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Post by sheepsgoboom on Apr 29, 2017 13:13:08 GMT
FYI, if you jump on top of the see-through glass section of derelict, you can't be grabbed by Fiends/Adhis/Wraiths and possibly Ascendants.
Combined with god mode, should allow you to test values easier.
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N7Mith
To troll or not to pug, that's the question
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
Mith0810
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Post by N7Mith on Apr 29, 2017 13:25:36 GMT
On Bronze he seems to have something like 33000 shields and 7963 armor. Perfectly balanced by bw  7963 * 2,878788 = 22923.7888. 8000 * 2,878788 = 23030. Rounding gets 30 points, I'm guessing Capn 'lost' 37 dmg and it's just 8000 bronze armor. 8000 and 23000 are too logical  Then with this formula Destroyers have 95000 shields on gold.  I'll let my Cobra * 8 eat that lunch.  |
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Post by capn233 on Apr 29, 2017 13:40:41 GMT
Perfectly balanced by bw 7963 * 2,878788 = 22923.7888. 8000 * 2,878788 = 23030. Rounding gets 30 points, I'm guessing Capn 'lost' 37 dmg and it's just 8000 bronze armor. 8000 and 23000 are too logical Then with this formula Destroyers have 95000 shields on gold. I'll let my Cobra * 8 eat that lunch. space time anomaly edit: armor value is really 7920 after more testing. 33000 shields is confirmed edit: Also the game seems to update the health or armor values when the target is hit, even if the shield layer is the only one taking damage. Not sure this really is of any interest or practical application, but when I set Observer health to 500 and shot the shields it repeatedly took "5 health damage" on shield hits. |
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Post by lennybusker on Apr 29, 2017 13:52:20 GMT
It seems like the -10 DR on Gold is why the Remnant beam weapons all feel like shit. I see the PAW listed as 40 damage per tick at rank X. The Shadow is listed at 32. Yeah, cool, I'd like to use a gun that has a flat 25-30% damage reduction on Gold!
They obviously intended those to be purely for ammo priming. Which is just, ugh.
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hardcoresalmon
N2
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion
Posts: 246 Likes: 1,080
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion
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Post by hardcoresalmon on Apr 29, 2017 14:10:17 GMT
It seems like the -10 DR on Gold is why the Remnant beam weapons all feel like shit. I see the PAW listed as 40 damage per tick at rank X. The Shadow is listed at 32. Yeah, cool, I'd like to use a gun that has a flat 25-30% damage reduction on Gold! They obviously intended those to be purely for ammo priming. Which is just, ugh. They both suck against everything and not just armor. They have lower DPS than the avenger, of course, the armor DR won't help. EDIT: also that is just the base damage. with amps, passives and gear bonus: Body: 40 * (1 + 0.3 + 0.1 + 0.18) = 63.2 - 10 = 53.2 Head: (63.2 * 1.4) - 10 = 78.48 Still not great, but armor DR isn't the reason. |
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Post by lennybusker on Apr 29, 2017 15:14:49 GMT
It seems like the -10 DR on Gold is why the Remnant beam weapons all feel like shit. I see the PAW listed as 40 damage per tick at rank X. The Shadow is listed at 32. Yeah, cool, I'd like to use a gun that has a flat 25-30% damage reduction on Gold! They obviously intended those to be purely for ammo priming. Which is just, ugh. They both suck against everything and not just armor. They have lower DPS than the avenger, of course, the armor DR won't help. EDIT: also that is just the base damage. with amps, passives and gear bonus: Body: 40 * (1 + 0.3 + 0.1 + 0.18) = 63.2 - 10 = 53.2 Head: (63.2 * 1.4) - 10 = 78.48 Still not great, but armor DR isn't the reason. Ah I misunderstood, I thought you meant there was a flat -10 on Gold regardless of enemy type. |
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Post by cryosferon on Apr 29, 2017 16:25:52 GMT
every time the first page gets updated and I learn something new I want to give the thread another like.
but unfortunately it's not possible
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hardcoresalmon
N2
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion
Posts: 246 Likes: 1,080
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Post by hardcoresalmon on Apr 29, 2017 16:31:33 GMT
I will test ammo types later, they are a pain to get from the store so I have limited amounts.
