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Post by Deleted on Jul 10, 2017 13:59:47 GMT
Thanks must have missed it. Who knows maybe that's when we are gonna get the next DLC.
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Post by Elfen Lied on Jul 10, 2017 16:38:21 GMT
The same people who have been saying that DLCs are the bane of the industry... but now it's a sin for Bioware to not produce one within a very short time of the game releasing. The "sin", if there ever was one, is always leaving some things unresolved and they have made a habit of that. Why can't they provide a story without any loose end to tie up for once? These days I am playing Fallout NV and I absolutely love the fact that the 4 DLC are stand alone adventures totally detached from any other quest out there. And the same goes for TW3's expansions Hearts of Stone and Blood and Wine. Why can't they do something like that? No, instead they had to leave out the Quarian's Ark, the cure and the assassination plot. When will they understand that by doing that they just risk to leave part of the game unfinished if things go south? Because they like to keep players hooked up? You know what Bioware? if people like your games they will buy your DLC even if they are not part of the story! Stop relying on loose ends already!
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Post by Deleted on Jul 10, 2017 16:51:21 GMT
The same people who have been saying that DLCs are the bane of the industry... but now it's a sin for Bioware to not produce one within a very short time of the game releasing. The "sin", if there ever was one, is always leaving some things unresolved and they have made a habit of that. Why can't they provide a story without any loose end to tie up for once? These days I am playing Fallout NV and I absolutely love the fact that the 4 DLC are stand alone adventures totally detached from any other quest out there. And the same goes for TW3's expansions Hearts of Stone and Blood and Wine. Why can't they do something like that? No, instead they had to leave out the Quarian's Ark, the cure and the assassination plot. When will they understand that by doing that they just risk to leave part of the game unfinished if things go south? Because they like to keep players hooked up? You know what Bioware? if people like your games they will buy your DLC even if they are not part of the story! Stop relying on loose ends already! Who says the loose ends weren't leading up to a planned direct sequel instead of DLC. Maybe no DLC was ever really planned and they decided to double down by planning to go directly into a second game quickly... but the game sales are giving them pause... or the voice actor's strike is preventing them from going into production on that second game. The reality here is that the whole fan base is just pretending to know what's going on. What they need to do is develop just even a little touch of some patience and wait until Bioware is able to tell us their plans... and they should also just stop trying to tell Bioware how to make a video game. Bioware has done a pretty good job in the past... a better job without all this ridiculous level of "fan input" that they've endured since ME3.
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Post by abaris on Jul 10, 2017 16:51:48 GMT
These days I am playing Fallout NV and I absolutely love the fact that the 4 DLC are stand alone adventures totally detached from any other quest out there. And the same goes for TW3's expansions Hearts of Stone and Blood and Wine. Why can't they do something like that? No, instead they had to leave out the Quarian's Ark, the cure and the assassination plot. When will they understand that by doing that they just risk to leave part of the game unfinished if things go south? Because they like to keep players hooked up? Most game companies these days don't make you buy DLCs to get the whole story. With Bethesda games, up to FO4, the DLCs add something new, but they're not needed to tie up lose threads of the main game. Obsidian, since you mentioned FNV, added to Pillars of Eternity, but the DLCs aren't needed for completion. Even with DAI tresspasser only adds Solas' story, but most of the lose ends can be resolved without needing it. The other DLCs aren't really needed to complete the main story.
