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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Nov 16, 2017 20:54:14 GMT
E3 maybe we'll see some new news... I would guess E3 2020 might have new news for another ME game Probably. 2018 will be all about Anthem and 2019 will be all about Dragon Age 4. Though I wouldn't be surprised if there are tweets teasing about another Mass Effect game long before it is officially announced, like they do with all their games. |
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Post by SofaJockey on Nov 16, 2017 20:58:19 GMT
Well, maybe this one won't go nuclear. *crosses fingers, toes, arms and legs* Well, despite differing views, we're all friends here, aren't we?   I wouldn't be surprised if there are tweets teasing about another Mass Effect game long before it is officially announced, like they do with all their games. To be honest, they teased MEA far too early. If they go back to Mass Effect I hope they share it only when it's mostly done. |
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Post by river82 on Nov 16, 2017 21:00:03 GMT
EA is aiming to make Anthem into a franchise. If Anthem does well there may not be an ME continuation in the near future, unfortunately. In their quote, Blake Jorgensen mentioned turning Anthem into a franchise "just like Battlefront" but looking at the reception Battlefront got ... that's probably not wise  |
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Post by Sylvius the Mad on Nov 16, 2017 21:06:17 GMT
It is my humble belief that Bioware are lazy. This is an insane and unfounded position. |
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Iakus
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Post by Iakus on Nov 16, 2017 21:21:00 GMT
It is my humble belief that Bioware are lazy. This is an insane and unfounded position. Indeed. They are not lazy. What they are is suffering an identity crisis. They want to be Skyrim They want to be The Witcher They want to be Halo. They want to be No Man's Sky (as originally envisioned) But in chasing all these ideals, they have forgotten how to be Bioware. Once they were leaders, now they are followers, trying to find a popular trend to monetize. |
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Post by rahavan on Nov 16, 2017 22:01:17 GMT
Okay I have to single you out here because that is legit the dumb shit I've ever seen. Why in the world would EA want ANY of their games to fail. Please tell me how a human being can reach that conclusion. EA didn't do shit wrong when it came to MEA besides not be vigilant enough during development. Almost everything you're saying EA did wrong is what they did right. You dont let your employees that made a bad product continue to do so. Oh good grief...... If you're going to insult someone at least use proper grammar. How is this comment the dumbEST shit you've ever seen? There where clearly mistakes with Andromeda that needed to be addressed, but abandoning the whole team was asinine. EA is clearly putting all its eggs into one basket "Anthem". If that game fails, it will be a long time if ever before we see DA4 or another Mass Effect game. Bioware might even be on the chopping block at that point. Given the luke warm reception to Destiny 2, it wouldn't surprise me if Anthem flops. Sorry for the improper grammar had just woken up and didn't reread what I wrote. As long as the point can be understood a typo isn't a huge deal. On to the point EA gains NOTHING by sabotaging their developers. They also didn't "abandon" the whole team they ripped apart the studio and shuffled people into other projects. Honestly fairly deserved since the lowly members at the studio were not the issue but rather the upper and middle management. Honestly EA isn't making many great decisions right now but putting MEA to the side and focusing on anthem wasn't one of them. Yeah sure MEA could have had DLC but its likely EA didn't think that was going to net them enough money to justify going that route. EA made the right moves as a company with MEA. They don't care about our feelings only cold hard cash. That's why it blows my mind when someone says EA intentionally hurt a game they had invested money into. Just doesn't make any sense. |
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Sanunes
N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Sanunes on Nov 16, 2017 22:47:42 GMT
It's a discussion forum, so love/hate topics will continue to appear. In any case, until Anthem and whatever Dragon Age is next, there's not a heap of new stuff to discuss. E3 maybe we'll see some new news... Well, maybe this one won't go nuclear. *crosses fingers, toes, arms and legs* As far as I see in thread that contains BioWare or any of their games skips nuclear and just goes straight into post-nuclear nuclear. |
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Post by cmoe on Nov 16, 2017 22:55:05 GMT
It's a discussion forum, so love/hate topics will continue to appear. In any case, until Anthem and whatever Dragon Age is next, there's not a heap of new stuff to discuss. E3 maybe we'll see some new news... Well, maybe this one won't go nuclear. *crosses fingers, toes, arms and legs* I don't think this will be enough. We need a shaman, 3 goats, a rooster, drum and a rattle.  |
