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Post by Deleted on Jun 14, 2018 9:38:48 GMT
I hope Elder Scrolls Six doesn't suck...
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Post by Queen Skadi on Jun 14, 2018 10:50:24 GMT
I guess it comes down to what you want in a game. I have yet to be disappointed by a Bethesda game, so I'm always excited when they reveal something because I can be sure that I'll enjoy it. Perhaps their offerings aren't to your taste? Perhaps, and yet while I know it technically shouldn't bother me and that I should just ignore the games if they don't cater to my tastes I can't help but feel a little bothered by the fact that they have the potential to be much better than they currently are.
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Post by MediocreOgre on Jun 14, 2018 14:43:52 GMT
people like the sandboxy side of Beth, bugs and all, in part because with less ridgid quest structure, lack of a pre-defined protag and a general unreliance on cinnematic story telling many players feel like they get to establish their own character and play theur own stories. Modding only adds to that. Bugs are minor inconveniences if these things are important to you.
Some people like pre established protags in a highly cinnematic experience in a confined narrative experience. Some people hate that fundamentally and some people like myself don’t inherently hate a more restrictive narrative but find the characters and narratives being explored in More “polished” games to be contrived, uninspred, generic and unsatisfying compared to the protagonists and narratives we can eek out of Beth’s ambiguity and jank.
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Post by linksocarina on Jun 14, 2018 14:46:06 GMT
Same reason CD Projekt Red does. Or RockStar. Or Naughty Dog. Or BioWare. Or FromSoftware. Or Nintendo. Or...
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Post by Queen Skadi on Jun 14, 2018 15:30:51 GMT
people like the sandboxy side of Beth, bugs and all, in part because with less ridgid quest structure, lack of a pre-defined protag and a general unreliance on cinnematic story telling many players feel like they get to establish their own character and play theur own stories. Modding only adds to that. Bugs are minor inconveniences if these things are important to you. Some people like pre established protags in a highly cinnematic experience in a confined narrative experience. Some people hate that fundamentally and some people like myself don’t inherently hate a more restrictive narrative but find the characters and narratives being explored in More “polished” games to be contrived, uninspred, generic and unsatisfying compared to the protagonists and narratives we can eek out of Beth’s ambiguity and jank. What if I told you Bethesda games were not sandboxy enough and the quest structure was too rigid and linear? Would you understand what I mean or would it sound like gobbledegook?
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Post by Cyberstrike on Jun 14, 2018 16:33:50 GMT
Yet when they actually get released they are usually such disappointments? Sure there are a lot of Bethesda fanboys who don't know any better and who's only barometer for judging the quality of a game is the amount of hours of content the game has but while Bethesda games usually have a lot of content it is usually the most shallow and dull content you can imagine, little more than a list of tasks and items to collect for 100% completion as you strive to be leader of every guild and group in the land despite their often times conflicting natures and goals. Now we got Fallout 76 coming despite knowing little about it other than speculation all it takes to get the internet roused into a frenzy is a live stream featuring nothing but a bobblehead and a television showing the emergency standby signal, why? Also I take it we wont be seeing Starbound this year as all rumours before hand suggested (just like last year and the year before suggested as well)?
Because Bethesda has made games that I enjoy more than I think would and are a lot of fun to play, and have to ability to switch between 1st person and 3rd person while CDPR could not get that feature to Cyberpunk 2077 which MIGHT have had me on board. A key choice from a company that is supposedly all about "player's choices" what a load of bullshit that "CDPR is the future of single player games" all Cyberpunk 2077 is a glorified FPS with some RPG elements thrown in, I could play Halo if I wanted that shit.
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Post by Kappa Neko on Jun 14, 2018 18:19:44 GMT
Bethesda do open world exploration like no other, that's why. Their games are unique. Either you dig their style or you don't.
