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Post by alanc9 on Oct 21, 2017 6:15:04 GMT
BiOWARE tried to make a statement with Dragon Age franchise to make it about a setting rather than about a To Be Continued sprawling saga, but it went down badly. I am more inclined to fault them for not being bold enough to set different stories separated by whatever centuries in DA... Don't we have TES for that?
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Post by sil on Oct 21, 2017 8:53:30 GMT
It's the only way to Deception.
The tantalus core freighter... was that before or after Anderson and Sanders dress up like a 70's pimp and his bottom bitch?
I'm pretty certain that it was in the opening chapter. I did pick it up and read the "cereal killer" scene after learning of it on the BSN. I feel mildly guilty in that my copy of "Deception" got traded in with a bunch of worthwhile books. Allowing it to reenter circulation was a crime against Mass Effect and literature. A tantalus core... I should read that book, it's been awhile since I've been really outraged about something.
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Post by SirSourpuss on Oct 21, 2017 9:51:54 GMT
General consensus, reviews, sales and EA seem to disagree with you, though. Can you find it in your heart to re-examine your view? Alternatively, what did make Andromeda a great game for you? There is no necessity in reexamining his experience. He liked it. It wouldn't matter if people like him made up only 1% of those who played it. He liked it. That's all that should matter to him.
It's like saying to someone who does not like chocolate that they need to reexamine their taste receptors. You like what you like.
Well, man, sometimes I like something too, when other people tell me that it's bad. Sometimes I do it out of stubborness, others out of spite and sometimes because I am right. And even if I am right, I will get that little seed of foubt in my head that I might be wrong. So what do I do? I re-examine my veiws, this time more impartially, more objectively. If I'm right, then I'm right and if I'm wrong, then I'm wrong and I have a chance to better myself. In the case of a video game I liked, does it cancel out the fact that I had a good time, even if the game is bad? Hell no! But I also realise that what worked for me won't necessarily work for other people and if I recommend it to someone else, I should probably take into account the flaws of the game. I should not hold my taste as a pinnacle of quality and if I want Bioware to sell games, I should want them to make better games, not worse, because eventually the deterioration of quality in their games will lead them to making games I don't like or, as in Jade's case with Andromeda, incomplete games that she will have to look for closure in "associated media" for a game she possibly paid $60. I am very happy for Jade that she had a fun experience and through our conversation I understand why she liked it, why she will continue to like it and why she was right. I was not asking her to change her mind, I was asking if she could, now that the proverbial dust has settled, re-evaluate the game, taking into account the legitimate complaints about it. For example, I am currently going through Piranha Bytes' ELEX and I do realise that it is a bad game. I would argue that it is critically at Andromeda levels of bad, but I do enjoy it. I do not blame the internet for how badly received it is and I do not blame players for bashing it. I do, however, expect a lot less in terms of quality from a studio that has 30 people working on their game, like Piranha Bytes and even Spiders, that sell their games on release for $30, when Bioware sells me a game for $60 and tells me to further the legend through DLC, or look for answers in "associated media". I do have some disagreements with Jade, I have quite a few, actually and I am really saddened by what she has to go through for liking something. I can respect that she disagrees with me, though and I hope I replied to her with the respect she deserves. As respectfully I hope I am replying to you.