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Post by SofaJockey on Nov 16, 2017 23:11:11 GMT
I don't think this will be enough. We need a shaman, 3 goats, a rooster, drum and a rattle.  We could have dancing, dancing is nice...   |
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Post by colfoley on Nov 16, 2017 23:11:45 GMT
This is an insane and unfounded position. Indeed. They are not lazy. What they are is suffering an identity crisis. They want to be Skyrim They want to be The Witcher They want to be Halo. They want to be No Man's Sky (as originally envisioned) But in chasing all these ideals, they have forgotten how to be Bioware. Once they were leaders, now they are followers, trying to find a popular trend to monetize. I prefer to think of it as they try to find something that works, take it, put their bioware spin on it and then combine with what they do best. Its one of the strengths of the company that they are willing to experiment and change rather then putting out the same product with a slightly different coat of paint. |
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Post by slimgrin727 on Nov 16, 2017 23:19:52 GMT
I think they've lost some valuable talent as well. Look at how some elements have tanked compared to earlier games: quest design, cinematics, character design ( good in Inquisition, fucking abysmal in Andromeda) writing, animation, overall pacing - which was excellent in DA:O, ME1, ME2 and decent in ME3.
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linksocarina
N5
Always teacher, sometimes writer
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
PSN: LinksOcarina
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Post by linksocarina on Nov 16, 2017 23:25:38 GMT
This is an insane and unfounded position. Indeed. They are not lazy. What they are is suffering an identity crisis. They want to be Skyrim They want to be The Witcher They want to be Halo. They want to be No Man's Sky (as originally envisioned) But in chasing all these ideals, they have forgotten how to be Bioware. Once they were leaders, now they are followers, trying to find a popular trend to monetize. Well they tried being BioWare and that hasn't worked for a while. |
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Post by river82 on Nov 16, 2017 23:32:05 GMT
Well they tried being BioWare and that hasn't worked for a while. Really? |
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N5
Always teacher, sometimes writer
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
PSN: LinksOcarina
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Post by linksocarina on Nov 16, 2017 23:34:40 GMT
Well they tried being BioWare and that hasn't worked for a while. Really? Andromeda is a very "BioWare" game in its final form. Warts and all. Inquisition is also very similar to that BioWare style design, and people hated a lot of the aspects that marked it such. We can also argue a lot of the design found in Mass Effect and Dragon Age II is very BioWare-styled. The "chasing of trends" sort of charge is not really an identity issue of the studio in that way, they are clearly BioWare games. I think the problem is the lack of innovation overall from BioWare since Mass Effect is the bigger problem. The rest is mostly PR speak that people take at face value for some reason. BioWare is never going to be exactly like Skyrim for example, the design of Inquisition is proof enough of that. |
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Iakus
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Post by Iakus on Nov 16, 2017 23:35:10 GMT
Indeed. They are not lazy. What they are is suffering an identity crisis. They want to be Skyrim They want to be The Witcher They want to be Halo. They want to be No Man's Sky (as originally envisioned) But in chasing all these ideals, they have forgotten how to be Bioware. Once they were leaders, now they are followers, trying to find a popular trend to monetize. Well they tried being BioWare and that hasn't worked for a while. Lately they've tried to be Skyrim and Deus Ex. |
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Post by Guts on Nov 16, 2017 23:40:59 GMT
*Looks at the title of the thread*
EDIT: I couldn't resist
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Post by river82 on Nov 16, 2017 23:53:49 GMT
Andromeda is a very "BioWare" game in its final form. Warts and all. Inquisition is also very similar to that BioWare style design, and people hated a lot of the aspects that marked it such. We can also argue a lot of the design found in Mass Effect and Dragon Age II is very BioWare-styled. The "chasing of trends" sort of charge is not really an identity issue of the studio in that way, they are clearly BioWare games. I think the problem is the lack of innovation overall from BioWare since Mass Effect is the bigger problem. The rest is mostly PR speak that people take at face value for some reason. BioWare is never going to be exactly like Skyrim for example, the design of Inquisition is proof enough of that. Andromeda wanted to be No Man's Sky. A hundred procedurally generated planets has never been what Bioware was about. It was only after Mac came in to give the thing direction that it became more like a Bioware game, but by then it was too