If you do, then you have to wait a loooong time to play another one because making these amazing maps and debugging the bazillion possibilities of things playing out takes a lot of time. And the end result is still buggy as fuck because it's impossible to try all possible combinations. So yeah, cut them some lack about bugs! Try programming such complex games and do better, I dare you!
Sooo after waiting for years and years for a new Fallout or Elder Scolls game, HELL YES are people excited! And if it's the first new IP in two decades, YOU BET YOUR ASS people are drooling all over their desktops!
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Post by fylimar on Jun 14, 2018 21:12:59 GMT
I have to agree about the open world thing. I don't consider myself a Bethesda fangirl, but I enjoyed Morrowind immensly back in the day. So much, that I just buyed the GOTY edition on steam in a sale. I like that you have absolute freedom. If I want great storylines and characters, I play otehr games, but for exploring, creating a character after your own taste and having fun in trying things out, it's great.
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Post by Queen Skadi on Jun 15, 2018 5:10:37 GMT
Yet when they actually get released they are usually such disappointments? Sure there are a lot of Bethesda fanboys who don't know any better and who's only barometer for judging the quality of a game is the amount of hours of content the game has but while Bethesda games usually have a lot of content it is usually the most shallow and dull content you can imagine, little more than a list of tasks and items to collect for 100% completion as you strive to be leader of every guild and group in the land despite their often times conflicting natures and goals. Now we got Fallout 76 coming despite knowing little about it other than speculation all it takes to get the internet roused into a frenzy is a live stream featuring nothing but a bobblehead and a television showing the emergency standby signal, why? Also I take it we wont be seeing Starbound this year as all rumours before hand suggested (just like last year and the year before suggested as well)?
Because Bethesda has made games that I enjoy more than I think would and are a lot of fun to play, and have to ability to switch between 1st person and 3rd person while CDPR could not get that feature to Cyberpunk 2077 which MIGHT have had me on board. A key choice from a company that is supposedly all about "player's choices" what a load of bullshit that "CDPR is the future of single player games" all Cyberpunk 2077 is a glorified FPS with some RPG elements thrown in, I could play Halo if I wanted that shit.
Wow, you are free to have some irrational hatred towards first person viewpoints but from everything we heard Cyberpunk 2077 sounds like a whole lot more than merely a glorified FPS with RPG elements thrown in. I gotta admit I am pretty shocked at how quickly people are writing off this game in spite of everything else revealed about it just because of one single solitary detail that may not have been what they wanted. Seems like a pretty massive overreaction to me.
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Post by Deerber on Jun 25, 2018 22:39:38 GMT
Mmmmmmhhhhh, let me think.
Because they're Bethesda.
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Post by The_Smiling_Bandit on Jun 26, 2018 1:29:33 GMT
This is actually something I’ve been putting some serious thought into. Because I have consistently been disappointed by Bethesda games, and yet I keep getting excited whenever a new one is announced. I think it comes down to what a few people have said already; no one does big, empty worlds like Bethesda (even though others have tried). And sure these games might subscribe to the “vast as an ocean, deep as a puddle” school of game design, but sometimes it’s fun to just splash around in that puddle for a while.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Jun 26, 2018 1:38:59 GMT
Because of all the slooty mods that will follow. (not that I know anything about them... 😉).
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Post by OneWomanArmy on Jun 26, 2018 11:08:18 GMT
They’re simply amazing at making open world games and giving you the opportunity to make a character whom you can shape and create almost exactly the way you want her/him to look like, that’s more than I can say for any other games out there. And their stories could perhaps use a bit of improvement but they aren’t half bad imo, enough to keep me interested. I simply love all the things they provide in their games, the freedom they give, that’s how a RPG should be.