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Post by peddroelm on Apr 29, 2017 16:48:58 GMT
just noticed something in SP . Past a certain long range the distance to target in viper scope goes from white to red. There's probably combat mechanics involved with when the target gets too far away ..
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Post by capn233 on Apr 29, 2017 18:13:21 GMT
just noticed something in SP . Past a certain long range the distance to target in viper scope goes from white to red. There's probably combat mechanics involved with when the target gets too far away .. Yeah I think we are range capped even on the standard hitscan guns. Some of the others have pretty pitiful range, especially the beam and some projectile. I have been using the Dhan a lot in my NG+ game, but the projectile flat out disappears before something like 20m, but I am a vanguard so no big deal. |
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by lennybusker on Apr 29, 2017 18:26:51 GMT
Yeah I think we are range capped even on the standard hitscan guns. Some of the others have pretty pitiful range, especially the beam and some projectile. I have been using the Dhan a lot in my NG+ game, but the projectile flat out disappears before something like 20m, but I am a vanguard so no big deal. The Equalizer in MP is also capped at like 20m. Of course the accuracy makes it useless past that point anyway. |
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Post by capn233 on Apr 30, 2017 3:20:41 GMT
Destroyer II - Electric Boogaloo -Bronze Destroyer has 33000 shields and 7920 armor. 7920.00048 actually for whatever reason.
-Bronze Destroyer Turret has 3712.5 shields and 1031.25 armor. Weakpoint multiplier is... 1x for Raptor and Equalizer.
-Too many margaritas last night apparently
edit: Added to this post above, wrapping test in spoiler now.
Salarian Architect 2 (no passive)
Raptor X vs Bronze Destroyer Turret
At Timediff: 15.231 Shield Damage : 126.000
At Timediff: 0.129 Shield Damage : 126.000
At Timediff: 0.097 Shield Damage : 126.000
At Timediff: 0.098 Shield Damage : 126.000
At Timediff: 0.131 Shield Damage : 126.000
At Timediff: 0.098 Shield Damage : 126.000
At Timediff: 2.998 Shield Damage : 126.000
At Timediff: 0.131 Shield Damage : 126.000
At Timediff: 0.099 Shield Damage : 126.000
At Timediff: 0.098 Shield Damage : 126.000
At Timediff: 0.131 Shield Damage : 126.000
At Timediff: 0.099 Shield Damage : 126.000
At Timediff: 0.097 Shield Damage : 126.000
At Timediff: 0.098 Shield Damage : 126.000
At Timediff: 0.130 Shield Damage : 126.000
Some of these showed as weakpoint, some didn't. Same number.
Equalizer VI
At Timediff: 28.197 Shield Damage : 72.450
At Timediff: 0.096 Shield Damage : 72.450
At Timediff: 0.098 Shield Damage : 72.450
At Timediff: 0.098 Shield Damage : 72.450
At Timediff: 0.098 Shield Damage : 72.450
At Timediff: 0.099 Shield Damage : 72.450
At Timediff: 0.097 Shield Damage : 72.450
At Timediff: 0.098 Shield Damage : 72.450
At Timediff: 0.098 Shield Damage : 72.450
At Timediff: 0.097 Shield Damage : 72.450
At Timediff: 0.098 Shield Damage : 72.450
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konfeta
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Post by konfeta on Apr 30, 2017 3:28:15 GMT
Does anyone here know exactly how the Cloak damage boost is applied?
Like, Sticky Grenades - it seems that any grenade that explodes while the cloak is "unbroken" don't seem to gain the damage boost.
