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Post by killabkilledb on Apr 18, 2017 2:15:00 GMT
Play lots of Pugs Gold, Squad Gold, have all Rares at X and everything unlocked but 65 URs… A couple of guns I haven’t tested much so I haven’t included them. I consider Tier 1 to mean the gun is solid to use on gold with a weapon consumable and ammo on. Any gun can extract on gold but if you have to shoot something for days to kill it the gun is not considered gold viable. Also note you aren’t supposed to melt things on gold until you have guns at X, mods and consumables on your weapons. The grind is the actual game here people. Deal with it! Tier 1
Inferno (better than the vanquisher if you can get it to a high level, super accurate and super fast fire rate. If you have it at level 1, get used to firing 4 shots and waiting a second or two as the fifth overheats you) or simply cast a power… but at level X apparently you get 7 super fast and super accurate shots…or 6 if you don’t want to overheat. The actual overheat is really not too much longer than a standard reload anyways… most people will have this at level 1 if they even have it so it might underperform a bit for you. I can score lots of points with this at level one on gold though….I love it! Easiest sniper to aim on console by far. And yes, I will hit something twice in the head in virtually the same amount of time it takes you to hit it once with the vanquisher, its that fast and accurate on console...where aiming with snipers is typically trash with insane dead zones.... Vanquisher (no comment needed) Black Widow (slower fire rate and one less bullet than the vanquisher but it hits harder at higher levels and the black widow can shoot things through cover with the receiver mod). Lots of things take cover in this game so this is very useful. My BW 6 does 838 damage and my vanquisher X does 810 With SR rail amp 3 (30%), an ammo consumable 3 (7.5%) a barrel x (21%) and 10% weopon damage passive thrown in that is 68.5% extra base damage on both weapons. The BW does 1412 and shoots through cover while the Vanquisher Does 1365 per bullet and doesn't but fires faster and has an extra bullet. Vanquisher nudges it as a better weapon but the BW is still outstanding gold. The BW at X must be even slightly stronger. Does anyone have the base damage for it? Piranha: (very high dps, smashes through things…..with accuracy boosts becomes a laser, if they fix smart choke this thing might become OP) Hurricane super high ROF, melts things at a decent clip and is amazing at priming enemies The five above are your for sure Top 5 weapons in the game! There is no disputing this. More tier ones below:
Falcon: grenade launcher packs a punch and does a decent job killing things on gold as long as you can hit them. Sidewinder X with barrel X and magazine mod X gets 10 rounds before reloading. This gun packs a solid punch and is just super fun to play. It handles amazingly well and reloads pretty well. If you double ammo glitch with this gun its like walking around shooting cobras at things….its perfectly viable on gold with a pistol mod. The new gear also gives you an extra 10%... I wish it had a 10 round clip because the scope makes it awesome for headshots but I’m partial to barrel X and magazine mod…on silver its scope headshot…on gold you can forego the mag mod and run pistol rail amp and targeting amps and a scope for headshot/weakpoint fun. The handling is just awesome! Thokin (small mag but at X with mag capacity increase X and barrel X you get 30 rounds per clip, it is accurate and packs a punch and good for priming with a high ROF, needs AR rail amp 3… Revenant (at X with barrel X and an AR mod it is good at gold. Characters with accuracy/stability would help it but it has a large ammo capacity and if you aren’t at long range, most of your shots will hit the mark. An argument can be made this is Tier 1.5. The recoil, poor range and missed shots do have a lot of people understandably put this at tier two. I find it melts things on gold from cover, as long as you aren't hitting the cover.. I wouldn't be mad if this was a Tier 1.5 gun... Tier 1-2ish arguable guns that may be tier 1 or 2...if these are tier two they are the best of Tier Two
Lanat: two hard hitting shots and when charged, hits harder than the Isharay for those that like single shotting enemies. A case can be made that this is a tier one gun but I’ll include it here because charging slows down DPS… Raptor: it can be argued this is a tier one gun as well but many console users at least struggle with its recoil. If you can get this thing to just headshot enemies consistently its definitely tier 1. Many consider it the best AR in the game… I find the recoil difficult on most classes so tier 2 for me. Talon: this pistol is the second best “shotgun” in the game behind the pirahna. This things fires 4 very hard hitting shots. With barrel X, pistol rail amp and ammo mod and pistol gear each bullet packs a serious punch… Valiant: outclassed by other snipers but it fires five fast rounds that pack a decent punch. Tier 2, Isharay, Widow (outclassed by Isharay), Sweeper is a solid castor weapon, needs all sorts of amps and mods to kill things though, Charger, Equalizer, Valkyrie is better after 1.05 patch but not what a UR should be, Hesh, Scattershot, Eagle (maybe tier 2.5), maybe the Soned but the time to fire just makes this weapon feel so bad…, the Dahn, Venom, Scorpion, Crusader (ultra rare, really? they really screwed this weapon over!)
