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Post by colfoley on Nov 14, 2017 2:52:34 GMT
Ehh, stop picking the casual lines. You do realize Ryder auto quips a lot of times even if you choose professional/logical? And? Shepard auto dialogued being an emotional cripple in ME 3 weeping over the death of the Asari even if you were trying to role play them as being a stone cold bad arse who had a borderline passionate dislike of the entire Asari race.
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Post by themikefest on Nov 14, 2017 2:53:35 GMT
What would it take for you to kick a squadmate off the ship?
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Post by colfoley on Nov 14, 2017 2:55:46 GMT
What would it take for you to kick a squadmate off the ship? At this point probably intentional genocide of an allied species who aren't the Asari.
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Post by smilesja on Nov 14, 2017 2:57:16 GMT
You do realize Ryder auto quips a lot of times even if you choose professional/logical? And? Shepard auto dialogued being an emotional cripple in ME 3 weeping over the death of the Asari even if you were trying to role play them as being a stone cold bad arse who had a borderline passionate dislike of the entire Asari race. And you're railroaded into feeling bad for a kid who got killed in ME3.
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Post by themikefest on Nov 14, 2017 2:57:20 GMT
And? Shepard auto dialogued being an emotional cripple in ME 3 weeping over the death of the Asari even if you were trying to role play them as being a stone cold bad arse who had a borderline passionate dislike of the entire Asari race. And a lot of folks complained about that.
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Post by colfoley on Nov 14, 2017 3:00:51 GMT
And? Shepard auto dialogued being an emotional cripple in ME 3 weeping over the death of the Asari even if you were trying to role play them as being a stone cold bad arse who had a borderline passionate dislike of the entire Asari race. And you're railroaded into feeling bad for a kid who got killed in ME3. I think most of the kid dislike came from his role in the ending because most people should feel bad for the kid. BioWare was trying to be all symbolic and psychological with the kid, and...admittedly it didn't work. But then with the Asari you have a race who has been borderline hostile to humanity off and on and is basically a race of velvet gloved tyrants in space, who came up with the monumentally bad idea of creating the Citadel Council and you can effectively role play as a Shepard who just does not care much and is actually uncomfortable and even a bit hostile towards the Asari for the first two games...not to mention the Council. But in the third game it was all weepy weepy weepy. My Shepard would have either shrugged her shoulders or threw a quiet party without Liara knowing.
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Post by themikefest on Nov 14, 2017 3:04:57 GMT
At this point probably intentional genocide of an allied species who aren't the Asari. Wow. So being a squadmate on your ship who can get away with nearly all kinds of stuff is ok as long they don't wipe out a species.
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Post by colfoley on Nov 14, 2017 3:11:10 GMT
At this point probably intentional genocide of an allied species who aren't the Asari. Wow. So being a squadmate on your ship who can get away with nearly all kinds of stuff is ok as long they don't wipe out a species. As I said two points...well three but one is more speculative role playing then an actual point: 1. on my first few PTs I do not tend to kick off companions for any reason so I can experience all the content (and I really try to not get them killed off either). And since I have had murderers, assassins, thugs, mercenaries, and Solas on my team in past games I can think of genocide (or rape) as being the only two crimes that are above anything which has already been done by people who has been companions of mine in BioWare games. 2. I do not let them get away with it. I've punished Peebee, I nearly threw Liam off the ship and really laid into him for his stupid stunt, and going to my Blackwall example I have punished him before by basically putting him into protective custody of the Inquistion (not to mention the scene where you can basically force him to live through his lie). Which brings me to.. 3. I would think there would be perfect roleplaying justification in keeping your enemies close to you if you can. No matter your personal feelings on Peebee it certainly can be argued it would make more sense to keep her on the squad to 'keep an eye on her' rather then having her out there wreaking havoc in the wild.
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Post by themikefest on Nov 14, 2017 3:11:57 GMT
My Shepard would have either shrugged her shoulders or threw a quiet party without Liara knowing. Not bad. My Shepard would have thrown t'soni off the ship for getting in Javiks face blaming him for what happened instead of blaming her pathetic species for not revealing the artifact earlier.
