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Post by normandy on Apr 20, 2017 7:36:30 GMT
I never use them
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Post by helios969 on Apr 20, 2017 7:48:26 GMT
I pick 3 powers and roll for the game. So, no, it doesn't kill replaying. I don't think it would even if I did profile swapping.
BTW, I love the unbiased poll choices: game sucks, bad game, meh.
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RakiaTime
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Post by RakiaTime on Apr 20, 2017 8:02:09 GMT
Nope, I don't replay to try different classes, i replay because i like it, in OT i had 30 soldier playtroughs and never touched another class, this time around i can still use soldier profile all the time but mix abilities, so to answer the question, i love profiles
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Post by KrrKs on Apr 20, 2017 15:01:06 GMT
I think the profile system is great! Finally we can mix and match powers as we wish, this is awesome and something I always wanted. (I believe Vortex13, Element Zero, KaiserShep, capn233, Cap'n'gown (or similar) and a couple of others were even discussing something very similar on the old BSN)A detail that I would have liked done differently is the aforementioned cooldown for profile swaps, instead of cooldown for powers upon profile swap. As it is now, I'm pretty much stuck between my ( fully customizable!) main profile and a defensive quick recharge profile. (And an Infiltrator/ long range sniper profile, when I get around to finalize that...)
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Post by kotoreffect3 on Apr 20, 2017 15:19:06 GMT
With profiles you basically have 4 gimped classes instead of one fleshed out class. With the old system you learned to actually rely on your squad mates and you had to adapt to the game instead of the game adapting to you. This meant each playthrough required you to change up your playstyle. You had to actually consider which squad mates you took with based on the enemy you were facing as well as how their abilities complimented our own. It was both more tactical and replayable. It also gave my Shepard a sense of identity whether they were a soldier armed to the teeth, an infiltrator you never saw coming, or a vanguard who destroyed everything in their path using their biotics and claymore shotgun making me feel like a krogan.
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n7ltrobbiesann7
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Post by n7ltrobbiesann7 on Apr 20, 2017 15:46:21 GMT
I think it's a decent idea personally, in that we have these options, but are not forced to use them.
I love playing engineer class so am playing that (energy drain, incinerate, remnant VI--I love my combat drone). I do like that I can change classes/profiles on the fly, where in MET you were stuck with the one class. So, it's some of this and that. Most of my points are going into leveling passives and weapons, and further points start going into soldier and biotic trees.
Now that I have most of those leveled though I think I am going to start investing in biotic tree and try out Vanguard, which is a class I did not play in MET.
As with anything in life, there's what you got, and how you use it. Your own mind is either getting in the way with all those beliefs/filters, or not. That's there whether you acknowledge and accept it or not (psych 101 stuff).
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dm04
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Post by dm04 on Apr 20, 2017 16:30:00 GMT
Profiles were not the right way to go, but they did not kill replayability for me.
The question that arises is... why are the profiles here in the first place? Maybe to compensate for only 3 active skill slots? Which lead to another question, why are there only 3 active skill slots? Because we have 4 consumables? Well, I only use shields, so that is 3 more slots to use for skills? The problem with profiles is, as shown in the "tutorial" (habitat 7, alec using it on the fly)... it only affects weapon skills and some passives. Active skills are disabled for 8 seconds. Now that is realy usefull for engineers and adepts. Changing profiles midfight is pretty much worthless... 8 damn seconds before you can use your skills, by that time any fight is over like 2 times, except for some bosses and who want to change skill sets and profiles anyway during a boss fight? Most people go in there with the right profile anyway. We can not even use different skills... like cloaking... or construct... or barricade, once you switch to a profile that does not have that particular skill, it goes off (no more cloak, construct/barrier just disappear). What is the point? I see it to some degree for multiplayer, to limit the player to 3 active skills per class, but singleplayer? That is just so pointless. Yet another "design" that is highly flawed and not well thought out, yet there are players who still think everything is perfect. Is the limination to 3 skills gamebreaking? No, it is stupid and pointless anyway. Forgot about profiles on 1st playthrough, remembered it on my 2nd... made some profiles and found out about the skill recharge delays, so now I have 4 different profiles and sitll using 99,9% of the time just the one. Replayin with different classes was never motivational to me (20x ME2 as infiltrator), tried biotics etc, never liked it. However, different decisions and taking diferent squadmates were interesting... there are other tactics and how you finish engagement with Cora+Peebee or Vetra+Jaal. Whatever. Do not like the profiles, it is only good for skipping classes. Not the "on the fly swap 10x during one fight" Alec shows us.