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Post by warrior on Jul 10, 2017 17:53:21 GMT
I worked as media assistant in a big company. Every single news about this company was carefully read every day and then it was discussed if they should take any action or make corrections / other towards the news. Usually it was the best to remain silent. BioWare/EA's chosen strategy is silence. They aren't taking the steps to a more discussive and open media formula what other companies had took in recent years. I think it is because they have so many different studios with their own agendas. With three (four? + EA's?) it would be ridiculously difficult to control the discussive style. The studios might be very independent and have different working cultures. And the people of internet aren't very forgiving. Internet remembers every misinformation. More info = probably more drama / misunderstanding between the studios. That being said I think EA and Bioware need to start to think a new strategy for their PR teams. This isn't working, they cannot get any lower and the mistrust is in there already. In this point, the silence is not making them look steady as my old company. Now the silence is a signal of worry. LOL, "aren't very forgiving"--understatement of the century. I agree that this silence on DLC isn't working -- from here, it feels like they are making MEA fans worry that their game is dead, making general Mass Effect series fans worry that their favorite franchise is dead, and letting the game fall out of consumer memory fast; the news about DLC/ME's future from Kotaku and elsewhere has already caused people to move on and deinstall the game. HZD and BOTW have already confirmed DLC last month. I feel like they just need to get on with it already. Their continued silence after the articles makes me think the info was good and no DLC is coming. If the series is really "on ice" they need to tell people that soon, because the silence after all this bad news makes bad vibes between BW and its fans (ME fans, anyway, which maybe they don't care about keeping...).
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Post by Elfen Lied on Jul 10, 2017 23:20:24 GMT
I would be happy if they had planned them for a sequel, but the narration imho suggested otherwise. Maybe I am wrong but I had the impression that they were matters that were going to be solved in the short term. The long-terms element for future games are the Ketts and the continuation of the colonization. But who knows. They could also scrap everything and put all those elements in a sequel like they already did for DA. Still, I would find a little strange to begin the second game with the Quarian Arc still lost. I think they should be already in Andromeda when MEA2 starts.
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Post by alanc9 on Jul 11, 2017 0:22:42 GMT
The same people who have been saying that DLCs are the bane of the industry... but now it's a sin for Bioware to not produce one within a very short time of the game releasing. The "sin", if there ever was one, is always leaving some things unresolved and they have made a habit of that. Why can't they provide a story without any loose end to tie up for once? These days I am playing Fallout NV and I absolutely love the fact that the 4 DLC are stand alone adventures totally detached from any other quest out there. And the same goes for TW3's expansions Hearts of Stone and Blood and Wine. Why can't they do something like that? No, instead they had to leave out the Quarian's Ark, the cure and the assassination plot. When will they understand that by doing that they just risk to leave part of the game unfinished if things go south? Because they like to keep players hooked up? You know what Bioware? if people like your games they will buy your DLC even if they are not part of the story! Stop relying on loose ends already! I don't see an actual problem here. Can you elaborate? if there's no DLC but there is a sequel, then either the fate of the Quarian ark will be backstory for the sequel, or it'll be a plot point in the sequel. Either way works.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 11, 2017 0:31:03 GMT
Why should they tell us anything? And the Anthem thing is like the Destiny thing, that was likely a vague generality or the intention to turn it into another franchise. I highly doubt Anthem itself will get ten years of support. Because you're paying customers that actually have the right to know about the future of said product you paid money for. Just a guess. Nope. You don't have a right to know jack about anything. It's their product. They sell it to you. You buy it. They are only obliged to make sure product works as intended. Everything else is up to their discretion with the exception of letting stockholder know how each quarter has done. In reality, (yes, let us function in reality rather than a fictional state of false entitlement) the shareholders are the only ones that they really owe anything to so that said shareholders can make informed decisions on whether to keep or sell EA stock. Even their consumers are not entitled to know what products they are working on or when those products will be released. Consumers are entitled to knowing what is being done to improve said products if they were in a subpar or nonfunctional state.
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Post by Elfen Lied on Jul 11, 2017 10:40:04 GMT
I don't see an actual problem here. Can you elaborate? if there's no DLC but there is a sequel, then either the fate of the Quarian ark will be backstory for the sequel, or it'll be a plot point in the sequel. Either way works. I agree with you, but only IF there is a sequel (as you said). And so far there isn't any evidence of it. And my problem is that I've always hated unfinished stories. And this does not apply only to videogames.