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Post by themikefest on Nov 14, 2017 3:22:48 GMT
3. I would think there would be perfect roleplaying justification in keeping your enemies close to you if you can. No matter your personal feelings on Peebee it certainly can be argued it would make more sense to keep her on the squad to 'keep an eye on her' rather then having her out there wreaking havoc in the wild. I don't agree. Turning both over to Nexus security to let them deal with them is more than enough. What that does is give Ryder the option to bring in two more squadmates, useful ones, to help. If not, it would get Drack out of the kitchen and into the spot the cop occupied. If Ryder is on a mission, and the asari and cop are left on the ship, who's going to keep an eye on them? It won't be the crew. They''re busy keeping the ship operational. If the asari or cop is taken on a mission, how can I trust them to have my back if I get in a tight spot?
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Post by colfoley on Nov 14, 2017 3:27:58 GMT
3. I would think there would be perfect roleplaying justification in keeping your enemies close to you if you can. No matter your personal feelings on Peebee it certainly can be argued it would make more sense to keep her on the squad to 'keep an eye on her' rather then having her out there wreaking havoc in the wild. I don't agree. Turning both over to Nexus security to let them deal with them is more than enough. What that does is give Ryder the option to bring in two more squadmates, useful ones, to help. If not, it would get Drack out of the kitchen and into the spot the cop occupied. If Ryder is on a mission, and the asari and cop are left on the ship, who's going to keep an eye on them? It won't be the crew. They''re busy keeping the ship operational. If the asari or cop is taken on a mission, how can I trust them to have my back if I get in a tight spot? Perhaps, I am merely saying the justification could be there from a roleplaying perspective.
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Post by KaiserShep on Nov 14, 2017 3:57:54 GMT
And? Shepard auto dialogued being an emotional cripple in ME 3 weeping over the death of the Asari even if you were trying to role play them as being a stone cold bad arse who had a borderline passionate dislike of the entire Asari race. And you're railroaded into feeling bad for a kid who got killed in ME3. I can't tell you how grateful I am that at least when speaking to Garrus in the main battery for the first time in ME3, we can mercifully avoid mention of that stupid kid.
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Post by KaiserShep on Nov 14, 2017 4:03:17 GMT
If Bioware doesn't waste resources to kick characters off the ship, though it would be nice if the option was available, then put in an option to be recruited or not. The player had that option in the trilogy. Why not in this game? Why did you bring up Ranier? He doesn't have to be recruited. To bad the same can't be said about the asari? I've left him in jail a couple of times, but most of the time I don't recruit him. I mentioned him as an example of me not tending to intentionally cut off content like that, especially on my first few PTs. I alwas go out of my way to recruit all the companions and then keep them all. I think most of the fanbase shares that personal taste, and BioWare probably sees numbers supporting that position hence why they don't use resources on an option that most players wouldn't take. I prefer to deal with my companions as I can without kicking them out, and Andromeda did a great job with that. I will say though, I wish we had more options with companions in Mass Effect in general like we did with characters in Dragon Age. In Mass Effect, typically the only way to be rid of someone was to outright get them killed somehow. We can't just boot them from the ship, even when we're basically an elite murder machine that gets very little oversight. Typically I try to keep everyone, with the exception of Anders, the one and only companion I truly reveled in knifing, but sometimes it's nice to have a lulzy moment in the game where we can kick our pixelated minions in the ass.
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Post by colfoley on Nov 14, 2017 4:11:02 GMT
I mentioned him as an example of me not tending to intentionally cut off content like that, especially on my first few PTs. I alwas go out of my way to recruit all the companions and then keep them all. I think most of the fanbase shares that personal taste, and BioWare probably sees numbers supporting that position hence why they don't use resources on an option that most players wouldn't take. I prefer to deal with my companions as I can without kicking them out, and Andromeda did a great job with that. I will say though, I wish we had more options with companions in Mass Effect in general like we did with characters in Dragon Age. In Mass Effect, typically the only way to be rid of someone was to outright get them killed somehow. We can't just boot them from the ship, even when we're basically an elite murder machine that gets very little oversight. Typically I try to keep everyone, with the exception of Anders, the one and only companion I truly reveled in knifing, but sometimes it's nice to have a lulzy moment in the game where we can kick our pixelated minions in the ass. DA has always been the far superior of the two franchises when it comes to role playing. Granted, imo, MEA was a huge step in the right direction by and large but they still have a long way to go before they even get close to the hallowed ground of Inquisition or, especially, DA 2.
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Post by stealthfox94 on Nov 14, 2017 6:35:01 GMT
Ehh, stop picking the casual lines. You do realize Ryder auto quips a lot of times even if you choose professional/logical? TW3 had more auto quips though, and people didn't complain about that.
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Post by KaiserShep on Nov 14, 2017 6:50:47 GMT
You do realize Ryder auto quips a lot of times even if you choose professional/logical? TW3 had more auto quips though, and people didn't complain about that. Well, it was delivered in that Geralt totally-not-Batman kinda way though, so it made it more dry commentary.
