Iakus
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Post by Iakus on Apr 8, 2017 0:31:30 GMT
I'd hate it if they didn't have Ryder anymore in a sequel. I've yet to fisnish the game, but for now i get a very distinct, intentional or not, "Origin" story from Andromeda. Maybe because of how i made my character progress, but it really feels like the whole game is about the making of Ryder and how he became a N7 rate badass. I want to see how the story continues We saw how that worked for Hawke and the Inquisitor didnt we? Build them up to point theyre semi likable and then dump them just as they begin to develop as characters. Its classic Dragon Age. Shepard still got it worse.
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Post by KaiserShep on Apr 8, 2017 0:34:31 GMT
Yeah at least Hawke can go back to Kirkwall and live it up with Viscount Tethras.
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Post by sauron001 on Apr 8, 2017 0:40:38 GMT
Very good read! Sounds like MEA will not continue in MEA2 with Ryder and crew. Not necessarily. He said each game would have a conclusion but still Cary on to the next. No reason to think Ryder couldn't continue. ^this Each game concludes an arc but doesn't mean the characters change. Kind of like a Star Trek or SG episode. We have a larger Arc in the sense of potential threats that could change but each game will conclude the story it started. I believe we will get more Ryder and crew but each game will be it's own adventure... I personally think it would work that way maybe so many games later (like 2-3 per protag) they can bring the glooming issue as the story and then move on say 10 years to another protagonist. ME is about characters/story, the only reason we end up loving the characters so much is because we have plenty of games to get attached to them. Without that it really isn't ME.
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Post by widepaul on Apr 8, 2017 2:00:50 GMT
I'd prefer Bioware not go down the route of new protagonists every game like dragon age, as dragon age already does that, but if they do then it would be nice if we could play as someone other than a human. After all if they are going to just keep us as human all the time then they may as well continue the adventures of Ryder and friends IMHO.
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Post by ShadowAngel on Apr 8, 2017 3:52:28 GMT
Whether true or not and because others have brought it up: I seriously hope they continue Ryder's story, it will kill my interest with the mass effect franchise if they do what DA does and replace the main character each game as well as the squads. It's harder to get attached if its only one game unless they get VERY good on character development throughout the game, which I honestly don't think bioware is currently capable of. Seriously, they need to keep Ryder + companions that they can expand on going just as they did with Shepard and company. It's part of why I loved the OT as I grew to care for them, much harder to care for Andromedas characters if they just start all over after Andromeda, and quite honestly I don't think I even can say I care for any of them (not saying they aren't good characters though). I want to care for Andromedas characters, so don't take the easy path and start anew bioware, just get better on developing them and making me care for them.
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Post by Petroshenko on Apr 8, 2017 4:03:51 GMT
Name other franchises that carry the same protagonist and the choices through save games across trilogy of games.
That's right. Remove that and you remove single-handedly most unique aspect of ME Trilogy in modern game industry that played a massive part in player investement and attachement to the series despite all the fuckups with actual consequences to carried choices.
This "standalone" route, likely meaning changining protagonists, sounds utterly unambitious and trying to play is as safe as much as possible. Yawn.
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Post by Revan Reborn on Apr 8, 2017 4:45:06 GMT
I actually believe many in this thread are misinterpreting what Walters means by "standalone." I also believe many are misinterpreting what he means by "when the story ends, the game continues."
With regard to the first point, one area where the original trilogy suffered was bringing in newcomers. Many may forget, but ME1 was originally a Microsoft exclusive. It wasn't until BioWare was bought by EA in 2008 that the ME franchise became multiplatform. As a result, Mass Effect, as a whole, never sold incredibly well on the PS3 due to many people never being exposed to the previous game. The Witcher 3 also had a similar issue as Xbox players never played TW1 and Playstation players never played TW1 or TW2. Doing a more contained story avoids the pitfalls of newcomers keeping their distance. That doesn't mean BioWare also needs to keep changing protagonists either. Consider each game a self-contained chapter with the same lead character.
