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Post by dropzofcrimzon on Jul 3, 2018 0:09:44 GMT
To answer the original op, no, I don't think BioWare should aim at their old RPG crowd with Anthem. Without companions, character development and story world building it would only lead to those people being disappointed. BioWare should be honest about what Anthem is and, from what I've seen, that's not DA/ME. Anthem looks like it's about the grind, which is fine if that's what you're looking for. I wouldn't aim the marketing to the RPG crowd if RPG isn't going to be a big part of the game. this, and also it sounds like the campaign cannot be repeated properly so that makes it even worse for those who would like a semblance of old school bioware games
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Post by kino on Jul 3, 2018 0:17:06 GMT
To answer the original op, no, I don't think BioWare should aim at their old RPG crowd with Anthem. Without companions, character development and story world building it would only lead to those people being disappointed. BioWare should be honest about what Anthem is and, from what I've seen, that's not DA/ME. Anthem looks like it's about the grind, which is fine if that's what you're looking for. I wouldn't aim the marketing to the RPG crowd if RPG isn't going to be a big part of the game. this, and also it sounds like the campaign cannot be repeated properly so that makes it even worse for those who would like a semblance of old school bioware games If it's like Destiny you can play through the campaign with each character. Still not an RPG, though, and it shouldn't be marketed to the RPG crowd as such.
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Post by dropzofcrimzon on Jul 3, 2018 0:23:31 GMT
this, and also it sounds like the campaign cannot be repeated properly so that makes it even worse for those who would like a semblance of old school bioware games If it's like Destiny you can play through the campaign with each character. Still not an RPG, though, and it shouldn't be marketed to the RPG crowd as such. ohhh but therein lies the rub. You can replay each MISSION...individually, without continuity really OR you make a new character (which would suck because you have to start from scratch AND Biowaee sad there is not real point in doing it) Point is, you see how they are saying that fort Tarsis is where you go see the consequences of your actions and the "choices" you may have made in your story missions? So if that is the case and you re-play a mission and change a choice what's gonna happen? Fort tarsis just changes? What about the decisions that hinged on that one originally? Unless you can reset the campaign and start from scratch with a NG+ sort of system. Because the thought of creating a new character each time REALLY does nor appeal to me especially since this is a grind game AND we were told new characters are limited in number
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Post by kino on Jul 3, 2018 0:32:39 GMT
If it's like Destiny you can play through the campaign with each character. Still not an RPG, though, and it shouldn't be marketed to the RPG crowd as such. ohhh but therein lies the rub. You can replay each MISSION...individually, without continuity really OR you make a new character (which would suck because you have to start from scratch AND Biowaee sad there is not real point in doing it) Point is, you see how they are saying that fort Tarsis is where you go see the consequences of your actions and the "choices" you may have made in your story missions? So if that is the case and you re-play a mission and change a choice what's gonna happen? Fort tarsis just changes? What about the decisions that hinged on that one originally? Unless you can reset the campaign and start from scratch with a NG+ sort of system. Because the thought of creating a new character each time REALLY does nor appeal to me especially since this is a grind game AND we were told new characters are limited in number As I said, it's not an RPG. If the campaign is what the campaign is then, with each of the four characters, you get to replay it at least that many times if you're looking to pick up on nuances. It would get tiresome and boring playing through the same story time after time but then that's pretty true of any game.
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Post by dropzofcrimzon on Jul 3, 2018 1:15:20 GMT
ohhh but therein lies the rub. You can replay each MISSION...individually, without continuity really OR you make a new character (which would suck because you have to start from scratch AND Biowaee sad there is not real point in doing it) Point is, you see how they are saying that fort Tarsis is where you go see the consequences of your actions and the "choices" you may have made in your story missions? So if that is the case and you re-play a mission and change a choice what's gonna happen? Fort tarsis just changes? What about the decisions that hinged on that one originally? Unless you can reset the campaign and start from scratch with a NG+ sort of system. Because the thought of creating a new character each time REALLY does nor appeal to me especially since this is a grind game AND we were told new characters are limited in number As I said, it's not an RPG. If the campaign is what the campaign is then, with each of the four characters, you get to replay it at least that many times if you're looking to pick up on nuances. It would get tiresome and boring playing through the same story time after time but then that's pretty true of any game.
coughs....you are talking to someone who finished ME1 more than two dozen times, all ng+...God only knows how many times I finished each halo or gears...
