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Post by abaris on Jul 30, 2017 9:20:18 GMT
To be honest, if I were gay, I would be offended by how hard Jill gets pushed over the course of that relationship. That's why I always said, Gil's just a checklist of stereotypes. Gay, check. Female best friend, check. Wanting baby, check. Getting baby with female best friend, check. Maybe I'm harsher in my judgment than any gay man would be, but first I ran into this story, it left me asking myself if a homophobe had written that character.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2017 12:47:26 GMT
The content in the game is intended for all players, and compared to the other characters with gender gated romances (Cassandra, Sera and Blackwall), Dorian's was positioned later in the game, and was more misleading in terms of the potential for success with the gated gender. What's so "god forbid" about making gay romances on the equal footing in their presentation with the straight ones? It's not particularly fun to flirt, then find out it's not going to work, then reroll. From how late Dorian came in the game, how important he is in the plot, and how great of a char he was, it would have been better if his relationship was open to both genders, and one of the earlier males companions were gender gated. Initially, they did the same with Jaal, but luckily, thy amended it, opening the romance with a plot-important, appealing character who joins late in the game to both genders. Yeah, all players, including gay ones. We had to wait 14 years (since BG2 and the first romances) to get a romanceable gay companion in a BW game. It's particularly great that we got to romance a story relevant character. That is on equal footing with the straight romances. Your insinuation that homosexuality should be reserved for less awesome and less plot relevant characters is just insulting. We've been ignored for a long time, it's time we also get some characters others can be envious of. Again, Dorian should have turned down the flirting, that was their mistake. Making him bi would not have been better. I've heard the same about Sam in ME3, and I'd really like straight people to stop trying to take away the very little gay representation we have in games. Well, I would overall prefer the game romances constructed in such a way that nobody has to feel slighted, I.e. All romances being opened to all player avatars. O do not like inequality on principle, no matter who it applies to. There should absolutely be no artificial gates for a male character being able to romance a male npc with a romance, or for a female one to romance a female, and neither there should be for male-female relationships. The game is a blueprint for a user-created story, so each player can if desired restrict the sexualiy of the character if they wish, or just think about their pc as their soulmate, no matter which genders are involved. As well, I do not believe that every player must only create a character that reminds them in RL, or create their main based on the romantic Gates published before the game, but just enjoy the story, including being able to have a romantic arc that suits them after they met them in the game.
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Post by abaris on Jul 30, 2017 13:43:19 GMT
Well, I would overall prefer the game romances constructed in such a way that nobody has to feel slighted, I.e. All romances being opened to all player avatars. That might sound PC but I think it would take away from the characters and their narrative. Obviously some members of the LGBT community still feel to be left out or to be fed leftovers. The answer to that isn't to make everyone bi as you seem to insinuate but to develop gay characters that are appealing to the community.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by mannyray on Jul 30, 2017 15:35:36 GMT
I actually like how they had flirt options like that rather than just very suave and overtly sexual ones. Agreed. I found it cute enough that I considered the idea of playing Sara (and I never play female) just for this romance. I see sweet where others see "cringe-worthy". Okay so Ryder is Suvi's commanding officer. It's bad enough that she's blatantly hitting on Suvi, who she just barely met. On top of that the whole first dialogue between them makes this look like National Lampoon's Mass Effect and it shows a 20-something woman acting like a young tween girl fawning over someone she likes. It's unprofessional within the context of the game and I think we all know if this was a straight romance between a male Ryder and Suvi, there would be some backlash over the way the Pathfinder not only acts 12 years old, but also how he shamelessly was hitting on one of his subordinates. Any of the clumsy "preciously awkward" behavior in their first conversation might have fun way later in the game after both characters had formed a friendship and slowly realized there was something more. I just get the feeling that being glad that an alternative sexual lifestyle is represented gets some to overlook how poorly done it is. If you don't think so look at the rest of the characterizations in the game, romantic and otherwise. They're just as bad.
