Ianamus
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Post by Ianamus on Mar 27, 2017 19:05:54 GMT
I enjoyed it, which is all that matters to me.
As long as it does well enough commercially to warrant a sequel and decent DLC, I'm good. I don't need it to win any awards to validate my enjoyment of it.
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CatcheJagger
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The King o' Kings, brah
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Post by CatcheJagger on Mar 27, 2017 19:14:09 GMT
It can still be GOTM (yes, month), right? Game of the month? Nier Automata was also released in March, so no. And Breath of the Wild. Both of these got a better reception than MEA. (Horizon: Zero Dawn came out on the very last day of February, meaning that pretty much all of it's "first month sales and coverage happened over the course of March)
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The Twilight God
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Post by The Twilight God on Mar 27, 2017 19:39:45 GMT
It can still be GOTM (yes, month), right? Breath of the Wild debuted March 3rd. Sorry.
Maybe Game of the Week?
Nah, Toukiden 2 was released that week.
Oh! Oh! I know! Game of the Day March 21 2017. It can have that honor.
Nah, Touhou Double Focus was also released March 21 2017.
Damn, this game can't catch a break.
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scouserant23
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by scouserant23 on Mar 27, 2017 19:42:12 GMT
40Million for a game of this scope would be a huge surprise for GOTY. Sure if it had a 150-200million budget it could of been a truly great game. I believe GOTY will be won by read dead redemption 2 or possibly the new shadow of mordor if it delivers. For a 40$M budget for a game of this size i believe BioWare have pulled off a solid game especially considering they lost a years development trying to do procedural planets. I just wish either of 2 things, 1 EA backed Mass Effect more and wanted it to be a flagship IP, giving it at least 100 million budget. Or 2 that BioWare stops trying to make the biggest game out there with a relatively shoe string budget. (GTAV had 100+million budget destiny over 200million think even Witcher 3 had 80million in a cheaper labour country) If they went for a smaller say 20-30 hour game 100% complete the budget would have sufficed for an epic game.
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Kabraxal
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Post by Kabraxal on Mar 27, 2017 19:43:09 GMT
I think many of us don't really care about the industry GotY. I know I mostly shrug with many giving it to Overwatch and The Witcher. They are simply opinions that are no more significant than my own. This is a thread about the industry GOTY. If you don't care about the industry GOTY w.r.t Mass Effect Andromeda, then perhaps this isn't the right thread for the point you are trying to make... Why are their opinions more important than other gamers? In fact i trust other gamers more than people rushing a game to meet a deadline for a job. Those opinions are actually quite worhless.
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Post by ticktak77 on Mar 27, 2017 19:57:36 GMT
This is a thread about the industry GOTY. If you don't care about the industry GOTY w.r.t Mass Effect Andromeda, then perhaps this isn't the right thread for the point you are trying to make... Why are their opinions more important than other gamers? In fact i trust other gamers more than people rushing a game to meet a deadline for a job. Those opinions are actually quite worhless. Who's opinions are we talking about here? Reviewers? Or those that make decisions for GOTY awards? On reviewers - I think you are a little naive if you think the critical conversation surrounding a game are "worthless". If reviews were worthless, publishers wouldn't have review embargoes on content/reviews from their games. This is done, because they know reviews have a significant influence on people's perceptions of a game. ( This place is a great example - people had their flaming pitchforks out last Monday night, when the reviews dropped. The critical conversation surrounding Andromeda was not good at all, and people were very upset by it).
Mediocre / poor reviews of Andromeda will hurt long-tail sales. Another good example of this, is Dishonored 2 - a game that reviewed extremely well, but they got too cute with their embargo strategy, and the critical conversation surrounding that game never really took off, and as a result it was a game that didn't sell well. On GOTY award choosers - generally it's very strong games that have been received very well publicly, that make it into contention for that game. So when people's favorite game(s) aren't up for contention, they get upset at that. Again, someone else's opinions do matter. It's a fairy tale world if you choose to believe that other people's opinions don't matter relative to how a game is perceived. Unfortunately, it's not a world that is grounded in reality.
