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warden
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warden
https://images4.alphacoders.com/101/thumb-1920-1010967.png
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
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Post by warden on Sept 23, 2019 12:36:02 GMT
Internet "justice" is much easier, and you don't have to put up with the bullshit legal system. and money, quite a huge quantity if you go through all to the end.
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Hrungr
Twitter Guru
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hrungr
Hrungr
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Hrungr on Sept 23, 2019 17:51:02 GMT
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revelationeffect
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
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Post by revelationeffect on Sept 23, 2019 19:20:56 GMT
I’m glad someone at Failbetter decided to make such a comprehensive post. A lot of things about Kennedy’s post pinged me as him trying to do damage control rather than honestly speak about his actions. Am pretty surprised he outright lied as much as he did about such verifiable things, though, guess he was hoping no one would call him on his bullshit. Well, he certainly did a good job of digging himself deeper into the hole he’s made for himself.
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midnight tea
Twitter Guru
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Post by midnight tea on Sept 23, 2019 23:21:47 GMT
Relevant excerpt IMO: I have a feeling he also takes into account actions of Bioware, given that many BW devs were quick to say that they believe the accusers. It's more than probable now that they act on knowledge beyond what the public is aware of.
Other than that, I can't agree more with Mr. Myers. In cases like this there hardly is any 'due process' to handle or resolve such issues - IMO public disclosure and subsequent discussion appears to be the most sensible option and shall likely remain so for foreseeable future.
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition, Dragon Age The Veilguard
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Post by AlleluiaElizabeth on Sept 24, 2019 6:53:02 GMT
Hey mods, you know Tea can't actually get to see that I didn't mean the accusation and was simply making a rhetorical point in a debate, if you delete the entire comment chain before we're done. Though it has since been pointed out to me that I could have spoiler tagged the "stinger" of my point in the same post instead of waiting for her to respond before making it clear. I hadn't thought to do that, and I'm not 100% sure that would have made the point I was making as strongly, but its a good suggestion for the future. My bad.
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Masque
N2
Holy Sigmar, bless this ravaged body!
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Holy Sigmar, bless this ravaged body!
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Post by Masque on Sept 24, 2019 14:31:40 GMT
The fact that there are people who equate wanting both sides of the story, and some corroborating evidence, before passing judgment with victim shaming just blows my mind.
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midnight tea
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Post by midnight tea on Sept 24, 2019 17:29:07 GMT
The fact that there are people who equate wanting both sides of the story, and some corroborating evidence, before passing judgment with victim shaming just blows my mind. Thing is that we do have both sides of the story, we have corroborating evidence and witnesses. At this point in time, and even prior to Myers' post, acting as if there was little or nothing supporting victims claims apart from their public accusations is indeed an act of passing judgment that scrutinizes one side a lot more than the other.
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Masque
N2
Holy Sigmar, bless this ravaged body!
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Holy Sigmar, bless this ravaged body!
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masque
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Post by Masque on Sept 24, 2019 18:22:39 GMT
The fact that there are people who equate wanting both sides of the story, and some corroborating evidence, before passing judgment with victim shaming just blows my mind. Thing is that we do have both sides of the story, we have corroborating evidence and witnesses. At this point in time, and even prior to Myers' post, acting as if there was little or nothing supporting victims claims apart from their public accusations is indeed an act of passing judgment that scrutinizes one side a lot more than the other. There were people, especially on Twitter, who were armed with torch and pitchfork before much of that came to light though. My point is, people blindly believing allegations with knee-jerk reactions rather than fact is dangerous, and I hope the people who are guilty of doing that are never falsely accused themselves, lest karma and that 'court of public opinion' bite them in the ass. Let it be said that I am not condoning his alleged behavior; if it's proven he's guilty of the accusations against him then he absolutely should face the consequences of his actions, as should anyone who harasses/abuses others in the workplace or elsewhere. (Yes, Myers' response is damning because unlike some of the other witnesses he can produce receipts.) But hopping on the hate bandwagon before there is concrete evidence can destroy innocent lives, ruin careers, etc. In many of such cases, even once the person is cleared of wrongdoing, their reputations are beyond repair. How does examining these kinds of situations from all angles equate to victim shaming though? Unless my definition of that phrase differs wildly from everyone else's. (Blaming the victim for the abuse/harassment they endured as if they somehow deserved it) I can't comprehend why people who weren't so quick to judge are being treated as if they are enemies of the victims and flag bearers of the accused.
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linksocarina
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Post by linksocarina on Sept 24, 2019 19:08:36 GMT
All of this is kind of a moot point no? Didn't someone from BioWare already state that they are not using Kennedy's contributions because of the switch to Joplin?
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Masque
N2
Holy Sigmar, bless this ravaged body!
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Posts: 132 Likes: 524
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Holy Sigmar, bless this ravaged body!
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August 2016
masque
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
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Post by Masque on Sept 24, 2019 19:17:54 GMT
All of this is kind of a moot point no? Didn't someone from BioWare already state that they are not using Kennedy's contributions because of the switch to Joplin? Yeah, I think it was Mark Darrah.