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Post by Lorn on Jul 30, 2017 16:00:40 GMT
What I want to know is, why the fuck a bunch of straight men came in to comment on an article written by a gay man about how having gay characters makes him feel, and how realistic their portrayals are.Why the fuck do you even care? It has nothing to do with you. Do you also have opinions about the effectiveness of various tampons? Did you just assume my sexuality?!
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Post by Rouccoco on Jul 30, 2017 16:43:27 GMT
Yeah, all players, including gay ones. We had to wait 14 years (since BG2 and the first romances) to get a romanceable gay companion in a BW game. It's particularly great that we got to romance a story relevant character. That is on equal footing with the straight romances. Your insinuation that homosexuality should be reserved for less awesome and less plot relevant characters is just insulting. We've been ignored for a long time, it's time we also get some characters others can be envious of. Again, Dorian should have turned down the flirting, that was their mistake. Making him bi would not have been better. I've heard the same about Sam in ME3, and I'd really like straight people to stop trying to take away the very little gay representation we have in games. Well, I would overall prefer the game romances constructed in such a way that nobody has to feel slighted, I.e. All romances being opened to all player avatars. O do not like inequality on principle, no matter who it applies to. There should absolutely be no artificial gates for a male character being able to romance a male npc with a romance, or for a female one to romance a female, and neither there should be for male-female relationships. The game is a blueprint for a user-created story, so each player can if desired restrict the sexualiy of the character if they wish, or just think about their pc as their soulmate, no matter which genders are involved. As well, I do not believe that every player must only create a character that reminds them in RL, or create their main based on the romantic Gates published before the game, but just enjoy the story, including being able to have a romantic arc that suits them after they met them in the game. You feel slighted by having only 4 romance options instead of 5? No one seemed to care that gay gamers got nothing or scraps for so long, but as soon as we get our own romances somehow it's unfair. If you don't have to play you in games, can't you roll a male protagonist to romance Dorian? Can't we have even one male gay companion without people acting like it's somehow unfair? Why is having homosexual (and bisexual) characters be part of the story without erasing their sexuality or letting players decide, who they are, such a big deal.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2017 17:06:37 GMT
As a general point: Straight people can express their opinions here too BioWare games are roleplaying games and straight people can roleplay as a gay or lesbian character very easily, the choices are for all BUT If there are people here to just troll and/or cause arguments/problems, please dont. You arent accomplishing anything, and if your entire reason for being here is to disrupt conversations, make fun of people and cause hostilities, please just leave. It takes no effort on your part to leave people alone, it takes more to actually type these posts. Who knows, you might save yourself from being reported for trolling in the process PS: Actually playing through the romances in question might benefit the outcome conversation before you start posting
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2017 17:34:31 GMT
Pricefield forever!
When I was playing I just had to record, then turn it into a gif, then my avatar... because reasons
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Post by OdanUrr on Jul 30, 2017 17:39:18 GMT
Pricefield forever!
When I was playing I just had to record, then turn it into a gif, then my avatar... because reasons
All I know is that was one decision where I didn't feel the need to rewind (it's quite funny if you do though).
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2017 17:46:20 GMT
Pricefield forever!
When I was playing I just had to record, then turn it into a gif, then my avatar... because reasons
All I know is that was one decision where I didn't feel the need to rewind (it's quite funny if you do though).
Just to kiss again???
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Post by OdanUrr on Jul 30, 2017 17:48:02 GMT
All I know is that was one decision where I didn't feel the need to rewind (it's quite funny if you do though).
Just to kiss again???
How did I not think of that before?
