Sanunes
N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Just a flip of the coin.
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Post by Sanunes on Aug 12, 2018 1:25:23 GMT
The thing is if people hated the bugs in Andromeda at launch having the Fallout New Vegas level of bugs I think would have caused humanity to blink out of existence. DIfference is: New Vegas had a good, multi-faction story the player could shape and was mod-friendly. It didn't rely on multiplayer and loot boxes to carry it. That has nothing to do with the launch condition of the game. If BioWare made a story like that, but the tradeoff was all those bugs the game would have been panned worse because nobody would see what you consider important.
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Post by themikefest on Aug 12, 2018 1:37:52 GMT
Obsidian has done a damn good job creating an immersive story that adds replayability value, and BioWare should've learn from to put value in their storytelling of the Mass Effect franchise. For me, the trilogy has more replay value than Fallout New Vegas
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Post by cloud9 on Aug 12, 2018 2:18:36 GMT
Obsidian has done a damn good job creating an immersive story that adds replayability value, and BioWare should've learn from to put value in their storytelling of the Mass Effect franchise. For me, the trilogy has more replay value than Fallout New Vegas Each to his own.
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Sanunes
N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Prime Posts: 4392
Prime Likes: 882
Posts: 5,908 Likes: 8,942
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Just a flip of the coin.
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Post by Sanunes on Aug 12, 2018 5:04:05 GMT
Obsidian has done a damn good job creating an immersive story that adds replayability value, and BioWare should've learn from to put value in their storytelling of the Mass Effect franchise. For me, the trilogy has more replay value than Fallout New Vegas Been so long I forgot where the paths finally branch and you are right I only played Fallout 4 to completion once after multiple save corruptions along the way. Until you get to the dam the game is completely the same only for the last 30 to 60min if I recall correctly the branching makes a difference and you don't have to worry about any choices up to that point.
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Post by alanc9 on Aug 12, 2018 16:28:16 GMT
Because the Reapers don't care about expendable pawns like the Collectors. That makes no sense. Why not totally genocide the Protheans to begin with then? I should have been clearer. As expendable pawns, the Collectors can be risked. It's not like Harbinger expected Shepard to be able to get through the Omega-4 relay and blow them all up; the Reapers didn't know about the derelict Reaper or they would have taken care of it. The Collectors had already fulfilled their primary function of cataloging and analysing the current cycle's organics. Risking a few of them on prototyping a human Reaper isn't a bad idea; better to figure out how you're going to process organics before you start the harvest.
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Post by alanc9 on Aug 12, 2018 16:29:47 GMT
For me, the trilogy has more replay value than Fallout New Vegas Been so long I forgot where the paths finally branch and you are right I only played Fallout 4 to completion once after multiple save corruptions along the way. Until you get to the dam the game is completely the same only for the last 30 to 60min if I recall correctly the branching makes a difference and you don't have to worry about any choices up to that point. Depends on where you branch, doesn't it? And aren't there quite a lot of NCR, Legion, and House missions that are mutually exclusive?
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ahglock
N5
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
Origin: ShinobiKillfist
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Post by ahglock on Aug 12, 2018 17:21:41 GMT
DIfference is: New Vegas had a good, multi-faction story the player could shape and was mod-friendly. It didn't rely on multiplayer and loot boxes to carry it. That has nothing to do with the launch condition of the game. If BioWare made a story like that, but the tradeoff was all those bugs the game would have been panned worse because nobody would see what you consider important. The reason people are accepting of bethesdas engine having so many bugs is because the engine makes the whole world more open and alive. Each damn fork is a object. Bioware and most other games just mean big map when they say open world but what and how you interact with the world isn't any different than corridor campaigns like ME2. Which is fine but people then expect a lot less bugs. Bethesda has so many possible things that can break due to the range of what characters can do and how many things they can interact with people recognize that a larger number of things will slip through because you can't encounter and fix everything without millions of players bumping through things.
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Post by 10k on Aug 12, 2018 17:22:39 GMT
Any reboot with Shepard would be nice. I wouldn't even mind if they began a sequel to ME3 where you play as a Shepard clone.
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Sanunes
N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Prime Posts: 4392
Prime Likes: 882
Posts: 5,908 Likes: 8,942
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Just a flip of the coin.
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Post by Sanunes on Aug 12, 2018 19:17:38 GMT
Been so long I forgot where the paths finally branch and you are right I only played Fallout 4 to completion once after multiple save corruptions along the way. Until you get to the dam the game is completely the same only for the last 30 to 60min if I recall correctly the branching makes a difference and you don't have to worry about any choices up to that point. Depends on where you branch, doesn't it? And aren't there quite a lot of NCR, Legion, and House missions that are mutually exclusive? As I mentioned its been awhile, but I don't recall any of that. I remember it branching just before the damn the first time and the inside the dam a second time and I remember exclusive quests I did, but I just put on faction armor to get them. Now I might have missed somethings doing that, but I never felt like I did.
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Post by alanc9 on Aug 12, 2018 19:49:44 GMT
I guess we'll need to check. My impression is that you get locked out fairly early from other factions' quest lines. By the time Mr. House asks you to wipe out the BoS, for instance, you're no longer going to be able to work with either Caesar or the NCR. (You still have the choice of either House or the Yes Man path, though.)
