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Post by txgoldrush on Aug 7, 2017 17:56:53 GMT
Andromeda easily.
Why?
Because unlike DAI, the story and characters are woven into the exploration and gameplay well. Every quest story has connection to another, and characters matter in the grand story of the game.
DAI is a mess when it comes to this. The exploration and the storytelling feel separate, like 2 different games. And most of the cast doesn't matter in the plot.
The Witcher 3 crushes them both however.
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Post by Kabraxal on Aug 7, 2017 19:23:27 GMT
For a discussion on Andromeda and Inquisition, why is another game entirely brought up?
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Post by griffith82 on Aug 7, 2017 19:30:45 GMT
For a discussion on Andromeda and Inquisition, why is another game entirely brought up? I've yet to see a topic where TW3 isn't forced into somehow.
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Post by Kabraxal on Aug 7, 2017 19:33:19 GMT
For a discussion on Andromeda and Inquisition, why is another game entirely brought up? I've yet to see a topic where TW3 isn't forced into somehow. It's annoying. Especially for those of is that find TW3 inferior to the games that were brought up as the focal point of the topic.
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Post by jaegerbane on Aug 7, 2017 19:42:29 GMT
For a discussion on Andromeda and Inquisition, why is another game entirely brought up? Because reasons.
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Post by AnDromedary on Aug 7, 2017 20:02:16 GMT
While I liked it overall, I had many issues with Andromeda. Nevertheless, I thought it was way better than DA:I. On the one hand, I just like the direct combat much more than the "order" system of the DA games, they pull me out of the experience and in DA:I combat was especially tedious. Also, while ME:A still have plenty of filler content, it was improved and the pacing of the game was a bit better. Part of this is the Nomad, which added a bit of variety to the gameplay over all. Sure, DA:I had the mounts but frankly, I thought those were completely useless. Also, ME:A had the better integration of gameplay with the protagonists role. In DA:I, those were kind of at odds. The big Inquisitor, leader of one of the most powerful organizations in Thedas shouldn't do the things you are doing 80% of your time (basically everything except the main story quests and the war table stuff). On the other hand, the Pathfinder should be out there, exploring, finding stuff, it's the job description. Sounds silly but this made me feel much better even about the more repetitive parts of the gameplay. On the main story front, I think the two games are more or less on par. I couldn't give a definite advantage to either one. IMO, DA:I is a bit stronger on the main characters while ME:A is a bit stronger on the side of the antagonists. Both are not super great on the story front IMO but they are decent. In terms of the more intricate (non filler) side quests, I like how ME:A has these integrated chains of side quests (that link into the planet viability). E.g. Voeld, with it's quest chain of freeing the resistance guys to assaulting the Kett base to liberating the dig site and finding the AI, that was nicely done. DA:I's side quests seem to be either very isolated and confined or they are rather unspectacular, so ME:A overall wins that one, too. I may also be biased because I always like SciFi a little more over fantasy and ME a little more than DA but still, I'd say ME:A was an improvement over DA:I in quite a few areas. EDIT: After reading the last page I want to add that Witcher 3 is better than both.
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Post by tacsear on Aug 7, 2017 20:28:24 GMT
Of course DAI was the GOTY in 2014 and is a really good game. I wouldn't even compare it to mea. I would compare it with DA2 since they both had troubled development cycles but still DA2 is also vastly superior to mea
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Post by Iakus on Aug 7, 2017 20:34:59 GMT
DAI is a MUCH better game. Both are TERRIBLE open world games, but DAI had great character writing and a very cool subplot reveal and Bioware's best (?) secret villain. And very fun crafting, good score, much better character design, CC and so on. The only good thing about MEA is the combat and environment textures. DAI's combat is the worst aspect of the game and the most boring slog of all Bioware games I've played. That said I still prefer ME3's combat. The sound design was so much better and I hate the weird auto-cover MEA introduced. DAI is a GOOD game but I wish Bioware ditched open world. They suck at it and the whole thing does their narrative no favors, nor replayability. I prefer DA2 over DAI, I think. I prefer any previous Bioware game over MEA, greatly so. MEA is a 6/10 at best judged by itself. (Would probably give it a 2/10 for a Mass Effect game based on the enjoyable combat). I'd give DAI an 8/10 or something compared to DAO, DA2 and the trilogy. Eh, neither game is terrible. They both certainly had their flaws. Though I find MEA's flaws to be deeper. I've gotten three playthroughs of DAI, at least.
