Dorian Pavus Thread "He's More Handsome Than A Cockroach"

This is a great response, Catilina! As justifiably angry as Fenris is at the system and those who perpetuate it, he's always been reasonable... I don't think he would necessarily like Dorian as a person (at least not any more than he liked Anders) but he knows how to be civil and stand his ground at the same time. I doubt he'd go on a bloodthirsty murder rampage unless Dorian suddenly started acting like Danarius or Hadriana. And that's not going to happen anytime soon.

But Bethany's not a Tevinter Altus, who doesn't question the slavery. And Hawke's sister. And Fenris wanted to see her inside the Circle...:

Fenris: You know, you cannot wish the Templars away.
Bethany: I can try.
Fenris: Is the Circle here truly so terrible an option?
Bethany: Do you really have to ask that?
Fenris: You would be kept safe from others as well as yourself, and they would be kept safe from you.
Bethany: I... didn't ask for this.
Fenris: Nobody asks for their fate.

Between Fenris and Dorian the friendship harder than even between Fenris and Merrill. Merrill NOT a slaveholder, while Dorian's family is.
Dorian's and Fenris' relationship wouldn't better than Fenris' and Anders'. Anders and Fenris also tried to approach, but the time was not the best, especially to Anders. Do you think, after Kirkwall, if Fenris helped to the mages, Anders wouldn't be grateful for that help? He was grateful for every little help. (And angry for the refusal... of course, Anders not that nice. But also Fenris.)

Fenris wouldn't want to kill Dorian. Fenris would able to work with Dorian (if must), but I don't think, he would be more friendly with him, as with Merrill or Anders. Merrill charming enough, but Fenris didn't care.
Fenris smart and open-minded, they can befriend, but only if Dorian able to change his mind about the slavery, and refuse that. Categorically. And help to Fenris.

Of course. He even appreciates Anders' stance on blood magic and suspicious altars and ... Merrill... They were high-five bros sometimes when Merrill was there.

Exactly.  This is what I meant about Dorian being a product of his upbringing.  He is not a bad guy as you say and I use him (and Solas) a lot when I play Inquisition.  But he does sometimes stick his foot in his mouth due to being born and raised in Tevinter.

^Oh, definitely. It's pretty pervasive. Like Aveline casually mentioning elves sleeping in stables and outbuildings and not seeing anything strange about that, meanwhile Merrill is quietly horrified.

On the mabari in the bedroom issue, this is something that can equally be found in real life. There is a story about a Hungarian King whose main guardians in his bedroom were his dogs because he trusted them more than his human subjects. The mabari is a guarding as well as a fighting breed, so it makes sense that you would want to keep your hound close to you at all times. Mind you, judging by a comment that Dorian makes about dogs when, I think, we were in Crestwood I think he would be horrified at the notion of having a mabari in the bedroom - from a cleanliness point of view if nothing else.

Well, Patrick Weekes a couple years ago on Twitter said this:

Sorry I've been a while answering on this. My view was entirely based on the fact that numbers in the Dalish are low and so I imagined there would be a fair bit of pressure to find a partner at an early age. You will recall that couple in DAO, who both appeared young and Cammen had yet to make a kill as a hunter. Her reluctance to make a commitment was also understandable if you think about the need to provide for a family. Now it always struck me if this was the case there had to be a reason why Lavellan, who had to be older in order to be entrusted with the mission by the Keeper, had not yet found a partner. In the case of female Lavellan, she was the Keeper's First, and I decided that probably mages do leave it later because they are concentrating on their magical training. However, my male Lavellan was chief scout and hunter in the clan, so would have been regarded as a good catch by any female member. It therefore seemed odd that he did not already have a partner but fitted perfectly with the idea that he was gay and had resisted getting married for the sake of it when he did not have any attraction for the girl.

As for terminology, the words homosexual, bisexual and gay are, so far as I am aware, fairly modern in usage. I believe homosexuality was identified as a sexual orientation only as late as the 19th century when such studies started to be made. Prior to that it was more a case of someone being thought to "prefer the company of men" as though it was something they had chosen to adopt as a lifestyle instead of being their sexual orientation. This is why there is no catch all term for it in Latin that the writers could conveniently use. It is stated that in Tevinter it is regarded as deviant behaviour, if indulged with someone who is not a slave, which I believe is exactly how it was viewed in ancient Rome. Homosexual is not a biblical word and if you find it used in the Bible this is where it is a modern translation that has used the term. I have an old Latin version of the Bible and there is no actual word to describe a homosexual person, only what they do.

In a lot of cultures where it was considered important to reproduce for whatever reason, but particularly among the ruling class, there was stigma and prejudice against remaining single and for this reason homosexuality would have been hidden. With arranged marriages also often being the norm, it was considered commonplace to have an official wife and then have lovers on the side, whether male or female, but generally from the lower classes. However, that is how they would have been referred to rather than an actual term for the sexual orientation of the person. This way of looking of things was the one that was adopted by the writers and reflected in the codex "The Sex Lives of Everyday Thedosians".

So to have people in Thedas using an actual term to describe a homosexual person would be out of place with the setting, making it seem like someone had made a study of modern psychiatry in relation to sexuality or genetics.

That was my point really. Real life cultures have derisive terms, particularly for the male who is considered the "woman" in the relationship, but that is probably the reason the writers decided not to have a corresponding word in their world. There seems no evidence of an actual gay community in Thedas who would have decided on their own label but then at the same time it is not something that seems specifically condemned or derided outside of Tevinter so probably no call for a word to counter negative connotations of descriptive terms for such a relationship as there are none. In Tevinter the word likely would be derisive, so naturally Dorian would not identify himself by it.

However, having a general term would suggest someone looking at it from a detached viewpoint that encompassed all races and cultures and there is no evidence of anyone undertaking that sort of scientific study.

I came here to see what folks were saying about Dorian, found some Fenris love and a bit of Anders hate instead.

disgustednoise, Since you're back -- and since he doesn't plug himself here very often -- I must take the opportunity to recommend Verfallen's Inquisitor/Dorian series of fics, for when you feel like some fic-reading. They're pretty great, and there's a lot, so you'll be occupied for a while!