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Post by Jeremiah12LGeek on Jul 11, 2017 13:46:54 GMT
Not commenting on ME being on hiatus. It technically isn't on hiatus. Support hasn't stopped. Not commenting on MEA's 3 year troubled development. That's normal, and doing so would hardly fall under the category of "marketing." If you're referring to transparency, that would only apply to the shareholders when it comes to troubled development. Transparency from a gamer's point of view refers to be being properly informed about what you're buying. Not commenting on the disappearing negative GlassDoor reviews. The reviews were taken down to minimize public awareness of the issues. It would be very foolish of them to talk about it, as it is a violation of the terms they agreed to when forming limited partnerships with other sites. Can say that Anthem which isn't released yet will get 10 year support, but they can't say anything about DLC on 4 month old game with only 1 year support. I haven't seen any information that confirms either the ten or 1-year support assertions you made, but if somebody is planning on making a multiplayer-only shooter, and they aren't prepared to commit to a long support cycle, they won't put a dent in a saturated market containing similar games that have been running and popular for close to ten years. There's also the not denouncing Manveer Heir's racist comments, and just leaving it at "he's not working on BW anymore". That's not unusual. BW's policy of not criticizing pundits and representatives of certain political movements has at times stretched to ridiculousness, but they either tacitly support them, or fear to condemn them for financial reasons. It's mostly up to you to decide which (it is probably a mix of both.) Edit: Oh, there's 8 pages already. My points have undoubtedly been covered already by now, but I'm too lazy to read through it all. Whoops.
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Post by darkway1 on Jul 11, 2017 14:24:30 GMT
Your not addressing the point being made. Then you have to give me more words to understand the point you're trying to make, instead of just saying it's unacceptable. I was simply answering a question about the direction I see Bioware going with regard to communication on their products. They are not different from other gaming companies in that regard. Because it's cut content and they didn't have time to include it so they teased it because they were planning a DLC. That's one interpretation. Bioware is under no obligation to respond. That's also an interpretation. Yes, they actually are going through a normal patching process. Andromeda patch notes They are also polishing the game, but every developer does that too. This is true of every game. Ignorance implies that they have no knowledge of what they're doing. They do. They can't talk future plans for all the reasons Mark Darrah mentioned in his Twitter feed: linkNot liking their response, or lack of one, is different from not understanding their response. Your response is a good example of how people "normalize" the gaming industries inept behaviour. 1/ If I cut content from a game,I would not draw people's attention to the fact.....why on earth would anyone end a game using "cliff hanger"content that you purposely removed from the game.???? 2/The only reason Bioware would indicate the existence of "cut" content is because...... A/Bioware intends to release it as DLC.....or....B/Bioware thought it would be cool (it's not).......or....C/Bioware haven't got a clue what they are doing. 3/Bioware is under no obligation to respond to anything......correct.....the latest Resident Evil game ends with a blatant advert for free DLC,which fans are still waiting for..........so Capcom acknowledged the delay,released a video stating the DLC they produced was not good enough,so they scrapped it and started again "sorry for the delay,were on it"........that's bad news but great PR and great transparency........Bioware's PR on the other hand is....shit.......no one knows anything about anything. 4/Andromeda's patch process is not normal,no normal process includes overhauls of scenes......Andromeda isn't finish,it's subject to change,so any Andromeda DLC would be put on hold.......bug fixing/patching is not the same as bug fixing,patching and retooling/finishing the game.......it's a very different context. 5/Mark Darrah cleverly lists a bunch of reasons why Bioware (or any company) can't respond.......they are nothing but examples......again,Bioware avoids transparency via an answer that isn't really answering anything. At the end of the day,people are supporting and defending poor business/PR practices,surrounding a game that has steered the Mass Effect franchise into the rocks,to the point where we speculate over,ever seeing another Mass Effect game.People are quick to forget the waves of staff leaving Bioware,the closure of their forums in the guise of better communication,the lead writer who came from Halo (and then left),the sales pitch of recapturing the same vibe as Mass Effect 1 (it's nothing like ME1) and I'm not even going to touch what Kotaku reported regarding Andromed's development..........sorry but none of this is deemed normal in my book. I don't have issue with the reality of Bioware's business/creative processes.......it's none of my business.......but I don't like the lies,the PR bullshit,the Bio-drone blinkered way of seeing thing's,it just hinders real debate and understanding. So here we all are,I speculate,you disagree and speculate with a response,some one else counters the point with more speculation and on and on..............so yeah,to keep the thread on point,Bioware and transparency would be very constructive.