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Post by geralt on Aug 7, 2017 20:39:08 GMT
It’s a fair question to ask, by and large I don’t think there is a huge gap between the two games, but the context behind them both play a big part in how they got received. DAI came out after a bit of a misstep in DAII, which wasn’t a bad game but most of the flaws are obvious. They fixed the issue of lack of scale and landscape diversity absolutely emphatically, they brought back the right characters from the previous two games (for the most part) to continue/finish their stories, they responded to calls to scrap plans on the human only MC, and gave a decent variance of race and background stories. They transition over to a completely new game engine which would in principal help in upping both the scale and graphical quality of their game.
The last two points in particular I think bought Bioware some goodwill ahead of time from most of the masses. I certainly cut them a break on some of the flaws within the game on the basis of using the new engine, and the trouble they had adapting it for an RPG during development. Again the flaws of DAI are pretty obvious to see, and they would have to be fixed for the next major release under the engine, which turned out to be MEA.
Now you need to consider the context MEA is coming out from. Regardless of your own personal thoughts of the ME3 ending, it’s a matter of great controversy and the next Mass Effect game to follow that would be under the microscope more than it usually would as a result of that. They had 5 years to develop the title, they had the experience of the engine the DAI team had to draw upon to help overcome some of issues, and they had a free pass to do pretty much anything they wanted narratively.
Despite all that, it would seem based on the reports we’ve seen that development of MEA was allowed to spiral on either rudderless or gambling on busted flushes (the procedural planet system). While they do eventually churn out something, a decision gets taken at some level to release the game in a clearly unpolished state, either arrogantly or ignorantly thinking they can sort it all out later and it’ll still sell good anyway with no harm done.
Even forgetting all that, there isn’t a lot MEA built upon what DAI introduced, a lot of the side quests involve a lot of faffing about, including long tedious travelling (with those unskippable cutscenes) and the matters as equally unbefitting for someone of the Pathfinder’s standing, though not as bad as some of the tasks in DAI. Still contained the horrid mapping and waypoint systems, interfaces for storage/crafting/upgrading still pretty rubbish, especially if you want to do more than one item at a time. Still the need for having to pick up materials as you navigate the planet maps, and the collection quests, which still left an MMO-light feeling to it. What MEA did improve upon was combat, which I quite enjoyed for the most part, most of the visuals were better despite the obvious flaws to some of course, slightly improved travel with the NOMAD which didn’t sacrifice party banter, the improved roaming about your squadmates do on the ship/nexus and the good amount more dialogue that was put in. Sure I didn’t like some of it, particularly the lack of difference in Ryder’s material, DAII seemed to handle that method of MC speaking better than MEA did.
So yeah, put side by side I’d rate these technically the same, but outside of that I’d give DAI a couple of points ahead of MEA. DAI was doing nearly all the venturing into new ground for the next gen material, and managed for the most part to pull it off successfully, albeit with plenty of points for improvement that MEA didn’t really take up on. If that was down to how the development cycle went down in the end, that certainly explains the reason, but cannot ever excuse it. We all at the end of the day shell out the same amount of money to buy it regardless, hopefully we won’t see a release like this from an EA title under Bioware again, and that a few DLC packs/patches can help mitigate some of the issues mentioned.
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Post by themikefest on Aug 7, 2017 20:49:49 GMT
The Herald, after dealing with Corypheus, ends up walking in snow, dealing with cold temperatures, and high winds blowing snow in his/her face, but with the rookie, he/she can die within a very brief time even with the help of a voice in the head thing and wearing armor that covers her/his whole body. The Herald is one tough individual
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LogicGunn
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I'll relinquish one bullet. Where do you want it?