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Post by ticktak77 on Mar 27, 2017 20:00:09 GMT
40Million for a game of this scope would be a huge surprise for GOTY. Sure if it had a 150-200million budget it could of been a truly great game. I believe GOTY will be won by read dead redemption 2 or possibly the new shadow of mordor if it delivers. For a 40$M budget for a game of this size i believe BioWare have pulled off a solid game especially considering they lost a years development trying to do procedural planets. I just wish either of 2 things, 1 EA backed Mass Effect more and wanted it to be a flagship IP, giving it at least 100 million budget. Or 2 that BioWare stops trying to make the biggest game out there with a relatively shoe string budget. (GTAV had 100+million budget destiny over 200million think even Witcher 3 had 80million in a cheaper labour country) If they went for a smaller say 20-30 hour game 100% complete the budget would have sufficed for an epic game. It's upto Bioware to figure out how to best spend that budget. Not EA. $40 million is a very good budget to make a triple A game. Don't forget - EA is a business. They aren't going to hand out blank cheques or $100 million cheques to anybody. Bioware doesn't deserve that sort of budget.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
PSN: LinksOcarina
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Post by linksocarina on Mar 27, 2017 20:48:06 GMT
40Million for a game of this scope would be a huge surprise for GOTY. Sure if it had a 150-200million budget it could of been a truly great game. I believe GOTY will be won by read dead redemption 2 or possibly the new shadow of mordor if it delivers. For a 40$M budget for a game of this size i believe BioWare have pulled off a solid game especially considering they lost a years development trying to do procedural planets. I just wish either of 2 things, 1 EA backed Mass Effect more and wanted it to be a flagship IP, giving it at least 100 million budget. Or 2 that BioWare stops trying to make the biggest game out there with a relatively shoe string budget. (GTAV had 100+million budget destiny over 200million think even Witcher 3 had 80million in a cheaper labour country) If they went for a smaller say 20-30 hour game 100% complete the budget would have sufficed for an epic game. It's upto Bioware to figure out how to best spend that budget. Not EA. $40 million is a very good budget to make a triple A game. Don't forget - EA is a business. They aren't going to hand out blank cheques or $100 million cheques to anybody. Bioware doesn't deserve that sort of budget. That number however is still relatively small for a AAA title. Average costs for a AAA game now a days is well over $50-$60 million. Some, like Witcher 3, went as high as $85 million, others, like GTA V or CoD, are close to $150 million. $40 million is rather telling: it's a limited budget for a game that is not really a major focus for EA- it was probably allocated those funds specifically because of other IP being more valuable in EA's mind, such as Star Wars liscensing or Battlefield 1. Multiplayer is also going to help recoup that easily as well, so the goalpost was a bit lower compared to expectations regarding Mass Effect 3. Andromeda doesn't seem like it went over-budget, but it does seem like it needed more time and money that it was ultimately never going to get because of EA. Considering the business side of things...this is going to be a win for both studios because the risk was low and the budget was low, respectively. What is going to be tarnished is next time...will the studio get the $80 million treatment, or will it stay in the $40 million range? We saw what we can get for $40 million...what blood can we squeeze from the stone here?
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Post by ticktak77 on Mar 27, 2017 21:04:49 GMT
It's upto Bioware to figure out how to best spend that budget. Not EA. $40 million is a very good budget to make a triple A game. Don't forget - EA is a business. They aren't going to hand out blank cheques or $100 million cheques to anybody. Bioware doesn't deserve that sort of budget. That number however is still relatively small for a AAA title. Average costs for a AAA game now a days is well over $50-$60 million. Some, like Witcher 3, went as high as $85 million, others, like GTA V or CoD, are close to $150 million. $40 million is rather telling: it's a limited budget for a game that is not really a major focus for EA- it was probably allocated those funds specifically because of other IP being more valuable in EA's mind, such as Star Wars liscensing or Battlefield 1. Multiplayer is also going to help recoup that easily as well, so the goalpost was a bit lower compared to expectations regarding Mass Effect 3. Andromeda doesn't seem like it went over-budget, but it does seem like it needed more time and money that it was ultimately never going to get because of EA. Considering the business side of things...this is going to be a win for both studios because the risk was low and the budget was low, respectively. What is going to be tarnished is next time...will the studio get the $80 million treatment, or will it stay in the $40 million range? We saw what we can get for $40 million...what blood can we squeeze from the stone here? Point is, you can get a great triple A game out of that budget. I think there's a sense that because the budget wasn't as high as others, that's why Andromeda ended up in the state that it is in. I don't think that's true.