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Post by dmc1001 on Jul 30, 2017 17:49:56 GMT
Agreed. I found it cute enough that I considered the idea of playing Sara (and I never play female) just for this romance. I see sweet where others see "cringe-worthy". Okay so Ryder is Suvi's commanding officer. It's bad enough that she's blatantly hitting on Suvi, who she just barely met. On top of that the whole first dialogue between them makes this look like National Lampoon's Mass Effect and it shows a 20-something woman acting like a young tween girl fawning over someone she likes. It's unprofessional within the context of the game and I think we all know if this was a straight romance between a male Ryder and Suvi, there would be some backlash over the way the Pathfinder not only acts 12 years old, but also how he shamelessly was hitting on one of his subordinates. Any of the clumsy "preciously awkward" behavior in their first conversation might have fun way later in the game after both characters had formed a friendship and slowly realized there was something more. I just get the feeling that being glad that an alternative sexual lifestyle is represented gets some to overlook how poorly done it is. If you don't think so look at the rest of the characterizations in the game, romantic and otherwise. They're just as bad. I don't know. Shepard had no problem with sleeping with crew members. Why should I expect Ryder to be different?
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jul 30, 2017 18:01:16 GMT
Okay so Ryder is Suvi's commanding officer. It's bad enough that she's blatantly hitting on Suvi, who she just barely met. On top of that the whole first dialogue between them makes this look like National Lampoon's Mass Effect and it shows a 20-something woman acting like a young tween girl fawning over someone she likes. It's unprofessional within the context of the game and I think we all know if this was a straight romance between a male Ryder and Suvi, there would be some backlash over the way the Pathfinder not only acts 12 years old, but also how he shamelessly was hitting on one of his subordinates. Any of the clumsy "preciously awkward" behavior in their first conversation might have fun way later in the game after both characters had formed a friendship and slowly realized there was something more. I just get the feeling that being glad that an alternative sexual lifestyle is represented gets some to overlook how poorly done it is. If you don't think so look at the rest of the characterizations in the game, romantic and otherwise. They're just as bad. I don't know. Shepard had no problem with sleeping with crew members. Why should I expect Ryder to be different? Plus the Andromeda Initiative is a civilian organization, not a military one, so fraternization isn't discouraged. In fact if anything the Initiative encourages it.
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Post by dmc1001 on Jul 30, 2017 18:14:24 GMT
I don't know. Shepard had no problem with sleeping with crew members. Why should I expect Ryder to be different? Plus the Andromeda Initiative is a civilian organization, not a military one, so fraternization isn't discouraged. In fact if anything it is encouraged since people need to repopulate. I think the OP cited "professionalism" in the sense of "you're my direct boss so it might not be a good idea". This is often discouraged in regular, non-military jobs. I'm just saying that it's really not something to be concerned about in a BioWare game because fraternization/non-professionalism has always been cast aside. So if that's a point of contention the OP should just give up on romances entirely in BioWare games. Fine if the romance isn't liked, but that particular issue doesn't work well.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jul 30, 2017 18:20:28 GMT
Plus the Andromeda Initiative is a civilian organization, not a military one, so fraternization isn't discouraged. In fact if anything it is encouraged since people need to repopulate. I think the OP cited "professionalism" in the sense of "you're my direct boss so it might not be a good idea". This is often discouraged in regular, non-military jobs. I'm just saying that it's really not something to be concerned about in a BioWare game because fraternization/non-professionalism has always been cast aside. So if that's a point of contention the OP should just give up on romances entirely in BioWare games. Fine if the romance isn't liked, but that particular issue doesn't work well. Ah, okay. I thought they were referring to rules against fraternization like in militaries. But as I said the Initiative seems to actually encourage it due to the nature of their mission. Well, not entirely. Ignoring the subordinates, the romance options are: ME1: Sha'ira ME2: none ME3: Diana Allers MEA: Avel Kjar, Keri T'Vessa, Reyes Vidal Yeah, not nearly as many to choose from and those don't have nearly the content of subordinate romances. That said while I don't have problems with squad and crew romances, it would be interesting to see more off-ship romances with equal content to on-ship romances.
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N3
Played Anthem finally. So... yeah.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda
XBL Gamertag: Drycake3000
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Played Anthem finally. So... yeah.