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Hope for the best, plan for the worst
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Post by griffith82 on Aug 12, 2018 20:15:44 GMT
That is not what is meant, when someone says it has to stay consistent. What that means, is you cannot have a whole codex entry explaining the mechanics of why guns have unlimited ammo, and need only to be cooled down, only to turn around one game later and introduce an inferior ammo based system and try to justify it in lore as superior technology. Choices and Consequences can be easily handled if you are creative enough and don't provide any choices that can be seen as "massive, universe altering decisions" unless you already have a plan on how to represent those choices going forward. So if they write it in the codex they are never allowed to change something? They didn't like the game balance and changed it and said the new solution was deemed to be superior by the forces in the game, that doesn't sound like they aren't being consistent it just sounds like something you don't like. I much rather have a game that is fun to play then something that is forced to stay the same so people aren't upset that they don't like the new rules. The problem I see is people want a game exactly as they envision. This will never happen.
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Post by griffith82 on Aug 12, 2018 20:35:47 GMT
Any reboot with Shepard would be nice. I wouldn't even mind if they began a sequel to ME3 where you play as a Shepard clone.
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boxofscreaming
N3
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 943 Likes: 1,658
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Post by boxofscreaming on Aug 12, 2018 21:09:25 GMT
The thing is if people hated the bugs in Andromeda at launch having the Fallout New Vegas level of bugs I think would have caused humanity to blink out of existence. DIfference is: New Vegas had a good, multi-faction story the player could shape and was mod-friendly. It didn't rely on multiplayer and loot boxes to carry it. New Vegas? There are multiple factions for sure, but is it a good story? As I recall it's basically "there's going to be a big battle - get allies!" Rarely have I been more underwhelmed by the ending of a game. In my opinion, Fallout 3 had a better story than New Vegas - at least we got big moments like Liberty Prime's rampage, whereas New Vegas had nothing so dramatic. Don't get me wrong, I did enjoy the game for all that, but I doubt I've played a game with a longer list of flaws. If Bioware had made a game like that, they'd have been slaughtered by fans.
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Post by themikefest on Aug 12, 2018 21:31:09 GMT
Any reboot with Shepard would be nice. I wouldn't even mind if they began a sequel to ME3 where you play as a Shepard clone. I'm ok with that. The clone part, not too much
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Iakus
N7
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 20,884 Likes: 49,349
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Post by Iakus on Aug 12, 2018 21:32:23 GMT
That makes no sense. Why not totally genocide the Protheans to begin with then? I should have been clearer. As expendable pawns, the Collectors can be risked. It's not like Harbinger expected Shepard to be able to get through the Omega-4 relay and blow them all up; the Reapers didn't know about the derelict Reaper or they would have taken care of it. The Collectors had already fulfilled their primary function of cataloging and analysing the current cycle's organics. Risking a few of them on prototyping a human Reaper isn't a bad idea; better to figure out how you're going to process organics before you start the harvest. Which doesn't answer the question of why risk the Collectors now, when the Reapers will be there to back them up in just a couple years. Which isn't even an eyeblink to immortal space Cthulhu.
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Post by cloud9 on Aug 12, 2018 22:58:38 GMT
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Post by cloud9 on Aug 12, 2018 23:05:26 GMT
That makes no sense. Why not totally genocide the Protheans to begin with then? I should have been clearer. As expendable pawns, the Collectors can be risked. It's not like Harbinger expected Shepard to be able to get through the Omega-4 relay and blow them all up; the Reapers didn't know about the derelict Reaper or they would have taken care of it. The Collectors had already fulfilled their primary function of cataloging and analysing the current cycle's organics. Risking a few of them on prototyping a human Reaper isn't a bad idea; better to figure out how you're going to process organics before you start the harvest. But the Reapers were harvesting sentient beings for over millions of years, so figuring out how they're going to harvest people makes no sense. And we still don't know why the Collectors specifically abducting humans to create a Hybrid, and we don't know what's the real purpose of building a hybrid. They really need to get rid of "the humans are special" trope, because that's what the entire game was about.