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Post by SofaJockey on Mar 27, 2017 21:21:54 GMT
This.The OP said ' the GOTY' not your or my GOTY. The consensus builds from 400-500 review sites and player surveys. On that basis, this accolade isn't happening. What will it be? Red Dead, Shadow of War, BotW, HZD, could be others, but MEA? I don't think so. Doesn't mean it's a bad game, it just means it isn't the best game. I think many of us don't really care about the industry GotY. I know I mostly shrug with many giving it to Overwatch and The Witcher. They are simply opinions that are no more significant than my own. Our personal views should outweigh any 'consensus GOTY' but I find it quite interesting to see who does well each year. The GOTY isn't necessarily the best game of the year, but it's certainly an indication that a lot of people liked it.
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Post by DOOMSLAYER on Mar 27, 2017 21:30:31 GMT
Never going to be. The award will go to Zelda. RPG of the year will either go to Nier Automata or most likely, Horizon whatever.
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linksocarina
N5
Always teacher, sometimes writer
Teaching Mode Activated
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
PSN: LinksOcarina
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Post by linksocarina on Mar 27, 2017 21:37:05 GMT
That number however is still relatively small for a AAA title. Average costs for a AAA game now a days is well over $50-$60 million. Some, like Witcher 3, went as high as $85 million, others, like GTA V or CoD, are close to $150 million. $40 million is rather telling: it's a limited budget for a game that is not really a major focus for EA- it was probably allocated those funds specifically because of other IP being more valuable in EA's mind, such as Star Wars liscensing or Battlefield 1. Multiplayer is also going to help recoup that easily as well, so the goalpost was a bit lower compared to expectations regarding Mass Effect 3. Andromeda doesn't seem like it went over-budget, but it does seem like it needed more time and money that it was ultimately never going to get because of EA. Considering the business side of things...this is going to be a win for both studios because the risk was low and the budget was low, respectively. What is going to be tarnished is next time...will the studio get the $80 million treatment, or will it stay in the $40 million range? We saw what we can get for $40 million...what blood can we squeeze from the stone here? Point is, you can get a great triple A game out of that budget. I think there's a sense that because the budget wasn't as high as others, that's why Andromeda ended up in the state that it is in. I don't think that's true. I think it was a contributing factor to the technical shortcomings. The others being the relative inexperience of the team on a large scale project, and the fact that BioWare has a habit of being a generation behind when it comes to visuals. Dragon Age: Origins in 2009 was anachronistic in how it looked, for example. Dragon Age 2 was no better. Jade Empire was also a bit out-dated in 2005, and Inquisition was ok visually in some respects, but ultimately a bit shallow by comparison to next gen console games on the likes of a PS4. I guarentee the next game will feature a lot more visual upgrades due to all of this...whatever that game may be.
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SKAR
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Can you dig it?
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by SKAR on Mar 27, 2017 21:38:24 GMT
It's game of the year to me, that's all that matters.
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Post by The Biotic Trebuchet on Mar 28, 2017 3:26:13 GMT
40Million for a game of this scope would be a huge surprise for GOTY. Sure if it had a 150-200million budget it could of been a truly great game. I believe GOTY will be won by read dead redemption 2 or possibly the new shadow of mordor if it delivers. For a 40$M budget for a game of this size i believe BioWare have pulled off a solid game especially considering they lost a years development trying to do procedural planets. I just wish either of 2 things, 1 EA backed Mass Effect more and wanted it to be a flagship IP, giving it at least 100 million budget. Or 2 that BioWare stops trying to make the biggest game out there with a relatively shoe string budget. (GTAV had 100+million budget destiny over 200million think even Witcher 3 had 80million in a cheaper labour country) If they went for a smaller say 20-30 hour game 100% complete the budget would have sufficed for an epic game. Didn't Destiny have like 500 millions for budget?, and EA only drops big budgets to Sports and Dice it seems...