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Post by kino on Jul 3, 2018 1:58:15 GMT
As I said, it's not an RPG. If the campaign is what the campaign is then, with each of the four characters, you get to replay it at least that many times if you're looking to pick up on nuances. It would get tiresome and boring playing through the same story time after time but then that's pretty true of any game.
coughs....you are talking to someone who finished ME1 more than two dozen times, all ng+...God only knows how many times I finished each halo or gears... Same, except DA instead of GoW.
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Just a flip of the coin.
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Post by Sanunes on Jul 3, 2018 4:02:19 GMT
Except that doesn't work to what is going on here. BioWare is still making "pizza" but they are changing the toppings because people have been giving feedback for what they want to see on their "pizza". There are a group of people that believe the "pizza place" should go out of business catering to what they want and only what they want and the rest of the people that live in that area should be ignored. So the "pizza place" has been giving notification of the change of "toppings" for over a year and a half. yeah...no you are way understating the difference between a traditional bioware game and what Anthem is (hence the other poster's predicament). Also, I do not want them to go out of business, I wish that the player base will turn Anthem into a failure so that either Bioware goes back to make games like ME and DA OR so that EA dissolves them so the talent can be picked up by another studio or band together to form another studio. If Anthem is a resounding success sooner than later that is all we are gonna get from them. I know exactly what you call a "traditional BioWare" game is and I am pretty sure BioWare would have been closed by EA long ago if they stuck to that model. Just because you like it doesn't mean those games attract the numbers of people willing to buy it and it was proven by Andromeda people have expectations that I don't think any company could cram into a smaller budget. Besides I haven't played Anthem yet so I cannot judge what it is or isn't, now if you have a release copy I can try let me know so I can proclaim what the game is or isn't.
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Post by bshep on Jul 3, 2018 4:28:10 GMT
yeah...no you are way understating the difference between a traditional bioware game and what Anthem is (hence the other poster's predicament). Also, I do not want them to go out of business, I wish that the player base will turn Anthem into a failure so that either Bioware goes back to make games like ME and DA OR so that EA dissolves them so the talent can be picked up by another studio or band together to form another studio. If Anthem is a resounding success sooner than later that is all we are gonna get from them. I know exactly what you call a "traditional BioWare" game is and I am pretty sure BioWare would have been closed by EA long ago if they stuck to that model. Just because you like it doesn't mean those games attract the numbers of people willing to buy it and it was proven by Andromeda people have expectations that I don't think any company could cram into a smaller budget. Besides I haven't played Anthem yet so I cannot judge what it is or isn't, now if you have a release copy I can try let me know so I can proclaim what the game is or isn't. Bioware's games changed a lot as time passed. Trying to hold on to some ideal of how their games are and should be is foolishness. A simple look at the first 3 ME/DA games will show to anyone how much.
Also as you said, until we know more about Anthem we cannot judge it.
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Just a flip of the coin.
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Post by Sanunes on Jul 3, 2018 4:45:43 GMT
I know exactly what you call a "traditional BioWare" game is and I am pretty sure BioWare would have been closed by EA long ago if they stuck to that model. Just because you like it doesn't mean those games attract the numbers of people willing to buy it and it was proven by Andromeda people have expectations that I don't think any company could cram into a smaller budget. Besides I haven't played Anthem yet so I cannot judge what it is or isn't, now if you have a release copy I can try let me know so I can proclaim what the game is or isn't. Bioware's games changed a lot as time passed. Trying to hold on to some ideal of how their games are and should be is foolishness. A simple look at the first 3 ME/DA games will show to anyone how much.