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Post by peddroelm on Apr 30, 2017 3:32:48 GMT
Does anyone here know exactly how the Cloak damage boost is applied? Like, Sticky Grenades - it seems that any grenade that explodes while the cloak is "unbroken" don't seem to gain the damage boost. already mentioned in OP. ~2 seconds damage boost AFTER BREAKING CLOAK. Being cloaked provides no damage bonus (unless under the grace period of 6b that keeps the cloak visual up after "breaking" the cloak and activating the 2 second damage window ). Can't cast DOT and then cloak for extra DOT damage .. capn233 So the cannon must be charging for weakpoint to activate ? Must remove shields first ? How does it work ? |
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by lennybusker on Apr 30, 2017 3:33:23 GMT
Does anyone here know exactly how the Cloak damage boost is applied? Like, Sticky Grenades - it seems that any grenade that explodes while the cloak is "unbroken" don't seem to gain the damage boost. Powers don't break cloak, so throwing a grenade or having it explode won't break it. The damage bonus is only applied on the shot or melee that breaks cloak, and for 2 seconds afterwards. So to get damage bonus from grenades you need to throw and then decloak before it explodes. With no delays in your button pressing, you can get two grenades out and have them both explode with damage bonus if you fire immediately. |
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Post by konfeta on Apr 30, 2017 4:19:19 GMT
So, you can't shoot to decloak than unload grenades for the damage boost?
Vaguely irritating.
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by capn233 on Apr 30, 2017 4:23:55 GMT
capn233 So the cannon must be charging for weakpoint to activate ? Must remove shields first ? How does it work ? Don't need to remove shields, and it applies to shield and armor. The weak point is in the center of the "torso" where it fires the cannon. It will open the port and you can shoot that gun port. Oddly it seems like you can still get a few hits on it right after it fires and then closes. I thought the intention was for the weak point to be hidden when it isn't trying to use that cannon, and that the ability to hit it a little after was just a mismatch in timing. Also this is why I had wondered earlier if Observers were supposed to actually behave in the same way with the weak point only working when the laser is active, but it seems like it can work with the laser off and the glowing "eye" covered. |
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Post by hanskey on Apr 30, 2017 4:27:55 GMT
Hey guys. I mentioned this in the resource library thread, but I made a Weapon stats spreadsheet based on everyone's work, chypsylon's spreadsheet, and the balance change details from Bioware: docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1d_YezAcp3z1BN4jnXd-mqvyPrsKMFqrzyLnFz7N99vA/pubhtml DPS calculated is simply max theoretical DPS, but I'll add level I-X damage/clip, and eventually level I-X full ammo used sustained DPS when I find hard numbers on reload times and reload+animation cancel times. I can't populate all weakpoint multipliers (keep up the testing!!). There's a long way to go for this to be complete, but I tried to make something you all could use! Also, there are probably some copy-paste mistakes, so any feedback is welcome!! |
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Post by peddroelm on Apr 30, 2017 4:28:50 GMT
capn233 So the cannon must be charging for weakpoint to activate ? Must remove shields first ? How does it work ? Don't need to remove shields, and it applies to shield and armor. The weak point is in the center of the "torso" where it fires the cannon. It will open the port and you can shoot that gun port. Oddly it seems like you can still get a few hits on it right after it fires and then closes. I thought the intention was for the weak point to be hidden when it isn't trying to use that cannon, and that the ability to hit it a little after was just a mismatch in timing. Also this is why I had wondered earlier if Observers were supposed to actually behave in the same way with the weak point only working when the laser is active, but it seems like it can work with the laser off and the glowing "eye" covered. should try the weakspot with a weapon that has different HS mod than the ones you've used. If its still *8 - this would be a fixed weakspot multiplier independent on weapon/ most skills used like it was with bosses in me3mp. (*1.4) .. |
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Post by peddroelm on Apr 30, 2017 4:41:20 GMT
Hey guys. I mentioned this in the resource library thread, but I made a Weapon stats spreadsheet based on Pedro's work, chypsylon's spreadsheet, and the balance change details from Bioware: docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1d_YezAcp3z1BN4jnXd-mqvyPrsKMFqrzyLnFz7N99vA/pubhtml DPS calculated is simply max theoretical DPS, but I'll add level I-X damage/clip, and eventually level I-X full ammo used sustained DPS when I find hard numbers on reload times and reload+animation cancel times. I can't populate all weakpoint multipliers (keep up the testing!!). There's a long way to go for this to be complete, but I tried to make something you all could use! Also, there are probably some copy-paste mistakes, so any feedback is welcome!! I'm not sure weapons have a headshot multiplier or a modifier to the default one .. Maybe Predator has *1.65, maybe the default is 1.4 and predator has +0.25 has bonus.. Maybe its something else.. Our understanding of the weapon damage formula is still poor atm.. I might try taking a look with modding tools and see if there is any stat that can clarify this issue .. |
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Post by hanskey on Apr 30, 2017 5:02:16 GMT
That would be fantastic to know! I'd love to provide data based on how things really work and I'll keep following to see how things pan out. If I can find time, I'll try to help with testing as well.