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Post by panzerwzh on Mar 28, 2017 5:34:37 GMT
40Million for a game of this scope would be a huge surprise for GOTY. Sure if it had a 150-200million budget it could of been a truly great game. I believe GOTY will be won by read dead redemption 2 or possibly the new shadow of mordor if it delivers. For a 40$M budget for a game of this size i believe BioWare have pulled off a solid game especially considering they lost a years development trying to do procedural planets. I just wish either or of 2 things, 1 EA backed Mass Effect more and wanted it to be a flagship IP, giving it at least 100 million budget. Or 2 that BioWare stops trying to make the biggest game out there with a relatively shoe string budget. (GTAV had 100+million budget destiny over 200million think even Witcher 3 had 80million in a cheaper labour country) If they went for a smaller say 20-30 hour game 100% complete the budget would have sufficed for an epic game. Didn't Destiny have like 500 millions for budget?, and EA only drops big budgets to Sports and Dice it seems... Because the market share of sports and shooter are much bigger than RPG. Although TW3's success has proven them wrong.
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Post by suikoden on Mar 28, 2017 6:00:17 GMT
Point is, you can get a great triple A game out of that budget. I think there's a sense that because the budget wasn't as high as others, that's why Andromeda ended up in the state that it is in. I don't think that's true. I think it was a contributing factor to the technical shortcomings. The others being the relative inexperience of the team on a large scale project, and the fact that BioWare has a habit of being a generation behind when it comes to visuals. Dragon Age: Origins in 2009 was anachronistic in how it looked, for example. Dragon Age 2 was no better. Jade Empire was also a bit out-dated in 2005, and Inquisition was ok visually in some respects, but ultimately a bit shallow by comparison to next gen console games on the likes of a PS4. I guarentee the next game will feature a lot more visual upgrades due to all of this...whatever that game may be. Dragon Age Origins has better facial animations than Andromeda... Lotta excuses for a mediocre game too. But if you guarantee it, that changes everything!!
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Post by smilesja on Mar 28, 2017 6:10:07 GMT
I think it was a contributing factor to the technical shortcomings. The others being the relative inexperience of the team on a large scale project, and the fact that BioWare has a habit of being a generation behind when it comes to visuals. Dragon Age: Origins in 2009 was anachronistic in how it looked, for example. Dragon Age 2 was no better. Jade Empire was also a bit out-dated in 2005, and Inquisition was ok visually in some respects, but ultimately a bit shallow by comparison to next gen console games on the likes of a PS4. I guarentee the next game will feature a lot more visual upgrades due to all of this...whatever that game may be. Dragon Age Origins has better facial animations than Andromeda... Lotta excuses for a mediocre game too. But if you guarantee it, that changes everything!! Well it's true Bioware is not very advanced when it comes to visuals. And Adromeda is far from mediocre.