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Post by Arijon van Goyen on Jun 26, 2018 11:23:19 GMT
Morrowind is bland and has the worst memes evar 
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Post by Queen Skadi on Jun 26, 2018 18:50:32 GMT
This is actually something I’ve been putting some serious thought into. Because I have consistently been disappointed by Bethesda games, and yet I keep getting excited whenever a new one is announced. I think it comes down to what a few people have said already; no one does big, empty worlds like Bethesda (even though others have tried). And sure these games might subscribe to the “vast as an ocean, deep as a puddle” school of game design, but sometimes it’s fun to just splash around in that puddle for a while. Gets less fun when they start removing features though, from levitation to spellcrafting each Elder Scrolls games get shallower than the last and while previous games allowed you to create your own fun to a degree if you knew how to break the game in the right places each new game cuts back on features in an effort to prevent players from doing this making a new game that is blander than the last What good is a sandbox without any toys?
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Post by Queen Skadi on Jun 26, 2018 18:57:20 GMT
They’re simply amazing at making open world games and giving you the opportunity to make a character whom you can shape and create almost exactly the way you want her/him to look like, that’s more than I can say for any other games out there. And their stories could perhaps use a bit of improvement but they aren’t half bad imo, enough to keep me interested. I simply love all the things they provide in their games, the freedom they give, that’s how a RPG should be. The ability to customize your character's looks? Don't other games provide this feature? I can think of plenty of games that allow you to customize your character's appearance to a greater degree than what is allowed in the Elder Scrolls, also what freedom are we talking about? The Freedom to choose which questlines to do and the order to do them in? Don't most RPGs allow this freedom as well? Do today's gamers have such a narrow field of view that they cannot see all the games out side of their periphery and falsely assume that the most hyped game is the only one that can provide these things?
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Post by The_Smiling_Bandit on Jun 26, 2018 20:31:32 GMT
This is actually something I’ve been putting some serious thought into. Because I have consistently been disappointed by Bethesda games, and yet I keep getting excited whenever a new one is announced. I think it comes down to what a few people have said already; no one does big, empty worlds like Bethesda (even though others have tried). And sure these games might subscribe to the “vast as an ocean, deep as a puddle” school of game design, but sometimes it’s fun to just splash around in that puddle for a while. Gets less fun when they start removing features though, from levitation to spellcrafting each Elder Scrolls games get shallower than the last and while previous games allowed you to create your own fun to a degree if you knew how to break the game in the right places each new game cuts back on features in an effort to prevent players from doing this making a new game that is blander than the last What good is a sandbox without any toys? I’m certainly not going to argue that Bethesda games have only gotten progressively more restrictive: but even still I somehow managed to put 80 hours into Fallout 4, and close to 200 in Skyrim (which is single handedly the most boring game I’ve put that many hours into since Mount and Blade). Like I said, I’m consistently excited for Bethesda games and yet without fail I’m disappointed when they actually are in my hands.
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Post by o Ventus on Jun 29, 2018 5:06:16 GMT
The idea that Bethesda games are good because of mods always seemed fallacious to me. You’re not playing the Bethesda product at that point, you’re playing the third party mod.
It doesn’t help that theses has never once actually released a finished game at any point in their history. Everything is always so relentlessly buggy and technically flimsy that anything can break at the slightest provocation, to the point where with things like Dawnguard, Dragonborn, or Fallout 3, you straight up almost require certain mods just to even play the game. I don’t think I’ve actually completed Dragonborn on my primary Skyrim save because any time I try to travel through Apocrypha to face Miraak, the game gets really choppy with frame rate stutters and eventually crashes, I guess because of the stretchy hallways that expand and rotate as you walk through them (since that’s always the area where it happens), like the game can’t handle all of the extra rendering and morphing of the 3D space.
Bethesda’s games are ambitious and have a lot of neat ideas in them, but ultimately they’re technical failures and are almost universally terrible when it comes to any kind of narrative. They’re fun and the mods do make the experience more enjoyable, but that doesn’t actually make the game any better when I often need third party assistance simply to launch the game and not have it shit itself after 15 minutes.