late. Saying Bioware type games haven't worked for a while by pointing to Andromeda, a game made by a studio that had never before released an actual game, a game riddled with problems both content wise and technically which were a result from a botched development, a game that was envisioned to be exploring a procedurally generated Universe ... it's a little disingenuous. Inquisition was based off Skyrim and was a direct result of the critique they received from DA:2. Coming up to release there were numerous reports about Inquisition "taking on Skyrim." Dragon Age 2 felt like Fable and was a radical departure from Origins (which was quintessential Bioware.) Dragon Age 2 also featured a character driven story rather than a plot driven story, which was not only a radical departure from what they were about but brings up role playing problems often hidden in plot driven stories. It completely got rid of strategic combat (which was a Bioware thing until then.) Mass Effect DID represent what Bioware were about last decade and was pretty well received. |
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linksocarina
N5
Always teacher, sometimes writer
Teaching Mode Activated
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
PSN: LinksOcarina
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Post by linksocarina on Nov 17, 2017 0:24:58 GMT
Andromeda is a very "BioWare" game in its final form. Warts and all. Inquisition is also very similar to that BioWare style design, and people hated a lot of the aspects that marked it such. We can also argue a lot of the design found in Mass Effect and Dragon Age II is very BioWare-styled. The "chasing of trends" sort of charge is not really an identity issue of the studio in that way, they are clearly BioWare games. I think the problem is the lack of innovation overall from BioWare since Mass Effect is the bigger problem. The rest is mostly PR speak that people take at face value for some reason. BioWare is never going to be exactly like Skyrim for example, the design of Inquisition is proof enough of that. Andromeda wanted to be No Man's Sky. A hundred procedurally generated planets has never been what Bioware was about. It was only after Mac came in to give the thing direction that it became more like a Bioware game, but by then it was too late. Saying Bioware type games haven't worked for a while by pointing to Andromeda, a game made by a studio that had never before released an actual game, a game riddled with problems both content wise and technically which were a result from a botched development, a game that was envisioned to be exploring a procedurally generated Universe ... it's a little disingenuous. Inquisition was based off Skyrim and was a direct result of the critique they received from DA:2. Coming up to release there were numerous reports about Inquisition "taking on Skyrim." Dragon Age 2 felt like Fable and was a radical departure from Origins (which was quintessential Bioware.) Dragon Age 2 also featured a character driven story rather than a plot driven story, which was not only a radical departure from what they were about but brings up role playing problems often hidden in plot driven stories. It completely got rid of strategic combat (which was a Bioware thing until then.) Mass Effect DID represent what Bioware were about last decade and was pretty well received. I don't care what it wanted to be when it comes to Andromeda. I care about what it ultimately is. As I said, a lot of that is ultimately PR speak to compare it to the trends of the day. |
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Post by colfoley on Nov 17, 2017 1:10:53 GMT
Andromeda is a very "BioWare" game in its final form. Warts and all. Inquisition is also very similar to that BioWare style design, and people hated a lot of the aspects that marked it such. We can also argue a lot of the design found in Mass Effect and Dragon Age II is very BioWare-styled. The "chasing of trends" sort of charge is not really an identity issue of the studio in that way, they are clearly BioWare games. I think the problem is the lack of innovation overall from BioWare since Mass Effect is the bigger problem. The rest is mostly PR speak that people take at face value for some reason. BioWare is never going to be exactly like Skyrim for example, the design of Inquisition is proof enough of that. i would add that their problems could very easily be that they cannot keep up with current industry trends ('livly' open worlds, the nonsense over facial animations) precisely because they are trying to focus on their niche things (like CCs and great characters) |
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Post by goishen on Nov 17, 2017 2:00:14 GMT
I don't care what it wanted to be when it comes to Andromeda. I care about what it ultimately is. As I said, a lot of that is ultimately PR speak to compare it to the trends of the day. Who's PR speak? And why? EDIT : I meant, why would they need it. Not to have you drone the same sentence back at me. There are times when I just don't get you. |
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linksocarina
N5
Always teacher, sometimes writer
Teaching Mode Activated
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
PSN: LinksOcarina