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Warrior DM
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The morning is for coffee and contemplation.
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Post by Warrior DM on Apr 20, 2017 16:38:48 GMT
I pretty much played as a Soldier exclusively during my first playthrough.
Now I get to switch on the fly to Vanguard, and it feels like a *very* different experience. It is basically necessary to experiment around with powers in Insanity.
Don't think I'd trade the current Profile system for the very linear Class system now.
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VanSinn
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Post by VanSinn on Apr 20, 2017 16:51:55 GMT
The main reason that I'm ok with 3 active powers at a time is the fact that I got used to doing just that in ME2/ME3. With the global cooldown mechanic, it didn't matter which power you used, ALL of your powers went on cooldown. Why bother using Shockwave, when pull/singularity/warp are generally better options depending on the situation? At best it was less efficient, and at worst it was a waste of a cooldown.
I generally used between 2-4 powers pretty much exclusively, depending on the class I was playing at the time. I imagine quite a few of the developers working on ME:A did something similar. So when they decided that SP gameplay would more closely match MP gameplay (I'm guessing to streamline the design process) they picked having 3 active powers at a time. But they also wanted access to more powers, so the 3X4 system was born.
Depending on your passives, gear and profile, powers cool down fast enough that switching profiles really isn't a problem, at least for me. I generally have a "generalist" build that's good for most situations, and 1 or 2 "specialist" favorites for dealing with specific enemy types. I can see how people would prefer a different system, but I disliked the switch to a global cooldown in ME2 vs ME1, but got used to it. I was leery on this change, but I've gotten used to it, and it works quite well.
I would say to really just kinda dive into the whole thing, really give it a good solid shot and see what it can do. If you've already done that and still don't like it, more power to you. This system just isn't your thing. Some people who've complained about this, though, might (and I emphasize MIGHT) find that they enjoy the system if they give it a proper chance, or at least come to a place where it works for them, even if they'd prefer something different.
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Post by fygee on Apr 20, 2017 17:00:46 GMT
I barely used them.
The thing is, you can play a defined class if you so desire. Dumping more points into your chosen field strengthens your overall effectiveness, even if you choose to never use those skills.
For my first playthrough, I was Vanguard through and through. Next one I'm re-specing to do a tech build.
Basically, the choice of how you want to play is yours.
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malgus
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Post by malgus on Apr 20, 2017 17:57:23 GMT
Don't think I'd trade the current Profile system for the very linear Class system now.
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Post by degs29 on Apr 20, 2017 18:18:55 GMT
Why would people vote "yes" for this? All it does is give choice, by not FORCING you to replay the game in order to try out different builds. If you want to try different builds on a single playthrough, you're free to do so. If you want to reserve different builds for different playthroughs, you're still free to do so!
So far during my first playthrough, I've done a traditional Vanguard-type build and a traditional Adept-type build. I may try a third...or not. It's about choice.
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Post by KaiserShep on Apr 20, 2017 18:56:42 GMT
Why would people vote "yes" for this? All it does is give choice, by not FORCING you to replay the game in order to try out different builds. If you want to try different builds on a single playthrough, you're free to do so. If you want to reserve different builds for different playthroughs, you're still free to do so! So far during my first playthrough, I've done a traditional Vanguard-type build and a traditional Adept-type build. I may try a third...or not. It's about choice. You think this kind of self control is easy? Not everyone has your willpower of steel, my friend.
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Post by Broggar on Apr 20, 2017 21:58:25 GMT
Why would people vote "yes" for this? All it does is give choice, by not FORCING you to replay the game in order to try out different builds. If you want to try different builds on a single playthrough, you're free to do so. If you want to reserve different builds for different playthroughs, you're still free to do so! So far during my first playthrough, I've done a traditional Vanguard-type build and a traditional Adept-type build. I may try a third...or not. It's about choice. No need to replay the game when you can respec, and there is no point in profiles when you can do so in the Tempest for pennies. Why waste points on stuff you can use half the time when you could put everything in a single strong build ? The sacrifice of points would have been worthwhile if my abilites didn't go on cooldown when switching profiles.
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Post by capn233 on Apr 20, 2017 22:46:16 GMT
I didn't vote in the poll because it wasn't simple yes / no.