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Post by mannyray on Jul 30, 2017 20:38:42 GMT
Okay so Ryder is Suvi's commanding officer. It's bad enough that she's blatantly hitting on Suvi, who she just barely met. On top of that the whole first dialogue between them makes this look like National Lampoon's Mass Effect and it shows a 20-something woman acting like a young tween girl fawning over someone she likes. It's unprofessional within the context of the game and I think we all know if this was a straight romance between a male Ryder and Suvi, there would be some backlash over the way the Pathfinder not only acts 12 years old, but also how he shamelessly was hitting on one of his subordinates. Any of the clumsy "preciously awkward" behavior in their first conversation might have fun way later in the game after both characters had formed a friendship and slowly realized there was something more. I just get the feeling that being glad that an alternative sexual lifestyle is represented gets some to overlook how poorly done it is. If you don't think so look at the rest of the characterizations in the game, romantic and otherwise. They're just as bad. I don't know. Shepard had no problem with sleeping with crew members. Why should I expect Ryder to be different? You're missing the point. It's not that Ryder has liasons with the crew. It's how the whole thing was set up in the dialogue. Have you played it? Seriously, I wonder if it was written by anyone who has even kissed another person romantically ever.
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Post by Arcian on Jul 30, 2017 21:07:53 GMT
I fucking hated that they explained Krem, and did it in one of the most hamfisted ways possible. Would have been much better to just not bring it up and let players put two and two together from meeting a male character voiced by Jennifer Hale. Nowhere near as hamfisted as "So what brings you to Andromeda" "I'm trans, let me deadname myself" Holy shit, I had totally forgotten about that. Yeah, that was way worse than Krem's scene.
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Post by Salty Drell on Jul 30, 2017 21:58:11 GMT
Nowhere near as hamfisted as "So what brings you to Andromeda" "I'm trans, let me deadname myself" Holy shit, I had totally forgotten about that. Yeah, that was way worse than Krem's scene. They promised they would fix that, I don't know if they have. Does anyone know if they did?
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Post by shechinah on Jul 30, 2017 22:03:01 GMT
They promised they would fix that, I don't know if they have. Does anyone know if they did? It was in one of the patches' notes, I believe, yes.
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Post by Salty Drell on Jul 30, 2017 22:29:37 GMT
They promised they would fix that, I don't know if they have. Does anyone know if they did? It was in one of the patches' notes, I believe, yes. I would've took a look in my most recent playthrough, but my mind was completely fixated on romancing Jaal with Scott lol.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2017 2:29:13 GMT
Holy shit, I had totally forgotten about that. Yeah, that was way worse than Krem's scene. They promised they would fix that, I don't know if they have. Does anyone know if they did? They left the line the same, but they made it where you only get it if you do her quest, and help her get her fiance out of stasis both. So you've earned the privilege to get to know her better I guess. It's still kind of an out of the blue thing to tell Ryder though, but better then the original train wreck.
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dmc1001
N7
Biotic Booty
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: ferroboy
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Post by dmc1001 on Jul 31, 2017 2:30:09 GMT
That said while I don't have problems with squad and crew romances, it would be interesting to see more off-ship romances with equal content to on-ship romances. I would give my right arm to have a fully fleshed out romance with Reyes.
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Origin: ferroboy
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Post by dmc1001 on Jul 31, 2017 2:32:37 GMT
I don't know. Shepard had no problem with sleeping with crew members. Why should I expect Ryder to be different? You're missing the point. It's not that Ryder has liasons with the crew. It's how the whole thing was set up in the dialogue. Have you played it? Seriously, I wonder if it was written by anyone who has even kissed another person romantically ever. I didn't play the Sara/Suvi romance, no, but did have Scott romance the following: Gil, Reyes, Keri, Peebee and Avela. Also flirted with Liam. Haven't played since 1.07. Holding out for dlc, or an upgrade to the Reyes romance (perhaps all at the same time...).
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The path up and down are one and the same.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition, Dragon Age The Veilguard
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Post by kino on Jul 31, 2017 2:33:22 GMT
That said while I don't have problems with squad and crew romances, it would be interesting to see more off-ship romances with equal content to on-ship romances. I would give my right arm to have a fully fleshed out romance with Reyes. Yeah, I felt the same way about the Avela romance. It was great that they're romance options, but there's just not enough substance to them.
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