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Post by linksocarina on Nov 17, 2017 2:36:13 GMT
I don't care what it wanted to be when it comes to Andromeda. I care about what it ultimately is. As I said, a lot of that is ultimately PR speak to compare it to the trends of the day. Who's PR speak? And why? EDIT : I meant, why would they need it. Not to have you drone the same sentence back at me. There are times when I just don't get you. Why does anyone need PR speak ultimately when they say "Game X is like Game Y?" To generate hype by comparing things to what is popular. That is what the "were looking at Skyrim for inspiration" type of lines are in the end. People tend to take it literally though. As for not getting me....sorry? I am pretty clear overall as to what I am saying here as far as I can tell. |
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Post by river82 on Nov 17, 2017 2:42:29 GMT
Why does anyone need PR speak ultimately when they say "Game X is like Game Y?" To generate hype by comparing things to what is popular. That is what the "were looking at Skyrim for inspiration" type of lines are in the end. It was Darrah coming out and saying Skyrim changed the expectation for role playing games and the expectation of exploration especially, and that open world games will be dominant going forward. That isn't PR speak, that's looking at the reasoning behind a pretty conscious design decision. |
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Post by goishen on Nov 17, 2017 2:49:53 GMT
Who's PR speak? And why? EDIT : I meant, why would they need it. Not to have you drone the same sentence back at me. There are times when I just don't get you. Why does anyone need PR speak ultimately when they say "Game X is like Game Y?" To generate hype by comparing things to what is popular. That is what the "were looking at Skyrim for inspiration" type of lines are in the end. People tend to take it literally though. As for not getting me....sorry? I am pretty clear overall as to what I am saying here as far as I can tell. So, just let quote what I'm hearing. Next post... Yah, thanks dude. That's as clear as mud. Also, No Man's Sky wasn't popular. Popular to make fun of, but not popular as a fun game. |
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Post by PapaCharlie9 on Nov 17, 2017 3:25:31 GMT
Now If you look closely at writers like Ian.M.Banks and Peter Hamilton, you will notice that their stories arent anything fancy they arent reinventing the wheel they are just a different colour. The premise is basically always that there is an overarching enemy hell bent on destroying the world. Sorry, but I've read every Iain M. Banks book ever written (may he rest in peace), and only one book has, "an overarching enemy hell bent on destroying the world," and that's Matter. And, as is typical for a Banks novel, that world-destroying enemy wouldn't have even been on the playing field if a bunch of stupid people hadn't been acting like a bunch of selfish pricks. Banks's Culture novels are, first and foremost, character driven and profoundly human stories, usually focusing on just a small handful of characters. They are the opposite of epics. Although, no character is an actual human, they're all aliens, Minds, or Drones. Even the human equivalent seeming one's aren't human -- kind of like how the people in Star Wars aren't human. And to call the Culture novels not "anything fancy" is shockingly obtuse. Excession is both fancy and inventive, and possibly the best science fiction novel of all time. Player of Games, Surface Detail, and my god, Use of Weapons(!!!) "aren't anything fancy??" I can't give any credence to the rest of your rant, given how much I disagree with your characterization of the Culture novels. |
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Sanunes
N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Sanunes on Nov 17, 2017 3:40:22 GMT
One of the problems I have with Andromeda is how much of the game is buried behind choices so if you only play a game I would guess you could easily be missing over half of the interesting parts of a BioWare game. There is unique dialogue for mission dialogue locked behind having the right characters in your party or having a lot of dialogue locked behind different dialogue choices which again a lot of people will not see (which is why even though the P/R system was bipolar they only needed half as many choices).
Andromeda felt to me that they wanted to incorporate everything people said they wanted to see in a BioWare game and proved to be an expensive gamble to find out that people don't know what they want. I should go back again and really time myself with a Mass Effect 1 game and show that one of the reasons why the dialogue for that game was as good as it was primarily due to the game being short and they took shortcuts as well. People kept talking about how great Mass Effect 1 was because of "open world", how Mass Effect 2 was because of characters, how great Mass Effect 3 was because of the combat, wanting a skill system that was completely open, a vehicle to explore with, the game must be 20+ hours long, things of that nature. So when trying to do all that they lost track of why people really buy their games.
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