As for the second point, I'm almost positive what Walters is talking about is the fact you can continue playing MEA after the Critical Path ends. In ME1, ME2, and ME3, the game would end once you completed the last mission. If you wanted to continue playing, you'd have to start right before the final mission or do a new playthrough. MEA is different since it's more of an open world game, so it allows the game to continue even when the main story ends.
I am 100% positive that Ryder will come back as a protagonist and that likely most, if not all, of the crew will return as well. Even though there are challenges with a continuous protagonist, it without a doubt has been far more successful than the revolving door protagonist approach we see with Dragon Age. I'd find it incredibly disappointing if we never saw a recurring protagonist again in Mass Effect. Shepard was amazing and Ryder still has plenty of stories to tell.
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Post by RageUnderFire on Apr 8, 2017 4:45:09 GMT
Wise decision by Bioware.
Ryder sucks so bad we don't want another game with em.
The Mass Effect equivalent of Assassin's Creed Connor
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Post by Arcian on Apr 8, 2017 12:53:23 GMT
Translation: Who knows? By then, maybe I will be ready to go back to the Milky Way and deal with the disaster I created with Casey. After Andromeda I'm convinced Casey had a good idea somewhere and fucked up by letting Mac write it. You and me both, brother. *chugs barrel of ryncol*
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Post by KaiserShep on Apr 8, 2017 12:58:33 GMT
I actually believe many in this thread are misinterpreting what Walters means by "standalone." I also believe many are misinterpreting what he means by "when the story ends, the game continues." With regard to the first point, one area where the original trilogy suffered was bringing in newcomers. Many may forget, but ME1 was originally a Microsoft exclusive. It wasn't until BioWare was bought by EA in 2008 that the ME franchise became multiplatform. As a result, Mass Effect, as a whole, never sold incredibly well on the PS3 due to many people never being exposed to the previous game. The Witcher 3 also had a similar issue as Xbox players never played TW1 and Playstation players never played TW1 or TW2. Doing a more contained story avoids the pitfalls of newcomers keeping their distance. That doesn't mean BioWare also needs to keep changing protagonists either. Consider each game a self-contained chapter with the same lead character. As for the second point, I'm almost positive what Walters is talking about is the fact you can continue playing MEA after the Critical Path ends. In ME1, ME2, and ME3, the game would end once you completed the last mission. If you wanted to continue playing, you'd have to start right before the final mission or do a new playthrough. MEA is different since it's more of an open world game, so it allows the game to continue even when the main story ends. I am 100% positive that Ryder will come back as a protagonist and that likely most, if not all, of the crew will return as well. Even though there are challenges with a continuous protagonist, it without a doubt has been far more successful than the revolving door protagonist approach we see with Dragon Age. I'd find it incredibly disappointing if we never saw a recurring protagonist again in Mass Effect. Shepard was amazing and Ryder still has plenty of stories to tell. Just a quick note, but ME2 can be played after the critical path ends. Not sure exactly how much you can really do since I tend to do everything before the main campaign ends in the vanilla game, but LotSB, Arrival and Overlord can be played whenever.
