you can hear inflections, the tone of the voice, and other such things. Unless it's spelled out literally, you get blown up outrages over what is really a joke. Now I'll try to explain this with a simple two word example: no. Can anybody honestly tell if am I being snarky, angry, sarcastic, seductive, intelligent, stupid, loud, and quite? I can vocalize the differences in just saying the word "no" in ways that I can never do typing the word. I know adding different punctuation marks and capitalizing the letters can tell you what I mean but that actually just makes my strengthens point. Someone speaking can put more meaning in one simple two letter word, and give an exact emotional meaning that reading can't and never will. Now I understand the appeal the silent protagonist but when you have other NPCs talking and the PC can't it looks and feels off putting to me, I would like to one day play a game where the silent protagonist can be silent for a reason in the game and has to interact with others in an interesting way, (i.e. writing stuff down and having people read it, sign and body language, interpreters, telepathy) but you all will pardon if I'm not holding my breath on that happening anytime soon because of technology limits or the sheer cost of making that actually work in a game that I would want to buy and play. Confused: How are you all these emotions at the same time? With sympathy: I agree, just like with the Elcor you could not tell the emotion being displayed through mere words without tone of voice & clear facial expressions. This is why having a voiced protagonist in a story based game is ideal in most cases.
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Post by ClarkKent on Aug 20, 2016 17:39:36 GMT
There's really no point. We're playing as a human and only a human with likely a set background, a set faction and a set authority.
Games like Fallout absolutely need it because the world is so filled to the brim with possibilities for the player(or should be). Likewise in Dragon Age Origins our character can and should be many different things, be it a snooty Dwarf noble, boy scout human noble, vindictive city elf etc.
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Cyonan
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
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Post by Cyonan on Aug 20, 2016 18:17:28 GMT
This thread makes me nostalgic for epic multi-quote battles with Sylvius.
Though I think there really isn't any worthwhile benefit in this case. The main one I see put forward by advocates of silent protagonists is that you can control the tone, but even silent dialogue is written with a specific tone assumed that just makes the other characters seem really inconsistent if you don't also assume the same tone.
There is also the idea that without a main voice actor you can get more dialogue options in, but I also think DA:I actually did a pretty solid job in that area with a voiced protagonist(with a total of 4 different voice options).
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BountyhunterGER
N2
Trying to be more active.. We'll see how this goes. - This went well..
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR
Origin: BountyhunterGER
PSN: BountyhunterGER
Posts: 231 Likes: 456
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Trying to be more active.. We'll see how this goes. - This went well..
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Post by BountyhunterGER on Aug 20, 2016 18:32:17 GMT
I would still buy and enjoy it (not as much as with a voiced protagonist though). My multiplayer hours however would outnumber my singleplayer hours even more than they did in me3.
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Post by Sartoz on Aug 20, 2016 18:32:43 GMT
<<<<<<<<<<(0)>>>>>>>>>>
I'm used to the "talkies", now. Any silent protag is so yesterday.
Having said that, It would get me more engaged with the main character, imo.
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Post by Zemgus on Aug 20, 2016 18:55:31 GMT
I would be very disappointed, but gladly that's not going to happen. It was my only complaint about the Warden. He was supposed to be the leader of the group but often the companions had to speak instead of him because he had no voice.
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Monk
N4
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: MonkMcMueller
PSN: Monk_McMueller
Prime Posts: 600, something, something
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Monk on Aug 20, 2016 19:24:06 GMT
Just for fun (because this ship really has sailed hasn't it) but what if the Ryder trailer was a trolling cutscene for a protagonist that was actually silent? If BioWare did make the protagonist silent (incredibly unlikely as that is) would it have any advantages, or would the games market and players universally believe BioWare were off their head? The only reason why i wouldn't consider returning the game outright was if the character was mute, either by birth or possibly recent accident. While i understand the imagination is a horrible thing to waste, i'd rather use it elsewhere than with a game i'm playing where the NPCs all have actors providing their voices. I know it's how i am but i really don't have a tolerance for non-speaking PCs in RPGs anymore. Hell, i've played both KotOR and KotOR2 back-to-back but probably won't play them again likely for this very reason. The only exception, so far, has been with DAO. I think with the exception of a small group of individuals, people would think BioWare had gone crackers, and not in a good Ritz kinda way.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2016 19:48:59 GMT
In all honesty? It would probably have room for more features around other areas. Software is kind of like how they say once you go blind your other senses become intesified? If they had to cut out voiced protagonist they would hopefully allocate that budget to other suffering aspects(suffering because not given enough attention) of the game. The voiced protagonist is one of bioware's main features but it is also one of it's main dependencies. Each scene requires, voice to be recorded, dialog to be written,cinematography to be designed and dialog trees path to be programmed.
However, from a design perspective, i think the game would suffer if they had to remove voiced dialog while going for a more cinematic approach. Having a silent protagonist in such a game wouldn't be beneficial because of how out of place the protagonist will look. They are ways around this like having graphical emotes to highlight what exactly the protagonist is feeling when delivering that piece of dialog but they do not have as much effect as the voiced protagonist.
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You'll be peeling goddamn potatoes for the rest of your miserable excuse for a military career!
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Post by General Mahad on Aug 20, 2016 19:56:29 GMT
As much as I loved my Wardens, it always felt immersion breaking when DA:O/A have these well made cinematic cutscenes where it looks like the warden is going to talk but they keep their faces shut and only make faces.
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Post by capn233 on Aug 20, 2016 20:17:03 GMT
Silent protagonist is not worth it.
Now if you had magical technology where the player was responsible for all the protagonist dialogue, that could be interesting.
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Xerxes52
N3
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Jade Empire
XBL Gamertag: Xerxes52
Posts: 374 Likes: 519
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Post by Xerxes52 on Aug 20, 2016 22:16:07 GMT
It would be disappointing, to say the least. I'd probably still play the game, just not enjoy it quite as much.
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Aug 20, 2016 22:38:40 GMT
It would take away 50% of what draws me to play a BioWare game.
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