Also as you said, until we know more about Anthem we cannot judge it.
I agree, the only time where two BIoWare games were even close to being the same would have been Mass Effect 2 to Mass Effect 3 and my understanding that was because they wanted to shrink the development window and reused a lot of Mass Effect 2 in Mass Effect 3.
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Post by river82 on Jul 3, 2018 4:56:21 GMT
Bioware's games changed a lot as time passed. Trying to hold on to some ideal of how their games are and should be is foolishness. A simple look at the first 3 ME/DA games will show to anyone how much.
Also as you said, until we know more about Anthem we cannot judge it.
I agree, the only time where two BIoWare games were even close to being the same would have been Mass Effect 2 to Mass Effect 3 and my understanding that was because they wanted to shrink the development window and reused a lot of Mass Effect 2 in Mass Effect 3.Time between Mass Effect 1 and Mass Effect 2 -> 2 years and 2 months Time between Mass Effect 2 and Mass Effect 3 -> 2 years and 1.5 months
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We destroy them or they destroy us.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: MasterDassJennir
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Post by bshep on Jul 3, 2018 5:27:44 GMT
Bioware's games changed a lot as time passed. Trying to hold on to some ideal of how their games are and should be is foolishness. A simple look at the first 3 ME/DA games will show to anyone how much.
Also as you said, until we know more about Anthem we cannot judge it.
I agree, the only time where two BIoWare games were even close to being the same would have been Mass Effect 2 to Mass Effect 3 and my understanding that was because they wanted to shrink the development window and reused a lot of Mass Effect 2 in Mass Effect 3. While the engine in both was the same, ME2 and ME3 had quite a few differences from each other. But yeah, same engine probably helped cut some time.
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Post by PillarBiter on Jul 3, 2018 6:58:07 GMT
Bioware's games changed a lot as time passed. Trying to hold on to some ideal of how their games are and should be is foolishness. A simple look at the first 3 ME/DA games will show to anyone how much.
Also as you said, until we know more about Anthem we cannot judge it.
I agree, the only time where two BIoWare games were even close to being the same would have been Mass Effect 2 to Mass Effect 3 and my understanding that was because they wanted to shrink the development window and reused a lot of Mass Effect 2 in Mass Effect 3. This. So. Much. This. I know there are people who hate change as their tiny brain can't handle it and everything was oh so much better "in my time", but I applaud bioware for walking new paths and challenging, questioning themselves each and every time.
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Post by SofaJockey on Jul 3, 2018 9:27:42 GMT
Also, I do not want them to go out of business, I wish that the player base will turn Anthem into a failure so that either Bioware goes back to make games like ME and DA OR so that EA dissolves them so the talent can be picked up by another studio or band together to form another studio. 'Obsessed Fan' logic: If I boycott 'x' and it fails, then the studio will infer that making games like prior game 'y' will be more popular and will make it or pass the IP to another studio to do that. Publisher logic: Game 'x' has failed for no 'obvious' reason. Kill the studio and its IPs (or blame it on a crowded market and put the IP into hiatus). Have I understood the argument you are making correctly? If so, I think it's flawed.
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Post by dropzofcrimzon on Jul 3, 2018 10:11:43 GMT
Also, I do not want them to go out of business, I wish that the player base will turn Anthem into a failure so that either Bioware goes back to make games like ME and DA OR so that EA dissolves them so the talent can be picked up by another studio or band together to form another studio. 'Obsessed Fan' logic: If I boycott 'x' and it fails, then the studio will infer that making games like prior game 'y' will be more popular and will make it or pass the IP to another studio to do that. Publisher logic: Game 'x' has failed for no 'obvious' reason. Kill the studio and its IPs (or blame it on a crowded market and put the IP into hiatus). Have I understood the argument you are making correctly? If so, I think it's flawed. it worked for some franchises, hopefully it will work for Bioware as well, failing that, as I said, there are other favorable outcomes.