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: LogicGunn
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Post by LogicGunn on Aug 7, 2017 20:55:46 GMT
It’s a fair question to ask, by and large I don’t think there is a huge gap between the two games, but the context behind them both play a big part in how they got received. DAI came out after a bit of a misstep in DAII, which wasn’t a bad game but most of the flaws are obvious. They fixed the issue of lack of scale and landscape diversity absolutely emphatically, they brought back the right characters from the previous two games (for the most part) to continue/finish their stories, they responded to calls to scrap plans on the human only MC, and gave a decent variance of race and background stories. They transition over to a completely new game engine which would in principal help in upping both the scale and graphical quality of their game. The last two points in particular I think bought Bioware some goodwill ahead of time from most of the masses. I certainly cut them a break on some of the flaws within the game on the basis of using the new engine, and the trouble they had adapting it for an RPG during development. Again the flaws of DAI are pretty obvious to see, and they would have to be fixed for the next major release under the engine, which turned out to be MEA. Now you need to consider the context MEA is coming out from. Regardless of your own personal thoughts of the ME3 ending, it’s a matter of great controversy and the next Mass Effect game to follow that would be under the microscope more than it usually would as a result of that. They had 5 years to develop the title, they had the experience of the engine the DAI team had to draw upon to help overcome some of issues, and they had a free pass to do pretty much anything they wanted narratively. Despite all that, it would seem based on the reports we’ve seen that development of MEA was allowed to spiral on either rudderless or gambling on busted flushes (the procedural planet system). While they do eventually churn out something, a decision gets taken at some level to release the game in a clearly unpolished state, either arrogantly or ignorantly thinking they can sort it all out later and it’ll still sell good anyway with no harm done. Even forgetting all that, there isn’t a lot MEA built upon what DAI introduced, a lot of the side quests involve a lot of faffing about, including long tedious travelling (with those unskippable cutscenes) and the matters as equally unbefitting for someone of the Pathfinder’s standing, though not as bad as some of the tasks in DAI. Still contained the horrid mapping and waypoint systems, interfaces for storage/crafting/upgrading still pretty rubbish, especially if you want to do more than one item at a time. Still the need for having to pick up materials as you navigate the planet maps, and the collection quests, which still left an MMO-light feeling to it. What MEA did improve upon was combat, which I quite enjoyed for the most part, most of the visuals were better despite the obvious flaws to some of course, slightly improved travel with the NOMAD which didn’t sacrifice party banter, the improved roaming about your squadmates do on the ship/nexus and the good amount more dialogue that was put in. Sure I didn’t like some of it, particularly the lack of difference in Ryder’s material, DAII seemed to handle that method of MC speaking better than MEA did. So yeah, put side by side I’d rate these technically the same, but outside of that I’d give DAI a couple of points ahead of MEA. DAI was doing nearly all the venturing into new ground for the next gen material, and managed for the most part to pull it off successfully, albeit with plenty of points for improvement that MEA didn’t really take up on. If that was down to how the development cycle went down in the end, that certainly explains the reason, but cannot ever excuse it. We all at the end of the day shell out the same amount of money to buy it regardless, hopefully we won’t see a release like this from an EA title under Bioware again, and that a few DLC packs/patches can help mitigate some of the issues mentioned. Faffing. If there is one word to sum up MEA it's faff. It took what I thought was fairly an enjoyable aspect of DAI (exploration) and made it more faffy instead of more integral.
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Post by txgoldrush on Aug 7, 2017 21:01:26 GMT
For a discussion on Andromeda and Inquisition, why is another game entirely brought up? I've yet to see a topic where TW3 isn't forced into somehow. Because TW3 not only raised the bar in the genre, but beat Bioware at its own game.
It deserves to be mentioned, simply put because it is vastly superior than both games. Hell, after the release of TW3, DAI's reception got a lot more negative and for good reason.
Bioware is simply stuck with last gen formula with last gen design.
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Post by txgoldrush on Aug 7, 2017 21:03:38 GMT
I've yet to see a topic where TW3 isn't forced into somehow. It's annoying. Especially for those of is that find TW3 inferior to the games that were brought up as the focal point of the topic. But at the end of the day, TW3 is FAR better received than those games. You cannot deny this.
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Post by griffith82 on Aug 7, 2017 21:40:40 GMT
It's annoying. Especially for those of is that find TW3 inferior to the games that were brought up as the focal point of the topic. But at the end of the day, TW3 is FAR better received than those games. You cannot deny this. Look I like TW3 but you simply cannot compare it to these. Very different types of games.
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Post by txgoldrush on Aug 7, 2017 21:47:01 GMT
But at the end of the day, TW3 is FAR better received than those games. You cannot deny this. Look I like TW3 but you simply cannot compare it to these. Very different types of games. Yes you can. Outside of the protagonist being fixed, both are comparable.
TW3 simply put, does a lot better than DAI or MEA.