As pointed out above, strictly speaking the Favorites and the Profile system are separate, and I would lump the 3 power limit in with favorites. Also want to mention that switching Profiles only doesn't incur cooldowns, that only happens if you change Favorites. Favorites are only a thing because of controllers.
Now as far as just Profiles go, I would say the system as implemented is largely superfluous at best, even on Insanity. They are really just sort of nice bonuses, and let you pretend like you are changing something. For instance, my current character has Annihilation Field, Charge and Lance. Adept and Vanguard profiles are barely different in practical application, it is just that Adept has slightly larger AField and VG gets melee force and a little better cooldown. Actual effectiveness is practically the same. For fun I even switched to Engineer profile without any tech powers, and it wasn't really much less effective. I haven't bothered to try Explorer on him, but it might be better due to weapon damage bonus.
So basically as far as Profiles themselves are concerned, they aren't something that I feel really limits my replay-ability, but switching between them doesn't really wow me in a single game either. It is just something that is sort of there. What does hurt replay value for me is the current state of balance, whether it be the powers and passives or weapons. Add to that the bizarre decisions made with respect to squadmate, player character, and enemy leveling and you have some big problems with NG+.
If I were king of Mass Effect I would of course be a malevolent sovereign and would have limited trademark powers to the specific profiles, and perhaps made you choose a single profile at start, then unlock more at certain levels. Of course I would have also continued to call Marksman "Marksman," and called the bonus in Soldier "Adrenaline Rush" as well... of and there would be the Claymore, but I digress...
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Post by VanSinn on Apr 20, 2017 23:22:49 GMT
I didn't vote in the poll because it wasn't simple yes / no. As pointed out above, strictly speaking the Favorites and the Profile system are separate, and I would lump the 3 power limit in with favorites. Also want to mention that switching Profiles only doesn't incur cooldowns, that only happens if you change Favorites. Favorites are only a thing because of controllers. Now as far as just Profiles go, I would say the system as implemented is largely superfluous at best, even on Insanity. They are really just sort of nice bonuses, and let you pretend like you are changing something. For instance, my current character has Annihilation Field, Charge and Lance. Adept and Vanguard profiles are barely different in practical application, it is just that Adept has slightly larger AField and VG gets melee force and a little better cooldown. Actual effectiveness is practically the same. For fun I even switched to Engineer profile without any tech powers, and it wasn't really much less effective. I haven't bothered to try Explorer on him, but it might be better due to weapon damage bonus. So basically as far as Profiles themselves are concerned, they aren't something that I feel really limits my replay-ability, but switching between them doesn't really wow me in a single game either. It is just something that is sort of there. What does hurt replay value for me is the current state of balance, whether it be the powers and passives or weapons. Add to that the bizarre decisions made with respect to squadmate, player character, and enemy leveling and you have some big problems with NG+. If I were king of Mass Effect I would of course be a malevolent sovereign and would have limited trademark powers to the specific profiles, and perhaps made you choose a single profile at start, then unlock more at certain levels. Of course I would have also continued to call Marksman "Marksman," and called the bonus in Soldier "Adrenaline Rush" as well... of and there would be the Claymore, but I digress... I certainly could get behind locking "signature" powers behind profile gates. I think the profiles as is give a definite change to your build, but I do agree that the difference could be larger and more noticeable. Turbocharge/Marksman behind soldier, Charge behind Vanguard, cloak behind infiltrator, etc, would give a larger playstyle difference, and the ability to switch between profiles would make for some interesting combinations. I like the system as is, but I wouldn't argue with it being better. Edit: Didn't want to make a new post, but I thought of something I wanted to add to this. Having the freedom to do what you want means you can limit yourself if you choose. I may be going back on my original opinion in this post, but not because i disagree with the idea. I think having the freedom for players to do what they want is a good thing, and we can still choose to limit our playstyle through choosing powers and profiles together. It may not be exactly ideal for those who want more differentiation between profiles, but it gives a similar kind of feel. Want to play a Vanguard? Only use Vanguard profile with the Charge +whatever 2 other powers you want, for example. I kinda tend to do that already, even if it wasn't a conscious choice. My main build is a tech/combat build heavy on tech, using the Engineer profile, with Energy Drain, Incinerate and Concussive Shot. That works with the engineer profile quite well. A second, specialist favorite is Incinerate, Turbocharge and Cryo Beam (all specc'd to deal with the Fiends and high armor enemies) using a Soldier profile for extra weapon damage and clip size. The idea in the post I quoted is a good one, I just think we can do that if we want without taking options away from people who want to play differently.