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Post by Sondergaard on Apr 8, 2017 13:16:07 GMT
The curse of Mac Walters strikes again.... Nope the people that whined about the ending made this happen. What an absolute load of shit.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 8, 2017 13:23:04 GMT
I actually believe many in this thread are misinterpreting what Walters means by "standalone." I also believe many are misinterpreting what he means by "when the story ends, the game continues." With regard to the first point, one area where the original trilogy suffered was bringing in newcomers. Many may forget, but ME1 was originally a Microsoft exclusive. It wasn't until BioWare was bought by EA in 2008 that the ME franchise became multiplatform. As a result, Mass Effect, as a whole, never sold incredibly well on the PS3 due to many people never being exposed to the previous game. The Witcher 3 also had a similar issue as Xbox players never played TW1 and Playstation players never played TW1 or TW2. Doing a more contained story avoids the pitfalls of newcomers keeping their distance. That doesn't mean BioWare also needs to keep changing protagonists either. Consider each game a self-contained chapter with the same lead character. As for the second point, I'm almost positive what Walters is talking about is the fact you can continue playing MEA after the Critical Path ends. In ME1, ME2, and ME3, the game would end once you completed the last mission. If you wanted to continue playing, you'd have to start right before the final mission or do a new playthrough. MEA is different since it's more of an open world game, so it allows the game to continue even when the main story ends. I am 100% positive that Ryder will come back as a protagonist and that likely most, if not all, of the crew will return as well. Even though there are challenges with a continuous protagonist, it without a doubt has been far more successful than the revolving door protagonist approach we see with Dragon Age. I'd find it incredibly disappointing if we never saw a recurring protagonist again in Mass Effect. Shepard was amazing and Ryder still has plenty of stories to tell. Just a quick note, but ME2 can be played after the critical path ends. Not sure exactly how much you can really do since I tend to do everything before the main campaign ends in the vanilla game, but LotSB, Arrival and Overlord can be played whenever. In ME2, you can basically do any missions after the suicide mission that you haven't already done before it. Of course, there are a certain number of missions that must be done before the next set of main story missions will trigger. In ME1, you can do all the main missions with the exception of Ilos and then do any or all of the main mission quests. It seems odd, though, in light of the urgency of getting to Ilos once Shepard steels the Normandy; but the game does not actually penalize the player for doing them. In ME3, the game will return you again to the point just before you begin the assault on TIM's base, you can then do any missions you missed and redo the assault and endgame after that point. I don't believe that Mac is saying that Ryder will disappear completely in the next installment, The nice thing about Ryder being a pathfinder is that he/she has a job that involves continued exploration as the game world is perhaps expanded into other clusters. What I'm wondering is whether or not he means that we will be able to return to hubs in Heleus and the colonies there even as the game expands outside that particular cluster; but the story itself will be completely independent of any of the decisions we made during this first game. Ideally, we might be able to choose our character from Ryder or any of the other pathfinders introduced in ME:A1.
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Post by brandoftime on Apr 8, 2017 14:17:05 GMT
I just hope with all the rotten reviews online that the game sells well enough to get a sequel at all. Deus Ex was shelved due to bad sales. Maybe it's a tad early to worry about Ryder coming back ?
How is it selling, anyway? In UK it's no 1. right now, so there's some hope . . .
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danishgambit
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Post by danishgambit on Apr 8, 2017 15:53:36 GMT
Name other franchises that carry the same protagonist and the choices through save games across trilogy of games. That's right. Remove that and you remove single-handedly most unique aspect of ME Trilogy in modern game industry that played a massive part in player investement and attachement to the series despite all the fuckups with actual consequences to carried choices. This "standalone" route, likely meaning changining protagonists, sounds utterly unambitious and trying to play is as safe as much as possible. Yawn. It's not that simple. If they stayed this route we'd inevitably get a ME3 again. All your choices would get funneled into one plot point and you might not like that anyway. The nice thing about games like DAO is that since the game is meant to be standalone they can focus on making games choices more meaningful without worrying about the virtually impossible job of tying it together in 3 games. Character deaths for example led to really bad consequences as potentially dead characters ended up with less dialogue than others. Characters that could've been interesting had the personality sucked out of them because they could die. This is why Liara was so prevalent in ME3 - she couldn't die in the trilogy and thus she got a big role in the game. Let's be real here - you could cut out ME2 from the trilogy and the story would be barely affected in any way. You'd just wonder why that Reaper at the end of ME3 had four eyes. The Collectors (what a name) were a B-story villain at best that didn't matter in the larger scheme of things. ME1 was chock full of plot points that were relegated to codex entries and one-liners in the dialogue. They did what they could but a lot was left up to the imagination. And then there was the Rachni... Besides all of that, being invested in a character depends greatly on the writing of that character. You shouldn't need to read three books to finally care about a character. Making 10 games or 1 shouldn't have a difference on that. Carried choices are great - but Bioware is having problems with making them relevant for just single games let alone a trilogy. In fact standalone stories will allow Bioware to be waaaay more ambitious since they no longer will have to worry about the consequences of plot points carrying over and - THEY CAN WRITE WHAT THEY WANT. Sure maybe it is possible to get the game to work in the way you want it to. But it's not practical. To do the kind of game you want (and to make it better) would require time and resources that I frankly doubt EA will ever give them. In a vacuum sure it would be great. But I don't think something like the MET is ever going to be attempted again by anyone without unlimited resources.