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Post by alanc9 on Jul 11, 2017 14:53:54 GMT
I don't see an actual problem here. Can you elaborate? if there's no DLC but there is a sequel, then either the fate of the Quarian ark will be backstory for the sequel, or it'll be a plot point in the sequel. Either way works. I agree with you, but only IF there is a sequel (as you said). And so far there isn't any evidence of it. And my problem is that I've always hated unfinished stories. And this does not apply only to videogames. *shrugs* And what if there isn't? At some point the MEU will go on without us. Stuff's gonna happen without us playing it. Again, I'm not really seeing a problem.
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Post by alanc9 on Jul 11, 2017 15:03:05 GMT
1/ If I cut content from a game,I would not draw people's attention to the fact.....why on earth would anyone end a game using "cliff hanger"content that you purposely removed from the game.???? Wait a minute.... what cut content are we talking about here? I don't think the Quarian ark was cut out any more than Omega was cut from ME3. They put a hook for future content in rather than take existing content out. Such things have happened before. Javik and Shale were both cut from their games before returning as DLC. But I like that Bio was honest about Shale. (I don't know if they would have been honest about Javik, but the leak rendered that moot.) I thought you wanted transparency too.
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Post by Monica21 on Jul 11, 2017 15:14:49 GMT
Your response is a good example of how people "normalize" the gaming industries inept behaviour. We're not talking about social policy here; we're talking about a billion dollar business. Or any business, really. The only guarantee you have is the product you purchase works as intended. Full stop. Okay, really. You're using ellipses when periods are intended, and you used a period, and an exclamation point to end a sentence. That bothers me. That said, the reason you'd end a game on such a note is because it's cut content. Is this multiple choice? Because the answer is A. That fact that you don't know anything appears to be problematic for you. I don't really care. I said that game is getting patched as normal, in addition to being polished. The two are not mutually exclusive. You didn't read the patch notes, did you? Mark Darrah is communicating something that he doesn't have to communicate about why an industry can't or won't answer your questions. If you believe his statements are invalid, then we'll have to agree to disagree. Some things are not opinion though. All speculation based on an article with no sources who were currently on the team. You do realize that "it's none of my business" and "Bioware has a shoddy PR model because they don't tell me everything" are not in sync, right? I have no interest in countering your claims with speculation.
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Post by Monica21 on Jul 11, 2017 15:15:43 GMT
1/ If I cut content from a game,I would not draw people's attention to the fact.....why on earth would anyone end a game using "cliff hanger"content that you purposely removed from the game.???? Wait a minute.... what cut content are we talking about here? I don't think the Quarian ark was cut out any more than Omega was cut from ME3. They put a hook for future content in rather than take existing content out. Such things have happened before. Javik and Shale were both cut from their games before returning as DLC. But I like that Bio was honest about Shale. (I don't know if they would have been honest about Javik, but the leak rendered that moot.) I thought you wanted transparency too. He's responding to me saying that the Quarian Ark is likely cut content.
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Post by outlaw1109 on Jul 11, 2017 15:31:40 GMT
...just so everyone is aware...Bioware doesn't have any shareholders.
EA does.
Bioware is basically a division of EA. Not their own company. They did retain their own branding, but, again, EA calls the shots.
So, all of this speculation about how Bioware behaves is null. They are not an individual entity. So, while you criticize "Bioware's" PR model, or how they react or fail to react to certain scenarios, you fail to realize that it is EA's policies that direct these things.