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Post by Pounce de León on Apr 21, 2017 0:35:15 GMT
I really enjoyed my two playthroughs (normal and insanity), but I must admit the profile system has all but killed the game's replayability imo. In the trilogy, part of the appeal was beating the game multiple times using different classes, but that appeal is gone now. I've already tried everything I wanted to try on my one character, I've switched builds and weapon loadouts multiple times as well. Doing another playthrough would be exactly the same at this point. With other Mass Effect titles, I'd still be looking forward to trying the classes I hadn't tried yet. With Andromeda, I'm done at this point and just waiting for DLC. Anyone else feel like profiles was a bad idea in terms of replayability? Are you talking about NG+? It sounds like you do.
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Post by DoctorFox on Apr 21, 2017 2:36:25 GMT
Profiles just made the game UI more cluttered and i rarely use more than one profile in a playthrough anyway. Same for making ammo types consumables - this just added more clutter by forcing you back in and out of menus to use more and more consumables. It detracts from combat and fun.
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Post by JayKay on Apr 21, 2017 3:09:14 GMT
Replayability for me isn't about using new classes. It's more about making different choices, having a new LI, things like that. I could honestly play every game on Vanguard and not care. I never really used the profiles anyway, because you could blow through the game on Vanguard. I think I switched to explorer once because everyone was talking about it, and I just wanted to see it. But even though I didn't use different profiles, I'll never say anything that gives a player more choices and freedom in how they play is a bad thing. Yeah, even as insignificant a change as a different LI is enough for me to want to do another playthrough. Speaking of which, does anyone else change up their class for who they're planning on romance, so that, if they're squadmates, they can be used in combat and they can compliment you? Like, for example, if I'm romancing Liara, in 3 I'll go Sentinel so we can create endless biotic detonations. If I'm romancing Garrus, I'll go Vanguard so that he's watching my back as I'm wrecking fools with my shotgun. Profiles were a good direction, but they shouldn't have put your powers on cooldown every time you swtich. They should have made the ability to switch have a cooldown period. The system would be completely broken if not for those cooldowns. I wonder if a good way to kind of make that easier is if you're transfering from one favorites to another, the cooltimes of each power is cut in half--so a power that normally has 12 seconds of cooldown only has 6. While I switched up the profiles a fair amount of times for the very hard fights, that would have helped make it easier to decide "okay, I really do need to switch things up." An idea they could've implemented is to allow to change them on the fly without pausing the action. The problem with Andromeda's combat is that it's so fast paced, that pausing to switch profiles disrupts the flow in action. They should implement a feature where holding a button in real time will drop down the 4 available profiles, allowing the player to choose as they go. I think this will work a lot better than the current set up. I think an easy one would have flipped it so that the favorites wheel came up before the weapons/consumables wheel when you press that button. Or better yet, condense the two into one window. Why would people vote "yes" for this? All it does is give choice, by not FORCING you to replay the game in order to try out different builds. If you want to try different builds on a single playthrough, you're free to do so. If you want to reserve different builds for different playthroughs, you're still free to do so! So far during my first playthrough, I've done a traditional Vanguard-type build and a traditional Adept-type build. I may try a third...or not. It's about choice. Because even though the game has it's fair share of actual problems, some people feel the need to make any excuse possible to make it THE WORST EVAH to satisfy their own feeling of superority. Basically.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 21, 2017 3:27:13 GMT
Why would people vote "yes" for this? All it does is give choice, by not FORCING you to replay the game in order to try out different builds. If you want to try different builds on a single playthrough, you're free to do so. If you want to reserve different builds for different playthroughs, you're still free to do so! So far during my first playthrough, I've done a traditional Vanguard-type build and a traditional Adept-type build. I may try a third...or not. It's about choice. To me it has nothing to do with choice, but rather what was lost by letting us try out all classes. We could've had class specific dialogue and choices in the game, now that is out of the window because of this master of all nonsense.