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Post by scouserant23 on Mar 29, 2017 4:35:45 GMT
That number however is still relatively small for a AAA title. Average costs for a AAA game now a days is well over $50-$60 million. Some, like Witcher 3, went as high as $85 million, others, like GTA V or CoD, are close to $150 million. $40 million is rather telling: it's a limited budget for a game that is not really a major focus for EA- it was probably allocated those funds specifically because of other IP being more valuable in EA's mind, such as Star Wars liscensing or Battlefield 1. Multiplayer is also going to help recoup that easily as well, so the goalpost was a bit lower compared to expectations regarding Mass Effect 3. Andromeda doesn't seem like it went over-budget, but it does seem like it needed more time and money that it was ultimately never going to get because of EA. Considering the business side of things...this is going to be a win for both studios because the risk was low and the budget was low, respectively. What is going to be tarnished is next time...will the studio get the $80 million treatment, or will it stay in the $40 million range? We saw what we can get for $40 million...what blood can we squeeze from the stone here? Point is, you can get a great triple A game out of that budget. I think there's a sense that because the budget wasn't as high as others, that's why Andromeda ended up in the state that it is in. I don't think that's true. When it comes to a game of this scope (so many conversations, different species etc) having a higher budget means a better game. More money = More writers (better quests and more of the good ones less of poor ones) More designers/animators (better animations better models/meshes for alien races) More Artists (better weapons and armour more of them, better maps and levels, better aesthetics) More programmers (better gameplay mechanics better quests etc) Granted not every big budget game ends up great, but the fact bioware gets the basics right on smaller budget games says alot. Sure it would be a risk that it would sell like hot cakes to recoup a bigger budget but it is also true that the better a game and its marketing the better it sells. Got to spend money to make money. EA have always played it safe with BioWare which shows a lack of belief in the company. You can tell BioWare want to make games that compete with Bethesda or Rockstar, CDPR in scope but their budget is always way way off. This means every game they release is effectively less polished and less "Full". Sure they get to dictate their budget but a part of me likes that they keep pushing boundaries they could just do what most developers do and make smaller games and fine tune them, but they don't they keep trying to keep up with the big boys on big budgets. EA is a business but im willing to bet that any money made off of MEA will not be reinvested back into a sequel. Under EA BioWare will get a % of the profits reinvested into a sequel but never more ergo lacking investment and rather for lack of a better term treat BioWare as a cash cow. I will say this, EA has loosened the reigns since ME3. Both DAI and MEA had more time in development so props to them not milking the cow dry. Now they need to beef (no pun intended) up the cow before milking it again. I also will say that since DAI success is a mystery maybe it actually lost money or barely broke even compared to its investment in which case i can see the hesitation to invest in MEA especially since BioWare are already making a new IP with likely a lot of money behind it (so already facing risk of investment) add to that the backlash they got on ME3 and i could understand the risk involved in investing heavily in a reboot (basically) of the ME franchise. Here is to hoping that if MEA sells well and makes 60+ million (showing the interest in ME is still there) an the next game will get a 80ish million budget to truly see what they can do with the franchise. The criticism of the budget does not take away from the game though, even though at times you can see how stretched they were. The game overall is still a good game but i doubt it will age well and wont stand the test of time.
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Post by panzerwzh on Mar 29, 2017 7:03:05 GMT
Current news suggests the sales of MEA is horrible. My local EB games cancelled all the 'mighnight' launch event for MEA due to lack of interests.
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Post by vonuber on Mar 29, 2017 7:34:39 GMT
Current news suggests the sales of MEA is horrible. Sources and links please, including sales data from origin. You do have those, yes?
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Post by ATR16 on Mar 29, 2017 7:48:07 GMT
Why are their opinions more important than other gamers? In fact i trust other gamers more than people rushing a game to meet a deadline for a job. Those opinions are actually quite worhless. Who's opinions are we talking about here? Reviewers? Or those that make decisions for GOTY awards? On reviewers - I think you are a little naive if you think the critical conversation surrounding a game are "worthless". If reviews were worthless, publishers wouldn't have review embargoes on content/reviews from their games. This is done, because they know reviews have a significant influence on people's perceptions of a game. ( This place is a great example - people had their flaming pitchforks out last Monday night, when the reviews dropped. The critical conversation surrounding Andromeda was not good at all, and people were very upset by it).