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qwib
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I am Pathfinder rah bah bah
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by qwib on Apr 8, 2017 16:04:09 GMT
Stand alone is better, then they don't have to worry about implementing all the choices of the previous games. That's what killed ME3 a little bit, too many variables.
Stand alone in terms of protagonist, not okay with that one. Ryder has a lot of potential as a character to grow and change in the next games. From the beginner dork, to a seasoned veteran. I would be down for that journey in Andromeda.
I hope that's what they are going for, since Ryder is very young.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 8, 2017 16:06:06 GMT
I want my ryder to grow over games. I want my ryder to return for the next few games. Having a new character each game is the least fun experience for me. My shepard was awesome because I was with her for three games. My witcher was awesome because I watched him evolve. Getting new characters each game feels way less fun to me than evolving them. That is why shepard was a huge success. That is why the characters were a huge success. Unless they want to dig way deeper than they have there with this one on stories and arcs, this is not sufficient for a stand alone game as others have noted. We need to have characters develop and grow, see their arc over time to really see the richness of them, including their own ryder. Part of the fun of this game for me is knowing there is more to come and that this is just the start. If it turns out that this was all my ryder did and all I see of the characters, I think I would be feeling pretty meh about this game. Even the thought of it now is less compelling to me. I want to watch my character grow, to see that. This was not really a character growing, it was a character dealing with some shit and coming into their own but not really getting a chance to be in their own. They are stronger at the end for it, but after shepard experience, it's sort of meh by comparison. It is the equivalent of leaving shepard at ME1 and then switching off to some different character for ME2 and ME3.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 8, 2017 16:13:57 GMT
This. I hope they'll follow the Witcher route and make more games with the same cast but where each game has one overarching plot that will be solved at the end of the game (and potential DLCs). I love the DA series but losing the protagonist each time and basically all of the cast got jarring after a while. DAI was a good step in the right direction by letting characters from old games return in prominent roles, but still... I hope Bioware will give this cast a chance to shine and evolve. There's so much potential that I'd like to see come to life! I both love and hate dragon age at the same time. It always leaves me with a bitter taste in my mouth knowing that that whatever connection I make with the protagonist and the characters, they will disappear by the time the next game comes around. Varric is such a greate example of this. I love his character but honestly, seeing him in inquisition was painful because I was always reminded of the wonderful friendship he had with my hawke. Don´t give me wrong, it was great seeing him again but I hate that disconnection. Needless to say, I really hope they change their mind about this. Yeah. I loved the first one and connected to the characters. In 2 they were gone and I never cared about that main character = hawke? In three I couldn't invest in my character really at all. It was a huge part of what killed that game for me. I just didn't give a damn about any of it. I tried. But it was this new entity that stumbled into this situation and it all sort of left me flat. I have to care about MY character that I am playing to some degree and no matter how I rolled in that game, I just couldn't after DAO.
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Post by duckley on Apr 8, 2017 16:47:00 GMT
I like the idea of a new protagonist moving the world of Andromeda forward. references, appearances, consultations with Ryder and friends could tie the series together, along with a shared history of galaxy/world events.
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Single-player only =)
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Post by SilentK on Apr 8, 2017 16:58:30 GMT
I keep all my fingers and toes crossed for more content with Ryder and crew! Well, first I want more fun story-dlc for Andromeda but after that I want a new game with Ryder
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Post by griffith82 on Apr 8, 2017 17:12:22 GMT
Nope the people that whined about the ending made this happen. What an absolute load of shit. No it isn't. Read in between the lines and you can hear that they don't want carry over decisions. Why else would they take that route?
