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Post by goishen on Mar 22, 2018 16:12:17 GMT
They put the lead writer of ME:A as one of the lead writers of Anthem?? Something i wish i never knew tbh I don't know their names, because I don't wanna know their names. If I knew their names, I know that I'd look them up on twitter and hurl insults at them while drunk. So, I'm better off not knowing.
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Always teacher, sometimes writer
Teaching Mode Activated
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Post by linksocarina on Mar 22, 2018 16:15:54 GMT
They put the lead writer of ME:A as one of the lead writers of Anthem?? Something i wish i never knew tbh I don't know their names, because I don't wanna know their names. If I knew their names, I know that I'd look them up on twitter and hurl insults at them while drunk. So, I'm better off not knowing. You need to control your liquor my friend. That can't be healthy.
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Croatsky
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Old BSN veteran, I guess.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Croatsky on Mar 31, 2018 16:19:40 GMT
They put the lead writer of ME:A as one of the lead writers of Anthem?? Something i wish i never knew tbh I don't know their names, because I don't wanna know their names. If I knew their names, I know that I'd look them up on twitter and hurl insults at them while drunk. So, I'm better off not knowing. Geez, calm down. Also ME:A had 3 lead writers. Chris Schlerf who is basically a freelancer as he always changes projects and studios once his work is done. So no surprise he left Andromeda for Destiny 2. Which he also left for before Destiny 2 was even released. Also I can't see anywhere he is replacing Drew, so what gives? Anyway then John Dombrow( co-lead) and Cathleen Rootsaert( lead) took over, both of whom worked on ME3. In fact Cathleen worked since ME2 as dialogue editor and John wrote a bunch of ME comics along with Mac Walters. Basically both of them worked more on ME franchise then Drew did and I dare to say far better job then Drew. #DrewOverrated Also nothing on either of the two replacing Drew either. So what gives?
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Mar 31, 2018 18:37:41 GMT
I don't know their names, because I don't wanna know their names. If I knew their names, I know that I'd look them up on twitter and hurl insults at them while drunk. So, I'm better off not knowing. Geez, calm down. Also ME:A had 3 lead writers. Chris Schlerf who is basically a freelancer as he always changes projects and studios once his work is done. So no surprise he left Andromeda for Destiny 2. Which he also left for before Destiny 2 was even released. Also I can't see anywhere he is replacing Drew, so what gives? Anyway then John Dombrow( co-lead) and Cathleen Rootsaert( lead) took over, both of whom worked on ME3. In fact Cathleen worked since ME2 as dialogue editor and John wrote a bunch of ME comics along with Mac Walters. Basically both of them worked more on ME franchise then Drew did and I dare to say far better job then Drew. #DrewOverrated Also nothing on either of the two replacing Drew either. So what gives? There's a divide here. Some of us think the definition of Mass Effect was made with 2 and 1. Some like all 4 games or at least the trilogy and some think the series came to character specifically with 2 and 3. Dombrow and Cathleen came on around the time Drew left and this was IMO when Mass Effect started slipping out of its strong identity into something increasingly generic. Also i often criticize 3 for it's lamer dialogue. Cathleen and Dombrow started actively writing the main characters in 3 so they contributed to some of the stuff i didn't find great, but they happen to have worked on the best written squadmates. Kaidan and Garrus have great dialogue in ME3 and Jaal also had the best narrative moment in all of MEA; I think Dombrow wrote Captain Dunn (at least after Schlerf left) so there's promise here. Jay Watamaniuk wrote Miranda in ME3 and I think Grunt's mission. Idk about his work. It was on the middling side. I remember in Citadel DLC Miranda had a dialogue that went awkward. It is meant to be flirty but... Miranda: "How do I know YOURE not a clone?" Shepard: "I dunno. You just do." Idk some things i know he was doing felt unimaginative in 3. For Anthem, it doesn't matter. They're defining it all from their new vision, no detail of the past can dictate what is good or bad about what these leads do with Anthem, however on the off chance that Drew was actually a Lead and this is being kept under wraps, it's going to feel inconsistent like ME2 or MEA, both of which suffered from lack of focus in their narrative.
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N6
Just a flip of the coin.
