Sanunes
N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Sanunes on Feb 13, 2018 16:59:43 GMT
It might be the case that the most memorable thing from Andromeda is the memes for you, I can think of other games where the reaction of people outside the game is more then what I remember about the game, its human nature for it is what leaves a stronger impact. The majority of things I can remember about Assassin's Creed 3 is the negative aspects of the game as well or even BioShock: Infinite I remember more the interactions about the game on message boards then the game. I know there are things outside of the memes that I will remember, but that is because I didn't have the negative interactions others did. Fair enough. It's also entirely possible that you enjoyed the game much more than I did. It's just... ME:A is the first Bioware game I only played once, and have no real desire to play again. And considering that some Bioware games are among my most favorite games, ever, that's quite the disappointment for me. I only played it twice, but if you look at the hours I invested I got about the same that way as I did Mass Effect 1, and just a little less then Mass Effect 3. I will not say it is my favorite BioWare game, but I did enjoy it more then a lot of the other games out there, but there is nothing wrong with a game that you don't enjoy either. My personal example is Breath of the Wild, I tried the game and the weapon system hurt my enjoyment enough to the point I put the game down and never went back. I actually sold my Switch and copy of Breath of the Wild for what I paid for it because there was such a limited availability of both.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Feb 13, 2018 17:04:34 GMT
I completely disagree. Though the main villains of ME3 should have been the Reapers, it was actually Cerberus who were the main threat in ME3 as you fight them more than any other faction. Without ME2 they wouldn't have made any sense as the villains, and ME2 also introduced The Illusive Man who was the most visible of Reaper agents (though he didn't know it). Although ME2 put a 'nice' front on Cerberus, it was obvious that they were devious bastards because you kept coming across their scummy schemes in the game, it was obvious they would be a threat. Not only that, but ME2 is the story of the Reapers attempt to reopen the Citadel after Sovereign failed, the whole point of the Collector plot is that they are making a Reaper to take his place in opening the Citadel, when that fails, then Harbinger wakes the other Reapers and they take the long route to the Milky Way. The Reapers lack of control of the Citadel (first because Sovereign failed, then the Human Reaper was defeated) which is partly what makes a galaxy wide war possible for the third game, as they normally shut the relays down which wouldn't have been much fun to play through. Without ME2 we wouldn't have seen the Reapers coming to the galaxy, as far as ME1 was concerned we had prevented them from waking up. And this is ignoring other points I could make about how ME2 sets up the Tuchanka and Rannoch plots. People keep coming out with these claims that ME2 has nothing to do with ME3, but they're wrong. It's some weird viewpoint that people keep parroting. The main issue between ME2 and 3 is that Bioware didn't do nearly enough with the Collector Base decision and never gave the Reapers some kind of weakness or penalty because they took the long route to invade. By design, BioWare actively made the reapers an ill fit to be a primary antagonist to deal with in the game. Once we learned what Sovereign was, and what its faction was about and what they could do, any hope of them being the primary baddies to deal with throughout the game went straight out the window. We're playing a puny infantryman with nothing but some measly guns in a team of 3 at any given time, whereas you have these overpowered immortal starships that are an all-consuming space swarm that brainwash entire populations and could simply bombard everything from orbit if they wanted to. What's funny is that TIM himself even points this out plainly at the temple on Thessia. I think that the games should have played up just how vulnerable they are without their trap, but then once we actually see a reaper in action, it's a total beast that can obliterate a fleet singlehanded. It also does not help that ME tech is a freaking joke... They have not even mastered laser weapons!
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Post by themikefest on Feb 13, 2018 17:55:31 GMT
Not only that, but ME2 is the story of the Reapers attempt to reopen the Citadel after Sovereign failed, the whole point of the Collector plot is that they are making a Reaper to take his place in opening the Citadel, Is it? I don't recall anything mentioning that was why they were building a reaper. Weren't they already on their way to the Milky Way after Sovereign was destroyed? ME2 shows the reapers approaching the Milky Way after completing the suicide mission
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Post by abaris on Feb 13, 2018 18:31:45 GMT
Someone putting a mod into a game that allows something is one thing, but to make sure it works on all supported hardware is another. The particular modder creáted it for all moddable platforms. Also, Bethesda already created a reactive environment. The modders only built on that. They added something that should have been in the base game, but Bethesda already did the legwork. Settlers reacting to threats and going about their work, depending on day or night. There are very few static NPCs, mostly in bars, sitting at the tables. But even these crowds change in certain instances. The illusion of life is already in the base game. Something that's missing with Bioware.