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Post by PillarBiter on Jul 3, 2018 10:25:22 GMT
'Obsessed Fan' logic: If I boycott 'x' and it fails, then the studio will infer that making games like prior game 'y' will be more popular and will make it or pass the IP to another studio to do that. Publisher logic: Game 'x' has failed for no 'obvious' reason. Kill the studio and its IPs (or blame it on a crowded market and put the IP into hiatus). Have I understood the argument you are making correctly? If so, I think it's flawed. it worked for some franchises, hopefully it will work for Bioware as well, failing that, as I said, there are other favorable outcomes. Please, dear god, give use examples where this worked, and where the return to 'old games' was attributed to fan feedback, as acknowledged by the developers. Also, provide source material, and not just assumptions. Or: "I heard this somewhere sometime".
*Pulls out chair, sits back and waits*
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N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Sanunes on Jul 3, 2018 12:16:59 GMT
'Obsessed Fan' logic: If I boycott 'x' and it fails, then the studio will infer that making games like prior game 'y' will be more popular and will make it or pass the IP to another studio to do that. Publisher logic: Game 'x' has failed for no 'obvious' reason. Kill the studio and its IPs (or blame it on a crowded market and put the IP into hiatus). Have I understood the argument you are making correctly? If so, I think it's flawed. it worked for some franchises, hopefully it will work for Bioware as well, failing that, as I said, there are other favorable outcomes. I cannot think of any IP like that. The closest I can think of is Prey and that was the opposite as you said. If anything it would be like making Anthem and calling it Mass Effect, the fans of the original hated the return of the IP because it was just slapping a beloved name onto another completely different game. With this kind of post, I really don't think BioWare is for you anymore. You can hope that they will go back and make a game that will please you, but I think you will do better searching for smaller developers that don't have to make the perfect game to prevent not losing money. To me it has been proven that BioWare cannot take any type of risk with their future games because people are going to bitch and moan the moment the game isn't perfect and people will just bandwagon on. Edit: Cleaned up a sentence.
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Post by dropzofcrimzon on Jul 3, 2018 12:20:29 GMT
it worked for some franchises, hopefully it will work for Bioware as well, failing that, as I said, there are other favorable outcomes. Please, dear god, give use examples where this worked, and where the return to 'old games' was attributed to fan feedback, as acknowledged by the developers. Also, provide source material, and not just assumptions. Or: "I heard this somewhere sometime".
*Pulls out chair, sits back and waits*
look ar halo 5 and what happened with the Locke-Chief split Frankie specifically said that going back to a solely chief perspective and the "more open" spaces of older halo games in Infinte was because of fan feedback
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N6
Just a flip of the coin.
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Post by Sanunes on Jul 3, 2018 12:22:13 GMT
Please, dear god, give use examples where this worked, and where the return to 'old games' was attributed to fan feedback, as acknowledged by the developers. Also, provide source material, and not just assumptions. Or: "I heard this somewhere sometime".
*Pulls out chair, sits back and waits*
look ar halo 5 and what happened with the Locke-Chief split Frankie specifically said that going back to a solely chief perspective and the "more open" spaces of older halo games in Infinte was because of fan feedback We haven't seen that yet, for you could say the same thing about Andromeda because BioWare kept saying the "exploration of Mass Effect 1, the companions of Mass Effect 2, and the combat of Mass Effect 3" and people complained about that game plenty because they found there were issues with that approach. Edit: And they didn't close 343 after that either, they went back and started to work on a sequel. Microsoft didn't redistribute the entire staff and put the game into long term hiatus. Which is pretty much exactly what we have heard about Mass Effect too.