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Post by SirSourpuss on Oct 21, 2017 10:09:19 GMT
BiOWARE tried to make a statement with Dragon Age franchise to make it about a setting rather than about a To Be Continued sprawling saga, but it went down badly. I am more inclined to fault them for not being bold enough to set different stories separated by whatever centuries in DA... Don't we have TES for that? TES is not the only game to do that. FarCry, Final Fantasy (for the most part), Assassin's Creed (again, for the most part), Unreal, Quake, GTA, Alien, etc. It is also very emotionally draining. I can understand the writers wanting to do something new every time, maybe they are just bored of the characters they wrote or do not connect with them anymore due to a change in their mental/emotional state. But it is also draining for me to be asked to relate with different people all the time, fictional or real and it is difficult to re-establish such a connection every time. It's why Bruce Wayne is still the batman after, I don't know, 50-60 years? Why we still have Superman comic books, etc. It's a testament more to human condition, I think, rather than people's ability or inability to just move on.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 21, 2017 13:20:00 GMT
BiOWARE tried to make a statement with Dragon Age franchise to make it about a setting rather than about a To Be Continued sprawling saga, but it went down badly. I am more inclined to fault them for not being bold enough to set different stories separated by whatever centuries in DA... Don't we have TES for that? I would not know, but good for them I still wish DA did that though. DA1 to DA2 transition was better than DA2-DA3, imo, but overall, I would have wanted the Kirkwall story to take place 300 to 400 years later, it would have made far more sense. The refugees did not have to run from the Blight, or it could have been the next Blight, etc.
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The Twilight God
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate
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Post by The Twilight God on Oct 21, 2017 13:51:42 GMT
There is no necessity in reexamining his experience. He liked it. It wouldn't matter if people like him made up only 1% of those who played it. He liked it. That's all that should matter to him.
It's like saying to someone who does not like chocolate that they need to reexamine their taste receptors. You like what you like.
Well, man, sometimes I like something too, when other people tell me that it's bad. Sometimes I do it out of stubborness, others out of spite and sometimes because I am right. And even if I am right, I will get that little seed of foubt in my head that I might be wrong. So what do I do? I re-examine my veiws, this time more impartially, more objectively. If I'm right, then I'm right and if I'm wrong, then I'm wrong and I have a chance to better myself... OK, let me stop it there.
"Better yourself"? It's just a stupid video game. And there is no objectivity when it comes to rather or not it's enjoyable. Suicide Squad is an objectively bad movie. There are definite scripting issues that can be objectively pointed out, but that doesn't mean someone can't enjoy it. At the end of the day you're not a better person because you thought very deeply and meditated on rather some stupid movie was actually enjoyable or not.
I understand you basically state this in your reply. However, I'd say when it comes to what I would recommend to the general audiences the only criteria I have to encourage or discourage is my own opinion. If the dialog, story, bugs, reused skins asari, animations, etc. did not detract from the game for a person I can't see how you could expect them to discourage anyone else from trying it. People will make the decision they are going to make. I personally decided not the buy it. I might very well have enjoyed it. But I took the objective information and made a decision not to bother. That and I will never invest in another Bioware game again. And it seems I was right. The clowns at Bioware are building up a reputation for giving story telling blueballs or bruised balls. Now even SWTOR (an MMO) is become a complete mess of reckless writing with writers who apparently have no clue that people have emotions, build emotional attachments to characters and how the brain does not distinguish between reality and fiction when it comes to bestowing those feelings.
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troopertethras
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by troopertethras on Oct 22, 2017 6:39:24 GMT
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Post by voltangclan on Oct 22, 2017 10:01:13 GMT
Speaking as a man who never played Andromeda, I sincerely hope the Quarians are all dead. We don't need those pests to muck-about for handouts in another galaxy now. Hear hear. Those clanless are nothing but trouble. I say send them all to work at a factory that packs nutrient paste. Just be sure to equip them with suits with no pockets. Thieves. All of them.
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michaelm
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
XBL Gamertag: ArchMikem
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Post by michaelm on Oct 22, 2017 10:45:58 GMT
Lol, that childhood crush comparison is creepy AF. You're very welcome.