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Post by sil on Feb 13, 2018 19:11:08 GMT
Not only that, but ME2 is the story of the Reapers attempt to reopen the Citadel after Sovereign failed, the whole point of the Collector plot is that they are making a Reaper to take his place in opening the Citadel, Is it? I don't recall anything mentioning that was why they were building a reaper. Of course it is, what else would they make another Reaper for? To do a tap-dancing act in Omega? They left Sovereign behind to be the one to activate the Citadel, thus activating it as a Relay that the entire Reaper fleet could emerge from. Sovereign failed and then they start making a new Reaper? It's obvious that the human Reaper, if completed, would've had the exact same aim so they could repeat the tactic they've used every other time they harvested the galaxy; cut out the heart of galactic government, open the Citadel relay, turn off the other Relays. It is obvious. then Harbinger wakes the other Reapers and they take the long route to the Milky Way. Weren't they already on their way to the Milky Way after Sovereign was destroyed? ME2 shows the reapers approaching the Milky Way after completing the suicide mission They weren't, actually. Shepard was planning on stopping them returning at the end, or defeating them if they returned, but the Reapers don't wake up at the end of ME1. Only Sovereign was awake during the period of ME1 as it was his purpose to monitor the inhabitants of the Milky Way and judge when the end of the Cycle was at hand. It is after Harbinger's bid to create a human-Reaper fails that the Reapers are forced to activate as a whole and travel to the Milky Way by FTL. The end cinematic makes it very clear.
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Sanunes
N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Sanunes on Feb 13, 2018 19:20:35 GMT
Someone putting a mod into a game that allows something is one thing, but to make sure it works on all supported hardware is another. The particular modder creáted it for all moddable platforms. Also, Bethesda already created a reactive environment. The modders only built on that. They added something that should have been in the base game, but Bethesda already did the legwork. Settlers reacting to threats and going about their work, depending on day or night. There are very few static NPCs, mostly in bars, sitting at the tables. But even these crowds change in certain instances. The illusion of life is already in the base game. Something that's missing with Bioware. Now its been a long time since I played a Bethesda game for any period of time, I think around the launch of Skyrim. They might have had the underlying aspect of that, but I don't think the NPCs themselves was very unique so there could be some tradeoff somewhere that we don't see. One of my biggest complaints about Andromeda was they were building too many systems into the game and it might have been better if they cut a few of them to focus on what they did have. They did do something like you mention in Mass Effect 3 by having the companions in different areas of the ship, but completely wandering PCs sometimes is annoying for me as well for they act like roadblocks when you are trying to preform an action. That is just my old MMO day issues coming up.
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Post by themikefest on Feb 13, 2018 19:44:18 GMT
Of course it is, what else would they make another Reaper for? To get a head start with the harvest. Obvious? How long would it have taken to complete the reaper? In the time that the collectors took to abduct human colonies, they only had what is seen in the game completed. If, as you say, they wake up after the suicide mission, it takes them 6 months to get to the Milky Way, why waste all that time to build a reaper to try and succeed where Sovereign failed?
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Post by abaris on Feb 13, 2018 19:45:28 GMT
They did do something like you mention in Mass Effect 3 by having the companions in different areas of the ship, but completely wandering PCs sometimes is annoying for me as well for they act like roadblocks when you are trying to preform an action. That is just my old MMO day issues coming up. They relocated - which I liked. Much better than I liked roaming the ship in MEA, where they were just standing in certain spots calling over the intercom. But in both instances they didn't really move or react or anything like that. They just stood there. It's been a long time since I last played Skyrim also. But one thing I do remember. The Khajit trading band moving from town to town. And by moving I mean moving. You could meet them on the open road. Which is exactly how you create an open world. People populating and moving between the hubs or whatever it is you have for townships or settlements.