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Post by dropzofcrimzon on Jul 3, 2018 13:16:16 GMT
look ar halo 5 and what happened with the Locke-Chief split Frankie specifically said that going back to a solely chief perspective and the "more open" spaces of older halo games in Infinte was because of fan feedback We haven't seen that yet, for you could say the same thing about Andromeda because BioWare kept saying the "exploration of Mass Effect 1, the companions of Mass Effect 2, and the combat of Mass Effect 3" and people complained about that game plenty because they found there were issues with that approach. Edit: And they didn't close 343 after that either, they went back and started to work on a sequel. Microsoft didn't redistribute the entire staff and put the game into long term hiatus. Which is pretty much exactly what we have heard about Mass Effect too. uh, the chief as the only protagonist was confirmed, yes we have not seen how well they are doing yet but the change was still spurred by fan feed back and backlash Also, halo 5, differently than MEA, was ridiculously profitable and the MP (which I could care less about but furthers my point) AFTER the changes made between 4 and 5 due to massive fan backlash, is regarded as some of the best in the series
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Post by SofaJockey on Jul 3, 2018 13:34:49 GMT
change was still spurred by fan feed back and backlash So you're saying many parts of Anthem are a reaction to the backlash against Mass Effect Andromeda? Don't like shoddy animation in MEA, get sharp animation in Anthem. Don't like 'my face hurts' in MEA, get 'no face' in Anthem. Don't like 'empty' open world in MEA, get dense MP content world in Anthem. You can wind the logic back a game - 'if we don't support Mass Effect Andromeda, BioWare will sit up to the fan feedback and we'll get Anthem'
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N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Prime Posts: 4392
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Post by Sanunes on Jul 3, 2018 14:15:14 GMT
We haven't seen that yet, for you could say the same thing about Andromeda because BioWare kept saying the "exploration of Mass Effect 1, the companions of Mass Effect 2, and the combat of Mass Effect 3" and people complained about that game plenty because they found there were issues with that approach. Edit: And they didn't close 343 after that either, they went back and started to work on a sequel. Microsoft didn't redistribute the entire staff and put the game into long term hiatus. Which is pretty much exactly what we have heard about Mass Effect too. uh, the chief as the only protagonist was confirmed, yes we have not seen how well they are doing yet but the change was still spurred by fan feed back and backlash Also, halo 5, differently than MEA, was ridiculously profitable and the MP (which I could care less about but furthers my point) AFTER the changes made between 4 and 5 due to massive fan backlash, is regarded as some of the best in the series The changes between Mass Effect 3 and Mass Effect: Andromeda were due to fans being fanatics too. People kept moaning about wanting the exploration of Mass Effect 1 and how BioWare abandoned that with Mass Effect 2 and 3, and they were upset that Mass Effect 3 didn't have the companion content at launch like Mass Effect 2. They attempted to fix those things with Andromeda and people still found things to complain about. Which is the same with the changes are you are talking about with the changes to Halo based on fanatic feedback. I don't have access to real numbers about the financial success or failures of either game so I am unable to comment about your speculation about how well each game did.
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N5
Uncle Cyan
Dang it.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Oct 14, 2023 17:38:23 GMT
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Cyan_Griffonclaw
Dang it.
2,515
March 2017
griffonclaw39
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Cyan_Griffonclaw on Jul 3, 2018 14:54:42 GMT
Who are these old Bioware RPG fans you speak of? People like me who cut their teeth on KOTOR? Or the general Bioware fan who has played through the many games and for the most part enjoyed them all? I can tell you one thing...every iteration has had its group of doomsayers, pre- and/or post-launch...prophesying the demise of Bioware, and yet they are the largest they've ever been. This game will be no different. Bioware has continued to evolve...and as a longtime fan it's something I appreciate despite at times being frustrated by some of the missteps. The gaming landscape is changing to accommodate a generation that is all about connectivity. Maybe these old Bioware RPG fans should try to evolve themselves...otherwise they may find themselves with no options at all. I would speculate that for most it boils down to being afraid of playing in a public forum where they may "embarrass" themselves with their gameplay. I agree with the "git gud" part because honestly, I don't want to be that player that causes everyone to sigh. However, I never EVER complained about BioWare until I started feeling EA's squeeze plays for my wallet. I love most BioWare products. There are so many variations from Shattered Steel, Jade Empire, SW:OR and even Sonic. I'm down with Anthem, but I'm still in wait-and-see mode.