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Rhidor
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Post by Rhidor on Apr 8, 2017 17:57:48 GMT
I don't really see why we should get a new protagonist next game. I could understand if we were able to choose races and play an alien; but what's the point in creating yet another human? I'd rather keep Ryder and have her and her crew's story and character development expanded in future games.
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Post by alanc9 on Apr 8, 2017 18:01:29 GMT
Pretty much anything except LMs for dead characters. I generally do at least Jacob's LM after the conclusion, since it isn't time-critical. Plus any N7 I haven't stumbled across yet.
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Post by KaiserShep on Apr 8, 2017 18:13:43 GMT
I like the idea of a new protagonist moving the world of Andromeda forward. references, appearances, consultations with Ryder and friends could tie the series together, along with a shared history of galaxy/world events. I really wouldn't want my former protagonist appearing as an NPC. I didn't like it when it was Hawke either.
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Post by griffith82 on Apr 8, 2017 19:16:03 GMT
I like the idea of a new protagonist moving the world of Andromeda forward. references, appearances, consultations with Ryder and friends could tie the series together, along with a shared history of galaxy/world events. I really wouldn't want my former protagonist appearing as an NPC. I didn't like it when it was Hawke either. Yeah preferably not. I would preferably play again as Ryder however with all the arks there is plenty of opportunities to play as another race.
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Post by Revan Reborn on Apr 8, 2017 19:31:01 GMT
I actually believe many in this thread are misinterpreting what Walters means by "standalone." I also believe many are misinterpreting what he means by "when the story ends, the game continues." With regard to the first point, one area where the original trilogy suffered was bringing in newcomers. Many may forget, but ME1 was originally a Microsoft exclusive. It wasn't until BioWare was bought by EA in 2008 that the ME franchise became multiplatform. As a result, Mass Effect, as a whole, never sold incredibly well on the PS3 due to many people never being exposed to the previous game. The Witcher 3 also had a similar issue as Xbox players never played TW1 and Playstation players never played TW1 or TW2. Doing a more contained story avoids the pitfalls of newcomers keeping their distance. That doesn't mean BioWare also needs to keep changing protagonists either. Consider each game a self-contained chapter with the same lead character. As for the second point, I'm almost positive what Walters is talking about is the fact you can continue playing MEA after the Critical Path ends. In ME1, ME2, and ME3, the game would end once you completed the last mission. If you wanted to continue playing, you'd have to start right before the final mission or do a new playthrough. MEA is different since it's more of an open world game, so it allows the game to continue even when the main story ends. I am 100% positive that Ryder will come back as a protagonist and that likely most, if not all, of the crew will return as well. Even though there are challenges with a continuous protagonist, it without a doubt has been far more successful than the revolving door protagonist approach we see with Dragon Age. I'd find it incredibly disappointing if we never saw a recurring protagonist again in Mass Effect. Shepard was amazing and Ryder still has plenty of stories to tell. Just a quick note, but ME2 can be played after the critical path ends. Not sure exactly how much you can really do since I tend to do everything before the main campaign ends in the vanilla game, but LotSB, Arrival and Overlord can be played whenever. It's been a few years since I played ME2, so I'll take your word for it. The point still stands that I believe Walters means there is still plenty of content to do (if you don't do everything already) after the Critical Path ends. I know he stated multiple times that loyalty missions, for example, could be completed after the Critical Path. You could not do that in ME2, as loyalty missions would depend on whether your squadmates would live or die in the Suicide Mission. As far as DLC, you always had the options to do that whenever after you reached a certain point in the game. I will be absolutely shocked if he meant the Dragon Age approach. If Walters is planning to go the revolving door protagonist approach now (which I doubt with all the loose ends that need to be explained), he should have just said Mass Effect is taking after Dragon Age with protagonists.
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