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Post by KaiserShep on Feb 13, 2018 19:49:10 GMT
Not only that, but ME2 is the story of the Reapers attempt to reopen the Citadel after Sovereign failed, the whole point of the Collector plot is that they are making a Reaper to take his place in opening the Citadel, Is it? I don't recall anything mentioning that was why they were building a reaper. Weren't they already on their way to the Milky Way after Sovereign was destroyed? ME2 shows the reapers approaching the Milky Way after completing the suicide mission Thing is, the Collectors' actions only make sense if you consider them to be the reapers' contingency plan as a secondary vanguard. The only good reason to start construction of a new reaper right then and there would be to have a Sovereign substitute to carry on its intended purpose and get their trap up and running again, so they can have the element of surprise. But mostly, it's because the Collectors are relatively weak. Their ships aren't nearly as powerful as reapers for some reason, and they can be mowed down by gunfire. Their one ace in the sleeve was the seeker swarm, which a simple salarian was able to counter. Only reason I could think of that would necessitate activating them would be that they had no choice. Of course, all of that goes out the window, because the reapers are basically just 6 months out, and could just effortlessly bumrush the galaxy with minimal losses with or without the relay network.
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Post by alanc9 on Feb 13, 2018 20:01:18 GMT
They did do something like you mention in Mass Effect 3 by having the companions in different areas of the ship, but completely wandering PCs sometimes is annoying for me as well for they act like roadblocks when you are trying to preform an action. That is just my old MMO day issues coming up. They relocated - which I liked. Much better than I liked roaming the ship in MEA, where they were just standing in certain spots calling over the intercom. Huh? The ME:A crew moves around the ship too. Well, most of them, anyway.
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Post by abaris on Feb 13, 2018 20:08:48 GMT
Huh? The ME:A crew moves around the ship too. Well, most of them, anyway. And yet they don't do anything besides shouting over the intercom or walk along the predestined path between point A to point B for all eternity. They don't give the semblance of interacting. No storytelling, no stare game, no game of cards, no being passed out drunk on the floor. They're pretty much static as compared to ME3. And they already were static there too. Just in a more interesting way. You never knew what you would find when roaming the ship.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Feb 13, 2018 20:26:44 GMT
Of course it is, what else would they make another Reaper for? To get a head start with the harvest. Obvious? How long would it have taken to complete the reaper? In the time that the collectors took to abduct human colonies, they only had what is seen in the game completed. If, as you say, they wake up after the suicide mission, it takes them 6 months to get to the Milky Way, why waste all that time to build a reaper to try and succeed where Sovereign failed? Maybe they were building that Reaper to ask life's biggest question: What is the sound of one robotic arm clapping?
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Post by sil on Feb 13, 2018 22:46:03 GMT
Of course, all of that goes out the window, because the reapers are basically just 6 months out, and could just effortlessly bumrush the galaxy with minimal losses with or without the relay network. Sadly that's the fault of ME3 for not giving the Reapers a penalty caused by their immense trek across dark space.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
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Post by xeternalxdreams on Feb 14, 2018 0:35:21 GMT
Well, I think SAM works against him/her because it's literally stuck in Ryder's head so he/she always has a super intelligent AI helping by commenting on what they are doing as well as the scanner. Having that follow Ryder for 2 or 3 games might get tiresome, IMO.
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Post by alanc9 on Feb 14, 2018 1:15:29 GMT
Huh? The ME:A crew moves around the ship too. Well, most of them, anyway. And yet they don't do anything besides shouting over the intercom or walk along the predestined path between point A to point B for all eternity. They don't give the semblance of interacting. No storytelling, no stare game, no game of cards, no being passed out drunk on the floor. They're pretty much static as compared to ME3. And they already were static there too. Just in a more interesting way. You never knew what you would find when roaming the ship. Gotcha. It's hard to actually come up with a workable metric for this. Does ME:A have less animations than previous games, or is it just that the game is bigger and what they have is spread out too far?
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Post by KaiserShep on Feb 14, 2018 16:21:24 GMT
Well, I think SAM works against him/her because it's literally stuck in Ryder's head so he/she always has a super intelligent AI helping by commenting on what they are doing as well as the scanner. Having that follow Ryder for 2 or 3 games might get tiresome, IMO. The solution to that would be simple: simply leave the deduction and analysis dialogue to Ryder him/herself. Like, if Ryder is investigating a scene with the scanner and detects various things around the room, it should be Ryder putting all the pieces together rather than SAM's robot voice. I think SAM as a concept is fine; it's that it keeps chiming in that gets tiresome, but it's easily rectified.
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Post by shinobiwan on Feb 14, 2018 17:59:57 GMT
I see it as a very good thing that the writers have shifted out. If I had another game full of "I'm Cora I trained with Asari commandos and I like flowers" I'd lose it.