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Post by LilTIM on Apr 21, 2017 16:43:16 GMT
Why would people vote "yes" for this? All it does is give choice, by not FORCING you to replay the game in order to try out different builds. If you want to try different builds on a single playthrough, you're free to do so. If you want to reserve different builds for different playthroughs, you're still free to do so! So far during my first playthrough, I've done a traditional Vanguard-type build and a traditional Adept-type build. I may try a third...or not. It's about choice. To me it has nothing to do with choice, but rather what was lost by letting us try out all classes. We could've had class specific dialogue and choices in the game, now that is out of the window because of this master of all nonsense. Quoted for truth. This issue is compounded because Ryder's dialogue choices are very similar (only few exceptions), so replaying the game feels like playing the same character all over again. Different classes, backgrounds, races, etc. helps add to replayability by creating DIFFERENT characters each playthrough, DAO is imo the best example, but the ME trilogy had classes, pre-service history (abandoned after ME1, i admit) and... Actual different dialogue choices; Renegade/Paragon, despite it's problems, were different things - not the same sentence reworded more politely, casually, logically, etc.
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Feb 12, 2017 18:07:45 GMT
February 2017
brad2240
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by brad2240 on Apr 21, 2017 17:35:35 GMT
Anyone else feel like profiles was a bad idea in terms of replayability? I voted "no," they're not a mistake. BUT it's not because I didn't replay the OT with different classes, I did all the time. Profiles are a good thing because it gives players more choices, more options, but doesn't take anything away from those of us who want to dedicate to one specific profile for a character. I was leery of the profile system going in because I like class-based systems in my RPGs, so I decided to stick with only the Adept for my first time through. It worked out great and I felt stronger than my Adepts in ME3 did. I think the profiles are better than the old classes whether you want to mix-and-match your builds or stick to only a single profile, it's the best of both worlds, IMO. In fact, I'd say the profiles actually enhanced my desire to replay. Since I stuck to Adept the first time, the NG+ run was when I really started to experiment. I tried out several builds before settling on a Soldier profile with some Energy Drain thrown in. Some didn't click with me but some are builds I want to come back to for a full game, like the Sentinel I'm using in my third playthrough. With classes I would have been stuck with one I didn't like and trying to muscle through anyway or forced to restart the game, both of which happened in the OT. So, yep, I definitely think profiles were the right way to go.
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passacaglia
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, KOTOR, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: PassaCalle
Posts: 18 Likes: 31
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passacaglia
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Mar 24, 2017 21:12:41 GMT
March 2017
passacaglia
Mass Effect Trilogy, KOTOR, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda
PassaCalle
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Post by passacaglia on Apr 23, 2017 20:47:51 GMT
I personally love them. I switch regularly between Infiltrator, Vanguard, and Grenadespam profiles, and it's just pure fun for me. I'm in the middle of Insanity at level 75, and I've got more than enough points that I don't feel particularly gimped (since Vanguard and Infi profiles are both at lvl 6). Replay is still fun for me, but I get why some folks don't like the new setup.
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Rivercurse
N3
Hey Conrad, I slept with your sister.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
XBL Gamertag: Rivercurse
Posts: 265 Likes: 590
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Rivercurse
Hey Conrad, I slept with your sister.
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December 2016
rivercurse
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
Rivercurse
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Post by Rivercurse on Apr 23, 2017 21:22:24 GMT
What gets me is that the MET ammo powers became consumables, which then gave rise to additional consumables like shield boosting etc, which means the player needs to pause the action to use all of these consumables.
If the point of removing the much loved squad commands was to stop players pausing the action and detracting from your free flowing combat, then replacing it with another pause-then-continue menu is completely self defeating.
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VanSinn
N3
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: VanSinn77
Posts: 576 Likes: 1,429
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Sept 18, 2021 9:17:16 GMT
1,429
VanSinn
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January 2017
vansinn
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda
VanSinn77
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Post by VanSinn on Apr 24, 2017 0:20:03 GMT
What gets me is that the MET ammo powers became consumables, which then gave rise to additional consumables like shield boosting etc, which means the player needs to pause the action to use all of these consumables. If the point of removing the much loved squad commands was to stop players pausing the action and detracting from your free flowing combat, then replacing it with another pause-then-continue menu is completely self defeating. Agreed. I will say, though, that the squad AI seems quite a bit smarter in ME:A. Nothing truly AMAZING, but they detonate combos I set, I've had Drack save my ass a number of times from some guy who snuck up around my flank and behind me, etc. Yeah, they bug out and do stupid shit like stand out of cover way too often and get killed, but it's WAY less common than in the MET. If it took removing control over my squad powers to give me squadmates that feel like their own characters, and not simply extra buttons on my power bar, I'm all kinda happy about it. That being said, the consumable idea wasn't a good one. I'd rather the ammo types be weapon mods instead of powers, like ME1, but we at least agree on the fact that ammo consumables was less than ideal
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