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Post by Elfen Lied on Jul 11, 2017 16:06:36 GMT
I agree with you, but only IF there is a sequel (as you said). And so far there isn't any evidence of it. And my problem is that I've always hated unfinished stories. And this does not apply only to videogames. *shrugs* And what if there isn't? At some point the MEU will go on without us. Stuff's gonna happen without us playing it. Again, I'm not really seeing a problem. Yes indeed I know that in Middle Earth life goes on and stuff continues to happen. But I would not have been happy if I couldn't know what happened to the people at Mordor's gate after Frodo destroyed the Ring. Besides, I am not using the right example because Tolkien went too far with his closure, letting us know a lot of unnecessary stuff that I hated. Closure =/= I want to know whatever happens later til the death of every single character. But asking for a plot to close its loose ends, well that's another matter, and I don't see it as a greedy request.
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Post by darkway1 on Jul 11, 2017 17:11:08 GMT
Your response is a good example of how people "normalize" the gaming industries inept behaviour. We're not talking about social policy here; we're talking about a billion dollar business. Or any business, really. The only guarantee you have is the product you purchase works as intended. Full stop. Okay, really. You're using ellipses when periods are intended, and you used a period, and an exclamation point to end a sentence. That bothers me. That said, the reason you'd end a game on such a note is because it's cut content. Is this multiple choice? Because the answer is A. That fact that you don't know anything appears to be problematic for you. I don't really care. I said that game is getting patched as normal, in addition to being polished. The two are not mutually exclusive. You didn't read the patch notes, did you? Mark Darrah is communicating something that he doesn't have to communicate about why an industry can't or won't answer your questions. If you believe his statements are invalid, then we'll have to agree to disagree. Some things are not opinion though. All speculation based on an article with no sources who were currently on the team. You do realize that "it's none of my business" and "Bioware has a shoddy PR model because they don't tell me everything" are not in sync, right? I have no interest in countering your claims with speculation. The response is what I expected.....your normalizing substandard PR (public relations) and business practices......the game is not up to scratch,it wasn't the mega hit everyone hoped for,the game reviews all acknowledge problems,the community acknowledge problems,fans show concern over the future of the franchise and yet Bioware won't acknowledge any of it simply because they don't have to.......oh....but they have a new book you can buy,new multiplayer stuff and they will be at some convention to promote stuff........but the game,the issue's,the future......nah...no comment. Oh and what about that staged Anthem xboxoneX game play footage that's not representational of xboxone or ps4 or PC as it runs on a machine that's not even out yet,the footage then gets posted on the PS4 network with photo shopped playstation buttons over the xbox one's........yeah,stella PR Bioware,way to build trust with the public...LOL.
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Post by darkway1 on Jul 11, 2017 17:34:51 GMT
...just so everyone is aware...Bioware doesn't have any shareholders. EA does. Bioware is basically a division of EA. Not their own company. They did retain their own branding, but, again, EA calls the shots. So, all of this speculation about how Bioware behaves is null. They are not an individual entity. So, while you criticize "Bioware's" PR model, or how they react or fail to react to certain scenarios, you fail to realize that it is EA's policies that direct these things. Yes,this is why I show concern because EA is pretty much the embodiment of poor PR.
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Post by outlaw1109 on Jul 11, 2017 19:12:11 GMT
...just so everyone is aware...Bioware doesn't have any shareholders. EA does. Bioware is basically a division of EA. Not their own company. They did retain their own branding, but, again, EA calls the shots. So, all of this speculation about how Bioware behaves is null. They are not an individual entity. So, while you criticize "Bioware's" PR model, or how they react or fail to react to certain scenarios, you fail to realize that it is EA's policies that direct these things. Yes,this is why I show concern because EA is pretty much the embodiment of poor PR. Ah, but it's this exact reason I'm not concerned in the least. A) I don't really care if DLC is released or if a sequel is planned. 2) Curiously, however, EA has this reputation for being "money hungry" and many of their worst titles received DLC. Sequels are another thing, but DLC is pretty common among EA's crappy games. That's not optimism. I don't really care for Andromeda, so DLC is not really on my radar. It's just my observation.