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Post by SirSourpuss on Oct 22, 2017 11:26:07 GMT
"Better yourself"? It's just a stupid video game I am generalising. For example, I might like Hitler (not literally). I know Hitler is bad, but I very much like what he did for Germany at the time and its people. Someone argues with me that Hitler was the man that threw the entire world into a war that claimed millions of lives, commited unspeakable war crimes, tortured and executed people. Now, being stubborn and close minded, I will disregard that and continue thinking that Hitler is actually a pretty nice guy. A few days later, I re-examine that someone's arguments and realise that he is actually pretty goddamn right and Hitler is actually Satan. Through that process, I have broadened my mind, allowing myself to view things from a scope that isn't necessarily my own. So next time, when someone presents me with such an argument I can be more receiving to his views, try to tone down my own stubborness and that is something that I will have to be aware constantly and struggle with it actively, whenever I argue with someone again. In that way, I am bettering myself. I think this is a pretty common trait in humans, as we are often reluctant to embrace new ideas and views that change the way we see things politically, socially, economically and even scientifically. If I am mistaken in this, I don't think Galileo stating the Earth is round would cause such backlash from the Church. And there is no objectivity when it comes to rather or not it's enjoyable. Sure.I'm not asking her to hate the game. I am asking her if she can re-review it. I could go into, I hate to return to it as an example, ELEX and say "yeah, man, it's a fantastic game. Open world, great characters, so immersive, all that lore and the gameplay! It even has jetpacks! 10/10". And it would be true to me. For me it hits all the right spots. As a game, as an experience for someone else, who is not into these type of games, does it still hold up? No. The graphics are outdated, the writing is superfluous and poor, the lore is uninteresting and stitched, the controls are "janky", as it has been scrutinized before, but the level design is actually pretty good and Piranha Bytes is very good at placing interesting things throughout the map and making you want to explore those landmarks. It is a mediocre game, that I'd give it a 5/10 objectively and I still love it, whereas I'd give Andromeda a similar 5/10, but the difference is that Andromeda failed to capture me. I understand you basically state this in your reply. However, I'd say when it comes to what I would recommend to the general audiences the only criteria I have to encourage or discourage is my own opinion. If the dialog, story, bugs, reused skins asari, animations, etc. did not detract from the game for a person I can't see how you could expect them to discourage anyone else from trying it Anyone who wants to play Andromeda regardless, either because of studio/brand loyalty, Bioware experience, love for all things sci-fi etc. can and should do so. Like I said, though, should I be talking to recommend, again sorry for the example, ELEX, I cannot fot the heart of me say "it's a great game, fuck the haters", because that's simply not true and the game isn't really all that good, regardless of my enjoyment of it. The clowns at Bioware are building up a reputation for giving story telling blueballs or bruised balls. Now even SWTOR (an MMO) is become a complete mess of reckless writing with writers who apparently have no clue that people have emotions, build emotional attachments to characters and how the brain does not distinguish between reality and fiction when it comes to bestowing those feelings. I am 100% with you on that one. Personal opinion, of course, I am sure Jade would disagree with the both of us.
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Post by sil on Oct 22, 2017 11:49:31 GMT
Maybe we should discuss the quarian ark, instead of personal attacks, off-topic arguments and other crap?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 22, 2017 12:44:22 GMT
Don't we have TES for that? TES is not the only game to do that. FarCry, Final Fantasy (for the most part), Assassin's Creed (again, for the most part), Unreal, Quake, GTA, Alien, etc. It is also very emotionally draining. I can understand the writers wanting to do something new every time, maybe they are just bored of the characters they wrote or do not connect with them anymore due to a change in their mental/emotional state. But it is also draining for me to be asked to relate with different people all the time, fictional or real and it is difficult to re-establish such a connection every time. It's why Bruce Wayne is still the batman after, I don't know, 50-60 years? Why we still have Superman comic books, etc. It's a testament more to human condition, I think, rather than people's ability or inability to just move on. Oh, yes, AC is an example I am familiar with, and it is an absolutely ingenious set-up to build a franchise. If only we had the customizable main that copied over to the Assassin, and dialogue choices, it would have been without peers for me. The way it is realized, it is meh, but still fun, and the switch in the settings with every new game, and a new Sin every time is the best part of it. If a game with choices in an intriguing setting did that, or another game that offered the protagonist a time machine missions, wow, would have been soooo awesome.
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