Mediocre / poor reviews of Andromeda will hurt long-tail sales. Another good example of this, is Dishonored 2 - a game that reviewed extremely well, but they got too cute with their embargo strategy, and the critical conversation surrounding that game never really took off, and as a result it was a game that didn't sell well. On GOTY award choosers - generally it's very strong games that have been received very well publicly, that make it into contention for that game. So when people's favorite game(s) aren't up for contention, they get upset at that. Again, someone else's opinions do matter. It's a fairy tale world if you choose to believe that other people's opinions don't matter relative to how a game is perceived. Unfortunately, it's not a world that is grounded in reality. Reviews might not mean dick all to big fans of Bioware IPs, but they are probably the top source for the more casual audience and bringing in new fans to the games. Reviews are incredibly important to hitting your sales numbers and proving that the investment in the game was worth it. Games don't really live or die by their hardcore audience. Its the casual person who picks it up for the first time, the lapsed fan coming back, Gramma or Uncle Joe looking for a good birthday present for little Timmy, etc. For games I'm not huge on I check big site reviews a lot. Mix in some questions to a few friends here and there, maybe Steam reviews if that's where the game is. 40, 60, 80 bucks isn't exactly chump change and I don't want to spend it on something I can't get a return from in entertainment. I love Age of Mythology. I must have three or four copies of it now, plus buying a few for friends here and there, but I wouldn't touch the Asian expansion after seeing the reviews even though I LOVE the series. I don't even want to waste 15 bucks or whatever if it won't be worth it.
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Post by ATR16 on Mar 29, 2017 7:55:54 GMT
That number however is still relatively small for a AAA title. Average costs for a AAA game now a days is well over $50-$60 million. Some, like Witcher 3, went as high as $85 million, others, like GTA V or CoD, are close to $150 million. $40 million is rather telling: it's a limited budget for a game that is not really a major focus for EA- it was probably allocated those funds specifically because of other IP being more valuable in EA's mind, such as Star Wars liscensing or Battlefield 1. Multiplayer is also going to help recoup that easily as well, so the goalpost was a bit lower compared to expectations regarding Mass Effect 3. Andromeda doesn't seem like it went over-budget, but it does seem like it needed more time and money that it was ultimately never going to get because of EA. Considering the business side of things...this is going to be a win for both studios because the risk was low and the budget was low, respectively. What is going to be tarnished is next time...will the studio get the $80 million treatment, or will it stay in the $40 million range? We saw what we can get for $40 million...what blood can we squeeze from the stone here? Point is, you can get a great triple A game out of that budget. I think there's a sense that because the budget wasn't as high as others, that's why Andromeda ended up in the state that it is in. I don't think that's true. Yeah, if thats all the money you were given then you need to make a game that is a great 40 million dollar game. Adjust your goalposts to fit that goal. Do that and you get 60, or 80 next time. Not an okay 40 million dollar game with an excuse that "It would have been better if we had more money". That does no one favours and is on Bioware internally. When I worked on marketing projects, your budget was your budget. It was almost never as much as you wanted but there are ways to work within that budget. Adjust your aim and hit that target. Sometimes we kicked ass and next time the client said "That was great! What if we gave you 150% of last time?" If we delivered okay results then they'd usually say "Okay, cool. Do that again I guess" or even worse "Well, you didn't use the budget that well last time in our opinion so here's 70% of it" or sometimes even less.
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scouserant23
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Post by scouserant23 on Mar 29, 2017 9:02:46 GMT
Current news suggests the sales of MEA is horrible. My local EB games cancelled all the 'mighnight' launch event for MEA due to lack of interests. Midnight sales are loosing their appeal as gamers as a whole are shifting towards digital. Physical sales for all games are down even on consoles.
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Post by panzerwzh on Mar 29, 2017 9:15:28 GMT
Current news suggests the sales of MEA is horrible. My local EB games cancelled all the 'mighnight' launch event for MEA due to lack of interests. Midnight sales are loosing their appeal as gamers as a whole are shifting towards digital. Physical sales for all games are down even on consoles. It depends, HZD just had a successful midnight launch event. As for anybody needs references so badly, just click: www.eurogamer.net/articles/2017-03-27-mass-effect-andromeda-physical-launch-sales-down-on-me3
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Post by vonuber on Mar 29, 2017 10:30:26 GMT
As was discussed to death on the other thread, physical sales are not a good indicator anymore, especially for pc.
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