Tier 3, Halberd (better after 1.05 pitch...maybe tier 2.5..., Avenger, Mattock, Ruzad, Paw (good for priming MAYBE tier 2 with 35 amps/mods and mag mod), Cyclone (decent for priming and high rate of fire....I actually need to test this more..., Carnifex, Sandstorm Tier 603: Zalkin ...wtf is this even in the game for? If you disagree with any of this you are obviously wrong and need to #l2p
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Post by Doctor Fumbles on Apr 18, 2017 2:19:23 GMT
Here is my problem with your list. You shouldn't need to use the boosters in order to do good damage. That is shitty balancing. The boosters should just be added damage and not required.
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Post by riviet on Apr 18, 2017 2:25:41 GMT
The BW at X must be even slightly stronger. Does anyone have the base damage for it? 891 at rank X (roughly 6.32% more damage than at rank VI) according to Quick and Dirty Gun DPS. You're welcome.
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Post by killabkilledb on Apr 18, 2017 2:26:39 GMT
Here is my problem with your list. You shouldn't need to use the boosters in order to do good damage. That is shitty balancing. The boosters should just be added damage and not required. Boosters and mods are part of the game and leveling up. If you didn't need boosters and mods to melt things on gold then all the guns would become OP with them as you are adding 40% more base damage..... Its balanced perfectly (well some URs need serious buffs). You just HAVE TO GRIND and actually level up before you can melt things more efficiently on gold. The grind is the game. If you want to come out melting stuff a few weeks into the game then $$$ on real packs or grind. Welcome to mass effect. I think everyone had all these amazing weapons and consumables and awesome manifests on ME3 and come here and are like wtf....yeah, you have to grind here just like you did on ME3....fuck, I used the phaeston and geth assault rifle for like a month of playing while leveling up....do you know how BAD those weapons are? They are horrendous. You have to grind. Do you guys just not remember using garbage like the avenger and phaeston in the beginning of ME3?
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Post by nthjester on Apr 18, 2017 2:30:05 GMT
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Post by Doctor Fumbles on Apr 18, 2017 2:30:34 GMT
Here is my problem with your list. You shouldn't need to use the boosters in order to do good damage. That is shitty balancing. The boosters should just be added damage and not required. Boosters and mods are part of the game and leveling up. If you didn't need boosters and mods to melt things on gold then all the guns would become OP with them as you are adding 40% more base damage..... Its balanced perfectly (well some URs need serious buffs). You just HAVE TO GRIND and actually level up before you can melt things more efficiently on gold. The grind is the game. If you want to come out melting stuff a few weeks into the game then $$$ on real packs or grind. Welcome to mass effect. I think everyone had all these amazing weapons and consumables and awesome manifests on ME3 and come here and are like wtf....yeah, you have to grind here just like you did on ME3....fuck, I used the ohaeston and geth assault rifle for like a month of playing while leveling up....do you know how BAD those weapons are? They are horrendous. You have to grind. I did grind. I spent more then enough real $ to get a lot of weapons at X. Needing boosters has nothing to do with the grind. It is plain shitty balancing. It might make some guns OP with the boosters, but I would rather have that instead of the situation we are in now. I still disagree with you. BW are just being shit heads atm with how they want to balance stuff.