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Sanunes
N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Prime Posts: 4392
Prime Likes: 882
Posts: 5,908 Likes: 8,942
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8,942
Sanunes
Just a flip of the coin.
5,908
Sept 13, 2016 11:51:12 GMT
September 2016
sanunes
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Sanunes on Jul 3, 2018 16:13:37 GMT
Who are these old Bioware RPG fans you speak of? People like me who cut their teeth on KOTOR? Or the general Bioware fan who has played through the many games and for the most part enjoyed them all? I can tell you one thing...every iteration has had its group of doomsayers, pre- and/or post-launch...prophesying the demise of Bioware, and yet they are the largest they've ever been. This game will be no different. Bioware has continued to evolve...and as a longtime fan it's something I appreciate despite at times being frustrated by some of the missteps. The gaming landscape is changing to accommodate a generation that is all about connectivity. Maybe these old Bioware RPG fans should try to evolve themselves...otherwise they may find themselves with no options at all. I would speculate that for most it boils down to being afraid of playing in a public forum where they may "embarrass" themselves with their gameplay. I agree with the "git gud" part because honestly, I don't want to be that player that causes everyone to sigh. However, I never EVER complained about BioWare until I started feeling EA's squeeze plays for my wallet. I love most BioWare products. There are so many variations from Shattered Steel, Jade Empire, SW:OR and even Sonic. I'm down with Anthem, but I'm still in wait-and-see mode. So when BioWare acts like the other developers its bad? Even CDPR makes a play for your wallet they are just manipulating you differently, for the entire campaign around "10 free DLC" was a crock with crappy content that they claimed was on par with other paid DLC and are counting on people being dumb enough not to see it, it sounds like it will return for Cyberpunk.
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Jan 20, 2022 14:46:14 GMT
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goishen
twitch.tv/goishen
2,360
August 2016
goishen
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
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Post by goishen on Jul 3, 2018 16:40:55 GMT
You're trying to tar everyone with the same brush.
CDPR, although they are far from my favorite developers, did release two extremely good DLC's. And plus... When they release the other DLC's, you're right. They are on par with other gaming companies paid DLC's. Paying for horse armor? Neigh. Getting that shit for free from CDPR? Yes, this is exactly what a gaming company should be.
And I don't even LIKE TW3. It still doesn't stop me from saying that they made an awesome game.
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Dec 18, 2021 22:02:27 GMT
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dropzofcrimzon
1,391
November 2016
dropzofcrimzon
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by dropzofcrimzon on Jul 3, 2018 16:56:38 GMT
change was still spurred by fan feed back and backlash So you're saying many parts of Anthem are a reaction to the backlash against Mass Effect Andromeda? Don't like shoddy animation in MEA, get sharp animation in Anthem. Don't like 'my face hurts' in MEA, get 'no face' in Anthem. Don't like 'empty' open world in MEA, get dense MP content world in Anthem. You can wind the logic back a game - 'if we don't support Mass Effect Andromeda, BioWare will sit up to the fan feedback and we'll get Anthem' I'm so sorry but...are you TRYING to he daft?? Anthem was in production BEFORE andromeda even according to Bioware themselves how the hell is any reaction from Andromeda relevant to a game that is 1: not related to Andromeda and 2: being developed before Andromeda and 3: was not even announced until AFTER Andromeda released??? Halo 5 had an issue with tight environments (minus one level) fans complained, Halo infinite will have open levels Halo 5 featured Locke...people REALLY complained about that, Halo infinite will not have Locke and center solely around the chief Halo 4's MP pissed the fans off garnerened some of the worst feedback in ALL halo multiplayer, halo 5 came out with a completely revamped MP which, according to 343 took into account the fan feedback and lo and behold it is considered one of the best in the series. Those are directly linked Now if you said Mass Effect andromeda sucked with animations and/or people complained about the fact they would rather play as Shepard again and Bioware came out with ME4 where the animations are awesome and you play as Shepard then that would make sense
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