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Post by alanc9 on Jul 11, 2017 21:51:44 GMT
Wait a minute.... what cut content are we talking about here? I don't think the Quarian ark was cut out any more than Omega was cut from ME3. They put a hook for future content in rather than take existing content out. Such things have happened before. Javik and Shale were both cut from their games before returning as DLC. But I like that Bio was honest about Shale. (I don't know if they would have been honest about Javik, but the leak rendered that moot.) I thought you wanted transparency too. He's responding to me saying that the Quarian Ark is likely cut content. Ah, got it. Is there evidence of that? What I've seen makes the Quarian ark look like content that was always going to be DLC, same as Omega or LotSB.
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Post by alanc9 on Jul 11, 2017 21:57:14 GMT
*shrugs* And what if there isn't? At some point the MEU will go on without us. Stuff's gonna happen without us playing it. Again, I'm not really seeing a problem. Yes indeed I know that in Middle Earth life goes on and stuff continues to happen. But I would not have been happy if I couldn't know what happened to the people at Mordor's gate after Frodo destroyed the Ring. Besides, I am not using the right example because Tolkien went too far with his closure, letting us know a lot of unnecessary stuff that I hated. Closure =/= I want to know whatever happens later til the death of every single character. But asking for a plot to close its loose ends, well that's another matter, and I don't see it as a greedy request. This doesn't seem to have much to do with ME, though. You could maybe make it stick for DA; if DAI had failed hard, neither DAI proper nor Trespasser would have been great end points. Might hold true for DA2 as well.
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Post by Monica21 on Jul 11, 2017 23:26:02 GMT
He's responding to me saying that the Quarian Ark is likely cut content. Ah, got it. Is there evidence of that? What I've seen makes the Quarian ark look like content that was always going to be DLC, same as Omega or LotSB. I don't have any direct evidence; I was just going off of the urgency of the person who tells you about it, how the message is already in the base game, and the blog post the developer wrote a few years ago that's basically "this is why DLCs are a thing" and it's mostly because of cut content. So yeah, really just an assumption on my part.
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Post by jaegerbane on Jul 12, 2017 11:17:48 GMT
Ah, got it. Is there evidence of that? What I've seen makes the Quarian ark look like content that was always going to be DLC, same as Omega or LotSB. I don't have any direct evidence; I was just going off of the urgency of the person who tells you about it, how the message is already in the base game, and the blog post the developer wrote a few years ago that's basically "this is why DLCs are a thing" and it's mostly because of cut content. So yeah, really just an assumption on my part. 'Cut content' is almost never delivered as paid DLC. Hooks are used for delivering planned paid DLC, and sometimes stuff that doesn't work is disabled and reactivated either for free (Shale) or expanded out into significant expansions (Overlord's Hammerhead sections following on from Firewalker) but it's extremely rare for stuff to be simply hacked out and re-enabled for a fee.
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Post by Monica21 on Jul 12, 2017 11:24:17 GMT
I don't have any direct evidence; I was just going off of the urgency of the person who tells you about it, how the message is already in the base game, and the blog post the developer wrote a few years ago that's basically "this is why DLCs are a thing" and it's mostly because of cut content. So yeah, really just an assumption on my part. 'Cut content' is almost never delivered as paid DLC. Hooks are used for delivering planned paid DLC, and sometimes stuff that doesn't work is disabled and reactivated either for free (Shale) or expanded out into significant expansions (Overlord's Hammerhead sections following on from Firewalker) but it's extremely rare for stuff to be simply hacked out and re-enabled for a fee. Javik was cut content. I can't find the article right now, but that's why From Ashes is a day one DLC.
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