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Post by killabkilledb on Apr 18, 2017 2:31:27 GMT
The BW at X must be even slightly stronger. Does anyone have the base damage for it? 891 at rank X (roughly 6.32% more damage than at rank VI) according to Quick and Dirty Gun DPS. You're welcome. Thank you.... so with a 68.5% boost to base damage the BW X does about 1501 per bullet compared to 1365 for the vanquisher and the BW works through cover. If you add in other damage increases from cloak (which can be huge, or annihilation field (20%) the BW damage can really surpass the vanquisher by quite a bit..... Not really as far behind the vanquisher as some people think but obviously probably less than 1% of the population has it at X....so for now vanquisher is king...
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Post by hobocommand3r on Apr 18, 2017 2:32:17 GMT
The part after your first 5 is a joke, putting revenant and thokin over talon and valiant lolk
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Post by killabkilledb on Apr 18, 2017 2:34:10 GMT
The part after your first 5 is a joke Those guns work fine on gold with rail amps and consumables. They aren't the harrier from ME3 but they kill things well enough which makes them gold viable.
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Post by killabkilledb on Apr 18, 2017 2:35:47 GMT
The part after your first 5 is a joke, putting revenant and thokin over talon and valiant look I noted that the talon and valiant are in a tier 1-2ish range......arguments can be made they are tier 1. Not sure what your issue is. That is delineated very clearly...
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Post by killabkilledb on Apr 18, 2017 2:36:57 GMT
You also have to factor in that the thokin primes very well.
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Post by godlike13 on Apr 18, 2017 3:02:21 GMT
Priming might matter more if combos did more then tickle.
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Post by someN7orother on Apr 18, 2017 3:17:52 GMT
I think everyone had all these amazing weapons and consumables and awesome manifests on ME3 and come here and are like wtf....yeah, you have to grind here just like you did on ME3....fuck, I used the phaeston and geth assault rifle for like a month of playing while leveling up....do you know how BAD those weapons are? They are horrendous. You have to grind. Geth assault rifle actually is a pretty decent gun. With some accuracy bonuses you can land basically a stream of headshots non-stop and is very good at applying ammo effects. It's the gun I run on my GEngineer, TB/Cryo/Fire 'splosions everywhere. It's no PPR or Cerberus Carrier, but what is? Regardless, as someone said, grind based balancing is cancer.
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Post by killabkilledb on Apr 18, 2017 3:24:48 GMT
I think everyone had all these amazing weapons and consumables and awesome manifests on ME3 and come here and are like wtf....yeah, you have to grind here just like you did on ME3....fuck, I used the phaeston and geth assault rifle for like a month of playing while leveling up....do you know how BAD those weapons are? They are horrendous. You have to grind. Geth assault rifle actually is a pretty decent gun. With some accuracy bonuses you can land basically a stream of headshots non-stop and is very good at applying ammo effects. It's the gun I run on my GEngineer, TB/Cryo/Fire 'splosions everywhere. It's no PPR or Cerberus Carrier, but what is? Regardless, as someone said, grind based balancing is cancer. Well, I don't like micro transactions but they are a part of the gaming world now. All the big games are doing it or moving towards it. Nothing we can really do about it. It suck but it is what it is. Once you get the rares maxed, I think at least every premium or expert pack you buy gives you a level III consumable... We don't have to like it, but the game is balanced around that... I mean you can still kill stuff with a piranha but a piranha with shotgun rail amp 3 is just so much better...
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Post by Paynezz on Apr 18, 2017 3:27:24 GMT
I'm a huge fan of the equalizer and the isharay. The equalizer is lightweight, packs a punch and is more accurate as the hurricane. Still not as good as thr hurricane ofc, but still pretty strong. Compared to the vanquisher the isharay falls short, but in a vacuum I think it's still pretty good.