Loved your work on ME3 MP meta, btw.
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Post by capn233 on Apr 30, 2017 5:15:46 GMT
Don't need to remove shields, and it applies to shield and armor. The weak point is in the center of the "torso" where it fires the cannon. It will open the port and you can shoot that gun port. Oddly it seems like you can still get a few hits on it right after it fires and then closes. I thought the intention was for the weak point to be hidden when it isn't trying to use that cannon, and that the ability to hit it a little after was just a mismatch in timing. Also this is why I had wondered earlier if Observers were supposed to actually behave in the same way with the weak point only working when the laser is active, but it seems like it can work with the laser off and the glowing "eye" covered. should try the weakspot with a weapon that has different HS mod than the ones you've used. If its still *8 - this would be a fixed weakspot multiplier independent on weapon/ most skills used like it was with bosses in me3mp. (*1.4) .. Yeah I might get to that tomorrow. I am going to guess that it will be flat 8x for all weapons, but we will see. *** Bronze Breacher seems to be 412.5 health. When it is in "kamikaze" mode, the health seems to count down. I had a hard time even getting to the health value since they like to go to that mode (a lot spawned that way). |
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Post by hanskey on Apr 30, 2017 6:09:20 GMT
I've added Damage per Clip (DPC) calculations.
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Post by peddroelm on Apr 30, 2017 6:13:17 GMT
Shadow also has *1.15 vs shields
Bronze sharpshooter shields 412.5
Incinerate impact damage *1 vs shields
Incinerate DOT damage ticks *0 vs shieldsinfliltrator 5% wpn damage 50/50/60 Cloak Shadow 1 38 base katana 1 322 / 7 base
Timediff: 1284.236 Damage : 45.885 // shadow 38 * 1.15 * (1 + 0.05) = 45.885
Timediff: 0.861 Damage : 45.885
Timediff: 1.229 Damage : 22.943 // hipfire 38 * 0.5 * 1.15 * (1 + 0.05) = 22.9425
Timediff: 1.896 Damage : 64.239 // HS 38 * 1.15 * (1 + 0.05) * 1.4 = 64.239
Timediff: 1.329 Damage : 64.239
Timediff: 5.362 Damage : 67.735 // cloaked body shot 38 * 1.15 * (1 + 0.05 + 0.5) =67.735
Timediff: 0.463 Damage : 67.735
Timediff: 1.262 Damage : 64.239
Timediff: 0.363 Damage : 64.239
Timediff: 12.963 Damage : 120.000 // incinerate impact will hit *1 vs shields but no DOT (*0)
Timediff: 32.662 Damage : 1.000
Timediff: 0.029 Damage : 48.300 // katana *1 vs shields (322 / 7) * 1.05 = 48.3
Timediff: 0.007 Damage : 48.300
Timediff: 0.008 Damage : 48.300
Timediff: 0.010 Damage : 48.300
Timediff: 0.006 Damage : 48.300
Timediff: 0.006 Damage : 48.300
Timediff: 0.011 Damage : 48.300
Timediff: 22.162 Damage : 67.735
Timediff: 0.066 Damage : 67.735
Timediff: 14.193 Damage : 120.000 // incinerate impact
Timediff: 7.393 Damage : 275.000 // melee vs shields *1
Timediff: 6.164 Damage : 67.735
Timediff: 0.058 Damage : 67.735
Timediff: 21.395 Damage : 94.829 // cloaked HS 38 * 1.15 * (1 + 0.05 + 0.5) * 1.4 = 94.829
Timediff: 0.061 Damage : 94.829
Timediff: 0.096 Damage : 94.829
Timediff: 0.096 Damage : 67.735
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Feb 26, 2019 15:45:34 GMT
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Tallgeese_VII (Old,playing casual)
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Post by gethadept on Apr 30, 2017 7:07:42 GMT
Can`t you guys just tell me what to use?  |
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Then with this formula Destroyers have 95000 shields on gold. 
I'll let my Cobra * 8 eat that lunch. 