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Post by Sanunes on Mar 31, 2018 20:19:01 GMT
There's a divide here. Some of us think the definition of Mass Effect was made with 2 and 1. Some like all 4 games or at least the trilogy and some think the series came to character specifically with 2 and 3. Dombrow and Cathleen came on around the time Drew left and this was IMO when Mass Effect started slipping out of its strong identity into something increasingly generic. Also i often criticize 3 for it's lamer dialogue. Cathleen and Dombrow started actively writing the main characters in 3 so they contributed to some of the stuff i didn't find great, but they happen to have worked on the best written squadmates. Kaidan and Garrus have great dialogue in ME3 and Jaal also had the best narrative moment in all of MEA; I think Dombrow wrote Captain Dunn (at least after Schlerf left) so there's promise here. Jay Watamaniuk wrote Miranda in ME3 and I think Grunt's mission. Idk about his work. It was on the middling side. I remember in Citadel DLC Miranda had a dialogue that went awkward. It is meant to be flirty but... Miranda: "How do I know YOURE not a clone?" Shepard: "I dunno. You just do." Idk some things i know he was doing felt unimaginative in 3. For Anthem, it doesn't matter. They're defining it all from their new vision, no detail of the past can dictate what is good or bad about what these leads do with Anthem, however on the off chance that Drew was actually a Lead and this is being kept under wraps, it's going to feel inconsistent like ME2 or MEA, both of which suffered from lack of focus in their narrative. I am curious to know why you only hold Drew to be responsible for writing the first game? Just because he was the lead writer doesn't mean he was writing the quality you like. I wish David Gaider kept his blog up, but it sounded like the lead writers write less the other members of the team because they have to communicate with management and the team to make sure that everyone is on track. Now they would have the responsibility of making changes to the dialogue to fit the game and have a more unified voice, but I am not sure that alone means that the lead writer should get all the credit or blame if something is wrong. To me to be close to what Mass Effect 1 for writing style and content you would need that team again and not just one person from it and maybe even reduce the amount of dialogue in the games to what Mass Effect 1 was as well for they keep talking about how much more they are cramming into the game in that regard as well. edit: I forgot that AskAGameDev is normally questioned about BioWare news and found this. AskAGameDev posted this in regards of Drew leaving when asked about it. Source
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Mar 31, 2018 20:42:29 GMT
I mean, you just pointed it out yourself. There was a fundamental tone and spirit that felt kind of consistent throughout ME1 and ME2 and as soon as our lead doppeldinger was gone it started losing focus. Reapers became godzillas, being part of alliance as a pivot for humanity in galactic society became "humans are special, N7 is military ASAP, GET TO COVER, GENERIC DUDEBRO MILIYARY SHOOTER STUFF", Cerberus is everywhere, Illusive Man becomes a stupid onedimensional villain. People go to the next galaxy "to explore" because the lead doppeldinger didn't remember only 1% of the galaxy had been explored.
Slowly but steadily Mass Effect slipped from recognizable into less recognizable. How is it all fault of Drew leaving? Well, maybe it's not but how is it NOT strengthened by his departure? I don't care if you think some things got better when drew left. Maybe you cared mildly about Mass Effect before and now you love it, it caters to you now, sure, but it's not as consistent as it would've been.
I'm not into vikings but i gotta say, I'm looking forward to all 3 Banner Saga titles dropping onto the Nintendo Switch because those have REAL consistency as a trilogy. The art style never changes, only combat systems evolved but it's low budget and not an innovative setting so i lowkey appreciate it while Mass Effect will always remain this one... GIANT missed opportunity in the history of games.
Dang it, it frustrates me to think about sometimes.
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Sanunes
N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Just a flip of the coin.
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Post by Sanunes on Mar 31, 2018 21:49:51 GMT
I mean, you just pointed it out yourself. There was a fundamental tone and spirit that felt kind of consistent throughout ME1 and ME2 and as soon as our lead doppeldinger was gone it started losing focus. Reapers became godzillas, being part of alliance as a pivot for humanity in galactic society became "humans are special, N7 is military ASAP, GET TO COVER, GENERIC DUDEBRO MILIYARY SHOOTER STUFF", Cerberus is everywhere, Illusive Man becomes a stupid onedimensional villain. People go to the next galaxy "to explore" because the lead doppeldinger didn't remember only 1% of the galaxy had been explored. Slowly but steadily Mass Effect slipped from recognizable into less recognizable. How is it all fault of Drew leaving? Well, maybe it's not but how is it NOT strengthened by his departure? I don't care if you think some things got better when drew left. Maybe you cared mildly about Mass Effect before and now you love it, it caters to you now, sure, but it's not as consistent as it would've been. I'm not into vikings but i gotta say, I'm looking forward to all 3 Banner Saga titles dropping onto the Nintendo Switch because those have REAL consistency as a trilogy. The art style never changes, only combat systems evolved but it's low budget and not an innovative setting so i lowkey appreciate it while Mass Effect will always remain this one... GIANT missed opportunity in the history of games. Dang it, it frustrates me to think about sometimes. I don't think if Drew Karpyshyn had stayed at BioWare what disappoints you would have been any different. Writers can change their styles if required and the core direction and tone of the game to me is a decision that would have gone beyond the writers room and more to the people that give the writers the direction they want for the game. So even if Drew had stayed I just don't think you would have gotten the uniformity you desire. The problem I have is that when people talk about Mass Effect 1 and Drew Karpyshyn it comes across as he was solely responsible for what made the story great and to me without that specific team behind him the story could have just as easily be complete garbage.
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Apr 1, 2018 10:35:52 GMT
No, writers can change direction, perhaps style but not their voice. It was the voice of Drew K that was missing for me in ME3. Whenever Anderson spoke, whenever TIM spoke etc.
Dragon Age Inquisition is directorially wildly different from Origins and DA2, yet, I was completely at home in DGaider's voice that is so prevalent in many parts of that game. Nobody writes comedic character dialogue the way he does. Nobody writes diplomatic conversations quite the same way Drew did. I know why i think Drew's absence mattered, c'mon ppl.
I started complaining about ME3 before the ending and not just cuz autodialogue. That very intro of that game felt so extremely downgraded as a piece of writing in contrast to ANYTHING in Mass Effect 1 or 2 maybe save the dumber parts of Suicide Mission, which was okay because so much of Suicide Mission got it right.
I was reading Mass Effect Retribution recently. It's solely written by Drew and it feels like a long lost part of that vibe ME1 had, that was cut. That's all just to confirm I think I recognize Drew's craft and i especially recognize that it has been missing for some time in the actual games.
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