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Post by killabkilledb on Apr 18, 2017 3:27:38 GMT
Priming might matter more if combos did more then tickle. They can stun, splash damage and do add up over time. If multiple people used ammo mods and spammed powers each time they cooled down the extra damage would be very significant despite ammo primed combos appearing to do less damage than other combos... I don't agree that all combos tickle. They are certainly weak than ME3 but individual cool downs, ammos priming and any detonator detonating any primer means with a team you can have a constant stream of combos going off. The damage more than adds up if you have a competent team. Pugging with scrubs doesn't mean powers are horrible. There have already been teams of biotic running through stuff on this game. Its just really hard or impossible for most classes to be lone wolf combo boom classes...
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Post by killabkilledb on Apr 18, 2017 3:31:25 GMT
I'm a huge fan of the equalizer and the isharay. The equalizer is lightweight, packs a punch and is more accurate as the hurricane. Still not as good as thr hurricane ofc, but still pretty strong. Compared to the vanquisher the isharay falls short, but in a vacuum I think it's still pretty good. I really like the isharay. Its fun to use. I wish it was a see through walls gun like the javelin though. That would make it really cool... Equalizer has range issues to me. I shoot things, maybe barely at medium distance, if that far and the bullets just don't register...even if I put a whole clip into an enemy.... its decent (tier 2 to me) but doesn't kill things nearly as fast or efficiently as a hurricane. I actually consider the sidewinder better than the equalizer but the unlimited ammo is cool as well...especially for castor classes...
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Post by Shodan/etm125 on Apr 18, 2017 4:12:52 GMT
Here is my problem with your list. You shouldn't need to use the boosters in order to do good damage. That is shitty balancing. The boosters should just be added damage and not required. Boosters and mods are part of the game and leveling up. If you didn't need boosters and mods to melt things on gold then all the guns would become OP with them as you are adding 40% more base damage..... Its balanced perfectly (well some URs need serious buffs). You just HAVE TO GRIND and actually level up before you can melt things more efficiently on gold. The grind is the game. If you want to come out melting stuff a few weeks into the game then $$$ on real packs or grind. Welcome to mass effect. I think everyone had all these amazing weapons and consumables and awesome manifests on ME3 and come here and are like wtf....yeah, you have to grind here just like you did on ME3....fuck, I used the phaeston and geth assault rifle for like a month of playing while leveling up....do you know how BAD those weapons are? They are horrendous. You have to grind. Do you guys just not remember using garbage like the avenger and phaeston in the beginning of ME3? On one hand I have a knee jerk reaction to consumables being required to do well. It just smacks of P2W. On the other hand I pretty rarely used them in ME3 or here. Ive already got a pretty big stockpile. Maybe Ill just have to start burnin em to pug gold.
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Post by SalMasRac on Apr 18, 2017 4:16:31 GMT
Revenant is surely not Tier 1 or even 1.5. On a Human Sentinel with full Weapons spec, Ammo Booster, and Assault Rifle Booster, it still tickles enemies. Putting it above Raptor is flat out wrong.
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Post by killabkilledb on Apr 18, 2017 4:28:10 GMT
Revenant is surely not Tier 1 or even 1.5. On a Human Sentinel with full Weapons spec, Ammo Booster, and Assault Rifle Booster, it still tickles enemies. Putting it above Raptor is flat out wrong. I didn't necessarily put it above. I mentioned a lot of people would call the rev tier two and said I was fine with it being 1.5ish ....raptor is a tier 1-2 gun. Situational. Raptor has greater potential than the rev but on console its hard to land consistent head shots on a lot of classes. With some stability you can make it a laser but that is situational and based on class. On an asari adept the raptor will be bouncing a lot and miss on console, especially if trying to hit the head (of moving enemies)...I also don't agree that the revenant tickles enemies. Doesn't melt them but it puts out enough damage combined with a large clip size...the sustained fire helps the DPS and for it to kill things. The thokin, for example, melts more but you run out of those 30 bullets really quickly because it has a high ROF....and if you miss part of your burst you are missing a large part of your clip with the thokin.......aside from the thoken the revenant is most likely the second most viable AR on gold...which is a bit sad but it is what it is... I also mentioned if you CAN control the raptor, it is very clearly Tier 1. That is a big if, though...