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Post by ShadowAngel on Aug 7, 2017 21:50:39 GMT
But at the end of the day, TW3 is FAR better received than those games. You cannot deny this. Look I like TW3 but you simply cannot compare it to these. Very different types of games. I really wouldn't go that far to say they can't be compared, especially when bioware even invites the comparison to CDR to begin with. Both are RPG studios, one simply puts more emphasis on creating your own character, the other has a set character, there's the primary difference between the two. Both have extensive dialogue and choices, they both feature an open world approach, they even share quest setups the same way. People wouldn't compare them if they weren't so comparable to begin with. It's hard not to when both developers take inspiration from each other when making their games.
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Post by alanc9 on Aug 7, 2017 22:06:23 GMT
Faffing. If there is one word to sum up MEA it's faff. It took what I thought was fairly an enjoyable aspect of DAI (exploration) and made it more faffy instead of more integral. Faff is a word?
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Post by alanc9 on Aug 7, 2017 22:07:38 GMT
I've yet to see a topic where TW3 isn't forced into somehow. Because TW3 not only raised the bar in the genre, but beat Bioware at its own game.
It deserves to be mentioned, simply put because it is vastly superior than both games. Hell, after the release of TW3, DAI's reception got a lot more negative and for good reason.
Bioware is simply stuck with last gen formula with last gen design.
I'm not sure open-world is Bio's game.
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I'll relinquish one bullet. Where do you want it?
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: LogicGunn
PSN: LogicGunn
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Post by LogicGunn on Aug 7, 2017 22:08:13 GMT
Faffing. If there is one word to sum up MEA it's faff. It took what I thought was fairly an enjoyable aspect of DAI (exploration) and made it more faffy instead of more integral. Faff is a word? Heck yes it's a word. It means "ineffectual activity". As in "trying to change your steam password is a faff cause there are 5 steps of confirmation".
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Post by alanc9 on Aug 7, 2017 22:11:25 GMT
I'll take your word for it. Is it an acronym or some such?
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Post by Kabraxal on Aug 7, 2017 22:13:07 GMT
It's annoying. Especially for those of is that find TW3 inferior to the games that were brought up as the focal point of the topic. But at the end of the day, TW3 is FAR better received than those games. You cannot deny this. Reception does not equally quality. TW3 was mediocre in comparison to any Bioware title for what I wanted in a game.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Aug 7, 2017 22:13:15 GMT
I've yet to see a topic where TW3 isn't forced into somehow. Because TW3 not only raised the bar in the genre, but beat Bioware at its own game.
It deserves to be mentioned, simply put because it is vastly superior than both games. Hell, after the release of TW3, DAI's reception got a lot more negative and for good reason.
Bioware is simply stuck with last gen formula with last gen design.
No it doesn't. This is a comparison between two games. Just two games. No other game should be involved since that defeats the purpose of the discussion.
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N3
I'll relinquish one bullet. Where do you want it?
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: LogicGunn
PSN: LogicGunn
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Post by LogicGunn on Aug 7, 2017 22:15:19 GMT
Bioware and Projekt Red aren't trying to emulate each other. They're both just trying to make good RPG games. I think that's where any meaningful comparison ends. Constantly bringing up TW3 is starting to get really boring. Some people like it, some hate it, but it no longer brings anything new or interesting to the conversation. Talk about flogging a dead horse. This one is fully decomposed.
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N3
I'll relinquish one bullet. Where do you want it?
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: LogicGunn
PSN: LogicGunn
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Post by LogicGunn on Aug 7, 2017 22:15:51 GMT
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Post by txgoldrush on Aug 7, 2017 22:16:15 GMT
Faffing. If there is one word to sum up MEA it's faff. It took what I thought was fairly an enjoyable aspect of DAI (exploration) and made it more faffy instead of more integral. Faff is a word? The world- narrative design of MEA is far superior than DAI.
Once again, DAI's narrative is overall very disconnected. Instead of the quest design integrated into the overall narrative, like MEA does, it feels random instead. And DAI's quests follow no theme as well. This is DAI's fatal flaw, and a flaw that causes other flaws.
MEA's problem is with the technical aspects, and the parts of the sum. DAI's problem is with the sum of its parts. And that's why MEA is overall better. Its where the flaws lie, in MEA, its the parts, in DAI its the sum.
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