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Post by colfoley on Nov 14, 2017 6:52:31 GMT
TW3 had more auto quips though, and people didn't complain about that. Well, it was delivered in that Geralt totally-not-Batman kinda way though, so it made it more dry commentary. I prefer to think of Geralt as being Batman's and Jack Bauer's secret love child.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Nov 14, 2017 16:23:59 GMT
My Shepard would have either shrugged her shoulders or threw a quiet party without Liara knowing. Not bad. My Shepard would have thrown t'soni off the ship for getting in Javiks face blaming him for what happened instead of blaming her pathetic species for not revealing the artifact earlier. Meh. What would be better if Shepard tossed Liara into a gas chamber, sealed the room. Then flood said chamber with Laughing Gas, and watch the what happens.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Nov 14, 2017 17:55:36 GMT
Well, it was delivered in that Geralt totally-not-Batman kinda way though, so it made it more dry commentary. I prefer to think of Geralt as being Batman's and Jack Bauer's secret love child. If I recall, didn't CDPR say that when it came to Geralt's voice they were inspired by Clint Eastwood's character Dirty Harry?
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
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Post by Iakus on Nov 19, 2017 20:15:40 GMT
You do realize Ryder auto quips a lot of times even if you choose professional/logical? TW3 had more auto quips though, and people didn't complain about that. Geralt is an established character with an established personality. Ryder is, in theory, our own character to shape.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
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Post by Iakus on Nov 19, 2017 20:16:34 GMT
You do realize Ryder auto quips a lot of times even if you choose professional/logical? And? Shepard auto dialogued being an emotional cripple in ME 3 weeping over the death of the Asari even if you were trying to role play them as being a stone cold bad arse who had a borderline passionate dislike of the entire Asari race. So now that we've established that Bioware has swung from one extreme to the other...
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Post by colfoley on Nov 19, 2017 20:24:00 GMT
And? Shepard auto dialogued being an emotional cripple in ME 3 weeping over the death of the Asari even if you were trying to role play them as being a stone cold bad arse who had a borderline passionate dislike of the entire Asari race. So now that we've established that Bioware has swung from one extreme to the other... Its not really an extreme though. Most people have a sense of humor, at least in my experience, whether or not they are consumate professionals or not. Most people do like to unwind or blow off steam in their off times and yet can be all business in times of crisis or 'on the job'. At least in my experience. The trouble with Shepard, at least personally, is the auto dialogue felt like they ripped control of my character away from me. Abigail didn't really care for the Asari or the Council. Abigail was a bad ass paragrade. Abigail survived Torfan, mutinied in ME 1, death, and then the suicide mission. Abigail should not have wept over the Asari, or at the very least for such a pivotal moment for the character BioWare should have given us the ability to actually react to the 'loss' and choose how we behave. Granted they kind of did make up for it with how you can really lay into Liara but the damage has been done. And this is just by far the most obvious but not the only. While Ryder was always within my control. Their auto dialogue never felt like it was infringing on my character, just minor, throw away, random bits of humor. I mean I suppose if you wanted to play Ryder as some entirely humorless curmegeon then you might feel cheated, and I know there are people on this board who feel this way, but you can make Ryder into a professional bad ass, you can give them a sense of humor, you can't with Shepard. I do not think what BioWare did with MEA was the other extreme, but really a happy middle ground.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
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Post by Iakus on Nov 19, 2017 20:36:53 GMT
So now that we've established that Bioware has swung from one extreme to the other... Its not really an extreme though. Most people have a sense of humor, at least in my experience, whether or not they are consumate professionals or not. Most people do like to unwind or blow off steam in their off times and yet can be all business in times of crisis or 'on the job'. At least in my experience. The trouble with Shepard, at least personally, is the auto dialogue felt like they ripped control of my character away from me. Abigail didn't really care for the Asari or the Council. Abigail was a bad ass paragrade. Abigail survived Torfan, mutinied in ME 1, death, and then the suicide mission. Abigail should not have wept over the Asari, or at the very least for such a pivotal moment for the character BioWare should have given us the ability to actually react to the 'loss' and choose how we behave. Granted they kind of did make up for it with how you can really lay into Liara but the damage has been done. And this is just by far the most obvious but not the only. While Ryder was always within my control. Their auto dialogue never felt like it was infringing on my character, just minor, throw away, random bits of humor. I mean I suppose if you wanted to play Ryder as some entirely humorless curmegeon then you might feel cheated, and I know there are people on this board who feel this way, but you can make Ryder into a professional bad ass, you can give them a sense of humor, you can't with Shepard. I do not think what BioWare did with MEA was the other extreme, but really a happy middle ground. My Ryder wasnted to show more emotion over Alec and his sister. My Ryder wanted to take the kett more seriously. My Ryder wanted to lay into Peebee for hijacking them on her personal mission. Basicallyy Ryder wanted moments to be all-business, and moments to blow off steam. What I got was a rather tepid character who cracked one-liners at questionably appropriate moments. I felt I had way more control over my Inquisitor than I ever did with Shepard or Ryder. Hell, I had more control playing as HAWKE! At least then when he told inappropriate jokes it's because I made him that way.