In spite of this though, I do love Fallout. One of my favorite series, ever, and I will play them all. Except for Brotherhood of Steel, that one can go and fuck itself. Fallout 3 is the best in the series on the rare occasion it DOES work, and New Vegas is hilariously overrated, don’t @ me. The Elder Scrolls is generic fantasy that doesn’t especially do anything special or different to make it stand apart from any other stereotypical high fantasy setting, don’t @ me.
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Post by dmc1001 on Jun 29, 2018 5:39:13 GMT
I don't remember being disappointed by any Bethesda game. Full disclosure: I've only played Elder Scrolls and Fallout games. I thoroughly enjoyed them. That they could be massively modded is outstanding. I've seen essentially entirely different games made out of mods. I saw Morrowind brought into Oblivion. To me, the versatility is what makes it worthwhile. As for tasks, most of them are up to you. If you only want to follow the main quest you can do that. No one is forcing you to find Farmer Joe's cow that's been cornered by a gang of leopards. Just as no one forced you to find that locket the asari lost on Illium. Or to put some flowers on the grave of an elf's wife because it's too dangerous to travel. Every game has main quests filled with a lot of optional quests. Do what you want and ignore the rest.
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Post by dmc1001 on Jun 29, 2018 5:40:46 GMT
It doesn’t help that theses has never once actually released a finished game at any point in their history. Everything is always so relentlessly buggy and technically flimsy that anything can break at the slightest provocation, to the point where with things like Dawnguard, Dragonborn, or Fallout 3, you straight up almost require certain mods just to even play the game. I don't disagree, though I love the games anyway. Makes me wonder why the bugs of MEA were so problematic when they've been in TES and FO games all along.
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Post by o Ventus on Jun 29, 2018 13:23:54 GMT
The idea that Bethesda games are good because of mods always seemed fallacious to me. You’re not playing the Bethesda product at that point, you’re playing the third party mod. On some level this is true, but dismissing the fact that if not for the base product you would never get any of those mods is fallacious too. Bethesda make a decent pizza bread, you can add the toppings yourself. That's how I see it anyway. No sane person would say “mmm that was some mighty delicious Bethesda pizza” in that case.
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Post by o Ventus on Jun 29, 2018 13:50:16 GMT
No sane person would say “mmm that was some mighty delicious Bethesda pizza” in that case. I'm not saying it either, just that their base is something that I ended up enjoying a lot after adding stuff to it. I mean, there are probably only a handful (or two) of games I can say I spent above 200-300 hours on, and Bethesda titles are among those games. So while I can't say that I'm impressed with their base work in particular, they must be doing SOMETHING right for me to play them as long as I did. And my point is, without all of those add-ons, the experience wouldn’t be so good, especially if it’s something like basic UI functionality, like in the case of SkyUI for Skyrim, or any of the various compatibility mods for Fallout 3 for machines newer than 2008. You yourself even say that you enjoy it after adding on to it. So, it’s not really the core game that you’re having the most fun with, is it?
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Post by wickedcool on Jun 29, 2018 14:31:17 GMT
It’s the base game that is the most fun. I do have extramods but I would still play it Basicmods that enhance it for me include The patch A weather mod Adding in cut content and added dialogue mods Bruma- basically a dlc. This is less than a year old and its well done Scary thing is there isn’t another company that can duplicate the elder scrolls formula with or without mods This is a 7+ year old game
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Post by Qui-Gon GlenN7 on Jun 29, 2018 17:53:23 GMT
Life simulators are dumb.
This is why I played Skyrim for maybe 7 hours, finished the main quest, and uninstalled that pos.
I am baffled by people that get fulfillment from living a mundane life inside a video game. It is horrifying really.
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Post by KaiserShep on Jun 29, 2018 18:02:07 GMT
Life simulators are dumb. This is why I played Skyrim for maybe 7 hours, finished the main quest, and uninstalled that pos. I am baffled by people that get fulfillment from living a mundane life inside a video game. It is horrifying really. There’s a simple joy in ordering a pizza, sitting down to listen to music for a few minutes, then go outside and set your town on fire with no consequences.
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