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midnight tea
Twitter Guru
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Posts: 8,428 Likes: 21,210
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109
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August 2016
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Post by midnight tea on Sept 24, 2019 19:19:06 GMT
Thing is that we do have both sides of the story, we have corroborating evidence and witnesses. At this point in time, and even prior to Myers' post, acting as if there was little or nothing supporting victims claims apart from their public accusations is indeed an act of passing judgment that scrutinizes one side a lot more than the other. There were people, especially on Twitter, who were armed with torch and pitchfork before much of that came to light though. My point is, people blindly believing allegations with knee-jerk reactions rather than fact is dangerous, and I hope the people who are guilty of doing that are never falsely accused themselves, lest karma and that 'court of public opinion' bite them in the ass. Let it be said that I am not condoning his alleged behavior; if it's proven he's guilty of the accusations against him then he absolutely should face the consequences of his actions, as should anyone who harasses/abuses others in the workplace or elsewhere. (Yes, Myers' response is damning because unlike some of the other witnesses he can produce receipts.) But hopping on the hate bandwagon before there is concrete evidence can destroy innocent lives, ruin careers, etc. In many of such cases, even once the person is cleared of wrongdoing, their reputations are beyond repair. How does examining these kinds of situations from all angles equate to victim shaming though? Unless my definition of that phrase differs wildly from everyone else's. (Blaming the victim for the abuse/harassment they endured as if they somehow deserved it) I can't comprehend why people who weren't so quick to judge are being treated as if they are enemies of the victims and flag bearers of the accused. I understand 'withholding judgement', but - as mentioned - there was more in the ether about Kennedy's faults than just accusations of one or two victims. Failbetter and people who worked there appear to have wholly sided with victims and they know both sides best on personal and professional level. I have no idea what Bioware folks knew, but it increasingly appears that they know more than the public, so their siding with victims can be viewed as a tell as well. Anyway - examining these kinds of situations from all angles is all fine and good IMO - I think the world overall could use more care when it comes to passing judgement on many things. But demanding an unspecified 'burden of proof' from victims or expecting them to go through many legal hoops regardless whether it's even possible or helpful ain't a thing that speaks of neutrality on the matter. Be it in this case or in many others victims that come out present public testimonies, oftentimes with details, find corroborating witnesses or we see a slew of people coming out saying that they believe victims based on their personal experiences with perpetrator among other things... is such is the case, making it seem like victims did little to nothing to prove their claims doesn't look that fair or impartial to me. I'm not sure if this could be called outright 'victim shaming', but from what I've seen, heard or experienced, it does have a chilling effect on people.
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linksocarina
N5
Always teacher, sometimes writer
Teaching Mode Activated
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Posts: 3,186 Likes: 4,072
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Always teacher, sometimes writer
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Teaching Mode Activated
3,186
August 2016
linksocarina
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Post by linksocarina on Sept 24, 2019 19:21:16 GMT
All of this is kind of a moot point no? Didn't someone from BioWare already state that they are not using Kennedy's contributions because of the switch to Joplin? Yeah, I think it was Mark Darrah. Sort of works out in the end. Kennedy is pretty deplorable with all of the new info that has surfaced, so it may be for the best.
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Masque
N2
Holy Sigmar, bless this ravaged body!
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
Posts: 132 Likes: 524
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Masque
Holy Sigmar, bless this ravaged body!
132
August 2016
masque
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
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Post by Masque on Sept 24, 2019 19:29:35 GMT
Yeah, I think it was Mark Darrah. Sort of works out in the end. Kennedy is pretty deplorable with all of the new info that has surfaced, so it may be for the best. It certainly appears that way. Granted, I didn't know much about him, aside from really enjoying Fallen London, until this all blew up.
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ღ I am a golem. Obviously.
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phoray
Gotta be kiddin me
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August 2016
phoray
Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Dragon Age The Veilguard
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Post by phoray on Sept 24, 2019 20:00:58 GMT
The only tweet I saw from Mark Darrah was Bioware no longer works with him. Is there one that explicitly stated they are omitting all content AK created?
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Hrungr
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Prime Posts: 18,258
Prime Likes: 65,767
Posts: 31,200 Likes: 114,171
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ღ N-Special
151
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114,171
Hrungr
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31,200
August 2016
hrungr
Hrungr
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Post by Hrungr on Sept 25, 2019 17:23:27 GMT
The only tweet I saw from Mark Darrah was Bioware no longer works with him. Is there one that explicitly stated they are omitting all content AK created? - This was Mark's tweet. It's not explicit, but you can argue it does imply they're not using his work.Mark Darrah @biomarkdarrahDragon Age did work with Alexis Kennedy on a previous incarnation of the game. We no longer have a working relationship with him.
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annia
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Post by annia on Oct 3, 2019 14:35:22 GMT
The only tweet I saw from Mark Darrah was Bioware no longer works with him. Is there one that explicitly stated they are omitting all content AK created? - This was Mark's tweet. It's not explicit, but you can argue it does imply they're not using his work.Mark Darrah @biomarkdarrahDragon Age did work with Alexis Kennedy on a previous incarnation of the game. We no longer have a working relationship with him. IMO, BioWare isn't really responsible for AK's behaviour after he left their employ, so I don't consider them morally obligated to throw away anything. I wouldn't mind them using the work if they found it good enough, since they have already paid for it. It's not like we would recognize it. Whatever would be helpful to getting the game finished quicker... but it's quite possible from this quote that that is now longer in the plans.
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