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Post by colfoley on Nov 19, 2017 20:40:46 GMT
Its not really an extreme though. Most people have a sense of humor, at least in my experience, whether or not they are consumate professionals or not. Most people do like to unwind or blow off steam in their off times and yet can be all business in times of crisis or 'on the job'. At least in my experience. The trouble with Shepard, at least personally, is the auto dialogue felt like they ripped control of my character away from me. Abigail didn't really care for the Asari or the Council. Abigail was a bad ass paragrade. Abigail survived Torfan, mutinied in ME 1, death, and then the suicide mission. Abigail should not have wept over the Asari, or at the very least for such a pivotal moment for the character BioWare should have given us the ability to actually react to the 'loss' and choose how we behave. Granted they kind of did make up for it with how you can really lay into Liara but the damage has been done. And this is just by far the most obvious but not the only. While Ryder was always within my control. Their auto dialogue never felt like it was infringing on my character, just minor, throw away, random bits of humor. I mean I suppose if you wanted to play Ryder as some entirely humorless curmegeon then you might feel cheated, and I know there are people on this board who feel this way, but you can make Ryder into a professional bad ass, you can give them a sense of humor, you can't with Shepard. I do not think what BioWare did with MEA was the other extreme, but really a happy middle ground. My Ryder wasnted to show more emotion over Alec and his sister. My Ryder wanted to take the kett more seriously. My Ryder wanted to lay into Peebee for hijacking them on her personal mission. Basicallyy Ryder wanted moments to be all-business, and moments to blow off steam. What I got was a rather tepid character who cracked one-liners at questionably appropriate moments. I felt I had way more control over my Inquisitor than I ever did with Shepard or Ryder. Hell, I had more control playing as HAWKE! At least then when he told inappropriate jokes it's because I made him that way. Because Hawke and the Inquisitor are, at least in my experience, probably the two best Role Playing protagonists around. The ones you get the most control over their characters and their character arcs. My Ryder was able to lay into Peebee, I'm unsure why yours wasn't. And my Ryder had moments where he was all business. Again unsure why yours wasn't. And my Ryder took the Kett dead seriously. Other then the one moment where he mocked the one ruler on Eos, but then by the time I got their with Robert he also did similar things to Sloan, and would later on do the same thing to the Krogan Warlord on Eladaan.
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Post by Iakus on Nov 19, 2017 20:45:43 GMT
My Ryder wasnted to show more emotion over Alec and his sister. My Ryder wanted to take the kett more seriously. My Ryder wanted to lay into Peebee for hijacking them on her personal mission. Basicallyy Ryder wanted moments to be all-business, and moments to blow off steam. What I got was a rather tepid character who cracked one-liners at questionably appropriate moments. I felt I had way more control over my Inquisitor than I ever did with Shepard or Ryder. Hell, I had more control playing as HAWKE! At least then when he told inappropriate jokes it's because I made him that way. Because Hawke and the Inquisitor are, at least in my experience, probably the two best Role Playing protagonists around. The ones you get the most control over their characters and their character arcs. My Ryder was able to lay into Peebee, I'm unsure why yours wasn't. And my Ryder had moments where he was all business. Again unsure why yours wasn't. And my Ryder took the Kett dead seriously. Other then the one moment where he mocked the one ruler on Eos, but then by the time I got their with Robert he also did similar things to Sloan, and would later on do the same thing to the Krogan Warlord on Eladaan. My Ryder couldn't be more than mildly disapproving of Peebee "You owe me a new escape pod" simply doesn't cut it. My Ryder was P*SSED at her antics. And My Ryder sounded like the illicit love child of a cheesy action hero and Mal Reynolds. Fine for some playthroughs, but I'd like a little more variety.
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