You could tell very clearly that the Edmonton team helped create great premises for these characters and the Montreal team dropped the ball when it came time to put pen to paper.
I'd have no problem with the writing being inconsistent with the first game - I'd be more concerned if it was.
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Post by abaris on Feb 14, 2018 18:10:54 GMT
Does ME:A have less animations than previous games, or is it just that the game is bigger and what they have is spread out too far? It's hardly about the animations. It's more of an empty feel to what they do in MEA. They shout at each other, whereas in ME3 they gave the illusion of hanging out with each other and having a good time. Garrus telling his war tales to a few listeners, Garrus and James staring down each other or parts of the crew playing a game of cards. That's totally missing in MEA. They only stand by themselves in various places or - I guess Liam's the only one doing that - move between two points in rapid succession. They always are alone, which makes it so much easier to discard them as bots. It's a regression to ME1.
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Post by alanc9 on Feb 14, 2018 18:16:07 GMT
They shout at each other? I heard normal conversations.
And the specific things you mention would require non-default animations.
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Post by sil on Feb 14, 2018 18:50:27 GMT
Does ME:A have less animations than previous games, or is it just that the game is bigger and what they have is spread out too far? It's hardly about the animations. It's more of an empty feel to what they do in MEA. They shout at each other, whereas in ME3 they gave the illusion of hanging out with each other and having a good time. Garrus telling his war tales to a few listeners, Garrus and James staring down each other or parts of the crew playing a game of cards. That's totally missing in MEA. They only stand by themselves in various places or - I guess Liam's the only one doing that - move between two points in rapid succession. They always are alone, which makes it so much easier to discard them as bots. It's a regression to ME1. As someone who has modded ME3, then you're wrong. There are less instances of that in ME3 than there are in ME:A. It's one of the parts they got right.
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Post by KaiserShep on Feb 14, 2018 19:13:21 GMT
Huh? The ME:A crew moves around the ship too. Well, most of them, anyway. And yet they don't do anything besides shouting over the intercom or walk along the predestined path between point A to point B for all eternity. They don't give the semblance of interacting. No storytelling, no stare game, no game of cards, no being passed out drunk on the floor. They're pretty much static as compared to ME3. And they already were static there too. Just in a more interesting way. You never knew what you would find when roaming the ship. I thought ME3 was a pretty vast improvement over ME2, which really has no excuse for pretty much leaving all companion interplay to mere persuasion checks.
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Post by cszoltan on Feb 19, 2018 17:32:53 GMT
Even if I hated MEA (which I didn't) I still would like a sequel. I just hate unfinished things, I think it looks bad for a franchise.
Besides, what else could they do? The Milky Way wouldn't work for the same reasons it didn't work before. Post-ME3 the world state is just too diverse to make a setting out of it. Unless they make a canon ending which would be a spit in the face. And a prequel is just fucking boring. Why should I care about irrelevant people doing irrelevant things that either have no impact or we already know what happened (god save us from a First Contact War game).
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Post by link2twenty on Feb 20, 2018 10:26:29 GMT
Even if I hated MEA (which I didn't) I still would like a sequel. I just hate unfinished things, I think it looks bad for a franchise. Besides, what else could they do? The Milky Way wouldn't work for the same reasons it didn't work before. Post-ME3 the world state is just too diverse to make a setting out of it. Unless they make a canon ending which would be a spit in the face. And a prequel is just fucking boring. Why should I care about irrelevant people doing irrelevant things that either have no impact or we already know what happened (god save us from a First Contact War game). I think there is space for a first Contact war space battle VR experience or maybe a VS multiplayer game like battlefield with ground and space battles. I don't think it would fit as a story-driven entry into the series but the ME universe is so diverse I think they can make other game types.
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Post by Elfen Lied on Feb 20, 2018 11:55:09 GMT
Even if I hated MEA (which I didn't) I still would like a sequel. I just hate unfinished things, I think it looks bad for a franchise. Besides, what else could they do? The Milky Way wouldn't work for the same reasons it didn't work before. Post-ME3 the world state is just too diverse to make a setting out of it. Unless they make a canon ending which would be a spit in the face. And a prequel is just fucking boring. Why should I care about irrelevant people doing irrelevant things that either have no impact or we already know what happened (god save us from a First Contact War game). I think there is space for a first Contact war space battle VR experience or maybe a VS multiplayer game like battlefield with ground and space battles.
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