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Post by cloud9 on Aug 12, 2018 23:23:04 GMT
So if they write it in the codex they are never allowed to change something? They didn't like the game balance and changed it and said the new solution was deemed to be superior by the forces in the game, that doesn't sound like they aren't being consistent it just sounds like something you don't like. I much rather have a game that is fun to play then something that is forced to stay the same so people aren't upset that they don't like the new rules. The problem I see is people want a game exactly as they envision. This will never happen. They envisioned Andromeda and look how that turned out.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Aug 12, 2018 23:31:12 GMT
I should have been clearer. As expendable pawns, the Collectors can be risked. It's not like Harbinger expected Shepard to be able to get through the Omega-4 relay and blow them all up; the Reapers didn't know about the derelict Reaper or they would have taken care of it. The Collectors had already fulfilled their primary function of cataloging and analysing the current cycle's organics. Risking a few of them on prototyping a human Reaper isn't a bad idea; better to figure out how you're going to process organics before you start the harvest. But the Reapers were harvesting sentient beings for over millions of years, so figuring out how they're going to harvest people makes no sense. And we still don't know why the Collectors specifically abducting humans to create a Hybrid, and we don't know what's the real purpose of building a hybrid. They really need to get rid of "the humans are special" trope, because that's what the entire game was about. Yes we do actually. It isn't a hybrid at all. Every Reaper in their core has the species used to create it, in this case humans, sealed within to preserve them. Once it was completed, it would have been inserted into a dreadnought shell. They were going after humans specifically because humans were deemed the best species in this cycle and each cycle has the best species get that treatment while the other species are put into the smaller Reapers. As for us figuring it out, they didn't think anyone would actually reach the Collector Base because only ships with Reaper IFFs aka only Reapers can. That's why we take one from the derelict Reaper. Plus they see themselves as so much more advanced than us they wouldn't care if we figured it out because that doesn't mean we can do anything about it in the grand scheme of things. I agree that they need to get rid of that trope, but those questions like most of yours are answered by the games.
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Post by cloud9 on Aug 13, 2018 0:27:55 GMT
But the Reapers were harvesting sentient beings for over millions of years, so figuring out how they're going to harvest people makes no sense. And we still don't know why the Collectors specifically abducting humans to create a Hybrid, and we don't know what's the real purpose of building a hybrid. They really need to get rid of "the humans are special" trope, because that's what the entire game was about. Yes we do actually. It isn't a hybrid at all. Every Reaper in their core has the species used to create it, in this case humans, sealed within to preserve them. Once it was completed, it would have been inserted into a dreadnought shell. They were going after humans specifically because humans were deemed the best species in this cycle and each cycle has the best species get that treatment while the other species are put into the smaller Reapers. As for us figuring it out, they didn't think anyone would actually reach the Collector Base because only ships with Reaper IFFs aka only Reapers can. That's why we take one from the derelict Reaper. Plus they see themselves as so much more advanced than us they wouldn't care if we figured it out because that doesn't mean we can do anything about it in the grand scheme of things. I agree that they need to get rid of that trope, but those questions like most of yours are answered by the games.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Aug 13, 2018 0:29:23 GMT
Yes we do actually. It isn't a hybrid at all. Every Reaper in their core has the species used to create it, in this case humans, sealed within to preserve them. Once it was completed, it would have been inserted into a dreadnought shell. They were going after humans specifically because humans were deemed the best species in this cycle and each cycle has the best species get that treatment while the other species are put into the smaller Reapers. As for us figuring it out, they didn't think anyone would actually reach the Collector Base because only ships with Reaper IFFs aka only Reapers can. That's why we take one from the derelict Reaper. Plus they see themselves as so much more advanced than us they wouldn't care if we figured it out because that doesn't mean we can do anything about it in the grand scheme of things. I agree that they need to get rid of that trope, but those questions like most of yours are answered by the games. Thank you for conceding and agreeing with me. I'm glad I was able to help you.
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Post by cloud9 on Aug 13, 2018 0:46:55 GMT
Would the spaceship crew be younger or older? Would the Reapers still be the threat or be replaced by something else? Would it be darker or more optimistic? I think the trilogy should have a reboot. They should keep the Reaper threat with a consistent story, of course. And the tone setting of trilogy should have a dark setting especially on ME3.
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Post by Phantom on Aug 13, 2018 1:07:28 GMT
there is dark and there is too fucking dark. so becareful in what you wish for
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Post by alanc9 on Aug 13, 2018 2:56:11 GMT
I should have been clearer. As expendable pawns, the Collectors can be risked. It's not like Harbinger expected Shepard to be able to get through the Omega-4 relay and blow them all up; the Reapers didn't know about the derelict Reaper or they would have taken care of it. The Collectors had already fulfilled their primary function of cataloging and analysing the current cycle's organics. Risking a few of them on prototyping a human Reaper isn't a bad idea; better to figure out how you're going to process organics before you start the harvest. Which doesn't answer the question of why risk the Collectors now, when the Reapers will be there to back them up in just a couple years. Which isn't even an eyeblink to immortal space Cthulhu. Again, they didn't think they were risking "the Collectors" since their base was thought to be secure, and would have actually been secure except for a wild stroke of luck.They thought they might be risking a couple of Collector ships and some ground forces.
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Post by cloud9 on Aug 13, 2018 4:33:30 GMT
DIfference is: New Vegas had a good, multi-faction story the player could shape and was mod-friendly. It didn't rely on multiplayer and loot boxes to carry it. New Vegas? There are multiple factions for sure, but is it a good story? As I recall it's basically "there's going to be a big battle - get allies!" Rarely have I been more underwhelmed by the ending of a game. In my opinion, Fallout 3 had a better story than New Vegas - at least we got big moments like Liberty Prime's rampage, whereas New Vegas had nothing so dramatic. Don't get me wrong, I did enjoy the game for all that, but I doubt I've played a game with a longer list of flaws. If Bioware had made a game like that, they'd have been slaughtered by fans. If they've created a decent ending of ME3, then they would not receive any backlash in the first place.
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