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Post by SalMasRac on Apr 18, 2017 4:39:28 GMT
Revenant is surely not Tier 1 or even 1.5. On a Human Sentinel with full Weapons spec, Ammo Booster, and Assault Rifle Booster, it still tickles enemies. Putting it above Raptor is flat out wrong. I didn't necessarily put it above. I mentioned a lot of people would call the rev tier two and said I was fine with it being 1.5ish ....raptor is a tier 1-2 gun. Situational. Raptor has greater potential than the rev but on console its hard to land consistent head shots on a lot of classes. With some stability you can make it a laser but that is situational and based on class. On an asari adept the raptor will be bouncing a lot and miss on console, especially if trying to hit the head (of moving enemies)...I also don't agree that the revenant tickles enemies. Doesn't melt them but it puts out enough damage combined with a large clip size...the sustained fire helps the DPS and for it to kill things. The thokin, for example, melts more but you run out of those 30 bullets really quickly because it has a high ROF....and if you miss part of your burst you are missing a large part of your clip with the thokin.......aside from the thoken the revenant is most likely the second most viable AR on gold...which is a bit sad but it is what it is... I also mentioned if you CAN control the raptor, it is very clearly Tier 1. That is a big if, though... Raptor is pretty accurate until after 5 shots, at which point the bloom happens. If you quickly release and repull the trigger in 5 shot quickbursts, you can get all 15 shots to be accurate.
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Post by killabkilledb on Apr 18, 2017 4:41:50 GMT
I didn't necessarily put it above. I mentioned a lot of people would call the rev tier two and said I was fine with it being 1.5ish ....raptor is a tier 1-2 gun. Situational. Raptor has greater potential than the rev but on console its hard to land consistent head shots on a lot of classes. With some stability you can make it a laser but that is situational and based on class. On an asari adept the raptor will be bouncing a lot and miss on console, especially if trying to hit the head (of moving enemies)...I also don't agree that the revenant tickles enemies. Doesn't melt them but it puts out enough damage combined with a large clip size...the sustained fire helps the DPS and for it to kill things. The thokin, for example, melts more but you run out of those 30 bullets really quickly because it has a high ROF....and if you miss part of your burst you are missing a large part of your clip with the thokin.......aside from the thoken the revenant is most likely the second most viable AR on gold...which is a bit sad but it is what it is... I also mentioned if you CAN control the raptor, it is very clearly Tier 1. That is a big if, though... Raptor is pretty accurate until after 5 shots, at which point the bloom happens. If you quickly release and repull the trigger in 5 shot quickbursts, you can get all 15 shots to be accurate. Nice! I'll have to retry it with the quick bursting then because I know if I spam the entire clip I personally can't control it at all...
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Post by nucleartech76 on Apr 18, 2017 4:50:16 GMT
Raptor is a damn good AR masquerading as a SR. People can't control it? Wtf it has very little recoil. I wouldn't put it up there with the hurricane, piranha, black widow and vanquisher which are tier one guns IMO. Talon is good but has some weirdness with it at times. I'd put a lot of other stuff in tier two that you have higher. And a lot more in tier three.
Tier one: great guns for any difficulty on most any character. Tier two: good guns that can become great on certain characters. Tier three: decent weapons that work on some characters through dps or other unique characteristics Tier four: dumpster fire trash, aka most of the ultrarares in this game.
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Post by neightrix on Apr 18, 2017 6:08:35 GMT
Looks like I'm wrong and should L2P I do like Thokin and Sidewinder being higher than on the reddit list, the latter putting out significant damage for having almost no weight at rank X. Personal opinion vs mass player opinion both have their own biases. For the best results, we'd have a group of 5-10 players at or near the top who most people regard as good and objective (and regard each other as good) come up with a list. Still no such thing as perfect of course, just an "it is what it is" thing. Hopefully we can get some significant changes to some of the weapons and kits - weapon weight and kits selection could have a bigger impact than they currently do.
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jamesdsidious
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Post by jamesdsidious on Apr 18, 2017 6:35:35 GMT
Piranha: (very high dps, smashes through things…..with accuracy boosts becomes a laser, if they fix smart choke this thing might become OP) not sure about this one. i only have it at 2 so far but i can't seem to do proper damage with it on gold.
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